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Will France lease Reaper surveillance drones?

Vergennes

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Faced with uncertainties about the launch of Airbus's Eurodrone, Dassault,Leonardo and , the American General Atomics is offering a rental offer for its Reaper and SkyGuardian drones. Something that would make the French Ministry of the Armed Forces to consider.

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Le drone de surveillance SkyGuardian, de l'américain General Atomics

In ambush. Faced with the possible explosion in flight of the European drone program Eurodrone, deemed too expensive by the client states (Germany, France, Spain, Italy), the American group General Atomics is active behind the scenes.

The manufacturer of the Reaper drone, seven of which are already in service with the Air Force, had already proposed to France, at the end of 2019, an offer based on its SkyGuardian, an improved version of the Reaper with new wings. in composites and an autonomy of up to 48 hours.

The idea was to offer an alternative to the Eurodrone, deemed too expensive by the Minister of the Armed Forces Florence Parly, and not efficient enough by the Air Force. General Atomics offered two options: an off-the-shelf purchase of the SkyGuardian in its basic version; or a Europeanized version, called EuroGuardian, which would allow the installation of European radars, mission systems and armaments on a platform delivered "naked".

Surprise, the San Diego group now adds a third option to its proposal to the Ministry of the Armed Forces: the rental of Reaper or SkyGuardian drones, based on the leasing of automobile fleets.

The idea is simple: rather than engaging in a long and costly acquisition procedure, France could thus have access to a fleet of drones whose maintenance, pilot training, or even part of the missions, would be taken into account and taken in charge by the American industrialist.

"The rental makes it possible to fill the capacity gaps for surveillance needs at a lower cost, we say within the group. The US Air Force is already doing it a lot: the provider takes care of the" dull "part (boring ) missions. The client remains in charge of the truly operational part. " Outsourcing would only concern surveillance missions. The air force would remain solely in charge of the strikes carried out by its drones, effective in the Sahel since last December.

$ 25 million a year

Leasing has several advantages. Flexibility, first: the rental allows access to ready-to-use drones and available crews. A strong argument when you know that the training of pilots in sufficient numbers is a real headache for the forces, in France as in the United States, because of the lack of instructors, simulators, even candidates.

The price, then. When purchased, a Reaper system (three drones and two cockpits) costs around $ 80 million, and a SkyGuardian system $ 100 million, excluding training and maintenance costs. According to the first offer presented by Airbus, the Eurodrone reached 180 to 200 million euros. By way of comparison, a year of rental costs around 25 million dollars, including maintenance. The customer can choose to acquire the drone system after 5 to 7 years.


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The solution would have other advantages, assures General Atomics. It would allow the French Navy, which also calls for long-endurance surveillance drones, to be able to have a MALE drone quickly and at a moderate cost.

The SkyGuardian, unlike the Eurodrone project, indeed incorporates a marine version, which was the subject of a recent demonstration in Greece. The rental solution could even be compatible with a launch of the Eurodrone. It could make it possible to fill the capacity gap by the entry into service of the European drone, best planned for 2028, that is to say three years behind the initial schedule of the program.

The concept of leasing is less new than it seems. The rental of drones has already been practiced for a long time by Israeli players in the sector, IAI and Elbit Sytems in mind. Germany is thus renting five MALE Heron TP drones to IAI, after having long rented Herons 1. Greece announced at the beginning of May the rental of Herons for the surveillance of its borders. The English coast guard has chosen to rent Hermes 900 from Elbit to test the contribution of drones for their missions. The Italian Leonardo also offers leasing services with its Falco Xplorer drone, a small MALE drone (medium altitude, long endurance) of 1.3 tonnes.

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Will the Ministry of the Armed Forces take the lead in renting drones? The arguments of General Atomics are sobering, a fortiori in a context of Covid-19 which could constrain the margins of financial maneuver.

The proposal also allows an alternative to the Eurodrone program, which is still tight. The Airbus prime contractor’s first offer, filed in early 2019, was around 10 billion euros, more than 30% more than the envelope provided by the French procurement agency . All with excessive weight and very limited, even zero export prospects, was alarmed at the end of 2019 Christian Cambon, the chairman of the Senate defense committee.

Negotiations between manufacturers and client states are therefore dragging on. "We are continuing negotiations with the industrial trio made up of Airbus Defense and Space, Dassault Aviation and Leonardo, said general delegate for armaments Joël Barre on April 29 before the defense committee of the National Assembly.

I hope that it will succeed in the coming weeks, so that we can converge on the conditions for carrying out the program before the summer. "A deadline which looks very much like a last ultimatum.

https://www.challenges.fr/entrepris...ouer-des-drones-de-surveillance-reaper_710983
 
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The Eurodrone is most likely a failure,too costly and above planned schedule. Too much involved countries with each willing to use it differently.

Too bad France missed the train of unmanned aerial drones even though it was among the first nations to use them as far as the first gulf war.

If we didn't have such bad relations with Turkey it would have been probably interesting to look at a cooperation on drones especially that their platforms are combat proven and among the best in terms of quality and cost to efficiency.

With Israel it would have been risky politically. The Americans remain the best alternative as of now.

They are making a ravage in the Sahel.

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Countries that have bad relations can still do business. Sometimes at the same time too, as evident between Russia and Turkey (s400 deliveries in the midst of operations that Russia was not fond of).

But currently our platforms are Anka and TB2 which are smaller and more lightweight then what's been proposed here.

Sure Akıncı and Aksungur is coming in the VERY near future, but they're not combat tested yet.

What do you think France needs at the moment?
 
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Countries that have bad relations can still do business. Sometimes at the same time too, as evident between Russia and Turkey (s400 deliveries in the midst of operations that Russia was not fond of).

But currently our platforms are Anka and TB2 which are smaller and more lightweight then what's been proposed here.

Sure Akıncı and Aksungur is coming in the VERY near future, but they're not combat tested yet.

What do you think France needs at the moment?
For Surveillance and Strike roles, ANKA and TB2 is more than enough, as we proved in the battlefield... And just like you said, next generation is so close... But The ''political problem'' our french friend mentioned here is, france most probably wants to use this drones to watch the energy basins of Mediterranean and this might includes the east Mediterranean, you know there is all this ''I am gonna protect south cypriot natural gas'' and all that... In that case, no Turkish Technology for france...
Israel would be a better bet, I wonder why he doesn't like the israeli option?
 
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For Surveillance and Strike roles, ANKA and TB2 is more than enough, as we proved in the battlefield... And just like you said, next generation is so close... But The ''political problem'' our french friend mentioned here is, france most probably wants to use this drones to watch the energy basins of Mediterranean and this might includes the east Mediterranean, you know there is all this ''I am gonna protect south cypriot natural gas'' and all that... In that case, no Turkish Technology for france...
Israel would be a better bet, I wonder why he doesn't like the israeli option?

For most of the French political class it would be unthinkable to equip our armed forces with Turkish equipments. It's not even about eastern Mediterranean,mentionning your country is already a repulsive for the French political class from the right to the left.

For an operational point of view,several sources said the French armed forces were closely monitoring (not without interest) the recent Turkish military operations in Syria and their extensive use of drones. It is said they envied Turkey's drone capabilities,which are currently far superior to France's. If this was up to the armed forces staff they would have probably equipped their forces with Turkish drones.

BTW,they are mostly used to support France's overseas operations especially in the Sahel. Since France decided to arm those Reapers (and will arm all its future drones) they have conducted 40% of the airstrikes against terror groups in the vast Sahel region. (Alongside 7 Mirage 2000D)

Israeli drones would be too sensitive politically,it has already made much noise when France bought some Harfang drones. (based on the IAI Heron)
 
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What happened with the Talarion UAV? Last thing I know was EADS complaining that no EU country commits to a buy although, on paper, it looked like a formidable UAV.
 
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For most of the French political class it would be unthinkable to equip our armed forces with Turkish equipments. It's not even about eastern Mediterranean,mentionning your country is already a repulsive for the French political class from the right to the left.

For an operational point of view,several sources said the French armed forces were closely monitoring (not without interest) the recent Turkish military operations in Syria and their extensive use of drones. It is said they envied Turkey's drone capabilities,which are currently far superior to France's. If this was up to the armed forces staff they would have probably equipped their forces with Turkish drones.

BTW,they are mostly used to support France's overseas operations especially in the Sahel. Since France decided to arm those Reapers (and will arm all its future drones) they have conducted 40% of the airstrikes against terror groups in the vast Sahel region. (Alongside 7 Mirage 2000D)

Israeli drones would be too sensitive politically,it has already made much noise when France bought some Harfang drones. (based on the IAI Heron)
Hımm, apart from eastern Mediterranean there is also Turcophobia you mean... well fair enough.
About reapers, as far as I know, US only let Britain to have armed reapers... Do they give their permission for this? As you know, US is so protective about it's UCAVs... ''War Robots'' are classified as ''crucial technology''

What happened with the Talarion UAV? Last thing I know was EADS complaining that no EU country commits to a buy although, on paper, it looked like a formidable UAV.
Canceled. Turkish AeroSpace (Creators of ANKA) were signed a MoU for technology support, as far as I remember but project canceled.
 
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It is funny to see some 17-year old desperately trying to get someone's attention by posturing how proud (and racist) he and his people are :) You don't have to buy anything Turkish; since you are doomed to lose in Africa anyway when the Chinese decide you are out. So why bother with drones and such, seems like a total waste of money to me
 
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Hımm, apart from eastern Mediterranean there is also Turcophobia you mean... well fair enough.
About reapers, as far as I know, US only let Britain to have armed reapers... Do they give their permission for this? As you know, US is so protective about it's UCAVs... ''War Robots'' are classified as ''crucial technology''

France did need the US green light (which was given) to arm its Reaper fleet. They are already used in Sahel and as I said have conducted 40% of the airstrikes against terror groups alongside the Mirage 2000Ds. They will soon be armed with hellfire missiles.
 
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Hımm, apart from eastern Mediterranean there is also Turcophobia you mean... well fair enough.
Not Turcophobia....but you know how European Leaders acts when Erdogan's name is mentioned. It's the general perception.

France did need the US green light (which was given) to arm its Reaper fleet. They are already used in Sahel and as I said have conducted 40% of the airstrikes against terror groups alongside the Mirage 2000Ds. They will soon be armed with hellfire missiles.
Reapers, Hellfires.....some TB-2 (which is not even a MALE but tactical class) with cheap MAM-L missiles would be much more cost effective when doing terror operations. Too bad that the current political climate doesn't allow this.
 
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Not Turcophobia....but you know how European Leaders acts when Erdogan's name is mentioned. It's the general perception.


Reapers, Hellfires.....some TB-2 (which is not even a MALE but tactical class) with cheap MAM-L missiles would be much more cost effective when doing terror operations. Too bad that the current political climate doesn't allow this.
For France, even if we had a leftist government today, you wouldn't have see anything friendly. Their problem is with the Turkish Nation, Erdogan is just an easy target to legitimize their racist believes. armenian diaspora is also a part of french nation, and they are quite liked by general french, do you see the real problem?
 
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Okay. First of all, in their eyes you murdered millions of armenians, you know their lovely ''innocent'' minority. armenians are crying day and night.
You are Muslim. For them, You invaded Cyprus, tortured poor balkan nations for years. We are muslim mongols in their eyes.
The point is, before Erdogan, was france ever Turkish Friendly?
If a western country's far-right organisations hates you, there is no problem. This must be expected. But if in a country far-right organisations to far left to liberal parties hates you, it means their problem is with your nation, not with your government.
Today, Erdogan's politics makes them more vocal, I can agree about that, but their problem is with The Turkish Nation, Erdogan is just an easy target.
PS; My Personel Opinion. Would like to hear yours.
 
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