Western culture adoption by Chinese.

[paritosh]

You have been fed well by your own propaganda. It must feel good knowing China's development is simply the result of its evilness. You Indian angels are too civilized for that kind of thing. You should come to China and see for yourself how us lowly slaves live. Maybe then you will have real pity on us

Sarcasm aside, I admire the Chinese governance model. Wish we had similar choices as well. It’s unfortunate that we can’t collaborate as that has taken away a lot of opportunities to learn from your successes.

China has invested 100 Billion USD and counting in CPEC. If given an option Pakistan will merge with China.

i can guarantee that if you put that to vote here on the forum, there would be consensus on the opposite position. You can try it. Pakistan’s national identity isn’t that shallow.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Xi doesn't live in Britain. Musharraf does and Manmohan Singh used to.

"Why go to the West when you can bring West to your home" comes to mind.

I wonder which idiot invented heels.

The idiot who hoped the woman of his dreams would trip on those heels and he would catch her in his arms.

 

[LeGenD]

How many people are attending these classes? It's just people taking an interest in foreign culture. Loads of people learn Salsa or speak a foreign language, or learn dishes from foreign cuisines. Look at how many European people do Yoga. It's not a problem to take an interest in a foreign culture or to adapt aspects of which which you find attractive.

The problem comes in when people value the foreign culture in such a way that they undermine their own and spread discord in their own society. Pakistani liberals are a perfect example. In fact they say a picture speaks a thousand words - I saw this on Twitter as a perfect example.

Not a second thought spared to how many Malala's, the drones killed sleeping in their beds.

Terrorists do not fight with ethics in mind. They do not care about civilian casualties. They prefer to blend among civilians to escape attention while they partake in horrible deeds. Terrorists also have families of their own who may get caught in crossfire at times.

How many civilians have been killed by terrorists over the course of years? Total is definitely huge.

Pakistan have lost so many soldiers fighting terrorists using HUMINT approaches over the course of years - are these lives not valuable?

Pakistan Army should also consider adopting sophisticated UAVs to fight terrorists much like Americans. These machines will help save lives.

There are no easy solutions for this menace, mate. Too much FITNA witnessed in these times.

 

[jamahir]

The idiot who hoped the woman of his dreams would trip on those heels and he would catch her in his arms.

Sweet dreams.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

So is adopting white Western culture the key to success or the answer?

A gorilla can be adopted by a human being, live in a palace, be trained and taught by finest brains but it will alll be to waste. He wil still be a gorilla. So your analogy does not fit.

The purpose of the thread was to highlight that modern China is a westernized country. It would never have succeeded had it not dropped it's "desi" ideas and adopted western culture, political philosophy and mores. Think of a pizza. The dough might be Chinese but all the toppings are Western. This applies to all other succesful countries. Japan. The dough is Japanese but the topping is Western. Singapore. The dough is Chinese/Malay/Indian but the topping is Western.

And most telling. The one example that should open Pakistani eyes is Turkey. The dough might be Turkish but the topping is Western. Indeed Turkey is just another westernized country but with a Muslim heritage. And please not I have been to all these countries so I can compare.

Ps. Turkey is the most Westernized country in the Muslim majority world.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

A gorilla can be adopted by a human being, live in a palace, be trained and taught by finest brains but it will alll be to waste. He wil still be a gorilla. So your analogy does not fit.

The purpose of the thread was to highlight that modern China is a westernized country. It would never have succeeded had it not dropped it's "desi" ideas and adopted western culture, political philosophy and mores. Think of a pizza. The dough might be Chinese but all the toppings are Western. This applies to all other succesful countries. Japan. The dough is Japanese but the topping is Western. Singapore. The dough is Chinese/Malay/Indian but the topping is Western.

And most telling. The one example that should open Pakistani eyes is Turkey. The dough might be Turkish but the topping is Western. Indeed Turkey is just another westernized country but with a Muslim heritage. And please not I have been to all these countries so I can compare.

Ps. Turkey is the most Westernized country in the Muslim majority world.

The gorilla analogy is priceless.........

 

[313ghazi]

Terrorists do not fight with ethics in mind. They do not care about civilian casualties. They prefer to blend among civilians to escape attention while they partake in horrible deeds. Terrorists also have families of their own who may get caught in crossfire at times.

How many civilians have been killed by terrorists over the course of years? Total is definitely huge.

Pakistan have lost so many soldiers fighting terrorists using HUMINT approaches over the course of years - are these lives not valuable?

Pakistan Army should also consider adopting sophisticated UAVs to fight terrorists much like Americans. These machines will help save lives.

There are no easy solutions for this menace, mate. Too much FITNA witnessed in these times.

1. This is really off topic. I posted that picture to discuss people who have an inferiority complex, not drone strikes.

2. Many of the terrorists were created and supported because for years the Pakistani state allowed foreign forces to indiscriminately bomb on our territory. My arguement with drone strikes is not the technology, rather the indiscriminate nature of the bombings by NATO forces on Pakistani territory.

You'll note the difference in tactics our own forces took in their operations to reduce civillian casulties as much as possible. You'll also do well to note how effective our approach was, vs the American one. Pakistan utilised it's airfoce and now also uses drones too - but they were used through intelligence led operations, not random indiscriminate attacks like the US did.

 

[313ghazi]

A gorilla can be adopted by a human being, live in a palace, be trained and taught by finest brains but it will alll be to waste. He wil still be a gorilla. So your analogy does not fit.

The purpose of the thread was to highlight that modern China is a westernized country. It would never have succeeded had it not dropped it's "desi" ideas and adopted western culture, political philosophy and mores. Think of a pizza. The dough might be Chinese but all the toppings are Western. This applies to all other succesful countries. Japan. The dough is Japanese but the topping is Western. Singapore. The dough is Chinese/Malay/Indian but the topping is Western.

And most telling. The one example that should open Pakistani eyes is Turkey. The dough might be Turkish but the topping is Western. Indeed Turkey is just another westernized country but with a Muslim heritage. And please not I have been to all these countries so I can compare.

Ps. Turkey is the most Westernized country in the Muslim majority world.

So what do you make of a 15 inch spicy vegetarian pizza with chicken tikka on top? Or an Achaari special?

I kind of agree with what you're saying, but i'm not clear on exactly what you mean.

Pakistani's more than anyone should know how "drag and drop" of Western culture into an alien environment fails. The Chinese are successful because they picked and chose the bits of western culture that were useful to them. The communist political model, the capitalist economic model, the shift from one to the other without hinderance of idealistic dogma. They adapted the English language, they learnt science from the greatest western minds, yet they restrict their social media platforms and censor films.

Eating cucumber sandwiches won't make Pakistan a better place, just like makke ni roti and lassi doesn't. Wearing wingtips rather than kaptan chappals won't help us walk in the right direction. We need to look at what is wrong with our society - what needs improving and what model we can borrow and adapt to implement that improvement.

I'll give you an example - we had parliamentary democracy and it's completely failed us. We need a more totalitarian form of governance to take control of things. Unfortunately for us, every time we try that, the same elites who wreck parliamentary democracy, put on a uniform and wreck totalitarianism.

We have English legal systems, but we don't have the same justice we can get in England? Why? Who else suffered from that - how did they fix it? I don't have all the answers, but whatever answer we have is going to be bespoke to us.

 

[halupridol]

A gorilla can be adopted by a human being, live in a palace, be trained and taught by finest brains but it will alll be to waste. He wil still be a gorilla. So your analogy does not fit.

The purpose of the thread was to highlight that modern China is a westernized country. It would never have succeeded had it not dropped it's "desi" ideas and adopted western culture, political philosophy and mores. Think of a pizza. The dough might be Chinese but all the toppings are Western. This applies to all other succesful countries. Japan. The dough is Japanese but the topping is Western. Singapore. The dough is Chinese/Malay/Indian but the topping is Western.

And most telling. The one example that should open Pakistani eyes is Turkey. The dough might be Turkish but the topping is Western. Indeed Turkey is just another westernized country but with a Muslim heritage. And please not I have been to all these countries so I can compare.

Ps. Turkey is the most Westernized country in the Muslim majority world.

A good thread.
But thr is a fundamental difference here, which u have completely ignored-----the bhayya gene.
Compared to Chinese,,,the so called "desis" ( basically bhayyas ranging from pendus to biharis) had alot more exposure to western ideas n culture,, due to british rule n english language proficiency.
But despite tht,, current day chinis seem more westernized thn a regular bhayya(sindhu, pendu, up, bihari, kashmiri Or whatever subtribe of bhayyes).
Reason- once a bhayya,, always a bhayya. (Like the gorilla)

 

[halupridol]

N quite possibly ur analogy is faulty.
It's a pizza becoz of the dough make n mozzarella cheese,,,, toppings r to one's taste(I.e. it can remain desi).
But the base (foundation) determines what it will become(believe it or not thr r tandoori pizzas,, n they rnt bad)
Eg. Naan/roti with cottage cheese (paneer) cannot make pizza,,,,, but with proper base(westernised) ,,, even with a "desi" topping it can become one.
Masla foundation me hai.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

So what do you make of a 15 inch spicy vegetarian pizza with chicken tikka on top? Or an Achaari special?

Well, I am getting hungry. Off topic but the best pizzas I have tasted are the ones with a Pakistani twist.

 

[-blitzkrieg-]

Xi doesn't live in Britain. Musharraf does and Manmohan Singh used to.

Take a chill pill.. those few dont represent the Chinese nation..

 

[halupridol]

Well, I am getting hungry. Off topic but the best pizzas I have tasted are the ones with a Pakistani twist.

I can safely assume tht the toopings were pakistani/desi twist. But the base/foundation was tht of a "westernised" pizza.

 

[jamal18]

Talk about act western, how about a country of 1 trillion people giving up their own language for English, self proclaimed democracy with freedom, and yet still remains the biggest sh!thole of the world.

A wannabe can never be. A true shame indeed

The greatest act of slavery any people can do is to surrender their language.

 

[peagle]

They actually pay good money to act Western. Shame on them.

Although I can see your point, but I have a question.

Is it wrong to assimilate a social or cultural practice if one is impressed by it?

Is that not how cultures have always developed through history.
The only difference being that now it is more global and more visible, whereas previously people would have been influenced differently and perhaps more gradually.