195 Pak army men to be tried by Dhaka for war crimes

[karan.1970]

Deserves a Bollywood flick if nothing else..

 

[Saiful Islam]

Sheikh Mujib had to have smoken on his crack pipe to come up with numbers such as 3 mill.

 

[Jf Thunder]

India should break diplomatic ties with Bangladesh

 

[45'22']

India should break diplomatic ties with Bangladesh

why so????its working fine from India's pov.......

 

[Jf Thunder]

why so????its working fine from India's pov.......

nothing i just felt like trolling .__.

 

[Skies]

What an attention seeking country, sorry if I offended any BD members here but that's what it looks like.

Here things are not as clear as you see; you are totally unaware, or have misunderstood. BAL/Hasina's aim is not to get PK's attention at all, but to keep the past wound alive to make us hate PK so much that we do not hate India even though we have valid and conclusive reasons to raise voice against India.

Here generally in BD, if someone hates India, he does not hate PK, or vice verse. Since India feels BD as threat, it does want that if somehow we keep hating PK, we wont hate India naturally. This is an unfortunate phenomena in BD connected with the ideology of Two Nation Theory.

Hasina has nothing to do with PK, but to do everything against PK being subservient of India. India bought her, and she circumscribed herself along with this country.

 

[Icarus]

The generally quoted figure for rapes is 200,000.

As I said, 90,000 POWS, not 90,000 soldiers.

It is eminently doable by 58,000 people over a course of 9 months. There are BD sources that debunk this myth than it was not doable mathematically, I would avoid posting that for now.

Much smaller number of Mongols used to do it a thousand years back with just swords. Here these people had American supplied guns and bullets.

[/QUOTE]

58,000 guys raping 200,000 women is possible but only if everyone was in on the game. I doubt it was like that. I mean, unless its an order it can't be practiced by all uniformed men, right?
Secondly, testimony from Bangladesh itself seem to counter-act the rape claim. During the raid on Shankharipara, known for the iconic picture of a man lying dead with an infant, insurgents alleged mass-rape against Hindu females whereas the occupants of the town, who were questioned after the breakaway of Bangladesh have maintained that only one house was raided, there too no doors were broken down, rather all men were asked to produce themselves to the Army for questioning and the only casualties were the dead man in the picture and his infant son because he had jumped over the wall and attempted to escape and was shot by men for non-compliance to the verbal order for his return. The infant, also alleged killed by the Army actually died in the fall. The bodies were then taken to the courtyard by locals where the picture was taken in an attempt to paint it as an execution. This is the testimony of Amiya Kumar Sur, the son of the dead man in the picture, the occupant of the sole house that was raided.
In Dhaka University as well, the wife of Prof. Guhatakhurta says that the Army men were not interested in women and their conduct towards women was perfectly fine, she and her daughters were not harmed, her home was searched by a Lt who reprimanded a soldier for kicking a door in Mrs. Guhatakhurta's presence and they left with her husband, never having done anything to harm the sanctity of the women. Even when soldiers conducted a search of her house in the absence of an officer or her husband, they never misbehaved with the women and keep in mind that this was deep into the night where any attempt to engage in any act below the dignity of a soldier could have easily been disguised. Families of other faculty present at the University at the time, recount similar instances.

Sir, I think i read somewhere that Regular Army troops were around 40K. Are you sure it was 58K? Are you including Paramilitary & Police too in 58K figure?

Yes this includes the loyal elements of EPR and East Pak Police as well.

 

[Vinod2070]

As I said, 90,000 POWS, not 90,000 soldiers.

OK. Though I would assume that no family members would have been made POWs.

58,000 guys raping 200,000 women is possible but only if everyone was in on the game. I doubt it was like that. I mean, unless its an order it can't be practiced by all uniformed men, right?

Not necessarily. Even 10%-20% of these people can carry out the genocide and rapine on this scale over 9 months. And majority of these people would never need to get involved.

 

[Ayush]

In 1971 to be precise.






That was the last nail actually.

really?

 

[EAK]

Hell No. We nailed it.
Long ago.......
In 1971 to be precise.






That was the last nail actually.

lol mumbai needs no explanation... so when ur strategic bombers are coming

 

[Vinod2070]

lol mumbai needs no explanation... so when ur strategic bombers are coming

You are having a Mumbai every week. Though we are sad for every loss of human life. That is the difference between us and we would like to keep it that way.

And are the drones and daisy cutters not enough?

 

[EAK]

You are having a Mumbai every week. Though we are sad for every loss of human life. That is the difference between us and we would like to keep it that way.

And are the drones and daisy cutters not enough?

lol cant do jack urself and chest thumping on drones... pity

 

[Icarus]

OK. Though I would assume that no family members would have been made POWs.

They were, the unfortunate ones who weren't were paraded around, had their eyes gouged out and were hacked or bayoneted to death by Bengali Rebels.

Not necessarily. Even 10%-20% of these people can carry out the genocide and rapine on this scale over 9 months. And majority of these people would never need to get involved.

Surely they could, but question is where? If there was mass rape, where did it happen? I can't find a single instance. Even rebels deny that women were defiled by Pakistani troops. Joynal Abedin, who organized an ambush against a passing military convoy at Tangail also denied reports by Awami League activists that after their defeat, the rebel's homes were raided by the military and the women were raped. He says that no man was killed except those killed in the cross-fire between rebels and the Army and no woman was touched. Whereas there are many people on record to say that there were no acts of force against women, as I have demonstrated. There are none to say otherwise. We have all heard those tall tales of women being raped in rape camps, of having to satisfy 40 men a day, of women strangling their babies with their own umbilical cords but the problem remains that why doesn't anyone confirm that they actually witnessed this?
I'll tell you why, because it was all a pack of lies used to stir the Bengali masses but it was and thus turned out to be a farce.

 

[Vinod2070]

lol cant do jack urself and chest thumping on drones... pity

Au contraire, we can all see who was jerking off on the Mumbai terror attack.

Just as who was celebrating 9/11 and other such attacks.

They were, the unfortunate ones who weren't were paraded around, had their eyes gouged out and were hacked or bayoneted to death by Bengali Rebels.

Truly sad events.

In this case, I believe the POWs mentioned in the stamp were those in Indian custody. India provided them full protection and I don't think any family members were made POWs.

Surely they could, but question is where? If there was mass rape, where did it happen? I can't find a single instance. Even rebels deny that women were defiled by Pakistani troops. Joynal Abedin, who organized an ambush against a passing military convoy at Tangail also denied reports by Awami League activists that after their defeat, the rebel's homes were raided by the military and the women were raped. He says that no man was killed except those killed in the cross-fire between rebels and the Army and no woman was touched. Whereas there are many people on record to say that there were no acts of force against women, as I have demonstrated. There are none to say otherwise. We have all heard those tall tales of women being raped in rape camps, of having to satisfy 40 men a day, of women strangling their babies with their own umbilical cords but the problem remains that why doesn't anyone confirm that they actually witnessed this?
I'll tell you why, because it was all a pack of lies used to stir the Bengali masses but it was and thus turned out to be a farce.

Well, there are contradictory claims. However, your own Hamidoor commission report mentions Hindus being singled out for violence and genocide.

It was a process euphemistically called "being sent to Bangladesh". The killing and torture of respectable citizens of East Pakistan incensed an already hostile people. A host of army officers who were ordered to - and carried out - these atrocities, provided details to the commission. "Brigadier Arbab... told me to destroy all houses in Joydepur. To a great extent I executed this order," said Lt-Colonel Aziz Ahmad Khan, then commanding officer (CO) of 8 Baluch in his deposition. "General Niazi asked as to how many Hindus we had killed. In May, there was an order in writing to kill Hindus."

1971 war: 'How many Hindus have you killed?' : Cover Story - India Today

 

[Icarus]

Truly sad events.

In this case, I believe the POWs mentioned in the stamp were those in Indian custody. India provided them full protection and I don't think any family members were made POWs.

Families were taken by the Indians as well because like I said, the Indians were seen as deliverance for the families after the surrender, Indians offered protection from a horrible death at the hands of the Mukties. Families were taken too but they were kept in separate camps or in prison blocks emptied for the same reason, treatment of all prisoners was in accordance with
the Geneva Convention.

Well, there are contradictory claims. However, your own Hamidoor commission report mentions Hindus being singled out for violence and genocide.
1971 war: 'How many Hindus have you killed?' : Cover Story - India Today

I have read the article and I believe that it takes selected portions of transmissions and conversations and applies them to make a broad generalization, I will start with the part about Joydevpur in the start for an example. The post mentions about an officer being ordered to destroy houses in Joydevpur, a task he says he fulfilled to a good degree, what is neglected however is the fact that Joydevpur had been the center of the 2nd EBR mutiny and had seen the massacre of all Non-Bengali and their families in the area, the mutineers as well as locals had carried out a genocide of a couple of thousand people by the time 8th Baluch got there and the dead included West Pakistani Officers, soldiers and their families and also a vast Bihari civilian population. Under such a situation, the troops were routinely fired upon and huts close to the Battalion HQ, used as vantage points were destroyed after being captured from mutineers and insurgents. Now you see how context breathes new life into the whole turn of events.

As for the order to kill Hindus, if such an order had ever been passed, the largest single hindu dwelling in East Pakistan Shankharipara would have been the scene of a bloodbath but ironically even when it is alleged that a sweeping order to kill all hindus was passed, only two were killed, one of whom was killed by accident.
Whereas I can safely say that many Hindus might have been killed for no fault of their own, however there was never a sweeping order for killing all Hindus.

Similarly the part about being asked "How many Bengalis were shot" is also taken out of context and is derived out of a radio transmission recorded 25th March 1971 when Brigade HQ asked an officer how many insurgents had been arrested or killed, the officer replied that no one had been arrested but they might have killed over a 100. The word "Bengali" or shot was never used, it was derived.

Quite ironically, the real massacres like those in Crescent Jute Mill and People's Jute Mill were never publicized much because the Government felt that they might instigate violence against Bengalis back in West Pakistan. In one night, over 15,000 recorded fatalities of Biharis occurred and their bodies dumped in the water made it difficult to cross by boat. These are just the recorded casualties, collected, recorded, identified and buried, locals still assert that the total number killed was in the hundreds of thousands but for the sake of keeping this discussion grounded in facts, I will stick with the recorded figures only.