14 dead in shooting at San Bernardino, Calif., center for disabled; 3 suspects on loose

[VCheng]

^

This is a badly worded article from Dawn (was expecting better from them to be honest).

The news article only states that the "CNIC number" seems to be in the name of the alleged lady as checked through NADRA's SMS service, that's all.

FWIW, it might be a totally different person with the same credentials.

It nowhere proves that the "CNIC copy" doing the rounds is authentic. IMO, that's a PS'd image.

Okay, we can wait for an official statement by NADRA then, if you prefer that.

 

[VCheng]

Following the money trail:

California terrorists got a $28k payment two weeks before attack - suspicious transfer revealed as FBI says couple had been radicalized for 'some time' and had rigged building to blow after massacre

• Pipe bombs placed by Syed Rizwan Farook and Tashfeen Malik were supposed to detonate when first responders arrived on scene
• But the bombs at the Inland Regional Center in San Bernardino, California, never detonated
• FBI says Farook and Malik were radicalized and had been 'for some time'
• Investigators are also looking into a $28,000 deposit was made into Syed Farook’s bank account two weeks before the shooting
• Farook visited Riverside Magnum Shooting Range twice in the days before the San Bernardino shooting, and Malik joined him at least once

San Bernardino terrorists rigged building to blow up as first responders arrived | Daily Mail Online

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Whereas I'm pointing out that IF the scholar is correct, THEN it's the belief that Islam is the one "true religion" that has to change for Islamic society to achieve tolerance. If there's room for different schools of Islamic thought, doesn't that imply there have to be different approaches to achieving tolerance as well?

Rather cunning, isn't he? Don't his rhetorical questions and comparisons rule out forms of Islamic practice that would allow non-Muslim communities to grow in size or even remain stable, leaving the listener to conclude that prevention or compulsion - that is, force - must be used against non-Muslims and backsliders?

Think of it this way: you're traveling and there's a fork in the road leading three different ways. Your guide and companion says you can't take the first or second ways. He doesn't explicitly say to take the third way: he leaves you to conclude that the only way to go is the third way - or else turn back.

You're essentially arguing against the ideological concept of "one true faith" (no matter what the religion is called), correct?

Jihad is an ugly conflict. .I don't see how disgracing Jihadis or their manufacturers is distasteful...that's the least one can do other than bomb the crap out of such countries.

My comment was perhaps not phrased correctly - I was calling the alleged comments of Pakistanis directed at Indian soldiers killed by insurgent groups distasteful.

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

Starting with Talibans in 1980s and later Al Qaeeda in 1990s and now Daesh in 2010s these groups have hijacked Islam and using it for their criminal aims. Any Muslim that tries to reason with them is termed as Munafiq as they only consider their own followers as true Muslims. There are foreign powers that are manipulating these groups for their own political and strategic aims. Pakistan is stilling using Talibans in Afghanistan and Daesh is supported by Saudi Arabia, Zionazis and many western governments.

 

[spinghar]

again pakistani national? Are they Afghani by any chance?

 

[Solomon2]

You're essentially arguing against the ideological concept of "one true faith" (no matter what the religion is called), correct?.

The contrapositive is always true. So if what the scholar said is correct yet you reject the outcome he supports, then modifying the IF part must be the way to go. Because the contrapostive is always true, It's not my argument but his: just stated as a double negative and inverse.

A little more on Islamic scholars and terrorism here:
The Source Of Islamic Terrorist Justification

 

[VCheng]

So who else knew?



Shooting targets, GoPro packaging, hammer and 'vise grips' found by FBI in car belonging to San Bernardino shooter's MOTHER

• Car registered to Rafia Farook was searched by FBI agents after her son and daughter-in-law massacred 14 last Wednesday
• She lived in same house as where the couple amassed thousands of rounds of ammo and built pipe bombs
• FBI agents raided Lexus registered in her name and seized list of items, including packaging for GoPro
• Unclear what happened to camera as law enforcement say one was not used in course of mass murderers by ISIS-inspired husband and wife
• Rafia Farook has not been charged but attorney-general has said her possible knowledge or involvement is being looked at 'very closely'
• The family's lawyer says mother did not know her son was planning atrocity

Shooting targets, GoPro packaging and hammer found in Syed Farook's mother's car | Daily Mail Online

 

[Solomon2]

California terrorists got a $28k payment two weeks before attack - suspicious transfer revealed -

Whoa! No "lone wolf" white supremacist ever got external payments before carrying out an attack.

Any Muslim that tries to reason with them is termed as Munafiq as they only consider their own followers as true Muslims. There are foreign powers that are manipulating these groups for their own political and strategic aims...

I note that Jinnah refused to label anyone claiming to be a Muslim as munafiq. When did Pakistan abandon this?

...Pakistan is stilling using Talibans in Afghanistan and Daesh is supported by Saudi Arabia, Zionazis and many western governments.

What are "Zionazis", exactly? Is it supposed to be some insulting and inaccurate portmanteau for Zionists?

 

[Azad-Kashmiri]

I felt Islam to be more radical than ever now

Islam hasn't changed, Muslims have. It's a shame from this one statement you left Islam without knowing it.

support women rights in my view Islam didn't provide women the freedom or equality to women equally when compared to men

I'm interested to know what inequality you're talking about.

 

[pakdefender]

There's no need to go back in time more than a hundred years. The Ottoman Caliph enjoined upon his departing subjects and the League of Nations set up the Mandate of Palestine with the call for Jews to closely settle the area while preserving Arab and Jewish civil and property rights; Jews bought land from Arabs legally or settled on the remaining land granted them by the Caliph after the British chopped off 70% to become Jordan from where the Arabs then expelled the Jews; the Arabs told themselves they could take the Jews money in Mandate Palestine and then kill the Jews and regain the land they sold or wasn't theirs once the British departed. As the Brits left the Arabs decided to go to war and the Jews did what they had to to protect Jews' lives. That didn't involve massacring Arabs but defeating Arab arms and creating a defensible state to protect the lives of the citizenry.

even by just going back 100 years ask yourself why did jews want to buy lands in this area or settle in this ? it all goes back to the narrative of the exodus and the return , doesn't it

and it is that narrative that drives Zionists like yourself to resort to violence and land grab

So my original question about reform in rabbinical judiasim stays valid

 

[Solomon2]

even by just going back 100 years ask yourself why did jews want to buy lands in this area or settle in this...it is that narrative that drives Zionists like yourself to resort to violence and land grab

Read what you wrote, it's self-contradictory.

 

[FullMetalJacket]

even by just going back 100 years ask yourself why did jews want to buy lands in this area or settle in this ? it all goes back to the narrative of the exodus and the return , doesn't it

and it is that narrative that drives Zionists like yourself to resort to violence and land grab

So my original question about reform in rabbinical judiasim stays valid

And what exactly did muslim invaders and conquerers do? Peacefully enter a country, and politely ask for the current rulers to step down, and kindly replace whatever faith they had with Islam? If it's history your're after, then what the Israelies did or are doing is nothing compared to what the muslims and the christians have done. Don't give me any of that zionist conspiracy crap either. So much hipocracy, it's astounding.

 

[Dubious]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10153130877991104

3 WHITE SHOOTERS = 1 brown Muslim + 1 brown Muslim woman

Shoot the brown people than handcuff them and get a hero badge and enough Islamophobia across the nation to tilt it towards a bigot like Donald Duck!

And as this is a government institution how come there is no camera recording to be shown? Maybe because it would show a "three tall men in black" ?! There are many questions unanswered, and probably we will not get answers soon......



San Bernardino police chief confirmed the same day that a third person fled from the SUV has been detained. But he also told that person may not be involved in the shooting. Sounds funny? A person who accompanied two shooters in the same SUV that was shot at by the police and two people are dead in a hail of bullets, but the third person survived the hail of bullets and he may not be involved in the crime. Certainly sounds spooky to me.

So crazy that one of the witness not only says she is certain they were 3 tall white men but also she described them wearing a "black long sleeve shirt with gloves" the suspect was hand cuffed while he is already dead and has a short sleeve shirt.

How come every time US or Western media has to pin the blame for an attacks on so called Muslim Islamic Religious fundamentalists. ..everything gets very murky...several eyewitnesses are claiming they saw 3 tall white males with athletic physique shooting and come to out find out the shooters were Muslim husband and wife...

 

[Assange]

Islam hasn't changed, Muslims have. It's a shame from this one statement you left Islam without knowing it.

I'm interested to know what inequality you're talking about.

Well I didn't leave Islam for that one statement....As you have said Muslims have changed so did interpretation of Islam's Holly Book, I really feel Islam is still in stone ages it should be updated this is my personal view....

Secondly about women rights...I think Muslim men are so used to it that they do not consider some stuff which are imposed on women are humane but it is not....Let's just take burka or Hjab or whatever you say...in few communities I have seen elders want women to even cover their eyes using that black cloth....women are not allowed to have their own mobile phones...education is another problem...child marriages in Islam have increased when a girl attends the age 14 she gets married to someone.... we impose so many things on women but when it comes men we don't care...men can wear whatever they want, a male can have multiple wives...etc etc...

Moreover it is my choice to follow whichever religion I want to, having said that let us not discuss about this anymore....I feel I left Islam for good....

 

[VCheng]

The Denial Brigade is now claiming that three white men shot up the place. How interesting these conspiracy theorists can get. Next we will hear they were not circumcised and had skull tattoos too.

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San Bernardino shooter Syed Farook was planning attack in 2012 with someone else | Daily Mail Online

Hunt for a THIRD terrorist linked to San Bernardino attackers: Syed Farook planned attack in 2012 with someone else - and his wife could have been a terror 'operative'

• Farook and an unidentified person conspired in 2012 and a specific target was considered, officials said
• But they did not go through with the earlier attack after several terror-related arrests in the area had them ‘spooked'
• Officials also announced that they are investigating the possibility that his wife and fellow attacker Tashfeen Malik was ‘an operative’
• Farook and Malik are believed to have been radicalized ‘for some time’
• Another investigation underway into a $28,500 loan from an online lender that Farook took out two weeks before the shooting rampage