1965 War Documentary Fath-e-Mobin

[Jamwal's]

Want to talk about achievements? Here are some I doubt your army has even come close to doing:

Most Israeli jets shot down in history:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saiful_Azam

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sattar_Alvi

Most amount of jets shot in under a minute:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Mahmood_Alam

4th country to officially develop and use armed UAV's:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burraq_UCAV

Won gold in Cambrian patrol:

http://tribune.com.pk/story/979201/pakistan-army-wins-gold-in-exercise-cambrian-patrol-in-uk/

Beat Eurofighter with F-16:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/06/08/eurofighter_beaten_by_f16/

I can give more if you want.



My bad, I read it wrong.

@500

@DavidSling

@Natan

@Solomon2

Is it true some PAF pilot shot down your jets in Arab - Israel conflicts ?

 

[cerberus]

There are a lot of pictures of Indian armour, war planes and POWs. Only if you choose to look at them.

But i know you wont because you are an Indian.

one Tank one Plane That's all

This We called War Pictures
to Look What We Posted Dear Ratio is 1: 8
In counter of your One Picture We Posted 8-9 Pictures at Go

There More Delicate Pictures But I Don't Want To Disrespect Died Soldiers

The Pakistan Army's elite 1 Armoured Corps met its Waterloo in the Battle of Assal Uttar as they lost nearly 165 tanks, many of them being brand new M-48 Pattons. Bhikiwind was used as a temporary tank cemetery to house some 60 captured & destroyed M-48 Pattons, M-24 Chafees and M4 Shermans. The cemetery stood as a standing memorial to Pakistan's humiliating defeat in the battle of Assal Uttar.

 

[nik141993]

Indian trolls posted same pictures and post just to destroy the thread. height of insecurity, jealousy and BS.

why dont you post pics of mighty battle of chawinda where you claim to destroy more than 100 indian tank

 

[Joe Shearer]

Both sides had mis-adventured in 1965. Indians invaded Pakistan Rann of Kutch and failed In response, Pakistan started Op Gibraltar, which went nowhere.

This is difficult to understand, since both sides agreed to arbitration of the Rann of Kutch dispute. How could Pakistan have started Operation Gibraltar in response to this matter under arbitration?

In retaliation, India invaded international border considering Pakistan a walkover but Pakistan defended itself. Its a win for Pakistan because India couldnt get any territory from Pakistan.

And where did Operation Grand Slam vanish in between? Have you forgotten that in response to the admitted failure of Operation Gibraltar, it was Pakistan who attacked Indian formations with tanks and artillery, in an outright assault on a poorly-guarded part of the frontier containing the single approach road to Kashmir? Have you decided to erase the magnificent gift to India of Ayub Khan and Musa Khan, replacing Akhtar Malik in mid-battle, as a result of which Indian reinforcements could rush in, and as a response to which India attacked on the Lahore and Sialkot sectors?

When you say India couldn't get any territory from Pakistan, was that ever a war aim, or is that a post-facto justification by Pakistan of having thrown in everything into an offensive war and failed?

Both sides signed Tashkent agreement and went on to same positions.

Indian second misadventure in 1965 had failed miserably.

It is weird that attacks by Pakistan in the Rann of Kutch, where her claims were dismissed by the tribunal with an award of 10% of the claim, in Kashmir in Operation Gibraltar, and again in Kashmir in Operation Grand Slam, come out worded in your wording as an Indian misadventure. If it were not so tragic, it would be funny.

why dont you post pics of mighty battle of chawinda where you claim to destroy more than 100 indian tank

And why don't you, if it comes to that, publish the account of Major Agha Amin (no, not Indian Army) about the Gadag Gallop? Or Z. A. Khan's account?

How come with such brilliant war historians available, themselves Pakistanis, you could come out only with some nonsense from YouTube and from propaganda channels?

 

[cerberus]

why dont you post pics of mighty battle of chawinda where you claim to destroy more than 100 indian tank

They Can't this Only Authentic Pic they have

One Centurion Tank in all Images

 

[unbiasedopinion]

How about you tell me?

Try...That will be a good brain exercise.

 

[cerberus]

And why don't you, if it comes to that, publish the account of Major Agha Amin (no, not Indian Army) about the Gadag Gallop? Or Z. A. Khan's account?

How come with such brilliant war historians available, themselves Pakistanis, you could come out only with some nonsense from YouTube and from propaganda channels?

@Joe Shearer I Doubt they Compile All the War Data And Operation Details
MOD Already Declassified & Published Most War Plans And Details

© History Division, Ministry of Defence, Government of India
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/ARMY/history/1965war/275-war-history-1965.html

 

[Joe Shearer]

@Joe Shearer I Doubt they Compile All the War Data And Operation Details
MOD Already Declassified & Published Most War Plans And Details

© History Division, Ministry of Defence, Government of India
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/ARMY/Galleries/Wars/PattonNagar/1965/6514.jpg.html

Unfortunately, many of us don't trust Bharat Rakshak, because of its virulently hostile anti-Pakistani stance. While they have genuinely valuable information, it is difficult to bring oneself to go there or to join them, in spite of having been friendly with some of their most vaunted experts, for that extreme skew in their thinking (the military music section is an exception, as that is the only place where most of the Indian Army march music is recorded and preserved).

I myself possess copies of the military histories of the 1965 war, but they are at Dera Bassi and not at hand; most of my books are there. I am relying on the accounts of Pakistani historians themselves, and of the eminent Pakistani military people, people like their former Air Chief, for my view of things.

There are official histories of the war from the Pakistani side, but Major Amin is scathing in his critique of those, and I hesitate to use them for that reason only.

 

[cerberus]

PAF also suffered the same fate i.e gracing our museum as wreckages.

Now it don't even show up agaisnt IAF even for CAS roles desperately needed by NLI in 1999- we haven't seen it in kargil and hopefully never will.

View attachment 317248


View attachment 317251

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Commemorating another 'Sabre Slayer' - then Flying Officer P S Pingale, who had to eject after being shot down on September 6th, took to the air ten days later and extracted his pound of flesh - by shooting down a PAF Sabre. During this short but fierce encounter, Pingale also went head to head in air combat with the Pakistani ace M M Alam.

Fg Offr Shaukat Ali of the PAF was shot down and taken POW - He would later join the Bangladesh Air Force after the 1971 war and then visit India again as a guest for a Staff

Fg Offr Feroze Bunsha was shot down in aircombat and lost his life on 16th September

Unfortunately, many of us don't trust Bharat Rakshak, because of its virulently hostile anti-Pakistani stance. While they have genuinely valuable information, it is difficult to bring oneself to go there or to join them, in spite of having been friendly with some of their most vaunted experts, for that extreme skew in their thinking (the military music section is an exception, as that is the only place where most of the Indian Army march music is recorded and preserved).

I myself possess copies of the military histories of the 1965 war, but they are at Dera Bassi and not at hand; most of my books are there. I am relying on the accounts of Pakistani historians themselves, and of the eminent Pakistani military people, people like their former Air Chief, for my view of things.

There are official histories of the war from the Pakistani side, but Major Amin is scathing in his critique of those, and I hesitate to use them for that reason only.

Well They Compiled Most of the Valuable Information Better the Wikipedia As Source Guess As Military Enthusiast
I Use it

Your Veteran I Guess Im Civilian Bureaucrat Ever Need Help Regarding After Post Retirement Benefits You can Contact me I See Accounts

 

[Joe Shearer]

Commemorating another 'Sabre Slayer' - then Flying Officer P S Pingale, who had to eject after being shot down on September 6th, took to the air ten days later and extracted his pound of flesh - by shooting down a PAF Sabre. During this short but fierce encounter, Pingale also went head to head in air combat with the Pakistani ace M M Alam.

Fg Offr Shaukat Ali of the PAF was shot down and taken POW - He would later join the Bangladesh Air Force after the 1971 war and then visit India again as a guest for a Staff

Fg Offr Feroze Bunsha was shot down in aircombat and lost his life on 16th September

Well They Compiled Most of the Valuable Information Better the Wikipedia As Source Guess As Military Enthusiast
I Use it

Your Veteran I Guess Im Civilian Bureaucrat Ever Need Help Regarding After Post Retirement Benefits You can Contact me I See Accounts

It is true, their information is excellent, their archives are very good. I might ask you to bring out stuff from time to time

That was your version but the reality is bit different if not the case then why Mrs. Gandhi said in 1971 that she took revenge of 1965 defeat?

What incredible delusion.

When and where did she say that? I was around then; nothing like that was ever reported. Did someone come and whisper this in your ear?

Did you give 1 month notice to India when you did Operation Gibraltar?

@unbiasedopinion

Wrong question.

Ask the duffer if he knows what Operation Grand Slam. Ask him to count the days between Grand Slam and India's counter-attack. An extract from Wiki, since this generation apparently only relies on Wiki and on YouTube for their information:

On 1 September 1965, Pakistan launched a counterattack, called Operation Grand Slam, with the objective to capture the vital town of Akhnoor in Jammu, which would sever communications and cut off supply routes to Indian troops. Ayub Khan calculated that "Hindu morale would not stand more than a couple of hard blows at the right time and place"[49][50][51] although by this time Operation Gibraltar had failed and India had captured the Haji Pir Pass.[49][52]At 3:30 hours, on 1 September 1965, the entire Chhamb area came under massive artillery bombardment. Pakistan had launched operation Grand Slam and India's Army Headquarter was taken by surprise.[53] Attacking with an overwhelming ratio of troops and technically superior tanks, Pakistan made gains against Indian forces, who were caught unprepared and suffered heavy losses. India responded by calling in its air force to blunt the Pakistani attack. The next day, Pakistan retaliated, its air force attacked Indian forces and air bases in both Kashmir and Punjab.

So much for their stories of India having launched unprovoked attacks.

 

[Windjammer]

IAF's top range fighter MiG-21 is shot down by the humble Sabre.

IAF Canberra bombers burning after an attack by PAF on their base.

Indian army convoy in the gun sights of a PAF aircraft, many Indian soldiers simply jumped out of their vehicles with engines running,

Smoke rises from Pathankot runway as it comes under attack by PAF in broad daylight.

IAF SU-7 falls in flames.

 

[Delnavaz B]

What incredible delusion.

When and where did she say that? I was around then; nothing like that was ever reported. Did someone come and whisper this in your ear?

History which i read and i have no concern that you was there or you took part. My father and uncle served in army and they are my best sources.

 

[.]

Now, now, Delnavaz. Lets not fool ourselves here. When a country goes to war, the economy goes down, besides this is pre 90's, you guys were sitting there enjoying your little boom. You guys creamed yourselves when we lost in 62' so you decided to take advantage. I personally congratulate you for defending lahore. Let this be a reminder to never set foot in Kashmir again. History has a bad habit of repeating itself.

Yes there were no reported "famine" in Pakistan after the war.. India was struck with Economic repercussions as so because being a Already hugely troubled state in the 1960s,Bihar famine of 1966 can be one example.However I can't understand the stupidity of some members who say India gained more territory?
Pakistan was actually successful in occupying Indian territories hence it setup pill box defenses along its occupied territories,India had a 3x larger Infantry than Pakistan
700,000 Indian Infantry
700+ aircrafts(IAF performed extremely poorly in the war)
720 Tanks

Pakistani forces
260,000 Infantry
280 aircrafts
756 Tanks(Fought valiantly but lost more tanks)
As per offical records
India it Just got back what It lost,Pakistan didn't loose any significant territory In fact we went in Screwed Indians up and when Indians came spilling like cockroaches in Greater numbers Pakistan had to fall back.
I have read fair enough analysis of the MBT's both sides had during the war.
The Indian centurion tank was by far a better than the Pakistani tanks,British tanks have always been ahead of the American tanks,Just like the Armour protection of Challenger is far better than M1Abrams
Pakistan should've not had the chaffes (Light Medium tanks) Or simply Light tanks.
Below is a answer from a Guy who personally drove both of these tanks.

Dave Sherry, Tank Commander, Tech Diver, motorbike rider, and I have been to both countries..
Interesting. Laser-based night vision on the M48? I think not. The generlaisations you amke in repect of the tanks is really quite appalling. While the statsis of the M48 appear better, in fact in tanks it's is all about cross country mobility, armour and firepower. In all respects the Centurion out performed the M48 killing the pakistani tanks at long range with no fear of retaliation. The M48 was effectively a lighter descendent of the Pershing, thinner armour and torsion bar suspension. it was neither as well armoured as the Centurion whcih also had a superior gun the L7 105MM that outranged and hit harder than the US guns.
Initially, the Pakistanis made the Indian army retreat to defensive positions to which then the Pakistanis advanced in an unsophisticated attack. This led to a large numebr of their vehicles being destroyed not just by RCL but mainly by the centurions.
(Google answer for source)

As for pictures how about these ones

Indian Prisoners of War (POWs) captured during 1965 war participating in three-legged race in a POW camp.

Pakistani soldiers celebrating after hoisting a Pakistani flag on an Indian check post, while on right, Indian flag is being replaced by the Pakistani one.

Pakistani soldiers atop captured Indian tanks.(Shermans)

Pakistani Desert Force after capturing the Loganewala posts.

Pakistani soldiers pose in front of a captured tank of India’s Poona Horse Regiment.

A Pakistani soldier standing next to the signboard of Muanbao Railway Station.

 

[Delnavaz B]

people like their former Air Chief

And that air chief later become political enemy of Ayub Khan and have personal grudge against him thats why he was mouthing against his actions first check his political affiliations then believe on him just like many Generals mouthing against Musharaf because he refuses to share power with them.

 

[Joe Shearer]

History which i read and i have no concern that you was there or you took part. My father and uncle served in army and they are my best sources.

OK.

Cite the history that you have read.