Abandoning status as "Islamic Republic"

[باپ]

Is it just me, but the majority of people arguing against you statement are living in Norway, USA or Uk so all benefitting from secular states.

No we can see how big a lie is that religion is basis of all problems. Its people who make or break nations, not secularism or religion.
Pakistan will be as dysfunctional as it as secular state as it is,now, but we will lose our reason to be a separate country from India. Two nation theory was the basis of creating Pakistan

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

No we can see how big a lie is that religion is basis of all problems. Its people who make or break nations, not secularism or religion.
Pakistan will be as dysfunctional as it as secular state as it is,now, but we will lose our reason to be a separate country from India. Two nation theory was the basis of creating Pakistan

The creation of Pakistan is justified from all POV. There is no compromise or ambiguity about. Pakistan was created as a homeland for a unique and beautiful race that is distinct and different to the indian race. Pakistan is a homeland for that unique beautiful race to preserve our unique culture and way of life without oppression and interference from those that are alien to and oppose us. We want to preserve and secure a future for our children.

 

[Azadkashmir]

secular or not we need to get rid of rothschild usury. we can print our own currency and mint our own coins and barter international. you be suprised after americans yes white christians its muslim pakistanis second in conspiracy belives. i admit i am into conspiracies. after all am from england. there many stories i can tell but i cant be bothered it too long.

 

[Pak_88]

This is a very, very, VERY sensitive topic, and whilst I may be in no position to comment on it, I shall do so for the interest of the argument:

What Pakistan needs is a true understanding of religion... There needs to be a reconstruction of political thought in Islam (which is the state religion and the religion of 96% of the population) vis-a-vis our current geo-political situation.... The idea that all Muslim countries are our allies is a toxic one... We must rise above all racial and sectarian prejudices if we wish to survive as an independent and sovereign country... We must realise that we are not the 'thekay-daars' of Islamic law, and that all power of judgement resides, firstly with Allah (as in the case of the Last Day - SUPREME JUDGEMENT, that is), and secondly, with the judiciary of the state, which is the proper Islamic framework in this regard - this is applicable to the whole Mumtaz Qadri fiasco... We must DE-RADICALISE, and for such an endeavour, I've come across the following two solutions:
i. Turn Pakistan into a secular entity.
OR
ii. Give Pakistanis the proper religious education required to tackle the situation at hand viz.: uplifting the state of the Ministry of Education for teaching the truth to the impressionable youth, and employing media to change public perception.

The former seems more practically feasible... The latter, not so much...

 

[Genghis khan1]

Maybe it is time to abandon our status as the "Islamic" "Republic" of Pakistan, and return to our secular roots which were planned by the fathers of the nation. Not a literal name change, but Pakistani people need to abandon the "Islamic Republic" ideology. Pakistan was created because Jinnah and co were afraid that in a Hindu dominated Country, there would always be episodes of violence and disagreement between the two chief religions, as Muslims of India had grown to become an almost different culture. Thus Pakistan was created so that the Muslims and Hindus can live in peace alone. Pakistan was created because the Muslim League felt the new "Hindus"tan would not be secular enough, not because it wouldn't be "Islamic" enough. Do we want to end up like the Middle East?

Also, it is embarrassing how many people believe in ridiculously stupid Jewish conspiracy theories, and hate Jews so much without having ever having seen one in their entire lives. Can a mature, mentally healthy human being actually believe such far fetched stories? Is this the result of one or two generations of cousin-cousin breeding? The reality is every year hundreds, if not thousands of non-Muslims are persecuted and harassed all along the country, but our sympathies are only for Palestine and non-existent dead Muslims in Burma and India. Isn't it ridiculous how people in Pakistan want women to "cover" themselves up, yet Google confirms the most number of pornographic searches are from Pakistan. Google also confirms that South Asia ranks the highest in bestiality searches.

Now people are going to be blame me for having such a negative view of my home country, but I am telling the truth, and even if the truth is not something that was told to us through biased text books. Media doesn't report such incidents because they are more focused on who Imran Khan wants to sleep with, and they don't have time for a family of murdered Ahmaids, Shias, Chrisitans, Hindus, etc. But of course it is all Mossad's, RAW's and CIA's fault, because they have so much time and resources to waste on us. (Well, RAW is an exception I guess. They all have the time in the world for their little Eastern Sibling)


P.S Removing it won't really affect the economical or the political situation. It would improve the social condition.

(NON PAKISTANIS KINDLY DON'T VOTE ON THE POLL)

Guess what, not everyone has access to Internet in Pakistan, but statistics suggest, almost 1 in 9 men jerk-off in their home. Considering the analogy of your argument, do you suggest should we change our religion too? I mean, let's hit the prosperity jackpot, why not have mass conversions?!

 

[Apprentice]

Those advocating that Pakistan become secular are nothing short of:

a) apostates - according to Shariat Law
b) traitors- according to Constitution of Pakistan

The creation of Pakistan is justified from all POV. There is no compromise or ambiguity about. Pakistan was created as a homeland for a unique and beautiful race that is distinct and different to the indian race. Pakistan is a homeland for that unique beautiful race to preserve our unique culture and way of life without oppression and interference from those that are alien to and oppose us. We want to preserve and secure a future for our children.

I dunno what ur smoking kid: Pakistan is a mix of Iranian and Indian races.

 

[Sparkle229]

Why the heck would we want to become secular

 

[Strigon]

Tell me 1 thing that is done in proper Islamic way in Pakistan.

When ever someone tries too hard to show a quality of themselves (even if its no where near earned), to get people to notice it, they attach such goofiness to their name and fame as well.

Point is to eliminate the negativity spread through out the world regarding Pakistan. One can be as religious as he wants and still keep it to himself. Indulging in extreme end of religion has already costed us so much in every aspect of life. And what have we got now? Ultra religious crazies at one end and overly liberal on the other and in mid a mix of confused and sexually frustrated people.

There is a famous saying. "One should always avoid the overly religious and overly nationalistic person."

And another, "Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people you have never met and take pride in accomplishments you had no part in". The way people have molded religion to their own version in Pakistan, religion isn't also far off nationalism in this aspect.

If you are really itching to attach a title to the country, try Aspiring to be tolerant republic of Pakistan. 100 times better.

But hey, its not like I live there or have to deal with these crazed two faced people.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Tell me 1 thing that is done in proper Islamic way in Pakistan.

When ever someone tries too hard to show a quality of themselves (even if its no where near earned), to get people to notice it, they attach such goofiness to their name and fame as well.

Point is to eliminate the negativity spread through out the world regarding Pakistan. One can be as religious as he wants and still keep it to himself. Indulging in extreme end of religion has already costed us so much in every aspect of life. And what have we got now? Ultra religious crazies at one end and overly liberal on the other and in mid a mix of confused and sexually frustrated people.

There is a famous saying. "One should always avoid the overly religious and overly nationalistic person."

And another, "Nationalism does nothing but teach you to hate people you have never met and take pride in accomplishments you had no part in". The way people have molded religion to their own version in Pakistan, religion isn't also far off nationalism in this aspect.

If you are really itching to attach a title to the country, try Aspiring to be tolerant republic of Pakistan. 100 times better.

But hey, its not like I live there or have to deal with these crazed two faced people.

And changing a title somehow will act like a magic wand and everybody will live happily ever after..?

Those advocating that Pakistan become secular are nothing short of:

a) apostates - according to Shariat Law
b) traitors- according to Constitution of Pakistan



I dunno what ur smoking kid: Pakistan is a mix of Iranian and Indian races.

And being secular makes a person an apostate ? What are you smoking? Afghanistans finest!

 

[Apprentice]

And changing a title somehow will act like a magic wand and everybody will live happily ever after..?



And being secular makes a person an apostate ? What are you smoking? Afghanistans finest!

It says in the Quran.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

It says in the Quran.

Where? In fact in Quran there ain't even a punishment for leaving Islam .. Have you even read the Quran? (Translation)?

"Let there be no compulsion in religion"-- Al Quran (Surah Al Baqra).... We study this in Islamic Jurisprudence aswell.. So tell me about "sharia law"... But also first decide which sects brand of sharia you are willing to follow !

Also was Pak an apostate state till the passing of the 73 constitution ?

Also enlighten me about the definition of secularism ....

Going by your logic this country was created by an evil wajib ul qatal apostate !

 

[Strigon]

And changing a title somehow will act like a magic wand and everybody will live happily ever after..?

It may not work on grownups but it will definitely have an effect on stupid kids that only need a few words to start a journey of evil.

Dis-associating ourselves from over attachment to concept of religion as a nation is a start, more things can follow that will help shape mentality of even grownups. I am not saying give up religion but keep it separated from state and in your home and religious institutions.

But to be honest with you, its inevitable weather we promote the idea or protest it. Evolution changed the darkest, the once most religious, most barbaric countries in Europe into tolerant nations. Its just a matter of time.

 

[litman]

I've come across the following two solutions:
i. Turn Pakistan into a secular entity.
OR
ii. Give Pakistanis the proper religious education required to tackle the situation at hand viz.: uplifting the state of the Ministry of Education for teaching the truth to the impressionable youth, and employing media to change public perception.

The former seems more practically feasible... The latter, not so much...

the former can make you successful in this world and the later is the only way to be successful in both worlds. but this path demands lot of sacrifice, effort and determination. The choice is yours.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

It may not work on grownups but it will definitely have an effect on stupid kids that only need a few words to start a journey of evil.

Dis-associating ourselves from over attachment to concept of religion as a nation is a start, more things can follow that will help shape mentality of even grownups. I am not saying give up religion but keep it separated from state and in your home and religious institutions.

But to be honest with you, its inevitable weather we promote the idea or protest it. Evolution changed the darkest, the once most religious, most barbaric countries in Europe into tolerant nations. Its just a matter of time.

It will only produce chaos ... This country (unfortunately) now has a large portion of nutjobs.. A segment of society in this country will go to any extreme... And frankly it's not nessecary..

 

[Apprentice]

Where? In fact in Quran there ain't even a punishment for leaving Islam .. Have you even read the Quran? (Translation)?

"Let there be no compulsion in religion"-- Al Quran (Surah Al Baqra).... We study this in Islamic Jurisprudence aswell.. So tell me about "sharia law"... But also first decide which sects brand of sharia you are willing to follow !

Also was Pak an apostate state till the passing of the 73 constitution ?

Also enlighten me about the definition of secularism ....

Going by your logic this country was created by an evil wajib ul qatal apostate !

Jinnah was not wajib ul qatal.

Pakistan was created in the name of Islam and was committed to its ideology. Remember the Objectives Resolution? It affirmed Allah's sovereignty and all constitutions had that as a preamble and the constitutions were committed to Islamic ideology and they all said that all laws must conform with the Quran and Sunnah.

Even Ayub Khan and Yahya Khan were committed to Pakistan's Islamic ideology,, despite their laziness to practice upon it.

For example in the Legal Framework Order which Yahya Khan made for establishing the 1970 elections, the 1st point in it that all parties to the elections agreed upon was a commitment to uphold Pakistan's Islamic ideology in the new Constitution.

Secularism is the separatin of religion from state. Islam demands rule by shariat and shariat only.


Allah says in Ayat number 44 of Surah Maidah: "If any do fail to judge by what Allah has revealed, they are non-believers."

And yes according to hadith of Prophet (saw) apostates should be killed: 'If somebody changes his religion, kill him.' — Sahih al-Bukhari