Why we lag behind

[Pakhtoon yum]

For this Bangladeshi elite. I had to "visit" my city again.

And give him some pictures.

They are a frog in a well

 

[waz]

Perhaps “we have nuke” is the only thing left as military wise as well Bangladesh will overtake Pakistan in a decade.

Not now not ever, and there are a multitude of reasons behind it.

But revealing this truth here is Blasphemy.

Keep faith in Atom Bomb. It will solve all the problems.

Wasn’t long before you started your nonsense.
My patience is fast running out with this section.
Do yourself a favour and get lost and brag elsewhere.

 

[Homo Sapiens]

For this Bangladeshi elite. I had to "visit" my city again.

And give him some pictures.

For Chinese cities, I never denied that there 8 lane expressways. I knew from many years ago that there are even 20 lane expressways in cities like Shanghai and Beijing. But you did not said that here. You are only talking about 6-8 lane expressway in your home city. So as a Chinese citizen, you have failed to properly represent China to the foreigners.

 

[Gibbs]

Hypocrisy?
Go educate yourself first, sweetheart. Hiding behind a screen thinking you understand the world. Western life styles for women are toxic.

Hypocrisy is posting all these dumbest extremist crap hiding away in one of the most liberal Western countries in the world, If the flag is to be believed.. Oh the irony

Why is that some of the most brain dead mullah type's supposedly live in the very societies they hate ?

I've had enough of his insults regarding our way of life.

Our way of life ? I dont think most Pakistanis that actually live in Pakistan have a 4th century cave mentality.. I would not generalize if i were you

Most expressways in China are 8 lane.

Inner city most definitely but Intercity/state expressways most are 4 lanes.. It's the norm even in the US or other major developed nations around the world

 

[Homo Sapiens]

Inner city most definitely but Intercity expressways most are 4 lanes.. It's the norm even in the US or other major developed nations around the world

This is the message I am trying to convince him in the last 5-6 posts, without any avail. He thinks I am belittling China which is not.

 

[Pakhtoon yum]

Hypocrisy is posting all these dumbest extremist crap hiding away in one of the most liberal Western countries in the world, If the flag is to be believed.. Oh the irony

Why is that some of the most brain dead mullah type's supposedly live in the very societies they hate ?



Our way of life ? I dont think most Pakistanis that actually live in Pakistan have a 4th century cave mentality.. I would not generalize if i were you



Inner city most definitely but Intercity/state expressways most are 4 lanes.. It's the norm even in the US or other major developed nations around the world

Do you realize what your vomiting out of your mouth?
You know shit about Pakistan and shit about Canada.
The issues I brought up are the same issues the people here are sick and tired of, but they deal with the bullshit the government decides. Our culture our way of life, you can go fu$k off.

 

[Saiful Islam]

I understand the War on Terror and how it must have been a financial burden too (duty calls though), but why do people forget that Bangladesh has been getting plunged by natural disasters ever since its inception, not to forget the 100's of Hartals that became a ritual for 5 years, then our border disputes, we also had military rule on 2 accounts. & not to forget Burma..

Bangladesh is the epitome of political instability. Always has been. But the Bengali psyche has always been the livelihood of people & not military gains. Muhammad Yunus comes to mind.

Our comparisons to Pakistan are only benchmarks, the same comparisons are held with India. They're not because we are "obsessed".

 

[Solomon2]

Pakistan universal education system is utterly failed, except some elite educated bunch who emerge in cluster elite education systems -

Having met a number of Pakistanis and Bangladeshis in the U.S., I wonder if it's not that Pakistan's "universal education system is utterly failed" as much as the fact that Pakistan's policies push its best people to go abroad and send home remittances, rather than encourage them to return home to start or work in new enterprises.

 

[Nike]

Having met a number of Pakistanis and Bangladeshis in the U.S., I wonder if it's not that Pakistan's "universal education system is utterly failed" as much as the fact that Pakistan's policies push its best people to go abroad and send home remittances, rather than encourage them to return home to start or work in new enterprises.

They are part of elites population, meanwhile until now how much percentage of Pakistan population literate? How much passing their basic education? Middle? And going through their tertiary education? Then compared them with education level and HDI indicator of other emerging country in which hold the roughly same level of starting point like Malaysia, China, India, Indonesia, Vietnam, Sri Lanka, South Korea and other?

 

[Solomon2]

They are part of elites population, meanwhile until now how much percentage of Pakistan population literate? How much passing their basic education? Middle? And going through their tertiary education? Then compared them with education level and HDI indicator of other emerging country in which hold the roughly same level of starting point like Malaysia, China, India, Indonesia, Vietnam, Sri Lanka, South Korea and other?

Husain Haqqani, in his book Reimagining Pakistan, wrote how he was struck while doing his research by the difference between nascent Pakistani and Indian officials during the decolonization process: the Indians were ready to take the helm from the Brits for the full range of government services, including education and social welfare; Pakistani leaders, by contrast, were only interested in what instruments of coercion would fall into their hands and ignored the rest.

From the start, Pakistani leaders pretty much milked East Pakistan's exports to finance development in West Pakistan, while hitting up the U.S. to finance their military and provide subsidized food to encourage immigration from India.

They showed no interest in broadening the education system. Foreign education aid could only go so far - it has often been diverted to other purposes. Build a school? It may be taken over to be the home of a local strongman. Provide teachers? These may be kidnapped for ransom....

As for encouraging remittances, the sheikhdoms across the water traditionally valued South Asians as servants and mercenaries and that fit in fine with Pakistan's feudal leaders.

I note that Bangladesh's success is all the more impressive because one of the most infamous deeds of the Pakistan Army was the massacre of unarmed professors and staff and students (both boys and girls) at Dhaka University in 1971. That set Bangladesh back intellectually for over a decade - few could do little better than trudge in a socialist mire for years - until a new generation of teachers could be trained to teach a new generation of students. Even so, Bangladesh has pulled ahead - it is a remarkable accomplishment.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Quoting Husain Haqqani as an authority on Pakistan.

Wow...

I understand the War on Terror and how it must have been a financial burden too (duty calls though), but why do people forget that Bangladesh has been getting plunged by natural disasters ever since its inception, not to forget the 100's of Hartals that became a ritual for 5 years, then our border disputes, we also had military rule on 2 accounts. & not to forget Burma..

Bangladesh is the epitome of political instability. Always has been. But the Bengali psyche has always been the livelihood of people & not military gains. Muhammad Yunus comes to mind.

Our comparisons to Pakistan are only benchmarks, the same comparisons are held with India. They're not because we are "obsessed".

These threads need to stop. It’s everyday now.

Discuss your country’s economy without bringing in Pakistan.

 

[Avicenna]

Quoting Husain Haqqani as an authority on Pakistan.

Wow...



These threads need to stop. It’s everyday now.

Discuss your country’s economy without bringing in Pakistan.

"I present this not to boast about Bangladesh, but to honestly discuss the right approaches to take for success in Pakistan as compared to Bangladesh. The article is starkly truthful and realistic.

Brothers and sisters please refrain from belittling each of our countries by name-calling, this is an honest, open-heart objective discussion.

Yes Bangladesh definitely has problems, just like Pakistan does. Pretending there is no issue won't solve problems in either of our countries. An honest effort is needed to tackle our problems."

The second part of OP initial post.

Please tell me what is wrong about that statement?

(Apart from the debatable reference to the veracity of the article in the first sentence)

 

[Nilgiri]

Your effort was noble.

But stupidity wins again.

How is this effort a noble one?

Its ad-nauseum the same ole drama again....repeating stuff to say BD better than Pakistan in whatever way....in the aptly named "BD defence subforum" (discussing everything except defence, given BD acquires zilch that matters).

Do Pakistani members come here to post an article every hour of every day of how their poverty rate is so low and so much better than Bangladesh....even though they host something like 3 million (many illegal) Bengalis?

Yes it is very stupid to keep doing this, just like the 3 million rona drona. But it seems to be inherent nature that too many of you are bitter that no matter how much you grovel and gesticulate, you are not accepted as peers by those you want some approval/acceptance from.....and you simply do not get that it doesn't happen BECAUSE of that grovelling. If its simply to "prove" some superiority, well that comes off as even worse look on you....given what BD lags in big time all over the place (especially once you remove the BD govt propaganda fuelled "data" and make everything a 3rd party neutral level playing field)

Why not just let it go, focus on your own matters purely....and let the facts out there speak for themselves?

Those that are unable to do that, have a big chip on shoulder, maybe invisible to them.....but everyone else sees it.

@OsmanAli98

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

"I present this not to boast about Bangladesh, but to honestly discuss the right approaches to take for success in Pakistan as compared to Bangladesh. The article is starkly truthful and realistic.

Brothers and sisters please refrain from belittling each of our countries by name-calling, this is an honest, open-heart objective discussion.

Yes Bangladesh definitely has problems, just like Pakistan does. Pretending there is no issue won't solve problems in either of our countries. An honest effort is needed to tackle our problems."

The second part of OP initial post.

Please tell me what is wrong about that statement?

(Apart from the debatable reference to the veracity of the article in the first sentence)

We have totally different challenges and problems, the two are incomparable.

Pakistan is in the crosshairs of the greatest powers of the world and directly affected by instability in the Middle East, Gulf, and Afghanistan.

We have an altogether different historical and political reality.

 

[fallstuff]

Tasneem Siddiqui

THERE are several Southeast Asian countries fortunate enough to bring socioeconomic prosperity to their people within a generation. On the other hand, there are countries that, despite decades of high growth rates, are still chasing an elusive ‘take-off’. Pakistan is one of those countries.

In its early years, in spite of major handicaps, we achieved an intermittent growth rate of about six per cent over four decades. As hopes were raised for a better future, even countries like South Korea sought to emulate Pakistan’s planning model. By the end of the Ayub era, however, it became clear that this ‘golden age’ of development not only failed to impact the lives of millions of disadvantaged groups, but also created massive inequalities due to the regime’s discriminatory policies. It was no surprise that, far from a ‘take-off’, this led to the country’s dismemberment.

This article is not about Pakistan’s economic situation. It is about a ‘development surprise’. Recently, Bangladeshi economist Wahiduddin Mahmud predicted that his country is on the verge of becoming the next Asian Tiger. This is the same country that, prior to 1971, Pakistan’s ruling elite felt was dragging economic growth down. Far from mourning its separation, many thought it was good riddance to the ‘bottleneck’ that was holding West Pakistan back. Almost 50 years later, it is interesting to see where Pakistan and Bangladesh stand in terms of economic and human development.

First, the Bangladesh story. It wasn’t easy for a poor country to overcome the trauma of a costly ‘liberation’, and so it faced both political and economic instability. To add, being a deltaic country, it had a history of natural disasters, resulting in famines and persistent poverty. They also shared the same problems our rulers tend to cite to explain lack of performance: military interventions, poor governance, institutional vacuum, corruption and a polarised society. Despite these handicaps, from the 1980s onwards, growth picked up. Initially lackluster, once it was on track there was no stopping it. To the surprise of many, at 7.28pc in FY-2017, its growth rate surpassed even India’s.

There are a few important factors to Bangladesh’s success. Its economic performance has been steady for the last 20 years. When its growth rate first exceeded Pakistan’s in 2008, many analysts treated it as an aberration whereas it was in fact a turning point. Besides GDP growth, the country has made significant progress in its social indicators. Given its level of economic development, it has actually over-performed in social development.

Bangladesh has maintained a 1.1 pc population growth rate — about half of Pakistan’s 2pc — and closed the gender gap in primary and secondary education by the mid-1990s. It has also had much success in child health and preventive measures such as immunisation. These factors have resulted in a rise in average life expectancy, surpassing India’s and Pakistan’s by four and six years respectively.

What is more surprising is that this remarkable progress was not achieved through large public expenditures on mega projects financed through domestic or foreign loans, but instead through mobilising resources at the grass-roots level: micro-financing, and active support of a committed and engaged civil society and intelligentsia. Bangladesh’s early growth came from the readymade garment industry, which not only proved to be a boon for women’s employment, but also their empowerment and inclusion in social development.

Coming back to Pakistan, in spite of early successes and great potential, it’s fair to say that both its economy and human development continue to face problems. As stated earlier, this isn’t a review of the current macro-economic situation, but anyone would admit that, even accounting for perennial structural problems, its growth is neither steady nor stable.

What is most worrying is Pakistan’s dismal performance in the social sector: 25 million children out of school (according to Alif Ailaan); continuing wide gender gap; poor quality of education and health; gaps in routine immunisation; the worst infant mortality rate in the world; rampant malnutrition and stunted growth in 40pc of the children. These issues do not bother either our political leaders or our intelligentsia. They think that a high growth rate for 10 or so years will automatically solve all our problems.

But Bangladesh’s experience has shown that its progress in social outcomes is neither a reflection of economic growth, nor public expenditure-led development. Would it be too much to ask of our planners, policymakers and civil society leaders to look at this ‘development surprise’, and perhaps learn a thing or two from it?

The writer is a social scientist.

saiban_project@yahoo.com

Published in Dawn, June 3rd, 2018

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I present this not to boast about Bangladesh, but to honestly discuss the right approaches to take for success in Pakistan as compared to Bangladesh. The article is starkly truthful and realistic.

Brothers and sisters please refrain from belittling each of our countries by name-calling, this is an honest, open-heart objective discussion.

Yes Bangladesh definitely has problems, just like Pakistan does. Pretending there is no issue won't solve problems in either of our countries. An honest effort is needed to tackle our problems.

There is no social scientist, there is no science behind this stuff labeled social science. I was reading until he started, "committed and engaged civil society and intelligentsia."

I don't recall anything these folks ever did anything that helped controlling population growth or increasing economic growth. I remember when Zia was denationalizing industries that Mujib Nationalized, the " civic and intellectual" class was vehemently against it for giving away these public assets.
Its the people who should get all the credit. If the people are not willing to change, mouthful words from these " civic and intellectuals ' will not do any good.

In case of Pakistan , it will be a factor of the entrepreneurs, people and the administration deciding the growth of economy moving forward. These so called intellectuals even in Pakistan ( these idiots with grandiosity tend to be same all over the world) will have zero contributions in the economic growth other than running their big mouth.