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Will the real America please stand up?

H2O3C4Nitrogen

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Will the real America please stand up?

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America has to reconsider its role in the world.

Here’s an amusing little nugget:


“Now a final note: The left blogosphere seems to have wigged out over the suggestion that George W Bush and the successful emergence of a secular, democratic Iraq has anything to do with all this. For starters, it is amusing to see that those voices, fresh from the smear on conservatives regarding the Arizona shooting, are now all about “causation.” But more seriously, had democracy failed in Iraq, had the country descended into chaos, and had Iraqis labouring for a secular, democratic Muslim country been killed and exiled, do we imagine this would have been good for the prospects of democracy elsewhere? Recall that it was the left that said that democracy was alien to the Middle East. Bush was right; they were wrong. And the notion that democratisation and rebellion against despotic regimes do not spread regionally after a successful experiment is belied by history (eg Central America, Eastern Europe).’’

Dear, oh dear! It just goes to show that delusional theories are not the sole monopoly of the Pakistani right but is also religiously practiced by the American right on a frequent basis.

First, can someone with a map point out where a successful democratic Iraq is?

All I see is an Iraq riveted be sectarian violence, with an epic power vacuum that is likely to be filled by different factions of the shia clergy vying for power. To somehow pretend that present day Iraq is a model of inspiration for the current Tunisian protestors is amusing at the least but deeply disturbing when we realise that the person making this claim is actually being serious.

Dangerous delusions

The American right is a corrosive force not only in their own domestic politics but their peculiar fantasy blockbuster notions of “freedom” (ironically the “American way”, as if freedom is somehow restricted to one geographical region in the world) have made the already complex working of international affairs that just little bit harder.

The American right refuses healthcare for its own people but is prepared to spend millions if not billions on arms and export them to all the nice, cuddly “pro-Western’’, autocrats of the Middle East. After all, it is Egypt after Israel along with Saudi Arabia that receive the most aid and funding for arms from the US.

The Tunisian revolution is an expression of social justice. That vision of social justice will inevitably include a Middle East free from an autocratic and bullying American presence. Tunisians are not naive, they know that Ben Ali was accepted and feted by Western leaders.

It’s best for the American right to realise their notions of peddling democracy via cluster bombs and tanks is likely to fall flat. We should instead look to the brave internal reformers in the Muslim world who would prefer if the Americans would just sit at home rather than go play “goodies versus baddies”.

This paragraph is extremely illuminating (moving now to the Iranian context):
“

“The best the US government can do for democracy in Iran is to leave us alone,” Akbar Gangi, an Iranian investigative journalist who spent six years in prison for reporting on the murder of dissidents by Iran’s intelligence agents, said on a recent trip to the United States.

Iran has a wide spectrum of reformist and democratic groups that are all against US intervention in Iran’s internal affairs and its goal of regime change. They favour political evolution and have made it clear that, for many reasons, they will not work with the United States. Many wonder aloud why the US did nothing when the reformist Khatami was elected in 1997. Washington could have lifted its economic sanctions against Iran that hurt only ordinary Iranians, but it did not. After Khatami’s government helped the US defeat the Taliban in Afghanistan, President Bush responded by listing Iran as a charter member of the “axis of evil.”
”

It is becoming increasingly clear, that American foreign policy is fundamentally flawed and is conceived in such a dated and condescending manner that it makes one wonder how a nation with some of the best Middle East and Islamic Studies university departments in the world, (which is now producing quality works of Muslim scholarship) can conceive of such a ludicrously ridiculous foreign policy.

The American right is why the US has such a terrible image in the wider international community, it is the reason why many resent the US even though its ideals are awe-inspiring and it has produced some of the finest civic leaders and icons in contemporary history such as Martin Luther King.

When America backs the Mubarak regime in Egypt which has one of the worst human rights records in the Middle East and then simultaneously punishes other countries for perpetrating human rights abuses does it not see the hypocrisy and double standards in its actions? The US speaks of democracy but why does it not allow it to take root in the Middle East? Why back generals, kings, sultans and sheikhs at the expense of freedom-loving people?

Learning from the US

There is much we can learn from the great tradition of progressive politics in American society. The American experiment of democracy is one that has tales of bravery and justice for all. In the Muslim World we have been guilty of tarring Americans with the same brush, and refusing to accept that just like there is no one single type of “Muslim”, there is no one single type of “American”. There is much to learn and take from American democracy, such as the Civil Rights movement.

I speak as a person deeply impressed by this great experiment of American democracy and liberty. The US is arguably the genesis of the democratic process, so it is for this reason I am concerned and perplexed. One can always read the Declaration of Independence with hope and optimism:
“

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.”
”


To sustain this great project of liberty, freedom and independence, America has to reconsider its role in the world, and remember that its success only demands that the US follow its ideals faithfully with the utmost diligence. It is this dichotomy between how America behaves at home with its sacred reverence for rights and liberty and its atrocious almost imperial foreign policy, that frustrates many not only in the Islamic world but generally across the globe.

So will the real America please stand up?

Will the real America please stand up? – The Express Tribune Blog
 
i esp like the way they waste money in war but their own countrymen go hungry and jobless.. and poor
 
Pandering to a rejected by popular vote of all Americans nationwide in Nov. 2010 leftist point of view proves nothing.

It is in fact out of date and backward to suggest the world at large does not know how to deal with the complex ethnic processes of nations like Pakistan.

Pakistan is dealing with formerly ignored parts of that nation, FATA, Swat, NWFP, Balochistan et al where al Qaida and their allies the violent terrorist Taliban have taken refugue, take hostages, kidnap for ransom, and murder at will Muslim minorities.

India and Israel are the only functioning voter driven democracies in the region, that is a true fact. But progress in Tunisia, Egypt, Jordan are measurable things, higher education attainment, higher paying jobs, better health care, better housing.

What is lacking in this dialogue is realization that people have to work for a living and earnings purchase proper healthcare, not give away liberal ideas now in the process of being rectifided inside the new US Congress.

There is no fountain of endless give away money from and inside the US and other Western nations. The very main reason the old USSR failed was a socialized vs. profit driven economy where going along to get along was paramount instead of job productivity for a net profit from which profit folks rising wages and salary, and benefits, were paid or amortized.
 
america only stands up for its own interests
 
Pandering to a rejected by popular vote of all Americans nationwide in Nov. 2010 leftist point of view proves nothing.

I like Americans, i like America ( well Boston, Oregon and New Orleans) that said.

A nation wide election that 82 million of a population of 300 million voted in, so a land slide for the republicans on the will of a tenth of the population.

Still if Americans are too stupid to take part in their own democracy they get what they deserve, sadly the rest of the world gets presidents that bomb countries they didnt know existed till the morning brief.

Till Americans stop thinking like this

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you will get Bushes Trumps and Carsons and the rest of us have to put up with your choice.
 
Arabs, and not any other nation, are responsible for everything that happens to them and that they do to each other. When Arabs tyrannize or murder other Arabs, they blame the US because they are jealous and it is easier than fixing their own mess. The US is involved with the Arabs because they want their oil and for no other reason. If the US and/or the oil were not there, the entire region would be one big Lawrence of Arabia set.

Most American voters recognize this, but the winner-take-all structure of the American political system and the lack of campaign finance reform in the US leaves them with no means to challenge the status quo.

Pandering to a rejected by popular vote of all Americans nationwide in Nov. 2010 leftist point of view proves nothing.

Obama won the election. Deal with it.

It is in fact out of date and backward to suggest the world at large does not know how to deal with the complex ethnic processes of nations like Pakistan.

The operative word is "complex". You really think the average voter ANYWHERE understands Pakistan? This might be the craziest thing I've ever read in print in my entire life.

Pakistan is dealing with formerly ignored parts of that nation, FATA, Swat, NWFP, Balochistan et al where al Qaida and their allies the violent terrorist Taliban have taken refugue, take hostages, kidnap for ransom, and murder at will Muslim minorities.

Afghanistan has always been like that, as far back as the days of Alexander. The basic problem is globalization and how Stone Age societies are suddenly put in the same boat with modern nations.

India and Israel are the only functioning voter driven democracies in the region, that is a true fact. But progress in Tunisia, Egypt, Jordan are measurable things, higher education attainment, higher paying jobs, better health care, better housing. What is lacking in this dialogue is realization that people have to work for a living and earnings purchase proper healthcare, not give away liberal ideas now in the process of being rectifided inside the new US Congress.

It's funny how you defend bread-and-circuses by Arab despotisms while disdaining providing those same benefits to Americans who maintain the world's largest economy. Particularly since you are at liberty to believe whatever you please since your paycheck is signed by Congress and you don't "work for a living" any more than King Hussein's other hired thugs do.

Bottom line is, all the things you describe are superficial and ephemeral so long as they are based on nothing more, nothing less and nothing else than the fiat of individual Arab despots. The exploding cost of living in Amman is a reflection of this - the "progress" is not reflected by economic or political realities. It's smoke and mirrors, just like all the progress in the Middle East.

There is no fountain of endless give away money from and inside the US and other Western nations. The very main reason the old USSR failed was a socialized vs. profit driven economy where going along to get along was paramount instead of job productivity for a net profit from which profit folks rising wages and salary, and benefits, were paid or amortized.

True fact: the USSR created a zero-poverty society and most Russians want it back. Also, you don't know the meaning of the word "amortized," I am guessing you heard it being talked about in the context of the VA. You realize most people in the real world outside the American military welfare system, people with real, actual jobs, don't get salaries or benefits?

A curious prejudice shared by Arabs and American rednecks is the belief that money and things equals wealth, and fear equals power. In both Red states in the US and the Arab world, the basic problems are cultural. These people don't want to understand what Europe, Israel and the East are actually doing to be successful, and are basically afraid to look for fear of offending their inferiority complex.
 
Name a group of human beings that does otherwise? And that still exists.

Bet you can't.
Sir you are right, but america claims to be the guardian, trying to make whole world a better place but in fact making America better at the expense of other nations.
 
America does make the world a better place. No other country in history has improved the lot of more people than has the United States of America. Not perfect but still the best.
 
America does make the world a better place. No other country in history has improved the lot of more people than has the United States of America. Not perfect but still the best.

What people forget is that it is easy to criticize USA, but very difficult to actually show better results themselves. :D
 
What people forget is that it is easy to criticize USA, but very difficult to actually show better results themselves. :D
The problem is that all nations are populated with human beings. Human beings by nature have defects. I like to remind myself of the "Seven Deadly Sins" as characterized by Christianity:
  1. Envy = the desire to have an item or experience that someone else possesses
  2. Gluttony = excessive ongoing consumption of food or drink
  3. Greed or Avarice = an excessive pursuit of material possessions
  4. Lust = an uncontrollable passion or longing, especially for sexual desires
  5. Pride = excessive view of one's self without regard to others.
  6. Sloth = excessive laziness or the failure to act and utilize one’s talents
  7. Wrath = uncontrollable feelings of anger and hate towards another person
Human government systems are successful to the extent that they successfully hold these human failings in check. No government is perfect because the various approaches control some "vices" better than others. "communism" for example, stifles greed and gluttony, but gives free reign to sloth. Capitalism does the opposite.
 
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The problem is that all nations are populated with human beings. Human beings by nature have defects. I like to remind myself of the "Seven Deadly Sins" as characterized by Christianity:
  1. Envy = the desire to have an item or experience that someone else possesses
  2. Gluttony = excessive ongoing consumption of food or drink
  3. Greed or Avarice = an excessive pursuit of material possessions
  4. Lust = an uncontrollable passion or longing, especially for sexual desires
  5. Pride = excessive view of one's self without regard to others.
  6. Sloth = excessive laziness or the failure to act and utilize one’s talents
  7. Wrath = uncontrollable feelings of anger and hate towards another person
Human government systems are successful to the extent that they successfully hold these human failings in check. No government is perfect because the various approaches control some "vices" better than others. "communism" for example, stifles greed and gluttony, but gives free reign to sloth. Capitalism does the opposite.

Are those seven sins limits or goals? :D

Once that has been determined, we can see how different systems would work.
 
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hey america is babylon a dark empire that must complete nwo and then die.
americans hold on to your gun 2nd amendment at risk. you could end up like Chinese and the Russians.
 
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