Why Saad Rafique called Altaf Hussain EHSAN FARMOSH ?

[SBD-3]

Would you elaborate this line.....??

MQM has a history of backstabbing its benefactors.

 

[Secur]

Proof those were killed were innocents? that they were not involved in killings, violence, extortion and what not ?

Did the law enforcement agencies try to prove them guilty? Were they presented in any court of law? I had been operating under the assumption that the law presumes innocence on the part of the accused , not guilt .

 

[Patriots]

MQM has a history of backstabbing its benefactors.

You didn't elaborate actual line which you had written ............

 

[SBD-3]

You didn't elaborate actual line which you had written ............

In blood means in nature. My english isn't so bad to be un-understandable

 

[Secur]

And what about Jaan?...you guys will always remain ehsan faramosh...its in your blood, biting your benefactor (Mushi-Mustafa Kamal) etc.....

Fair Dinkum , how? What exact favor has been bestowed on AH which the public knows nothing about and if yes ,why?

P.S. Refrain from " blood arguments " - they are ugly , work both ways and quickly get out of control .

 

[Bratva]

Did you try to prove them guilty? Were they presented in any court of law? I had been operating under the assumption that the law presumes innocence on the part of the accused , not guilt .

15000 figure aside, Is there any proper history exist of each and every person killed ? Were Army trigger happy persons? What was the situation in karachi before and after the Operation? Was there no target killings,

A situation of that era by two persons involved

Shaheen Sehbai thanking MQM for not killing and destroying his wife clinic


If all MQM were innocents, then why target killings, extortion bori band lashay decreased after the Op ?

 

[Secur]

If all MQM were innocents, then why target killings, extortion bori band lashay decreased after the Op ?

I am not talking about innocent or guilty people , seriously I am not . I am asking a simple question , were they presented in any court of law to establish their guilt? Since well , you seem too certain about everyone killed being guilty . What is Jinnahpur?

KARACHI, Aug 24 Muttahida Qaumi Movement chief Altaf Hussain has appealed to Chief Justice of Pakistan Iftikhar Mohammad Chaudhry to constitute a “truth and reconciliation commission” in the light of disclosures made by Lt-Gen (retd) Naseer Akhtar, a former corps commander of Karachi, and Brig Imtiaz Ahmed, a former director-general of the Intelligence Bureau, that the MQM had nothing to do with the “Jinnahpur conspiracy”.

Retired army officers absolve MQM of Jinnahpur plot: Altaf calls for truth and reconciliation commission - - DAWN.COM

Did it? Where's the comparison?

 

[Bratva]

I am not talking about innocent or guilty people , seriously I am not . I am asking a simple question , were they presented in any court of law to establish their guilt? Since well , you seem too certain about everyone killed being guilty .

Did it? Where's the comparison?

Is there any database of everyone killed, arrested, put in to jail in that Op?

I have examples of Wali Babur killers, 2010 JIT interrogation reports, Supreme court verdicts of Political parties militant wings, Deteriorating situation of karachi in 90's when there was no Blaoch, Aman committe or Zulfiqar mirza from which I infer my observations.

 

[Bratva]

There are sources who use that figure . Even if the 15k isn't true , the number of people killed ran in thousands and it isn't a secret , honestly . So , was their guilt established?

Who killed security forces in that Op and in preceding years of 90's. People Aman committee ?

I am not talking about innocent or guilty people , seriously I am not . I am asking a simple question , were they presented in any court of law to establish their guilt? Since well , you seem too certain about everyone killed being guilty . What is Jinnahpur?

KARACHI, Aug 24 Muttahida Qaumi Movement chief Altaf Hussain has appealed to Chief Justice of Pakistan Iftikhar Mohammad Chaudhry to constitute a “truth and reconciliation commission” in the light of disclosures made by Lt-Gen (retd) Naseer Akhtar, a former corps commander of Karachi, and Brig Imtiaz Ahmed, a former director-general of the Intelligence Bureau, that the MQM had nothing to do with the “Jinnahpur conspiracy”.

Retired army officers absolve MQM of Jinnahpur plot: Altaf calls for truth and reconciliation commission - - DAWN.COM

Did it? Where's the comparison?

So we have to take of Billa who was not involved in Karachi Op and was kicked out of army dishonorably? There is no credibility of Billa Imtiaz. Putting Jinnah pur aside. Was Everything cool and calm in karachi before the start of Op?

 

[Secur]

So we have to take of Billa who was not involved in Karachi Op and was kicked out of army dishonorably?

Why exactly would the army's top brass from that era lie today? Why exactly would they admit now that the Jinnahpur was a myth and the pretext used to operate against a political party had no basis in reality? Where are the maps which were allegedly recovered? The former Corps Commander of this city and the Director General IB ho headed the operation aren't liars , they know better . Mate , people got killed even those who weren't even part of MQM and you know what it resulted into? This created an insecurity so serious that even the people who didn't use to vote for the political party in question started to vote for it , the consequences were seen in Provincial elections '93 .

 

[Bratva]

Why exactly would the army's top brass from that era lie today? Why exactly would they admit that the Jinnahpur was a myth and the pretext used to operate against a political party had no basis in reality? Mate , people got killed even those who weren't part of MQM , you know what it resulted into? This created an insecurity so serious that even the people who didn't use to vote for the political party in question started to vote for it , the consequences were seen in Provincial elections '93 .

AHMED RASHID

Monday 11 January 1993


It was in Karachi and Sind that he came to political prominence as the province wilted under the most violent period in its history. Ethnic battles between Sindhis and Muhajirs claimed thousands of lives, and General Nawaz's troops were frequently called upon to impose curfews and break the civil strife. In a celebrated incident he was instrumental in organising a handover of 'prisoners of war' between ethnic extremist groups. His experience in Sind stood him in good stead when the government asked the army to take over law and order in Sind last year for a six-month period. Over the past few days there has been intense politicking in Islamabad between the army and the government as to whether the army would continue its role in the province.

Obituary: General Asif Nawaz - People - News - The Independent

MQM was loyal to it's people. Never harmed them. Took care of their own. It was bound to get popular.

 

[Secur]

Was Everything cool and calm in karachi before the start of Op?

It wasn't before , it wasn't after . So , whats the conclusion? Was the operation worth it , mate?

Since the Muhajir community as a whole bore the brunt of a program of systematic intimidation and harassment by the state, even those Muhajirs who had previously not supported the MQM, or did not believed in the politicization of their Muhajir identity, now felt that they had no choice but to support Altaf's MQM. - Vazira Fazila-Yacoobali
The Battlefields of Karachi: Ethnicity, Violence and the State

This is the sad part , honestly .

MQM was loyal to it's people. Never harmed them. Took care of their own. It was bound to get popular.

And the whole city of Karachi was MQM's people? You sure about that?

 

[Patriots]

In blood means in nature. My english isn't so bad to be un-understandable

Yes blood means nature ... And you meant that Urdu speaking community is naturally selfish & ungrateful people ... Is this right conclusion.......???????

 

[SBD-3]

Yes blood means nature ... And you meant that Urdu speaking community is naturally selfish & ungrateful people ... Is this right conclusion.......???????

MQM is different from Urdu Speaking community and there are numerous communities within urdu speaking community....

 

[Patriots]

MQM is different from Urdu Speaking community and there are numerous communities within urdu speaking community....

You said this is in your blood ... What blood is running in MQMer's vein ... Isn't it Urdu speakers blood ... I agree there are numerous communities with Urdu speaking community ... Same like there are numerous people from such communities in MQM which are in Urdu speaking community .........