Why has Pakistan failed in making its own version of the IITs?

[Adecypher]

Off-topic:
We have at our workplace few IITians; one of them is the winner of Eleventh All India Design Competition for Engineering Students...so I can say they are pretty good in their domains. Moreover I had quite a few class fellows from IITs when I was in grad school...they have to be good since its pretty tough to get into IITs from a huge pool.

On-topic:
Pakistan also has some excellent engineering institutions namely GIK or Ghulam Ishaq Khan Institute of Technology but why we don't have a strategically well planned and structured Engineering Institute is due to lack of resources with a void of considerable and sustained allocations for the sole purpose of R & D.

 

[Kaniska]

One thing which Pakistan education has advantage which India can not get it out of their schools...It is the quota system...Pakistan friends, do you have any quota system in your school? If not, see, how lucky you guys are...

 

[MilSpec]

In this day and age, I would really like to see TCS, Infosys, L&T, Tata Motors, HAL sail etc literally adopting universities/colleges/departments, funding labs and creating high quality syllabus and testing standards to get the talent it really needs.
There is a huge disconnect between the talent that comes out of Inian universities and the industry expectations, and IIT's are not the answer to that. We need more universities like caltechs and MIT's in India.

 

[Sky lord]

Education should not be only about educating people for technical jobs. Yes, having technically qualified people is important, if anything even more so for a developing economy but vibrant liberal arts are just as vital in the long term

We need more good liberal arts educational establishments and good quality students opting for it. It is unfortunate that today the best and brightest all go for the sciences/technology and the second rate students do arts/ history/ philosophy and the third rate imbeciles do politics. This needs to change.

 

[amnarafiq]

I think that India is not getting any benefit from all this.

 

[sparten]

There are lots of excellent engineering colleges in Pakistan, there is the UET group which is our version of IIT; at Taxila, Lahore, Peshawar, Narowal, Multan, Faisalabad, Bannu, Khuzdar, Quetta, Bahawalpur.Then there is NUST, NED Group in Sindh.

 

[Providence]

I think that India is not getting any benefit from all this.

Is it Lea Seadoux ?

 

[Grevion]

Indian education system is Changing for good. Our Educational institutions should be more R&D oriented rather then 'study hard and get the most marks' oriented.

 

[Zeeshi]

We will when our education sector is getting its proposed 5% share of the GDP. We need to invest in STREAM education.

Sir Pakistan has its own version like UET's lahore(main,kalashah kaku,gujranwala,fasialabad,narowal) uet taxilla(main,chakwal) MNS uet multan,newly another UET Rasul mbdin in punjab uet peshwar(main,abbotabad) uet jamshoro, ned uet karachi ...but mostly these universities lacks in proper infrastructure. they don't have proper labs, also faculty in most institute is not good. Many students go abroad through HEC schalorship(good initiative) many of them return back and have contract of 2-5 years(depending on cost of their education abroad) they taught us in CEME NUST they are excellent at teaching. but they left institutes because of low pay scale and not proper facilities provided to them. our institute like NUST has (main h-12,CEME,MCE,MCS,PNEC) campuses but the thing is NUST is investing more in infrastuctureonly in main campus h12() rather then quality. Like in in back 2008 EME has most research work(bcoz gud faculty. and lab facilities) but now they have no funds, old labs, most equipment is old and most of the faculty left our institute. because of this reason nust ranking was down in 2015 in qs ranking, but hoping for best that after infrastucture nust may concentrate towards quality. last week i was reading that kpk govt establishing a practical knowledge based university its good 4 us and 4 our future.

 

[911]

To most Indians what makes them study hard is the chance to leave the country and live abroad if they succeed. Its like Americans studying to make a living in India. Mostly Indians are selfish they barely care about anything other than thier own family and lack vision as a part of country, hence corruption.

But i truly hope these things change. Do not seem so far.

 

[tsinga]

India doesn't gain too much from these IITs, top IITians don't stay and work in India....therefore, Pakistan is not losing much by not having such premier educational institutions..........

That may be true for now. As more and more Indians go abroad and study at many world class institutions (after studying at IITs) they will achieve critical mass and start returning back. This has happened in China and is (and will) happening in India. A 'reverse brain-drain'.

When a country sends maybe a 0.01% of its graduates abroad they stay abroad. When it sends more and more like 10%-30% abroad a significant proportion of that starts coming back bringing back with them technology, skills and a better work ethos with them. I believe this will or is already happening with India. I personally know many many Indians that have chosen to go back to India. Sadly, not many Pakistanis here (University of Michigan) want to go back (there aren't many either). I would say this would come down to how many actually come abroad. If many more Pakistanis studied abroad as well and reached a 'critical mass' a reverse brain drain would also begin for Pakistan.

At UMich I see a 200 Indians for every Pakistani. And before you say their population is larger, its not 200 times ours. It is only 7 times as much. Even if 10 of the 200 Indians choose to go back they will have a huge impact.

You have outdated information @oFFbEAT .

This used to be the case for IITians a while back. Today a vast majority of them stay in India.

Plus the fact that Govt has increased the number of IIT's substantially in the last 7 years is vastly increasing the pool. Couple this with the startup craze in India - most unicorn startups in India today are founded by IIT'ians - is ensuring that most grads are now looking to set up their future in India.

There will always be those who leave for foreign shores - but I don't begrudge them either. Most of those who have left India have made it big in their respective countries and have contributed back to India in many ways, many a times in ways that are not obvious.

You would find that most multinationals investing more in India is because of Indians in senior managerial positions guiding the company to setup shop in India and hire more Indians. This among other things.

This is almost a decade old article:
Why IIT grads abroad are returning to India

 

[niaz]

I saw a comment denouncing Hoodbhoy as a “Zealot secularist”. What has this got to do with his calibre as a Scientists or a Teacher?

Einstein was born a Jew, but in hisAutobiographical Notes, Einstein wrote that he had gradually lost his faith early in childhood. Should we dismiss Einstein because he became an Atheist?

Dr Ata ur Rahman as well as Hoodbhoy are dedicated in their own field. I have never met Mr Hoodbhoy but I had the honour of meeting Dr Ata Ur Rahman twice, both times on Emirates flight from Karachi to Dubai. Dr Rahman is a very unassuming cultured Chemist of International stature.

Domination of India in the field of Information technology is without question. Information Technology sector revenue in India is close to $150- billion with exports in the region of $100-billion and domestic market of about $50-billion. Pakistan’s IT sector is worth about $2.5-billion with export of $2-bilion. There is really no comparison. It is also true that Indian IT experts are in demand all over the world. As early as 2000 Germany was looking to hire 20,000 IT experts from India.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2000/may/22/germany.lukeharding

It is not a shame to accept Indian ascendancy in the IT sector, because it is a fact. 4 Indian universities were rated among the World’s top 100 institutions in 2013 is also a fact.

http://www.rediff.com/getahead/slid...-global-university-rankings-2013/20130301.htm

Pakistan’s education sector was destroyed when Mr ZAB nationalised all school in 1972. I tried to get my son 5 year old son admitted in Karachi Grammar in 1977 and was told that I needed a phone from the Sind Chief Minister Mumtaz Bhutto. I never had such problem when my father got me admitted in St Mary’s Rawalpindi in 1953.

Now education standard of Gov’t Schools in Pakistan has dropped from bad to abysmal. Only the very wealthy can afford to pay fees for good private institutions schools such as LUMS. (Who can afford to pay Rs 252,000 per semester for undergraduate courses?)

Regretfully, PPP gov't have been biggest culprits in neglecting Education. For example Dr At-ur Rahman was removed from HEC by the PPP gov’t soon after Musharraf left.

I humbly request my compatriots that we can never improve our education standards if we continue to deny the facts. You may not like Pervaiz Hoodbhoy but what he is saying is not wrong. Education is the need of the day and we ignore its importance at our peril.

 

[Winchester]

That may be true for now. As more and more Indians go abroad and study at many world class institutions (after studying at IITs) they will achieve critical mass and start returning back. This has happened in China and is (and will) happening in India. A 'reverse brain-drain'.

When a country sends maybe a 0.01% of its graduates abroad they stay abroad. When it sends more and more like 10%-30% abroad a significant proportion of that starts coming back bringing back with them technology, skills and a better work ethos with them. I believe this will or is already happening with India. I personally know many many Indians that have chosen to go back to India. Sadly, not many Pakistanis here (University of Michigan) want to go back (there aren't many either). I would say this would come down to how many actually come abroad. If many more Pakistanis studied abroad as well and reached a 'critical mass' a reverse brain drain would also begin for Pakistan.

At UMich I see a 200 Indians for every Pakistani. And before you say their population is larger, its not 200 times ours. It is only 7 times as much. Even if 10 of the 200 Indians choose to go back they will have a huge impact.

Not many Pakistani students go to the U.S

Germany and Australia are the two top destinations these days.

 

[livingdead]

Education should not be only about educating people for technical jobs. Yes, having technically qualified people is important, if anything even more so for a developing economy but vibrant liberal arts are just as vital in the long term

We need more good liberal arts educational establishments and good quality students opting for it. It is unfortunate that today the best and brightest all go for the sciences/technology and the second rate students do arts/ history/ philosophy and the third rate imbeciles do politics. This needs to change.

we definitely need center of higher learning in arts subject... too many bright people are joining tech career, who could be leader in other fields like economics, history or even basic sciences.

 

[CriticalThinker02]

I saw a comment denouncing Hoodbhoy as a “Zealot secularist”. What has this got to do with his calibre as a Scientists or a Teacher?

Einstein was born a Jew, but in hisAutobiographical Notes, Einstein wrote that he had gradually lost his faith early in childhood. Should we dismiss Einstein because he became an Atheist?

Dr Ata ur Rahman as well as Hoodbhoy are dedicated in their own field. I have never met Mr Hoodbhoy but I had the honour of meeting Dr Ata Ur Rahman twice, both times on Emirates flight from Karachi to Dubai. Dr Rahman is a very unassuming cultured Chemist of International stature.

Domination of India in the field of Information technology is without question. Information Technology sector revenue in India is close to $150- billion with exports in the region of $100-billion and domestic market of about $50-billion. Pakistan’s IT sector is worth about $2.5-billion with export of $2-bilion. There is really no comparison. It is also true that Indian IT experts are in demand all over the world. As early as 2000 Germany was looking to hire 20,000 IT experts from India.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2000/may/22/germany.lukeharding

It is not a shame to accept Indian ascendancy in the IT sector, because it is a fact. 4 Indian universities were rated among the World’s top 100 institutions in 2013 is also a fact.

http://www.rediff.com/getahead/slid...-global-university-rankings-2013/20130301.htm

Pakistan’s education sector was destroyed when Mr ZAB nationalised all school in 1972. I tried to get my son 5 year old son admitted in Karachi Grammar in 1977 and was told that I needed a phone from the Sind Chief Minister Mumtaz Bhutto. I never had such problem when my father got me admitted in St Mary’s Rawalpindi in 1953.

Now education standard of Gov’t Schools in Pakistan has dropped from bad to abysmal. Only the very wealthy can afford to pay fees for good private institutions schools such as LUMS. (Who can afford to pay Rs 252,000 per semester for undergraduate courses?)

Regretfully, PPP gov't have been biggest culprits in neglecting Education. For example Dr At-ur Rahman was removed from HEC by the PPP gov’t soon after Musharraf left.

I humbly request my compatriots that we can never improve our education standards if we continue to deny the facts. You may not like Pervaiz Hoodbhoy but what he is saying is not wrong. Education is the need of the day and we ignore its importance at our peril.

With all due respect sir but what has Pervaiz Hoodbhoy done for Pakistan instead of just criticizing, writing baseless and idiotic articles of removing our Nuclear Weapons or attacking our Military institutions or bashing Islam. He is a nuclear physicists but what has he done for Pakistan to make our country a better place instead of being a judgmental prick, throwing his weight around, playing the blame game and considering himself to be some kind of an intellectual mastermind.

I am a 25 year old graduate and in the process of becoming an Android developer and already I am thinking of 5 to 6 years down the road, I'm thinking ok after learning Android I'm going to work for 5 to 6 years on various software houses and then later on I'm going to be a freelance developer and start my own school where I will teach Android/iOS development for free and will encourage my future students to do the same thing of what I will do, usually these courses cost around 10k dollars in the west and many of my friend are thinking along those lines, so you see we are thinking of how we can make Pakistan a better place, and this guy is writing articles of how Pakistani nuclear weapons should be removed, going to India bashing and maligning Pakistan, we are fully aware of the disaster Pakistan has faced because of the corrupt political parties and leaders, the question is what are you doing or going to do to make Pakistan strong again instead of pointing fingers.