Why Chengdu J-10C 4.5th Gen Fighter Can Easily Eat Alive F-16 Block 52 ?

[White and Green with M/S]

I think where you gets the idea of the AIM-120D having Dual-Pulse is that the AMRAAM currently has a dual propellant motor.

But dual propellant IS NOT Dual-Pulse Technology

Lol your really a fanboy you are not able to differentiate the meaning of Motor and engine, its a same things Motor= ENGINE

let me help you, here is the definition and difference from the google


“People use both interchangeably, but the difference is that motors run on electricity and engines run on combustion. The engine converts various forms of fuels into mechanical force, while the motor transforms electrical energy into mechanical energy.”


And earlier you says no version of AMRAAM using dual pulse rocket and now you're saying AMRAAM D is using dual propellent motor, its just a same thing just wording is change lol

 

[Daniel808]

Lol your really a fanboy you are not able to differentiate the meaning of Motor and engine, its a same things Motor= ENGINE

let me help you, here is the definition and difference from the google


“People use both interchangeably, but the difference is that motors run on electricity and engines run on combustion. The engine converts various forms of fuels into mechanical force, while the motor transforms electrical energy into mechanical energy.”


And earlier you says no version of AMRAAM using dual pulse rocket and now you're saying AMRAAM D is using dual propellent motor, its just a same thing just wording is change lol

Dual propellant IS NOT Dual-Pulse Technology


I'm already explain what is Dual-Pulse Motor Technology in the post page 2

I'll not repeat it again

 

[Bilal.]

@iLION12345_1 bro then based on what PAF including the chief declaring to maintain first shoot advantage? Even after meteor?

 

[White and Green with M/S]

A dual-Pulse motor will boost, from outside the targets MLD detection range, the AAM in a high arching profile. In mid-flight the first pulse (think first stage that does not jettison) cuts out and the AAM coasts until it is well past it's apogee. When the AAM is well into it's downward arch, it's 2nd pulse ignites when it is relatively close to the target. This ensures that the AAM is gaining energy in the end-game and can take advantage of TVC if it has it.

A ramjet AAM just has a longer burn and never turns off until it runs out of fuel.

One benefit of Dual-Pulse is that the AAM can "sneak" up on a target as it's motor is off until it is very close.

As to what that missile is, best I can come up with is a VFDR testbed, and of course PL-15 AAM

And first of all no solid rocket engine especially in BVR can burns throughout the flight because of limited capacity of a solid fuel in BVR

for example, as we take AMRAAM as example, first pulse will last only 5 seconds in boost phase and second pulse will only last 21 seconds after that all rocket powered whether they have only single pulse or dual pulse are become a glide projectiles and will lose kinetic energy at terminal phase, and PL 15 will have same properties, no rocket powered flight for BVR can reach powered flight at terminal phase, so most probably PL 15 will have unpowered flight at terminal phase

 

[iLION12345_1]

@iLION12345_1 bro then based on what PAF including the chief declaring to maintain first shoot advantage? Even after meteor?

As I stated, ranges are not that relevant past a certain point. BVR engagements do not take place at the sort of ranges these missiles can reach. You will never fire your BVR at a target thats 200 or 150 KM away, you simply won’t hit it, because of radar limitations, small RCS of modern jets as well as the time it gives for reaction and countermeasures.

If a missile has a 200KM range and another has a 100KM range and the engagement takes place at 60 km (which is already deep into BVR territory) then that max range won’t matter, the other factors will, like your radar and other available data (for example from AWACS) plus the other capabilities of the missile, its speed, accuracy, maneuverability etc. Missiles have a “No-escape envelope” where their effectiveness is at its maximum, a good missile has a bigger envelope. The meteor is believed to have one of about 60KM. It’s entirely possible that the PL-15s is even higher. When PAF officials say such a thing they’re obviously not referring to the range of their missiles, they’re referring to all the factors that go into an engagement, one such engagement was on the 27th of February and despite having better tech on paper, IAF didn’t even get a shot off.

 

[Daniel808]

And first of all no solid rocket engine especially in BVR can burns throughout the flight because of limited capacity of a solid fuel in BVR

for example, as we take AMRAAM as example, first pulse will last only 5 seconds in boost phase and second pulse will only last 21 seconds after that all rocket powered whether they have only single pulse or dual pulse are become a glide projectiles and will lose kinetic energy at terminal phase, and PL 15 will have same properties, no rocket powered flight for BVR can reach powered flight at terminal phase, so most probably PL 15 will have unpowered flight at terminal phase

 

[White and Green with M/S]

Dual propellant IS NOT Dual-Pulse Technology


I'm already explain what is Dual-Pulse Motor Technology in the post page 2

I'll not repeat it again

lol are you deny the REAL PHYSICS lol may be PL 15 using CHINESE PHYSICS, i sorry to say dude you have no basic knowledge of AVATION, that's why you always have a delusional

so what this proves?? that rocket and motor is a different things??? its proves nothing, both are same

 

[Bilal.]

As I stated, ranges are not that relevant past a certain point. BVR engagements do not take place at the sort of ranges these missiles can reach. You will never fire your BVR at a target thats 200 or 150 KM away, you simply won’t hit it, because of radar limitations, small RCS of modern jets as well as the time it gives for reaction and countermeasures.

If a missile has a 200KM range and another has a 100KM range and the engagement takes place at 60 km (which is already deep into BVR territory) then that max range won’t matter, the other factors will, like your radar and other available data (for example from AWACS) plus the other capabilities of the missile, its speed, accuracy, maneuverability etc. Missiles have a “No-escape envelope” where their effectiveness is at its maximum, a good missile has a bigger envelope. The meteor is believed to have one of about 60KM. It’s entirely possible that the PL-15s is even higher. When PAF officials say such a thing they’re obviously not referring to the range of their missiles, they’re referring to all the factors that go into an engagement, one such engagement was on the 27th of February and despite having better tech on paper, IAF didn’t even get a shot off.

But NEZ is more or less directly proportional to the over all range of the missile. Also while beyond NEZ the probability of hit reduces but in some tactics it is useful to put the enemy on defensive.

 

[White and Green with M/S]

I'm already explain what is Dual-Pulse Motor Technology in the post page 2

What is you prove on page 2 nothing, no backup no links by you to backup your claims

But NEZ is more or less directly proportional to the over all range of the missile. Also while beyond NEZ the probability of hit reduces but in some tactics it is useful to put the enemy on defensive.

It also depends on whether your enemy is heading toward you or leaves you, your enemy is receding you even within the NEZ your hitting chance will significantly reduce

 

[iLION12345_1]

But NEZ is more or less directly proportional to the over all range of the missile. Also while beyond NEZ the probability of hit reduces but in some tactics it is useful to put the enemy on defensive.

Yes but is there much possibility of a 150+ KM BVR engagement taking place between India and Pakistan? It’s a very rare scenario already, one that no Air Force would attempt. In a PAF-IAF scenario the targets will always be much closer due the nature of the conflict and the locations of the bases. It’s better to invest in other technologies than trying to have the longest range missiles. At the end of the day none of these ranges are actually confirmed, who knows, maybe PL-15 does have a longer range than the meteor too? We can’t know. Just like we can’t hope to hit their jets at 150KM even with the best missile, they can’t hope the same either.

These very long range missiles were made to shoot down larger aircrafts like strategic bombers, tankers and AWACS, the last of which is still a valid use for them for both India and Pakistan, but those larger targets are obviously much easier to hit due to their massive RCS, and it’s not like Pakistan doesn’t have the missiles to match India. They had R77s? We had AIM120, they get meteor? We get PL15, even if their missiles are better on paper (and trust me, they’re not, india also massively hypes up the stuff it gets, as you’ve seen with the “Raptor of the East” and the “agar aaj Rafale hota” stories), PAF will maintain that edge due to all the other factors that go into these engagements.

Lastly, people often forget that the entirety of the PAF is meant to counter India, while the IAF is split between the PAF, PLAAF and even their eastern border to some extent. In an actual combat scenario, their “numerical superiority” will be much smaller than claimed, especially with how India-China relations have been recently. The PLAAF has a massive edge over them, part of which is unintentionally also carried over to the PAF.

Even now, they’re getting a few Rafales and PAF is already countering them with a new purchase. The conventional gap between Pakistani and Indian forces has been closing for a long while now…

 

[onebyone]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1414117022535802884

 

[Scorpiooo]

But remember brother pl-15 have AESA seeker which is more resistance against jamming and deception from the enemy fighter jets

PL-15 AAM already using Dual-Pulse Rocket Technology which extend missile range compared to Conventional one, like AIM-120D

For PAF comparison of AIM-120C5s series and PL15 doesn't metter alot and fortunately they have both with them ...

If Afghan card is played well then PAF even can have AIM-120C7 and AIM-120D in comings days

 

[Bilal.]

Yes but is there much possibility of a 150+ KM BVR engagement taking place between India and Pakistan? It’s a very rare scenario already, one that no Air Force would attempt. In a PAF-IAF scenario the targets will always be much closer due the nature of the conflict and the locations of the bases. It’s better to invest in other technologies than trying to have the longest range missiles. At the end of the day none of these ranges are actually confirmed, who knows, maybe PL-15 does have a longer range than the meteor too? We can’t know. Just like we can’t hope to hit their jets at 150KM even with the best missile, they can’t hope the same either.

These very long range missiles were made to shoot down larger aircrafts like strategic bombers, tankers and AWACS, the last of which is still a valid use for them for both India and Pakistan, but those larger targets are obviously much easier to hit due to their massive RCS, and it’s not like Pakistan doesn’t have the missiles to match India. They had R77s? We had AIM120, they get meteor? We get PL15, even if their missiles are better on paper (and trust me, they’re not, india also massively hypes up the stuff it gets, as you’ve seen with the “Raptor of the East” and the “agar aaj Rafale hota” stories), PAF will maintain that edge due to all the other factors that go into these engagements.

Lastly, people often forget that the entirety of the PAF is meant to counter India, while the IAF is split between the PAF, PLAAF and even their eastern border to some extent. In an actual combat scenario, their “numerical superiority” will be much smaller than claimed, especially with how India-China relations have been recently. The PLAAF has a massive edge over them, part of which is unintentionally also carried over to the PAF.

Even now, they’re getting a few Rafales and PAF is already countering them with a new purchase. The conventional gap between Pakistani and Indian forces has been closing for a long while now…

I agree full range launch will hit nothing. My point was that the NEZ will also be proportionally more. Meaning the NEZ of a 150-200Km missile will be more than that of 100-110 Km missile.

Secondly, longer range even max range shots can be used to put the enemy of defensive while closing in for a NEZ kill shot.

Additionally, off topic. Would love to see a GAN AESA seeker on PL15 too. And hopefully in PAF arsenal.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

It's quite obviously J-10C is vastly superior to F-16C. It's a much newer design incorporating DSI. Comparing J-10C to F-16C is like comparing Walvax mRNA to Pfizer / Fosun or Moderna mRNA.

 

[Beast]

It’s like talking to a donkey about physics. I wonder why you act like you are payed to suck off china.

I don’t have any issues with China, in fact I take up a lot of issues with western people who just call all Chinese tech trash just because it’s Chinese, they never acknowledge the advancements China has made or their progress, because In 2021 China is one of the main players in defense tech.

But the sad fact is that there’s too many fanboys like you that know literally nothing about this stuff and try to convince the world that China does magic with its technology, the technology that China copied from the west in the 70s-90s before they started working on their own. There’s nothing inherently with with that because China makes its own stuff now. But bots like you are convinced that they’ve surpassed everyone, barely any of you are willing to have a civil discussion because it’s too hard for you to believe that western tech is good too. This is why Chinese tech has a bad name in the first place.

Chinese war tech has bad reputation is more to do with misinfo and lot of smearing from fanboy media. Just checkout youtube and see how many junk video of Chinese military hardware?

There are plenty of area which China military taking the lead and clear missile is the area of Chinese expertise with ASBM like DF-21 and DF-26. It isnt hard to be convinced of China PL-15 capabilities over AIM-120.