Week Before Final Indian Fighter Draw, Gripen Makes 2nd Price Pitch

[Zabaniyah]

So, the Swedes still trying to sell eh? hehehe...Indian defense market is indeed lucrative. Expect ruthless measures especially in today's economic climate

 

[nForce]

Saab should venture more into civilian aircrafts,the way Sukhoi did.The way the world is going,I don't think any largescale air war is going to happen in future.Mostly,it would be like reconnaissance,or ground support at max.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Either ways the gates are closed now. Think about it; Admiral Verma announced that more MiG-29Ks will be added to the Naval air arm instead of a third type of jet. That closed Sea Gripen's chance. The Israeli AESA was a winning point but as soon as US stepped in, everything non-EADS went down and out. Gripen is a fine fighter jet but we need something with a longer range and more payload.

Can you confirm this? Any sources? As far as I know the N-MMRCA is still very much alive. The Mig-29k order has been increased to 45 for Vikramditya and IAC-1. However the N-MMRCA is for any following ACC which are likely to be larger and CATOBAR (possibly EMALS) configured which rules out Mig-29K and means Sea Gripen is still in with a chains as it can operate in STOBAR and CATOBAR configurations. The F-35B/C, F-18SH and Rafle-M are still candidates also.

 

[illusion8]

Can you confirm this? Any sources? As far as I know the N-MMRCA is still very much alive. The Mig-29k order has been increased to 45 for Vikramditya and IAC-1. However the N-MMRCA is for any following ACC which are likely to be larger and CATOBAR (possibly EMALS) configured which rules out Mig-29K and means Sea Gripen is still in with a chains as it can operate in STOBAR and CATOBAR configurations. The F-35B/C, F-18SH and Rafle-M are still candidates also.

Does gripen come with complete TOT? IF so what about the US supplied parts, r they covered as well?

 

[Abingdonboy]

Does gripen come with complete TOT? IF so what about the US supplied parts, r they covered as well?

Well it comes with a damn site more TOT than the F-18/F-35. Obviously there are issues with US supplied parts.

 

[sancho]

Let them pitch,no harm in letting the competitors know that lower price options are currently available to India.I'm impressed by the resilience and great attitude that Swedes display towards rejection.Much better than the French who threw a fit and wanted to pull out of Aero-India after rumors started circulating that the Rafales got the axe for MMRCA.

I think you let yourself confuse too much by Saab, because all that they show is how desperate they are and how different their PR policy is compared to Dassaults for example, actually, they are the complete opposite!

On the one side Saab with a lot of PR in the media, that brought Gripens to at least 2 Aero India air shows that I remember, with a lot of pics of how the Gripen NG could look in future, loaded with big strike loads, painted with Indian colors...
...but in reality they have nothing to offer, because their fighter is only under development! That's why they attended the trials only with 2 older way less capable versions (comparable to LCA MK1) and fielded the Gripen NG (tech demonstrator, not the final prototype of the Gripen we might have got), just in the Leh trials and with 1 month delay.

On the other hand we have Dassault, that was the quietest company in the whole competition, which was annoying for a lot of us, because we didn't get much info. They prefered just to inform and demonstrate the capability of Rafale to IAF/IN/MoD/GoI, that's why they were one of the first contenders fielded in the trials and came with a fully working and integrated AESA radar to India. The French avoided media hypes, one reason why they only appeared at Aero India this year, so they couldn't pull out because of rumors in 2009.

As you can see, 2 very different policies, but for good reasons. When you have nothing in reality that can impress, you have to have impressive PR, with shiny presentations, posters and pics, Rafale didn't needed that and that's why it's still in the competition, while Gripen was rejected.

 

[LiberalAtheist]

Rafale will be in IAF colors soon Gripen just doesn't meet IAF standards

 

[sancho]

well if rafale is selected then when we induct first batch of planes

can any one has information

According the MMRCA RFP, the first squadron should be provided by the manufacturer in 2014 (3 years after the contract is signed), but the Rafale offered in MMRCA is actually available from 2013 onwards and Dassault offered fast production for India if we wanted. So it mainly will depend on how fast IAF would be ready to induct them.

Can you confirm this? Any sources? As far as I know the N-MMRCA is still very much alive. The Mig-29k order has been increased to 45 for Vikramditya and IAC-1.

Exactly, the statement Tshering22 refered to, was about the additional Mig 29K orders for Gorshkov and IAC1, while the Sea Gripen was offered in the new naval MMRCA competition.

Does gripen come with complete TOT? IF so what about the US supplied parts, r they covered as well?

Check this:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/134538-go-bankrupt-air-force-style-2.html#post2189543

 

[satishkumarcsc]

It is never the price...but Gripen screwed up in tech trials itself.....

 

[Cityboy]

According to my sources , it will be rafael, the mrca winner

 

[Agent_47]

Go for rafael,cheap and reliable.may be not the best.

 

[illusion8]

According the MMRCA RFP, the first squadron should be provided by the manufacturer in 2014 (3 years after the contract is signed), but the Rafale offered in MMRCA is actually available from 2013 onwards and Dassault offered fast production for India if we wanted. So it mainly will depend on how fast IAF would be ready to induct them.




Exactly, the statement Tshering22 refered to, was about the additional Mig 29K orders for Gorshkov and IAC1, while the Sea Gripen was offered in the new naval MMRCA competition.



Check this:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/134538-go-bankrupt-air-force-style-2.html#post2189543

If that's so, then gripen

 

[sancho]

If that's so, then gripen

It's already gone, the manufacturer is simply too desperate to understand it, that's all.

 

[Dash]

know very well that IAF acting as a rich man's kid...
nothing can be done if parents are too lebral...

Why do you always say that Lucky??, Its not a metter of who is rich and who is poor. I reckon my father always used to give the best to me so that I can stay protected and advanced....not that he was rich but he never wanted to compromise on his kids future and which needs to be secure..

so on teh same lines Gripen though cheap doent have the following things.

1. No strategic depth.
2. Doesnt fill the gap "completely" between Su-30 Mki and Tejas...Its a little more advanced than Tejas.
3. Doesnt give us freedom for TOT, especially the engine part, for which we are struggling. Whats the guarentee that they can give us TOT on Engine which is US engine, I am sure even neither have TOT nor the strategic depth to drive US to give us TOT. So rulled out.
4. Dosnt offer good weapons package compared to the other fighter.
5. Less advanced radar and IAF got it very right.
6. not so important but MRCA is deal has a big impact for N-MRCA and navy will surely go for one of the MRCA winners, just like they went for Mig-29 coz IAF operates and resolves the logistical challenges.

It is a good fighter, no doubt but a less good fighter compared to the others and IAF would want the best in the sky and a near equal competitor to the J-20s and J-10s...

---------- Post added at 09:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:31 PM ----------

It's already gone, the manufacturer is simply too desperate to understand it, that's all.

They are pitiching coz they want to save their own a**...nothing else.