Aamir Khan responds

[Mamsalaphala]

Everyday they keep saying "go to Pakistan if you don't like something here", as if they are hosts and muslims are second-class citizens.

Pakistan was created by popular Muslim demand, for doing things that were at variance with Indian social values and for creating a societies of their own choosing.

So how can you deny people the right to say that anyone who wants to do things in against our values should do so in pakistan ?

You can say that time should relive the baggage of partition and the new gen muslims bear no responsibility for the past, but then the new gen muslims in India should acknowledge the tolerance in Hindu society respect the Hindus and their values with any doubts.

You cannot have it both ways.

 

[rubyjackass]

Pakistan was created by popular Muslim demand, for doing things that were at variance with Indian social values and for creating a societies of their own choosing.

So how can you deny people the right to say that anyone who wants to do things in against our values should do so in pakistan ?

You can say that time should relive the baggage of partition and the new gen muslims bear no responsibility for the past, but then the new gen muslims in India should acknowledge the tolerance in Hindu society respect the Hindus and their values with any doubts.

You cannot have it both ways.

They have the right to say whatever BS they want. It will just expose their communal intentions. New generation muslims do acknowledge the tolerance in this country. But even non-muslims acknowledge today that intolerance is on the rise. Beef has become a subject of national importance. Everyone against Modi gets a traitor stamp.

Pakistan was created not because of Indian social values of such noble aims, but because someone wanted a place under the sun.

 

[Mamsalaphala]

They have the right to say whatever BS they want. It will just expose their communal intentions. New generation muslims do acknowledge the tolerance in this country. But even non-muslims acknowledge today that intolerance is on the rise. Beef has become a subject of national importance. Everyone against Modi gets a traitor stamp.

Pakistan was created not because of Indian social values of such noble aims, but because someone wanted a place under the sun.

What communal intention ? the intention when one desires to reinstall and nurture ancient social and cultural values of this Nation ? The same ones that was enshrined in our constitution by our founding fathers ?

The "intolerance" debate is a Farce and you know it. It was not like India was any different under CONgress rule. It actually was a LOT worse.

The debate is just a revised version of "secularism" debate which was again by many muslims and Non muslims.

Beef and Cow slaughter was ALWAYS a matter and Subject of National importance in a Nation full of Hindus. The very fact that you refuse to acknowledge this reality smacks of hypocrisy. How can you live in India and deny the significance of Cow Slaughter in India ? Something that even Mughals acknowledged ?

What real reason do you have to oppose Modi other than the fact that he is a Hindu Icon ? He is the cleanest, the most Honest and the most dedicated politician anyone can find in India.

What other reason to oppose him can exist other than Religious bigotry ? One that puts Religious sensitivities ABOVE National Interests ?

Why else would ANYONE in their right mind vote for LALU ? Yadav's I can understand, but Muslims ?


BTW its silly to put the blame of Pakistan on Jinnah. The Muslim League won in ALL muslim dominated seats in pre partition India. It was the league who spoke for the muslims and who demanded pakistan.

 

[dadeechi]

Aamir Khan responds: I'm proud to be an Indian and I'm staying here "

The damage has already been done. He will forever will be seen as a traitor whether he likes it or not.

 

[rubyjackass]

What communal intention ? the intention when one desires to reinstall and nurture ancient social and cultural values of this Nation ? The same ones that was enshrined in our constitution by our founding fathers ?

The "intolerance" debate is a Farce and you know it. It was not like India was any different under CONgress rule. It actually was a LOT worse.

The debate is just a revised version of "secularism" debate which was again by many muslims and Non muslims.

Beef and Cow slaughter was ALWAYS a matter and Subject of National importance in a Nation full of Hindus. The very fact that you refuse to acknowledge this reality smacks of hypocrisy. How can you live in India and deny the significance of Cow Slaughter in India ? Something that even Mughals acknowledged ?

What real reason do you have to oppose Modi other than the fact that he is a Hindu Icon ? He is the cleanest, the most Honest and the most dedicated politician anyone can find in India.

What other reason to oppose him can exist other than Religious bigotry ? One that puts Religious sensitivities ABOVE National Interests ?

Why else would ANYONE in their right mind vote for LALU ? Yadav's I can understand, but Muslims ?

BTW its silly to put the blame of Pakistan on Jinnah. The Muslim League won in ALL muslim dominated seats in pre partition India. It was the league who spoke for the muslims and who demanded pakistan.

The intolerance is real today and has implicit support from the ruling party and its sister organizations. And please don't insult our constitution and try to attribute values to our founding fathers. The secularism debate is one we should have today. One which should expose both Congress and BJP as opportunistic and communal forces. I don't care what Mughals thought about cow slaughter. What I care is that religion cannot be basis for any law in this country, its a slippery slope.

Pfft... I am sorry blind man that you don't see any blemish against Modi. Being clean and honest is supposed to be a necessary condition. If that is your sole benchmark for politics then your standards are low. Lol why would muslims not vote for Lalu when they have to choose between two evils? Bad mouth them daily and act surprised when they vote against BJP.

League did not win until 1946 in any of current Pakistani states, except may be Bengal.

 

[JohnyD]

lol...the effect is....BJP is coming out of its electoral hangover...read today that Modi and Jaitely are approaching congress to brief them on govmts policies and to seek support on reforms.. they are now talking about inclusive decisions.. arrogant jaitely and modi seems to have learned a lesson after Bihar....interestingly, Congress has set a pre-condition to support BJP's reform bills and that is govmt discuss and pass anti intolerance bill! Lol.

 

[jaiind]

 

[Indika]

 

[Mamsalaphala]

The intolerance is real today and has implicit support from the ruling party and its sister organizations. And please don't insult our constitution and try to attribute values to our founding fathers. The secularism debate is one we should have today. One which should expose both Congress and BJP as opportunistic and communal forces. I don't care what Mughals thought about cow slaughter. What I care is that religion cannot be basis for any law in this country, its a slippery slope.

Pfft... I am sorry blind man that you don't see any blemish against Modi. Being clean and honest is supposed to be a necessary condition. If that is your sole benchmark for politics then your standards are low. Lol why would muslims not vote for Lalu when they have to choose between two evils? Bad mouth them daily and act surprised when they vote against BJP.

League did not win until 1946 in any of current Pakistani states, except may be Bengal.

You are wrong on EVERY Count.


1. Intolerance to foreign invasion and Adharmic values have always existed in India. That is why India remains a Hindu nation even after more than a Century of islamic invasion, domination and Followed by christian invasion and colonization.

It is this intolerance that has helped this society survive through some of its darkest phases in history. So it is unlikely that this society will throw out the very survival skill that helped it escape slavery.

CONgress used to be a big part of this intolerance. "Quit India" movement, Satyagraha, burning of british clothes etc. is the result of this intolerance.

Intolerance to Adharma, intolerance to insults, intolerance to abuse, intolerance to destruction of our values is a POSITIVE trait of Indian society. So please DO have the debate, it will be good for you as it will help you understand India. But do not expect the debate to go your way, because I guarantee that it will not.

Jinnah too wanted that debate, but when he lost the debate, he wanted pakistan as a consolation prize.

2. Now Cow Protections is one of the DIRECTIVE PRINCIPLES of our Constitution. That is one of the many ways our founding fathers installed Indian values in our Constitution.

Indian Secularism is built on Hindu value, this is a statement of Fact. Religion is the fundamental source of any law, this too is a statement of Fact. It CAN be a slippery slope but it can also be the foundation of a very stable slope. Especially when the religion encourage Rational thought and not blind faith.

3. Now if the Supreme Court of India could not find any blemish against Modi, then your Rhetoric has no practical value except to cloak Religious animosity. Supreme court of India is the highest body that views PROOF objectively and makes a judgement purely based on Facts. So you are indeed blinded by Prejudice.

I said Clean, Honest and DEDICATED. ALL necessary condition, but which is lacking in almost all global politicians. You seem to have glossed over this while purposely ignoring "dedicated". Another example of dishonesty prompted by religious animosity.

BJP has not bad mouthed muslims, it has bad mouthed those who do not respect Indian values, be it of any religion. As a matter of fact, the greatest enemy of BJP is the Communist, majority of who are Hindus. Not to mention other "secular" parties in India. Lalu included.

I am not "surprised" by your choices, only showing that your choices are guided by Religious Bigotry and NOT National Interest.


4. Finally here is the Election Result of 1945,

Indian National Congress won 59 seat,
Muslim League won 30 seat.

 

[ASHARR]

Isay kehtay ha bol nay k baad azadi chin jana

 

[rubyjackass]

You are wrong on EVERY Count.


1. Intolerance to foreign invasion and Adharmic values have always existed in India. That is why India remains a Hindu nation even after more than a Century of islamic invasion, domination and Followed by christian invasion and colonization.

It is this intolerance that has helped this society survive through some of its darkest phases in history. So it is unlikely that this society will throw out the very survival skill that helped it escape slavery.

CONgress used to be a big part of this intolerance. "Quit India" movement, Satyagraha, burning of british clothes etc. is the result of this intolerance.

Intolerance to Adharma, intolerance to insults, intolerance to abuse, intolerance to destruction of our values is a POSITIVE trait of Indian society. So please DO have the debate, it will be good for you as it will help you understand India. But do not expect the debate to go your way, because I guarantee that it will not.

Jinnah too wanted that debate, but when he lost the debate, he wanted pakistan as a consolation prize.

2. Now Cow Protections is one of the DIRECTIVE PRINCIPLES of our Constitution. That is one of the many ways our founding fathers installed Indian values in our Constitution.

Indian Secularism is built on Hindu value, this is a statement of Fact. Religion is the fundamental source of any law, this too is a statement of Fact. It CAN be a slippery slope but it can also be the foundation of a very stable slope. Especially when the religion encourage Rational thought and not blind faith.

3. Now if the Supreme Court of India could not find any blemish against Modi, then your Rhetoric has no practical value except to cloak Religious animosity. Supreme court of India is the highest body that views PROOF objectively and makes a judgement purely based on Facts. So you are indeed blinded by Prejudice.

I said Clean, Honest and DEDICATED. ALL necessary condition, but which is lacking in almost all global politicians. You seem to have glossed over this while purposely ignoring "dedicated". Another example of dishonesty prompted by religious animosity.

BJP has not bad mouthed muslims, it has bad mouthed those who do not respect Indian values, be it of any religion. As a matter of fact, the greatest enemy of BJP is the Communist, majority of who are Hindus. Not to mention other "secular" parties in India. Lalu included.

I am not "surprised" by your choices, only showing that your choices are guided by Religious Bigotry and NOT National Interest.


4. Finally here is the Election Result of 1945,

Indian National Congress won 59 seat,
Muslim League won 30 seat.

1. Yeah Adharma values blah blah. Keep inventing new terms in your Hindutva dictionary. First fight the power cuts in your area and man-holes in your streets. That is the biggest adharma the governments have perpetrated over decades. You have so much tolerance to BS and so much idle time to waste on things tangential to your personal life that you want a ban on beef instead.

Yeah sure, debate will not go my way because you say so. Countries fight foreign invasion and domination because it is common sense. Not because some religion says so. And how many years should one stay in this country to become non-foreign? Is 100 years enough? Or should they convert into one (version) of religion that you guys claim Hinduism to be? When will you stop changing your dictionary to define intolerance as intolerance to intolerance? Why can't the saffronists just accept that a person of a particular religion is not foreign anymore? That he/she is equal. not inferior by virtue of numbers of his/her community in the country?

Is somebody stopping a debate on all this? Debate is indeed healthy and is exposing the hollowness of social argument the communal forces bring to this country. What do YOU want as a consolation prize in the debate?

2. Again we had a discussion on this forum regarding cow protection. I won't repeat all that but suffice it to say that directive principles are not legally enforceable and the principle was not included in constitution on religious basis. Don't lie saying otherwise, especially to yourself. Religion is not a basis for any law(excepting personal ones) in India, it may be an inspiration at most.

3. Pfft. You are so insecure about Godhra that the minute I said blemish regarding that is what comes to your mind. 'Dedicated' yeah apparently Obama is not a dedicated politician. No Sir that is unique to Modi and is with no one else in India(or not!). A dedicated idiot is worse than a leisurely wise man. And don't cry that I called Modi an idiot, I did not mean that. I am just tired of hearing somethings which the Modi fans keep harping about him, but those that are minimum expected from any politician. Today we demand better standards. Otherwise Manmohan Singh was all that dedicated, clean and honest. I just hope Indian social fabric survives the lines these people are drawing among people day in and day out. And the Modi who is another Maun muni doesn't say anything about it. He has no concrete stand on any issue, he wouldn't open his mouth if people get killed over beef. His minions assure us that he is against it. We never know.

And stop your nonsense of BJP does not bad mouth muslims. They don't badmouth publicly. They tolerate or wink to their members who badmouth muslims and they routinely pursue policies which are meant only to target muslims.


4. I didn't knew about the result. But yes, Muslim League won even in Madras then. What else is going to happen in an exclusively Muslim electorate when you have a communal party naming itself muslim and threatening that their religion is in danger. The same is happening with Hindutva brigade threatening us that Hinduism is in danger.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

They have the right to say whatever BS they want. It will just expose their communal intentions. New generation muslims do acknowledge the tolerance in this country. But even non-muslims acknowledge today that intolerance is on the rise. Beef has become a subject of national importance. Everyone against Modi gets a traitor stamp.

The country is picking sides. This is a good sign. And Beef IS a national issue. Has always been since centuries. The first thing the Islamic armies did while conquering Dharmic lands and converting people to Islam was to feed them beef.

It is your choice where you decide to stand.

For cow slaughter or against cow slaughter.

That is where the line is being drawn.

 

[rubyjackass]

For cow slaughter or against cow slaughter.

That is where the line is being drawn.

No, that is where you want the country divided across.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

No, that is where you want the country divided across.

The country is divided already. Just that there are no political lines drawn yet. It was always there.

Hindus have had enough now. The younger generation especially have had it. The only way you could have prevented it was to destroy Hinduism entirely. Not just Govt. controlling temples, but liquidating them slowly in the name of releasing funds for the public or some other hogwash. Now its too late.

The bad thing for hardliner Muslims and 'secular' folks like you is that except for some Sunnis, casteist uneducated folks and the eminent seculars - all of India(of all religions) is now rallying behind a revival. So in the event of the inevitable self purification (aka civil war), one side will have to cease to exist, without altering any International boundaries.

Every civilized country had to undergo them. USA, France, England, Germany, Italy, Russia, etc etc. So I am not surprised that we are not being any exception.

 

[Mamsalaphala]

1. Yeah Adharma values blah blah. Keep inventing new terms in your Hindutva dictionary. First fight the power cuts in your area and man-holes in your streets. That is the biggest adharma the governments have perpetrated over decades. You have so much tolerance to BS and so much idle time to waste on things tangential to your personal life that you want a ban on beef instead.

Adharma is not a new term. I am surprised that you do not know what it is. Its the Opposite of Dharma.

The fight against power cuts and man holes is what has brought Modi to power. It is a victory over the CONgress who has cheated the nation over decades.

A ban on Cow Slaughter is very much part of my Personal and Social Value system which seeks of me to install a Dharmic society. There is no contradiction here.

Yeah sure, debate will not go my way because you say so. Countries fight foreign invasion and domination because it is common sense. Not because some religion says so. And how many years should one stay in this country to become non-foreign? Is 100 years enough? Or should they convert into one (version) of religion that you guys claim Hinduism to be? When will you stop changing your dictionary to define intolerance as intolerance to intolerance? Why can't the saffronists just accept that a person of a particular religion is not foreign anymore? That he/she is equal. not inferior by virtue of numbers of his/her community in the country?

Is somebody stopping a debate on all this? Debate is indeed healthy and is exposing the hollowness of social argument the communal forces bring to this country. What do YOU want as a consolation prize in the debate?

No one has denied your citizenship so you crying victim is just a demonstrate of your dishonesty. A Strawman which you want to demolish and claim moral victory.

This entire rhetorical questions is build on falsehood and is designed to build and demolish strawmen. Nothing reeks more of dishonesty than this desperate attempt.

This is exactly why the debate will not go your way. My prize is the debate itself, where I get to prove you wrong everytime.

2. Again we had a discussion on this forum regarding cow protection. I won't repeat all that but suffice it to say that directive principles are not legally enforceable and the principle was not included in constitution on religious basis. Don't lie saying otherwise, especially to yourself. Religion is not a basis for any law(excepting personal ones) in India, it may be an inspiration at most.

This question has already been settled by a Supreme Court Judgement which has made slaughter of Cow illegal based on the directive principle. Funnily enough it was because of religion and the SC has recognized it.

So much for your Lies. (or ignorance?)

3. Pfft. You are so insecure about Godhra that the minute I said blemish regarding that is what comes to your mind. 'Dedicated' yeah apparently Obama is not a dedicated politician. No Sir that is unique to Modi and is with no one else in India(or not!). A dedicated idiot is worse than a leisurely wise man. And don't cry that I called Modi an idiot, I did not mean that. I am just tired of hearing somethings which the Modi fans keep harping about him, but those that are minimum expected from any politician. Today we demand better standards. Otherwise Manmohan Singh was all that dedicated, clean and honest. I just hope Indian social fabric survives the lines these people are drawing among people day in and day out. And the Modi who is another Maun muni doesn't say anything about it. He has no concrete stand on any issue, he wouldn't open his mouth if people get killed over beef. His minions assure us that he is against it. We never know.

I am not ashamed of what happened after Godhra Train burning. So there is no "insecurity' here. Its all your wishful thinking.

It comes to mind because that is what the usual "secular" discussing boils down too. Hardly a comment on me.

Your "minimum" expectations from a politician is a ridiculous wish list. Dedicated, clean and honest is a rarity in politics, not the norm. But I am sure you know this. Its again your Dishonesty that makes you comment otherwise.

Modi has not spoken on the murder of Poojari either. Its not his job to speak on state crimes. Murder or otherwise. You have been fed the opium of Minority Appeasement that you think that is your right to be fed that opium.

Modi has not taken any stand AGAINST Muslims, so you pretty much know he is not against you. But its one thing to know, another to acknowledge this reality.

And stop your nonsense of BJP does not bad mouth muslims. They don't badmouth publicly. They tolerate or wink to their members who badmouth muslims and they routinely pursue policies which are meant only to target muslims

.

I am yet to see BJP members who badmouth all muslims. They bad mouth all people who oppose them. Muslims or communist or Hindus. Again your mind seeks out "muslims" and expect minority appeasement and the absence of which is considered "communal".

4. I didn't knew about the result. But yes, Muslim League won even in Madras then. What else is going to happen in an exclusively Muslim electorate when you have a communal party naming itself muslim and threatening that their religion is in danger. The same is happening with Hindutva brigade threatening us that Hinduism is in danger.

Its been proven that ML spoke for the Muslims and they demanded Partition. You have lost your point.