Y-7 AWACS

[anonymous123]

LMAO at the jealous neighbour

 

[houshanghai]

new pic

 

[tanlixiang28776]

really?
why bother trying to purchase Phalcon?
because its so much more expensive right?
It is well known fact, that materials cost the same! Your T-99 mbt or otherwise would cost the same in the US!
the only difference in price would come from R&D, which needs to be payed off.
It is not that building at home is the best thing for China, rather it is the only option for China!
R&D costs are massive, that is why collabration is the new buzz word.
China does have a massive economy, but since your so good with numbers, you should also be aware,
India's GDP is what China's was 10 years ago. but i'm sure you realize that.

We didn't have the KJ 2000 program when we tried buying the Phalcon. 3 years later we did. China always has a contingency plan unlike a certain un named country.

And no materials do not cost the same in any country. For example China currently supplies 97% of the worlds rare earth medals. Rare earth medals are far cheaper to China then anyone else.

As for R&D the costs are covered.

And if you feel buying foreign AWACs forever for India is a good idea thats fine. But we feel differently for China

Collaboration is fine when you feel like having a open book. Once again we feel differently.

Yes GDP of India is similar to China 10 years ago.

However development of arms is vastly different.

 

[teddy]

really?
why bother trying to purchase Phalcon?

like 11 yrs ago, when china realize they cannot get the phalcon, they started to develop the KJ-2000.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

oh yes, China does.
J-10 recieved IOC in 2006, and till date it is yet to recieve FOC.
but more than a 100 J-10s are in service. powered by Russian engines, like your 500+ fleet of flankers,
compared to Indias 110+ flankers.
The PLA are not as stringent as the PA or InA. that is fact. That is why when Pakistani's order something, Chinese, it comes with a dash of western equipment or soviet.
example would be AK which uses a Ukrainian engine, and an FCS from somewhere else i hope. Your FC-1 concept was mangled and brushed off for a JF-17, and the PAF still wants to employ western avonics and equipment on it.
despite China's emergence in R&D, the lack of international collabration has left it in a somewhat of a darkage.
the only help arrives from the bankrupt Russian firms. who also sold you the license production of Su-27, and yet you harp saying its indegnious.
which by the was is made in China, but the PLAAF still pay royalties for the J-11. they always will, unless, unless ofcourse, they want the fleet flankers to be grounded when the Russians stop the sale of engines.
regards,
ps, your ultra patriotism is joke for me.

There was no expenses spared for the 4 AESAs on the 052C or the 3 on the KJ 2000. These two projects alone cost at least 10 billion dollars.

There are precisely 224 J 10 variants identified within the PLAAF, PLAANAF, and August performance team. We have very different standards of FOC compared to the IAF.

As for IA standards don't make me laugh. The INSAS is inducted despite its mediocre performance if even that. Even your own troops want more AK 47s. A rifle that China license produced and then retired two generations before.

As for engines that is a weakness of the PLA. However all J11B have WS 10A engines, and even the J 20 flight test was with WS 10Gs.

As for the FC 1 "concept" it already equips two squadrons. And for PAF they will receive Chinese AESA next year. Its not a dark age so much as a Cambrian explosion.

I have never called the J 11 indigenous but heres some facts. Its far more indigenous than anything India has. The entire thing is made in China including airframe, Avionics, Radar, Engine, IRST, OBOGS, and especially A2G weapons which the original sukhoi completely lacks. Even the original steel airframe has been largely replaced with composites.

And no PLAAF paid for the 200 originally ordered. No more, no less. As for engines we have not ordered any more. WS 10A have been used for years now. Funny you should mention engines though seeing as India has to send them to Russia to get maintained.

PS. Write coherantly and try to argue with facts. Not the crap you self masturbate to on Bharat Rakshak.

 

[teddy]

:

We did try to purchase the phalcon. US blocked it.

We then invested billions of dollars into a Domestic AWACS.

As for 3 years, not everyone follows India's timeline in producing weapons. We plan something and we get it done.

Three AESAs give continuous 360 coverage and thats pretty important when it has to cover several hundred kilometers of area

As for your Bharat Rakshak logic. It might get you a few pats on the backs there there but it won't work here.

And India has yet to deploy any domestic airborne AESA. Thats also a history lesson. See how off topic that is?

The IL 76 has plenty of power to keep the AESAs cool. Don't you worry.

The KJ 2000 has been in service for 8 years now, and there are far more than just two AESA programs.

Yes you are very much jealous, and you show it by trolling here.

I wonder what can indian achieve when they cannot get any foreign support. Can they catch up china in technology? no! they can't, even technology aid from all side.
Indian is a lucky guy compare to china, china is under 360 degree blockage of western, everything is count on themself. But indian can easily find someone to help.

It is actually a shame for indian to claim they are better then china. [

 

[anonymous123]

I bet those smelly land mine alone would deter any soldier from setting foot there, could you imagine falling into the river full of those thing???ewww man

 

[tanlixiang28776]

I bet those smelly land mine alone would deter any soldier from setting foot there, could you imagine falling into the river full of those thing???ewww man

Wrong thread lassie?

 

[anonymous123]

Wrong thread lassie?

no man, just testing reaction

 

[teddy]

really?
It is not that building at home is the best thing for China, rather it is the only option for China!
R&D costs are massive, that is why collabration is the new buzz word.
China does have a massive economy, but since your so good with numbers, you should also be aware,
India's GDP is what China's was 10 years ago. but i'm sure you realize that.

I had never heard a superpower can be build by import goods from others, what if wars happen or your country is under blockage? Your equipment is lack of parts. and armoury need refill? This is not a good or bad issue, this is a strategic issue.

 

[desimorty]

that was 10 years ago......

and then apperantly housing an AESA in the A-50 rotodome?

Three AESAs give continuous 360 coverage and thats pretty important when it has to cover several hundred kilometers of area

so does a rotating one.

The IL 76 has plenty of power to keep the AESAs cool. Don't you worry.

you know this? expecially 3??
wow you sound like you know your stuff.

The KJ 2000 has been in service for 8 years now, and there are far more than just two AESA programs.

Yes you are very much jealous, and you show it by trolling here.

trolling is when you say stuff that has no evidence or logic. and have short posts rather then sources, evidence. etc...
your only arguement is that China has AESA, therefore it has airborne AESA deployed in the KJ-2000 aircraft.
not just one rotating, but 3, stationary AESA panels. because everything built in China is super doper cheap.

We didn't have the KJ 2000 program when we tried buying the Phalcon. 3 years later we did. China always has a contingency plan unlike a certain un named country.

did you just say contingency plan? do you think large projects are ever embarked open with out a clear vision?
3 years down the road.
answer my question. why are there 3 panels?

And no materials do not cost the same in any country. For example China currently supplies 97% of the worlds rare earth medals. Rare earth medals are far cheaper to China then anyone else.

you don't know what your talking about
if there was a sharp difference in price in materials, goods, every one would let China build everything. Materials, expeically for military use, cost the same!
get over your self. have you ever looked into actual manufacturing costs? expecially for high end machines? even a laptop?

As for R&D the costs are covered.

by whom? who in the end had to pay extra for R&D?
ans
PLA
this is why they wanted the PHALCON, money spent on R&D could be spent on off the shelf solution. you obviosly have never made a business case, in your life.

And if you feel buying foreign AWACs forever for India is a good idea thats fine. But we feel differently for China

Collaboration is fine when you feel like having a open book. Once again we feel differently.

Yes GDP of India is similar to China 10 years ago.

However development of arms is vastly different.

its utterly baseless arguments.
if your brilliant idea was actually a good idea,
joint, collaboration would get business no where!

There was no expenses spared for the 4 AESAs on the 052C or the 3 on the KJ 2000. These two projects alone cost at least 10 billion dollars.

There are precisely 224 J 10 variants identified within the PLAAF, PLAANAF, and August performance team. We have very different standards of FOC compared to the IAF.

As for IA standards don't make me laugh. The INSAS is inducted despite its mediocre performance if even that. Even your own troops want more AK 47s. A rifle that China license produced and then retired two generations before.

okay.
you are the local idoit.
you just made my point.
FOC is a year or two maybe even more away, and yet 200 J-10s are in service. Thats a completely difference standard allright.
I think what just happened, is that you fail to understand what the consequences of the above actually mean.
As far as the INSAS is concerned.
Have you noticed, that you can find articles, from Indian journalist on the LCA, Insas, Arjun etc... putting down the projects, revealing and sometimes claiming defects etc..?
the same is true for F-35 and F-22.
whats more dangerous, is when the public is not aware of the costs of J-10's T-99 etc, and not given basic knowledge either.
there fore no one is held accountable.
thus China has many military projects. a lot of these defence projects, ended up being sacked.
thats poor project management.

As for engines that is a weakness of the PLA. However all J11B have WS 10A engines, and even the J 20 flight test was with WS 10Gs.

As for the FC 1 "concept" it already equips two squadrons. And for PAF they will receive Chinese AESA next year. Its not a dark age so much as a Cambrian explosion.

the Chinese are still using, russian engines.
The J-20 flew with both types of engines.
I have yet to see, a squadron of J-10's or J-11s with domestic engines. But i know i can count on an official PLAAF statement, if they said the WS-10 has achieved QSR.

I have never called the J 11 indigenous but heres some facts. Its far more indigenous than anything India has. The entire thing is made in China including airframe, Avionics, Radar, Engine, IRST, OBOGS, and especially A2G weapons which the original sukhoi completely lacks. Even the original steel airframe has been largely replaced with composites.

that was the idea of license production. thats what China payed for. to go about, replacing avonics with domestic products, is at China's own risk, with RUssian consultation. China was even given liesence production of the AF-31 engines. do you know what that means?
Russia transfered ToT.
China used the machinery which is used to cut the blades,
for the WS-10 design.
that was the idea.
btw,
the Su-30MKI is built from the ground up in India. airframe wise,
engines are assembled in India.
avonics are purchased from various companies, including a dozen Indian companies.

And no PLAAF paid for the 200 originally ordered. No more, no less. As for engines we have not ordered any more. WS 10A have been used for years now. Funny you should mention engines though seeing as India has to send them to Russia to get maintained.

PS. Write coherantly and try to argue with facts. Not the crap you self masturbate to on Bharat Rakshak.

aww,
a personal attack. your so much smarter then me.
i bet China a superpower now.
i'm sorry, China number 1.

you just had me deviate a topic. i don;t like to do it.
so agian, try refuting.
3 AESAs, in a stationary configuration. why?
is it because PLAAF has a lot of money?
is it because the AESA lacks serious performance?
is it because its not AESA?

for the record, India does have AESA, the have tested AESA, as well as a wide variety of radars. The currently used their own varient of the greenpine, called the swordfish.

but you know you know best.
i guess i should tell sinodefence to change their writeups. because, you have the actual specs. right?

he primary radar system housed in the radome is an three-sided electronically steered phased-array (ESA) developed by Nanjing-based 14 institute. Unlike the Russian A-50 or U.S. E-3, which rotate their rotodomes to give a 360 degree coverage, the KJ-2000's radar antenna does not rotate. Instead, three ESA antenna modules are placed in a triangular configuration inside the round radome to provide a 360 degree coverage.

so everything has a reason.
no specs are avalaible,
there is a lot of speculation. some more hype then reason.
if you pretend that China can build anything the more you'll actually fall.
i just proved you wrong.
but nothing is for certian. there is no military more secretive, than the Chinese, perhaps with good reason.
so i'll sum this up for you.
materials, cost the same when it comes to military hardware. a 50 million dollar jet will cost you 50 million dollars everywhere else pending on the technology and R&D done.
AESA is expensive, and how. not every military aircraft will be fitted with AESA, nore is it economical.
AESA heats up.
Ground based AESA is deployed since the early cold wars.
deploying AESA on a aircraft, expecially a rotodome is difficulte, even more so when you say there are 3 panels!
the beam support AESA concept is succefull because it keeps the AESA panels cool. That as far as we know, is the ONLY airborne AESA deployed by the PLAAF.

 

[desimorty]

Forgot to mention.
If the Russian engines need to be replaced. what do they get replaced with? You know the Su-30MKK and Su-27s? are they going to be replaced with WS-10? if so, then you just found out the difference between a AF-31 engine and WS-10.
my speculation is that the AL-31 and WS-10 are the same. Difference being slight.
If these engines, were radically difference.
The J-10's J-11's would need remodifications to re-engine the aircraft with Al-31's.
so like the J-11 is a Su-27 built in China
the WS-10 is Al-31 engine built in China.
go R&D.

 

[desimorty]

As for IA standards don't make me laugh. The INSAS is inducted despite its mediocre performance if even that. Even your own troops want more AK 47s. A rifle that China license produced and then retired two generations before.

i can give you more examples.
but you ever here the PLA complain?
no, apparently their equipment is top notch even if their tanks are death traps on the lines of T-90s.
get real.
The InAF deployed BVR fighters in the mid 80's, while the PLAAF got them in the mid 90s.
the PLAAF has vanilla flankers, even purchased a licences production of the airframe.
the IAF, returned the Su-30MK and collabrated on the Su-30MKI.
The PA, InA, have a more proffesional military. thats not an argument. These two militaries, have actually fought a real war with tanks and fighters, with out a massive death tole. they have never employed a bleeding strategy nore have they used conscription.

 

[vce]

.the Chinese are still using, russian engines.
The J-20 flew with both types of engines.
I have yet to see, a squadron of J-10's or J-11s with domestic engines. But i know i can count on an official PLAAF statement, if they said the WS-10 has achieved QSR.

typical selectively blind...

http://www.defence.pk/forums/china-defence/104643-j-11b-bs-now-all-equip-ws-10-engines-2.html

 

[S10]

Forgot to mention.
If the Russian engines need to be replaced. what do they get replaced with? You know the Su-30MKK and Su-27s? are they going to be replaced with WS-10? if so, then you just found out the difference between a AF-31 engine and WS-10.
my speculation is that the AL-31 and WS-10 are the same. Difference being slight.
If these engines, were radically difference.
The J-10's J-11's would need remodifications to re-engine the aircraft with Al-31's.
so like the J-11 is a Su-27 built in China
the WS-10 is Al-31 engine built in China.
go R&D.

I can only laugh at that stupidity. Here is a hint, WS-10 is based off of American technology, not Russian. Hell, even Wikipedia got it right and you're too retarded to look it up.