Why does Vietnam lag so far behind China, despite similar cultures and political systems?

[vtnsx]

Nope, CPC is technocrat, not plutocrat.

When you have a technocratic party to manage a third world nation, you will get China.

With a plutocratic system, you will get India.

VCP is plutocrat. I agree for now. That's where there is a lot of corruption and family wealth transfer. They didn't get rich by honoring their words, they got rich by swallowing their own words. Think of the Paris peace treaty as an example. There's no honor in that. This is why I don't respect this type of government. VCP is a good example of dishonor.

VCP controls its population by force, media control, freedom of speech, education and poverty. But the people already know that and there is a huge disconnect between the Vietnam people and its government. The people don't care about the government. The VCP government is far worse than Chinese building islands (except when China harm Vietnamese fishermen). Now, the tide is changing and VCP is open to new light due to China's aggression.

Most people in Vietnam do not know the reality that they live in because they are too occupied with making money and competing amongst themselves for money. This is where you get people stealing from tourists, robberies, cheating, family killing family, a sad place, indeed. However, there are improvements being made because of external pressures from tourism and outside countries. Again, this is a leadership problem for Vietnam. Vietnamese people can be much better off without a dictatorship in the VCP.

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

many reasons: wars, corruptions, incompentence, imperialism/colonism/socialism/communism and everything inbetween, delusions. last but not least if Vietnam was an island, protected, we would be certainly better off.

If Vietnam was an island, in the best of cases you'd end up like the Philippines and in the worst of cases, Guam, where their entire island is taken over and turned into a giant airport.

 

[xunzi]

Japan has never fought any real wars.

The 'China' that Japan fought during WWII was a shadow of its former self. It would be like me waiting for Muhammad Ali to develop Parkinson's and then beating him up with a baseball bat.

The last few times they fought China, we were at semi full strength was during the latter half of the Ming Dynasty and we destroyed them in The Imjin War. It is very similar to the US retreat after they conquered Pyongyang. Like I always said, Japan is an opportunist. Never fought us at full strength. Now if they fought us and beat us, I would bow my head to them. LOL

Yet that East Asian nation had conquered huge swathe of China, while China could never conquor than 'toddler' nation. In fact Chinese never stepped foot on Japanese soil , ever.

The last time was when the Mongol Yuan came, and well, it didn't really go to well for them did it?

lol

Why would we need to step foot on your land when you were a vassal state (accepting our tributary system)? LOL

 

[William Hung]

Most probably took advantage of the American or Canadian refugee processes , yes? They probably claimed Vietnamese persecution as catalyst and nationality declared was: Vietnamese.

This is the reason why there's close to 3 million Vietnamese in the United States and close to some 2 million in Canada.

De Nial ain't just a river in egypt, Sweetheart.

LOL I’m surprised you are the only one here who knew about this. You have figured him out.

It is a fact that most of those Vietnamese refugee in the 80s were nothing more than economic migrants who took advantage of the refugee process to migrate to the west, claiming persecution and all. I believe only a small portion of those Southern Vietnamese involved in politics/military were geniune refugees in the mid 70s (and was persecuted). Most of the Vietnamese-Hua ethnic were not involved in politics and were only involved in business. When the North took over, Vietnam is no longer a good place to do business so they decided to migrate to the west for better business opportunities, at the same time claiming persecution to take advantage of the refugee process, as you have said.

In fact, Hong Kong eventually got sick of these fake refugee taking advantage of Hong Kong hospitality and money so the HK administration decided, in the late 80s, to start shutting down their refugee centers and send those fake refugee back to VN. Thus, begin the funny 不漏洞拉 radio announcement (I suspect your HK friends or colleagues have told you all about this ). HK basically said you “refugees” are mostly fake and nothing more than economic migrants, go home! I guess Hong Kongers being Chinese know fully well the mentality of the Viet-Chinese hua and didn’t get deceived by those hua economic migrants like most western government did.

Our Vietnamese-hua friend is just now bathing in de Nile. lol

 

[Rechoice]

US has a long history of being independent and away from the Queen and Princes. I honor that more. I shouldn't have to bow down to anyone and that's the American way.



Sorry Rechoice, but you're 1 in a million people in Vietnam to know this. Not every Vietnamese like you and me are lucky to know this. VCP has to go. It has been proven that VCP is useless to the current situation. It has turned its back from Communism and slowly moving towards Democracy. Overseas Vietnamese have a huge influence on American soil and it can impact the US's president's decision. The reality is these news don't get broadcast into Vietnamese paper. A new government in Vietnam must emerge to adapt to a new "doi moi" change. If VCP truly cares for its people, it should have done this 40 years ago. I'm telling you Vietnam is very very behind. For it to pick up quickly, it has to be more open in regards to its business law, protection, and monitor corruption.

Not deny that you have good intention to critize VCP, but you do compare Vietnam with China, it is not reasonable.

China is peaceful develpped from 1949, normalized diplomacy with US (capitalism) from 1972. Korean war and Sino Vietnam war was out of China's territory. Chinese has big size territory and 1.4 bill population. There is big market.

To Vietnam, Vietnam war with Fance, USA and China extended to 1990. Doi moi policy began from 1986, but faced with embargo of US and his allies until 1995. In reality Vietnam has opened economy just from 1995 to 2015, only 20 year.There is very short time to change everything here.

I do bussines in Vietnam, for one private company. My grand-grand opa was landlord, my family member can't join to VCP based on this CV. So I can critize VCP better than you. But I think, not here.

 

[DaiViet]

Vietnam's economy is a joke.

Even developing countries like Thailand and Indonesia have the ability to manufacture over a million vehicles a year. Seriously, what does Vietnam even make?

2014 Statistics | OICA

Any rhetoric about Vietnam being a military or industrialized power is completely premature. Catch up to your Southeast Asian neighbors first.

Economic Vietnam does not do well however If you doubt Vietnam military power, try touch it with military you will see what will be happen. France, Mongol, U.S. and ancient China dynasty at peak of expansion could not do squat to Vietnam, I dont see modern China can do better - look at oil rig incident when the Viet are angerred and decided to fight you better retreat or you will have to deal with their last Viet man. Underestimate Vietnam military is your doom - see Khmer rouge was wiped in less than a month military campaign even with China back up. The shortest military campaign ever in modern history.

 

[DaiViet]

Most probably took advantage of the American or Canadian refugee processes , yes? They probably claimed Vietnamese persecution as catalyst and nationality declared was: Vietnamese.

This is the reason why there's close to 3 million Vietnamese in the United States and close to some 2 million in Canada.

That is right, how the F Vietnamese Hua considered as political refugees and granted the entry to the west if they claim they are Chinese. They would end up in China camp instead, indeed many of them do ended up in China, and cunning Chinese government did not grant them citizenship status so they can take advantage of U.N. food stamp while at same time the Chinese government allow them enjoy all benefits preference as a Chinese citizen.

Im sure have no problem with what the Vietnamese Hua lied to the world but when these people come here put all the blame to Vietnamese sure dont look right to me. The fact is that there are still about 1 million of hua in Vietnam, if communist do indeed brutal target Hua ethnic Im sure there would be zero of them living in Vietnam, see what Khmer Rouge did to the Hua in Cambodia which significant reduce Hua ethnic to almost Zero.

Many Southern Viet dont like VCP but unlike Hua, we dont trash talk Vietnamese as whole, we only criticize for wrong doing VCP did. Only the Hua Vietnamese who mentally never Vietnamese often trash talk Vietnamese and use VCP as an excuse for how they ended up living in the West. They would be thanked the VCP instead, living in China in far more brutal society where human life is less than a Walmart product.

 

[dichoi]

Yes, my cousins and uncles left the south in the 1980s Vietnam due to persecution from government. Their family have been there since the 50s.

You are Hua Chinese "boat people" from Vietnam 1980s, After 1954, huge amount of Nung-Hua people escaped from Quang ning provinca to South Vietnam. Nung Hua people joined to France army in Viet-France war (1946-1954).

That is truth in Canada, such Hua Chinese (Nung-hua) claimed themselves are Han, but Chinese community has denied it. It is reported by Chinese members on this forum.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

You are Hua Chinese "boat people" from Vietnam 1980s, After 1954, huge amount of Nung-Hua people escaped from Quang ning provinca to South Vietnam. Nung Hua people joined to France army in Viet-France war (1946-1954).

That is truth in Canada, such Hua Chinese (Nung-hua) claimed themselves are Han, but Chinese community has denied it. It is reported by Chinese members on this forum.

We embrace anyone who is pro-PRC/CPC.

@Jlaw is always Chinese in our eyes, not Vietnamese.

 

[dichoi]

It is a fact that most of those Vietnamese refugee in the 80s were nothing more than economic migrants who took advantage of the refugee process to migrate to the west, claiming persecution and all. I believe only a small portion of those Southern Vietnamese involved in politics/military were geniune refugees in the mid 70s (and was persecuted). Most of the Vietnamese-Hua ethnic were not involved in politics and were only involved in business. When the North took over, Vietnam is no longer a good place to do business so they decided to migrate to the west for better business opportunities, at the same time claiming persecution to take advantage of the refugee process, as you have said.

You are right.

Hua chinese "boat people" was crying and insulting Vietnam to get mercy of UNHCR officers in 1975-1980 to get permission to go to USA and Canada...

We embrace anyone who is pro-PRC/CPC.

@Jlaw is always Chinese in our eyes, not Vietnamese.

He is anti-Vietnamese on this forum, it is clear. Its good guy in your eye. I can understand.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

He is anti-Vietnamese on this forum, it is clear. Its good guy in your eye. I can understand.

To defend his biological Motherland against a bunch of trolls is nothing wrong.

 

[William Hung]

Hua chinese "boat people" was crying and insulting Vietnam to get mercy of UNHCR officers in 1975-1980 to get permission to go to USA and Canada...

Not just up to 1980, but pass 1980s and into 1990s, they still tried to apply as refugee.

But I think there was indeed a very small portion of Hua who got persecuted if they were previously involved with the former ROV government or military, so they were genuine refugees. However, the majority of Hua “boat people” were only taking advantage of the UNHCR to migrate to the west. I’ve once read that from a report by HK when they decided to shut down the refugee centers. After HK’s decision and findings, I think the Philippines and other neighboring countries also shut down their refugee process centre.

Im sure have no problem with what the Vietnamese Hua lied to the world but when these people come here put all the blame to Vietnamese sure dont look right to me. The fact is that there are still about 1 million of hua in Vietnam, if communist do indeed brutal target Hua ethnic Im sure there would be zero of them living in Vietnam

I agree with this. There’s nothing wrong with them being economic migrants, but what is also worst is that a lot of them do not become grateful and loyal to their new host country. Even when the west gave them a new home and new life, they still only worry about makimg money for themselves while talking trash about the west, the countries they asked to get in. You can see some of these Hua on this forum, talking trash about the west (eventhough they are US/Canadian citizen) and sucking up to the mainland members. They did it to Vietnam, living and taking advantage of their new VN home but talking trash about VN and not being loyal to their new VN homeland. Now most of them are doing it to the west, living and taking advantage of the west yet not being loyal but talking trash about it. So it is just the same.

But not all of them are like that though. A tiny small portion of them assimilated to the west or VN or some still loyal to VN or the west, but they are just in a extreme small minority. But most of the hua economic migrants are just leeching from their new host country and not being loyal to it. I consider that very parasitic.

@Jlaw is always Chinese in our eyes, not Vietnamese.

No one here is claiming him as a Vietnamese either. But most of us already knew there was something “off” about him, different to the other mainland members, even the trolling ones. Now that he has revealed this, the Vietnamese are not surprised.

 

[Viet]

If Vietnam was an island, in the best of cases you'd end up like the Philippines and in the worst of cases, Guam, where their entire island is taken over and turned into a giant airport.

Or a more likely scenario, Vietnam would be as strong as England and Japan.

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

Or a more likely scenario, Vietnam would be as strong as England and Japan.

Your scientific output is on the level of Kenya, a country that has half your population and 70% your GDP per capita. You have to beat Kenya first before even thinking about England or Japan.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

No one here is claiming him as a Vietnamese either. But most of us already knew there was something “off” about him, different to the other mainland members, even the trolling ones. Now that he has revealed this, the Vietnamese are not surprised.

Some anti-PRC/CPC Mainland Chinese members were not welcomed by the Chinese community in PDF.

We only care about the political stance, not the personal background.