What is your idea about the possibility of secularism in Iran?

[Ir.Tab.]

Anyway. I can't understand why people still want religion to have a saying in politics.

The question is more complicated when there are variety of ideologies

The influence of religion in a society has never led to anything positive.

This is a bit controversial one. It could be a discussion for itself but in my opinion it is not in contrast with the concept of secularism.

 

[Surenas]

This is a bit controversial one. It could be a discussion for itself but in my opinion it is not in contrast with the concept of secularism.

Perhaps you can give me an example of a positive outcome of religion in a society, in correlation to secularistic states? It doesn't surprise me that religious countries are in general far less developed than secularistic states.

 

[Ir.Tab.]

Perhaps you can give me an example of a positive outcome of religion in a society, in correlation to secularistic states? It doesn't surprise me that religious countries are in general far less developed than secularistic states.

As I said it is another discussion for itself, but secularism should not be presented as anti-religionism. I do not deny the more extreme oriented is the society, the more difficult are the reforms.

 

[Surenas]

As I said it is another discussion for itself, but secularism should not be presented as anti-religionism. I do not deny the more extreme oriented is the society, the more difficult are the reforms.

Secularism in itself doesn't have to be anti-religion, but in a way it is of course. Anti (which in Greek means 'against') religion shows that people acknowledge that religion has a bad influence in a society, and secularism is the solution to keep state and religion separated.

 

[Shahin Vatani]

Here is a map of secular nations (blue) versus nations with a state religion (red). It is interesting that almost all of the nations with a state religion are Islamic countries.

 

[Ir.Tab.]

Secularism in itself doesn't have to be anti-religion, but in a way it is of course. Anti (which in Greek means 'against') religion shows that people acknowledge that religion has a bad influence in a society, and secularism is the solution to keep state and religion separated.

keeping state and religion separated is to provide equal rights for every ideology. Anti-religion action means interfering in personal beliefs of people.

As I said the only ideology which is not allowed in secular society is the one that do not tolerate others.

 

[Surenas]

keeping state and religion separated is to provide equal rights for every ideology. Anti-religion action means interfering in personal beliefs of people.

As I said the only ideology which is not allowed in secular society is the one that do not tolerate others.

Religion, and in this case Islam, doesn't tolerate other ideologies, or at least not non-Abrahamistic/Monotheistic religions. Anti-religion doesn't mean interfering in the personal beliefs of others. I'm anti-religion, which means that I believe that religion has in general a bad influence on people, and that certain outcomes of it should be disputed.

Why should I respect christianity or islam, when both religions propagate that I as atheist would burn in a place called hell in my afterlife? When both religions contain anti-atheistic rhetoric, and sometimes even propagate to use violence against people like me? I have no respect whatsoever for these religions, and I will never have so.

 

[Ir.Tab.]

Religion, and in this case Islam, doesn't tolerate other ideologies, or at least not non-Abrahamistic/Monotheistic religions.

Europe is secular but no one, there, is banned to do his/her religious practice if he wants. people are free to have any ideology they want.

Anti-religion doesn't mean interfering in the personal beliefs of others. I'm anti-religion, which means that I believe that religion has in general a bad influence on people, and that certain outcomes of it should be disputed.

I mean anti religious governments not atheism which itself is kind of ideology. Secularism defines a minimum rights for humankind regardless of his ideology. You should respect others rights but in the same time they should respect your rights. People are not allowed to harm each other just because of their ideology mismatch.

Why should I respect Christianity or Islam, when both religions propagate that I as atheist would burn in a place called hell in my afterlife? When both religions contain anti-atheistic rhetoric, and sometimes even propagate to use violence against people like me? I have no respect whatsoever for these religions, and I will never have so.

In a secular society they are not allowed to. It is illegal.

 

[Surenas]

Europe is secular but no one, there, is banned to do his/her religious practice if he wants. people are free to have any ideology they want.

Religieus signs are banned in many public jobs, etc.

I mean anti religious governments not atheism which itself is kind of ideology. Secularism defines a minimum rights for humankind regardless of his ideology. You should respect others rights but in the same time they should respect your rights. People are not allowed to harm each other just because of their ideology mismatch.

Atheism isn't a ideology. You have communistic atheists, monarchistic-atheists, republican atheists, etc. Atheist don't believe in dogmas. Secularism is indeed applying to everyone, in contrast to religions, who all propagate their absolute truth and dislike of other (non-monotheistic) religions.

 

[Ir.Tab.]

Religieus signs are banned in many public jobs, etc.

Because it may violate equality of other beliefs in public services.

Atheism isn't a ideology. You have communistic atheists, monarchistic-atheists, republican atheists, etc.

Are not all of these ideologies?

Atheist don't believe in dogmas. Secularism is indeed applying to everyone, in contrast to religions, who all propagate their absolute truth and dislike of other (non-monotheistic) religions.

Secularism will provide everyone the opportunity to have his/her ideology for free. And violating others freedom is illegal in a secular state.

 

[Surenas]

Because it may violate equality of other beliefs in public services.

Because it can hurt the image of the government being neutral.

Are not all of these ideology?

No, because those ideologies aren't correlated to atheism. You also have nihilistic atheists like me. Atheism isn't a ideology.

 

[jandk]

Personally I am allergic to religiosity

 

[Ir.Tab.]

Personally I am allergic to religiosity

People oppose religion as they find it intolerable, but it is very interesting they react in an intolerable manner as the same. The aim of secularism is to save society from allergic responses, regardless of personal ideas.

 

[Ir.Tab.]

Because it can hurt the image of the government being neutral.

It is the duty of the secular state to remain neutral in order to secure equal rights in the country.

No, because those ideologies aren't correlated to atheism. You also have nihilistic atheists like me. Atheism isn't a ideology.

What are the beliefs of nihilistic atheists?

 

[Surenas]

What are the beliefs of nihilistic atheists?

None. Thats what I'm trying to say. There is no 'atheism'.