Why Pakistan won't sell Saudi the Bomb!

[BATMAN]

Pakistan cannot be trusted on this matter, they have already gifted the bomb tech. to Iran and India, why not to Saudi Arabia?

 

[anonymus]

While Pakistan may not have sold Nukes to Saudi's, the analysis is flawed on multiple counts.

1. The example of Osama-bin-laden

While Osama may have been a wanted man in SA, he was never their pressing concern. When they pressured PAK on Osama, sequence of priority was this

USA - SA - PAK - Taliban - Osama

Osama handover did not came through because Saudi's heart was not into it and while Pakistan may have influence over taliban, they were not exactly taking dictation from ISI.

2. Case of international reaction

Author ignores one very important factor in his analysis while predicting international response; " Iran already has a bomb ".

US and co may chose to look other way if Pakistan provides guarantees ( even though outright sale is bound to attract sanctions ). Europeans may cry wolf but they are irrelevant in global politics.

+

China would not have any reaction whatsoever. It is neither in Shia camp nor in Sunni camp. " Opening to conventional and Nuclear strike " is a preposterous assumption to make.

3. Survivability in first strike.

One this point author actually is not only wrong but completely opposite to reality. Basing Nukes on SA soil would increase not decrease survivability in case of first strike.

In any serious Indo-Pak war, India is bound to target Pakistani Nukes. It is a given ( including pre-emptive strike in hope of riding out attenuated retaliation under BMD shield ).

Basing Nukes in SA means that at least some of the Nukes would survive even the most efficient of India's reaction. In addition to that India currently cannot track missiles launched from SA but most of pakistan is theoretically under India radar sytem.

Iranian air force is so weak that it could not mount anything substantial.

4. Finances

While IMF's loan may be rejected, it is given that Saudi's would fill any shortcoming on that account. ( after all they would be getting Nukes)

5. Iran and India Factor

On this Author is correct but he has downplayed influence that local politics of Pakistan may have on international relations.

Nawaz sharif is extremely pro-Saudi and pakistan is in grip of sectarian violence. If various lashkars ( sipeh-sahiba included) who consider Shia's as infidels gain enough traction ( SA may finance them ) and whip up popular sectarian sentiment, they could force Pakistani government to forgo well reasoned analysis.

Regarding chabhar, India does not need to base it's ship in chabahar to enforce blockade on Pakistan.


While i believe that Saudi currently do not have nuclear weapon , the scenario is bound to unravel in following manner.

1. Iran gets Nuke

2. SA asks USA for nuclear umbrella

3. If USA agrees then End Else Ask Pakistan.

4. Her it would depend on a lot of variables

a. Who is in power?

b.State of sectarian war in Pakistan and other countries.If Iran gain significant victories in Syria, Afghanistan and Lebanon ( Shia vs Sunni ), it could become a matter of us vs them.

c. Saudi's proposal.

While Pakistan may easily refuse Sale of Nukes ( Pak's leverage ends once sale went through ), Basing Pakistani nukes in Saudi could be a very very attractive proposition for pakistanis.


They may always claim at "Protecting mecca + medina from ze Israel".

Ok,what do you gain by forming this alliance?
And if there is something you could lose,what would that be?
Do you want this alliance because Iran and India have one(didnt know they had one)?

There is no alliance between India and Iran. He is using it to justify his sectarianism driven worldview.

Pakistan cannot be trusted on this matter, they have already gifted the bomb tech. to Iran and India, why not to Saudi Arabia?

Cuckoo much.

India conducted it's first nuclear test when Pakistani nuclear program was not even in mammy poko panties.

 

[Darth Vader]

@Pakistanisage FYI KSA Your Very Close Friend is one of the biggest Supporter of terrorism in whole Globe 70 % of all the money which support terrorism Is From KSA Not By Iran , Israel ,US ,
Pakistan should have good and close relationship with many countries as possible and Pakistan should stay out of all the internal matters of other countries how they deal with problem is their business cz of poking nose in other business should have taught Pakistan many lession biggest example is Afgn refuge

And On Topic PAK nukes are not Some Toys or some stuff which You can go to market and buy them
What ever happens Pakistan will Not Give Nukes To any country no matter who it is KSA , IRAN , etc
Bcz many of my friends on pdf forget 1 very important point if pakistan gives Nukes to KSA and ksa is at war with a nuclear state
it will be counted as act of aggression ( NUKE WAR ) against the other country who is attacking KSA
and i m pretty sure they will have to Nuke Pakistan too So Pakistan army is not that idiot or crazy to put 180 million lives of their own country men in harms way to just protect a friend who is always stabbing you back from one hand
if they do it will be a global nuclear war in other words( M . A . D )

END

Pakistan cannot be trusted on this matter, they have already gifted the bomb tech. to Iran and India, why not to Saudi Arabia?

helping one with tech is a total different thing But Giving A Active nuke is different

 

[BATMAN]

@
helping one with tech is a total different thing But Giving A Active nuke is different

.

It is stupid to believe, that a Pakistan may have transferred complete nuke to KSA and only media knows about it

 

[graphican]

Ain't or can/t Uncle Sam provide 'Nuclear Umbrella' to KSA?

Uncle Sam can and might offer that too but their repo graph is on -ve scale. USA believes in utilitarian relationship.. when you are useful, you are "as great as founding fathers of America" but when your usefulness has lived its life, you are as good as Afghan Taliban or as great leader as Saddam.

Pakistanis look towards Arabs specially Saudis with religious devotion. They are custodians of two holy Masjids and we see Saudi Arabia as the holy land in general. Pakistan not only has no conflicts with them but we feel indebted to them for their never ending support and cooperation with Pakistan. There is no reason why Pakistan shouldn' t offer them the best it has.

 

[airmarshal]

These reports are only mischievous efforts to malign Pakistan and Saudi Arabia.

If there was ever going to be deal, will Pakistan or Saudi leave such footprints for these western smart asses to trace?

 

[Parul]

Uncle Sam can and might offer that too but their repo graph is on -ve scale. USA believes in utilitarian relationship.. when you are useful, you are "as great as founding fathers of America" but when your usefulness has lived its life, you are as good as Afghan Taliban or as great leader as Saddam.

Pakistanis look towards Arabs specially Saudis with religious devotion. They are custodians of two holy Masjids and we see Saudi Arabia as the holy land in general. Pakistan not only has no conflicts with them but we feel indebted to them for their never ending support and cooperation with Pakistan. There is no reason why Pakistan shouldn' t offer them the best it has.

I thought KSA has NATO like security pact with USA. That is why I asked it & @Pakistanisage has also clarified it. Anyway thanks!

 

[BATMAN]

Pakistanis look towards Arabs specially Saudis with religious devotion.

Pakistan is also house of millions of Pakistanis, our local economy depends very much on forex earned from KSA.
Unstable KSA means unstable Pakistan.

 

[Informant]

This @Pakistanisage guy is deluded, do you think you can handover a nuke to KSA? What about the 80% of the KSA military machine that is dependent on US hardware. Planes, tanks, ships, armours, small arms, artillery, etc etc. Do you think USA would let it slide? The KSA armed forces will just crunch up like a bag of chips. No offence, we couldnt fly our F-16s during sanctions. Imagine the abomination that would be KSA forces? A few T-90s? Some Typhoons? What about the KSA missile shields? Iran will attack KSA with what nukes? Their AF is shitty beyong comparison. 10 F-14s that are no good electronically and sub sonic F-4s that even mig 21s will make mince meat out of them? Will they threaten KSA with that? Or the pseudo missiles and "ballistic" missiles that Iran possess? Mind you even if they empty their arsenal on KSA they cant level a single city. So there goes that.

Now lets come to Israel. They arent idiots, they are one of the most shrewd and cunning political machine out there. Do you think Israel will alienate themselves from the world attacking KSA. KSA's oil will turn even USA against them, plus they do enjoy decent relations with KSA through US.

Apart from these 2 supposed threats i dont see any further harm to KSA, now the dirty game KSA plays and has played is for all of us to see. We are suffering the consequences of their brand of Islam, please don't preach me of the brotherhood this and that. They are 10 times better equipped for conventional warfare than us with a military budget of $40+ billion dollars.

Pakistan would alienate Turkey, Iran, plus a host of other nations throughout the world. We enjoy a very healthy relations with KSA but we will not fight their war, nobody will fight our war, NO ONE WILL. You childhood friendships are a different universe to diplomacy between nations. Do you even think before parroting irrational thoughts? Calling Icarus a kid? Do you know who he is?

I'm glad there arent people like you in decision making circles that actually matter, because Pakistan would be in a lot more shit than it is today.

Its like seeing the public education failure that is you, resorting to name calling and a clear picture of someone with a chip on his shoulder. Your single tracked narrow minded thoughts delude you off reason and conjecture.

@hinduguy @shuntmaster spare us your ingenious and original quips about our nuclear programme being funded by KSA. It's childish and old as ****. Come up with something new

 

[Cheetah786]

Pakistan is also house of millions of Pakistanis, our local economy depends very much on forex earned from KSA.
Unstable KSA means unstable Pakistan.

Don't forget cause of Saudi help we have 50,000 less Pakistanis to worry about. Not to mention billions upon billions invested in FATA are to create terrorist Jobs and related industries. Most ungrateful Pakistanis call that attack on pakistan and cant see what a brotherly nation doing for pakistan as a sign of good gesture they recently deported 1000s of Pakistani from Kuwait and Arabia plus a complete ban on visa for Pakistanis cause of fear of extremist they create.

we should be listening to professional taxi driver in USA and signing a strategic alliance with them we will protect them while they destroy us.

 

[BATMAN]

Don't forget cause of Saudi help we have 50,000 less Pakistanis to worry about. Not to mention billions upon billions invested in FATA are to create terrorist Jobs and related industries. Most ungrateful Pakistanis call that attack on pakistan and cant see what a brotherly nation doing for pakistan as a sign of good gesture they recently deported 1000s of Pakistani from Kuwait and Arabia plus a complete ban on visa for Pakistanis cause of fear of extremist they create.

we should be listening to professional taxi driver in USA and signing a strategic alliance with them we will protect them while they destroy us.

I believe all the terrorism in Pakistan is because of Iran / India & US.
Atleast, this is what captives tells us, that they are trained in Afghanistan.

 

[JOEY TRIBIANI]

Which "Middle Eastern neighbor" were you talking about?

Iran? Iran would never target Mecca/Medina.

what about Riyadh . jeddah. and else? ?

 

[rockstar08]

How very nice of them!



Which "Middle Eastern neighbor" were you talking about?

Iran? Iran would never target Mecca/Medina. Everything else is none of our business.
Israel? Will Pakistan take on the US by attacking Israel?

and you think usa will will go to war with pak ? by destroying himself ? you know any if a war with KSA and Pak than russia and china will interfere .. than be ready for WW3 and i dont think that USA is not a fool to go on a ww3 for israel

 

[Pakistanisage]

Your comment would have had carried a lot more weight if you didn't write 'kid' there.

No need to put down others

This is not my style but I just gave him a taste of his own medicine.

We were discussing normally till he took this immature " condescending " tone with me in his post # 12.

What else can I call someone who uses that arrogant tone instead of making their point in an academic way.

Please read his post number 12 and follow the discussion before Post #12 and you will know why you have to give people like that a taste of their own medicine.

Then he quickly googles to find a link that actually negates what he was saying an supported my contention.

I think in his rush to present something he did not even bother to read what he was posting.

This @Pakistanisage guy is deluded, do you think you can handover a nuke to KSA? What about the 80% of the KSA military machine that is dependent on US hardware. Planes, tanks, ships, armours, small arms, artillery, etc etc. Do you think USA would let it slide? The KSA armed forces will just crunch up like a bag of chips. No offence, we couldnt fly our F-16s during sanctions. Imagine the abomination that would be KSA forces? A few T-90s? Some Typhoons? What about the KSA missile shields? Iran will attack KSA with what nukes? Their AF is shitty beyong comparison. 10 F-14s that are no good electronically and sub sonic F-4s that even mig 21s will make mince meat out of them? Will they threaten KSA with that? Or the pseudo missiles and "ballistic" missiles that Iran possess? Mind you even if they empty their arsenal on KSA they cant level a single city. So there goes that.

Now lets come to Israel. They arent idiots, they are one of the most shrewd and cunning political machine out there. Do you think Israel will alienate themselves from the world attacking KSA. KSA's oil will turn even USA against them, plus they do enjoy decent relations with KSA through US.

Apart from these 2 supposed threats i dont see any further harm to KSA, now the dirty game KSA plays and has played is for all of us to see. We are suffering the consequences of their brand of Islam, please don't preach me of the brotherhood this and that. They are 10 times better equipped for conventional warfare than us with a military budget of $40+ billion dollars.

Pakistan would alienate Turkey, Iran, plus a host of other nations throughout the world. We enjoy a very healthy relations with KSA but we will not fight their war, nobody will fight our war, NO ONE WILL. You childhood friendships are a different universe to diplomacy between nations. Do you even think before parroting irrational thoughts? Calling Icarus a kid? Do you know who he is?

I'm glad there arent people like you in decision making circles that actually matter, because Pakistan would be in a lot more shit than it is today.

Its like seeing the public education failure that is you, resorting to name calling and a clear picture of someone with a chip on his shoulder. Your single tracked narrow minded thoughts delude you off reason and conjecture.

@hinduguy @shuntmaster spare us your ingenious and original quips about our nuclear programme being funded by KSA. It's childish and old as ****. Come up with something new

Stay with the program genius, nobody said anything about handing over any nukes to anybody.

Providing a nuclear umbrella to KSA does not mean handing over the nukes to them.

Learn the difference.

 

[Cherokee]

All i can say is Thank god we are friends both to Iran and SA , both to Turkey and Greece , both to Argentina and U.K , both to Russia and U.S. .

Instead of acting like a backup guy third country should always try to formulate deeper bonds between the two conflicting countries .

World is not black and white . It is in between 50 shades of grey .