Where do you want to be buried and why?

[Indus Pakistan]

Born in Europe, I remember that family and friends always talked about this issue. The overwhelming majority of people wanted to be buried at home in Turkey. How does Pakistanis in Europe/America think about this topic?

Unfortunately, as you likely already know, the transfer of the deceased to ones own country is extremely expansive. In our case, transportation from Europe to Turkey will easily cost several thousand euros. It's sad but not every family can afford this amount of money.

So, to share the costs fairly within the community, Turkish people in Europe set up several "funeral funds" recognized as charitable organizations. You have to get registered to become a member. After this step, you will get at the end of every year a letter from the fund management in which they explain the current financial situation and the number of deceased persons. The amount you have to pay is calculated on the basis of the sum of the projected number of deaths/costs divided by the projected number of members.

Usually, you pay roughly 40 euros at the end of the year. Your children and wife/husband are automatically covered by this fund as along as you're staying a member. Do you have a similar system?

Interesting and I can relate to what you say. Amongst Pakistan until late 1980s most dead were sent back to Pakistan and I think there were 'burial associations' into which you paid set amount exactly like what you mention.

However past 1990s things began to change. The problem was most of the elderly who died had hardly anybod close left in Pakistan. Since their immediate family was in UK it made little sense in the body being sent back to a village where most of the younger generation were strangers. I give my example. My dads sister died lasy year. she came to UK in 1965. Most people she knew were gone and my cousin insisted that their mother would be buried in UK as they could go and pay their respects at the grave.

That is why increasingly there are Muslim cemeteries in UK. The one my dads sister was buried in was just regular cemetry but had a portion given to Muslims and it had 100s of graves pointing to changing attitudes. So i expect I will be buried in UK. It matters nought to me. It matters to those in whom your memory lives on. So that they can pay respect at the grave.

 

[T-123456]

To much talk of death here,

Interesting and I can relate to what you say. Amongst Pakistan until late 1980s most dead were sent back to Pakistan and I think there were 'burial associations' into which you paid set amount exactly like what you mention.

However past 1990s things began to change. The problem was most of the elderly who died had hardly anybod close left in Pakistan. Since their immediate family was in UK it made little sense in the body being sent back to a village where most of the younger generation were strangers. I give my example. My dads sister died lasy year. she came to UK in 1965. Most people she knew were gone and my cousin insisted that their mother would be buried in UK as they could go and pay their respects at the grave.

That is why increasingly there are Muslim cemeteries in UK. The one my dads sister was buried in was just regular cemetry but had a portion given to Muslims and it had 100s of graves pointing to changing attitudes. So i expect I will be buried in UK. It matters nought to me. It matters to those in whom your memory lives on. So that they can pay respect at the grave.

Thats maybe because you feel at home in the UK,many Turks in Germany/Netherlands/Austria etc dont feel like its home.

 

[Fenrir]

To much talk of death here,

Well yeah, if you bury the living they might come back as a Draugr!!

Lay the body flat, leave it not standing or sitting, and for f*cks sake make sure the damn thing is dead before burying it!!

Of course we're talking about the dead. Fear grip a man who so buries the living.

 

[T-123456]

Well yeah, if you bury the living they might come back as a Draugr!!

Lay the body flat, leave it not standing or sitting, and for f*cks sake make sure the damn thing is dead before burying it!!

Of course we're talking about the dead. Fear grip a man who so buries the living.

I thought you wanted a Viking funeral?

 

[Khanate]

Usually, you pay roughly 40 euros at the end of the year. Your children and wife/husband are automatically covered by this fund as along as you're staying a member. Do you have a similar system?

PIA (Pakistan International Airlines) transports deceased overseas Pakistani citizens free of charge to Pakistan, if they request it. Turkish airlines should offer something similar. This is a cultural thing for most Muslims or Pakistanis.

 

[Well.wisher]

Madiinah .. my wish : ) . To be buried there .

 

[Kamikaze Pilot]

I want to be buried in the sea , like osama bin laden .

Whose is this Black & White picture in your profile pic?

 

[50cent]

Where prophets lived

 

[KediKesenFare3]

I must say that is a brilliant system!

Probably but I personally prefer the Pakistani solution.

PIA (Pakistan International Airlines) transports deceased overseas Pakistani citizens free of charge to Pakistan, if they request it. Turkish airlines should offer something similar. This is a cultural thing for most Muslims or Pakistanis.

That's the best system but on the other hand I can understand that the government doesn't want to support richer diaspora citizens. Though, in our case, the staff members of the fund are organizing everything. You just report a death and they handle the paper work. They take the body after the Salat al-Dschanaza in Europe from the family members. After handing over the deceased to the family in Turkey, they automatically cancel the membership. Sometimes they take the body at the airport in Turkey and drive him/her hundreds of kilometers to his/her village in Anatolia.

I want to be buried in our small village in Kayseri

I want to be buried in Turkey but not in my village. I'm looking for a place/city/village/region, which suits my political and social worldview. My decision is pending right now, though, I'm tending towards Kayseri.

Most people I see try to come back to their villages,cities for burial if they can afford it...

If I die abroad I'd like to be buried in my village near the final resting places of my ancestors...

Are you from Baluchistan?

Interesting and I can relate to what you say. Amongst Pakistan until late 1980s most dead were sent back to Pakistan and I think there were 'burial associations' into which you paid set amount exactly like what you mention.

However past 1990s things began to change. The problem was most of the elderly who died had hardly anybod close left in Pakistan. Since their immediate family was in UK it made little sense in the body being sent back to a village where most of the younger generation were strangers. I give my example. My dads sister died lasy year. she came to UK in 1965. Most people she knew were gone and my cousin insisted that their mother would be buried in UK as they could go and pay their respects at the grave.

That is why increasingly there are Muslim cemeteries in UK. The one my dads sister was buried in was just regular cemetry but had a portion given to Muslims and it had 100s of graves pointing to changing attitudes. So i expect I will be buried in UK. It matters nought to me. It matters to those in whom your memory lives on. So that they can pay respect at the grave.

You're right. In Germany, Switzerland, Austria and the Netherlands the number of Muslim cemeteries is growing. But Turks in general don't like the limitations in Europe. I can give you an example: in Germany relatives of the deceased have to pay "cemetery fees" for decades. If you forget to pay this fee, they will put another person into the grave without even to inform you. This is unacceptable for many. And I think that there is a general time limit too. Even if you pay your fee on time, in some regions of Germany you can only "reserve" a grave for 20 years.

Imagine that after this time span they open the grave of your mother and put another person inside. Sorry, but I can't take this. How are the regulations in UK?

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Probably but I personally would prefer the Pakistani solution.



That's the best system but on the other hand I can understand that the government doesn't want to support richer diaspora citizens. Though, in our case, the staff member of the fund are organizing everything. You just report a death and they handle the paper work. They take the body after the Salat al-Dschanaza in Europe from the family members. After handing over the deceased to the family in Turkey, they automatically cancel the membership. Sometimes they take the body at the airport in Turkey and drive him/her hundreds of kilometers to his/her village in Anatolia.



I want to be buried in Turkey but not in my village. I'm looking for a place/city/village/region, which suits my political and social worldview. My decision is pending right now, though, I'm tending towards Kayseri.



Are you from Baluchistan?



You're right. In Germany, Switzerland, Austria and the Netherlands the number of Muslim cemeteries is growing. But Turks in general don't like the limitations in Europe. I can give you an example: in Germany relatives of the deceased have to pay "cemetery fees" for decades. If you forget to pay this fee, they will put another person into the grave without even to inform you. This is unacceptable for many. And I think that there is a general time limit too. Even if you pay your fee on time, in some regions of Germany you can only "reserve" a grave for 20 years.

Imagine that after this time span they open the grave of your mother and put another person inside. Sorry, but I can't take this. How are the regulations in UK?

Yes..

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Imagine that after this time span they open the grave of your mother and put another person inside. Sorry, but I can't take this. How are the regulations in UK?

Yes, there is time limit. from what I know (don't take this as bible) it is from 75-100 years. I see your point about your mother - makes my skin crawl even thinking about it. But honestly I would prefer my mother or my dad are buried here (I hope they have many years) so that we, their offspring can go see them. I think despite how westernized you get the family remains a potent focus of your emotional investment. So teh, I guess I can't even imagine thinking about them burying somebody else. But I guess you can pay to buy for 100 years. Since nobody you know will be alive by that stage it does not matter. Nothing is forever anyway.

This is a very morbid subject .....

. My decision is pending right now, though, I'm tending towards Kayseri.

Any reason why? Just curious what your social or political worldview has influence on choosing city.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

PIA (Pakistan International Airlines) transports deceased overseas Pakistani citizens free of charge to Pakistan, if they request it. Turkish airlines should offer something similar. This is a cultural thing for most Muslims or Pakistanis.

Didn't know it was free.. Atleast PIA still does 1 thing good.

Yes, there is time limit. from what I know (don't take this as bible) it is from 75-100 years. I see your point about your mother - makes my skin crawl even thinking about it. But honestly I would prefer my mother or my dad are buried here (I hope they have many years) so that we, their offspring can go see them. I think despite how westernized you get the family remains a potent focus of your emotional investment. So teh, I guess I can't even imagine thinking about them burying somebody else. But I guess you can pay to buy for 100 years. Since nobody you know will be alive by that stage it does not matter. Nothing is forever anyway.

This is a very morbid subject .....

Can't you buy land on permanent basis for burial purposes?

In Pak lots of people have sort of like private graveyards for their families on their own land..

 

[KediKesenFare3]

Didn't know it was free.. Atleast PIA still does 1 thing good.

I found this:

The transportation of dead body of an overseas Pakistani is usually the contractual obligation of the employer or the company where an individual is employed. If the employer refuses to bear the cost of transportion of dead body and the 'family' financial position is not good, then concerned Pakistan Mission abroad use to undertake the responsibility to transport the dead bodies. Previously,also dead bodies of the deceased Overseas Pakistanis were transported to Pakistan through PIA on charge collect basis, on the production of Certificate by the Pakistan Mission and payment were made to PIA by OPF. Since 2003 on an initiative of OPF, the PIA as a gesture of goodwill towards the expatriate Pakistanis,has been transporting dead bodies on free of cost basis from abroad to Pakistan from all over the world from where it is operating.
http://www.opf.org.pk/WTransportationofDeadBodies.aspx

 

[padamchen]

It s not sad. It is tragic that we are such pryjsl enemies.we are No t we memory.we as re beers.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I found this:

The transportation of dead body of an overseas Pakistani is usually the contractual obligation of the employer or the company where an individual is employed. If the employer refuses to bear the cost of transportion of dead body and the 'family' financial position is not good, then concerned Pakistan Mission abroad use to undertake the responsibility to transport the dead bodies. Previously,also dead bodies of the deceased Overseas Pakistanis were transported to Pakistan through PIA on charge collect basis, on the production of Certificate by the Pakistan Mission and payment were made to PIA by OPF. Since 2003 on an initiative of OPF, the PIA as a gesture of goodwill towards the expatriate Pakistanis,has been transporting dead bodies on free of cost basis from abroad to Pakistan from all over the world from where it is operating.
http://www.opf.org.pk/WTransportationofDeadBodies.aspx

Few days back a friends 2 brothers died in accident in US... The family has been settled there for decades .. The bodies were brought back and buried in their ancestoral village..