Was INSAS rifle really ever used on ground zero of Indian insurgency battlefields/war battlefield?

[NKVD]

INSAS is crap but it was used widely as well.

No it's not actually Army never able to proove this practically

See the Delhi high court verdict in matter of insas

 

[Han Patriot]

No it's not actually Army never able to proove this practically

See the Delhi high court verdict in matter of insas

OK, you two can go on arguing whether INSAS is crap. The point is in times of war, you can't depend on imports, you can do this to Pakistan but when you face China with a more advanced MIC, they are gonna outgun you with artillery, etc.

 

[punit]

OK, you two can go on arguing whether INSAS is crap. The point is in times of war, you can't depend on imports, you can do this to Pakistan but when you face China with a more advanced MIC, they are gonna outgun you with artillery, etc.

whether Indian design or foreign design .. future Indian guns will be manufactured in India.

 

[halupridol]

It has been widely used in northeastern India,,army,crpf,assam rifles.
Heard only complains,,no praise.
Typical Indian engineering product,,world claas.
Expect similar world claas products in future frm our dpsu's

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

OK, you two can go on arguing whether INSAS is crap. The point is in times of war, you can't depend on imports, you can do this to Pakistan but when you face China with a more advanced MIC, they are gonna outgun you with artillery, etc.

When it comes to China, we all know that in a war -- a protracted war and not a small skirmish or border conflict -- India will lose. Simple as that. Situation is no different than what it was between China and US from 1960s to say mid 90s. We need to do the same thing which China did back then and for that matter Pakistan is doing : Have deterrence -- both nuclear and conventional -- which make China avoid conflict for most of the parts and keep a foreign policy which does not actively provoke China into a reactionary war.

Which is what India is doing. An all out war is a very remote possibility and having military pacts with USA makes it even more remote. A border skirmish is fairly remote possibility and even there we have enough equipments and manpower to hold China till US and rest of the world is able to put enough pressure on China to withdraw.

If still a protracted all out war happens with China, India will be defeated and disintegrate. But then, most likely Bejing will be gone, so will be Shenzeng, Hunan, Hong Kong, Shenghai and China will have start again from square one. The funny part is more prosperous China becomes, more unlikely it will like to have a direct long and protracted war with India.

 

[Han Patriot]

When it comes to China, we all know that in a war -- a protracted war and not a small skirmish or border conflict -- India will lose. Simple as that. Situation is no different than what it was between China and US from 1960s to say mid 90s. We need to do the same thing which China did back then and for that matter Pakistan is doing : Have deterrence -- both nuclear and conventional -- which make China avoid conflict for most of the parts and keep a foreign policy which does not actively provoke China into a reactionary war.

Which is what India is doing. An all out war is a very remote possibility and having military pacts with USA makes it even more remote. A border skirmish is fairly remote possibility and even there we have enough equipments and manpower to hold China till US and rest of the world is able to put enough pressure on China to withdraw.

If still a protracted all out war happens with China, India will be defeated and disintegrate. But then, most likely Bejing will be gone, so will be Shenzeng, Hunan, Hong Kong, Shenghai and China will have start again from square one. The funny part is more prosperous China becomes, more unlikely it will like to have a direct long and protracted war with India.

Definitely it will never be an all out war like say invasion of India. We are talking 1962 style border skirmish capturing some land, etc. India will not use nuclear weapons just because China captured AP. China will also not use nuclear weapons if India retaliates. It will be a conventional war, a quick and decisive war less than a year long, looking at Indian readiness rates, with all spare parts lacking, unknown % of SU-30MKI ready, India will lose this battle. The war in the highlands will be aircrafts and artillery. Both are produced in China.

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

Definitely it will never be an all out war like say invasion of India. We are talking 1962 style border skirmish capturing some land, etc. India will not use nuclear weapons just because China captured AP. China will also not use nuclear weapons if India retaliates. It will be a conventional war, a quick and decisive war less than a year long, looking at Indian readiness rates, with all spare parts lacking, unknown % of SU-30MKI ready, India will lose this battle. The war in the highlands will be aircrafts and artillery. Both are produced in China.

Actually India will use nuclear weapons if a significant portion of its territory is captured. And whole of AP is quite significant.

A quick decisive war will need to less than week long or US and rest of the world will intervene. A few week long war will be enough for US and NATO to mount diplomatic pressure on China. I doubt China can capture whole of AP in a week or so. Few months are minimum required.

Alternatively, China will follow inch-by-inch model which it is doing currently. Good thing is that India has realised it, and is now retaliating, albiet in a blood-less manner. China hold around 2000 sq km of India territory in this one square kilometer at a time in Ladhak region.

 

[Han Patriot]

Actually India will use nuclear weapons if a significant portion of its territory is captured. And whole of AP is quite significant.

A quick decisive war will need to less than week long or US and rest of the world will intervene. A few week long war will be enough for US and NATO to mount diplomatic pressure on China. I doubt China can capture whole of AP in a week or so. Few months are minimum required.

Alternatively, China will follow inch-by-inch model which it is doing currently. Good thing is that India has realised it, and is now retaliating, albiet in a blood-less manner.

Hmmm...that's the problem. We need to figure out the Indian limit and the right time to attack. It has to be some sort of crisis scenario where India cannot concentrate.

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

Hmmm...that's the problem. We need to figure out the Indian limit and the right time to attack. It has to be some sort of crisis scenario where India cannot concentrate.

Crisis can happen with China as well, Tibetian rebels getting hold of a large cache of explosives for example...

Or a fallout with Japan and US for example.

It will depend upon timing and political will in China and India.

In 1962, the conflict shadowed US involvement in Cuban Missile Crisis. I doubt Russia and US are going to war any time soon. US focus is now totally on China. It is noteworthy China ended the conflict as soon as US ended its standoff with Russia on Cuba.

 

[Han Patriot]

Crisis can happen with China as well, Tibetian rebels getting hold of a large cache of explosives for example...

Or a fallout with Japan and US for example.

It will depend upon timing and political will in China and India.

In 1962, the conflict shadowed US involvement in Cuban Missile Crisis. I doubt Russia and US are going to war any time soon. US focus is now totally on China. It is noteworthy China ended the conflict as soon as US ended its standoff with Russia on Cuba.

Yup, Russia is now pro China and is in no position to help India. The only thing stopping China is US. If you compare Tibetans and Uighur to your Marxist, Islamist threat, it's like kids with lego. LOL. Remember the advantages of a authoritarian state?

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

Yup, Russia is now pro China and is in no position to help India. The only thing stopping China is US. If you compare Tibetans and Uighur to your Marxist, Islamist threat, it's like kids with lego. LOL. Remember the advantages of a authoritarian state?

Well, China has more to loose as well. Few explosions in High Speed Trains will cause much bigger headache for Chinese government than say derailing 10-50 trains in India. Perception of peace in both the countries is not same.

Indians percieve most of their governments as incompetent. Chinese government will be shaken more if they loose their 'In Control' image.

In unconventional war, if India retaliates, Chinese government will have bigger problem. Remember a single 9/11 caused much bigger disrruption to US than years of war in middle east?

Yup, Russia is now pro China and is in no position to help India.

Russia is not exactly pro-China. Russia needs money to revitalize her economy. Thats all. In a conflict, Russia will keep supplying weapons to both sides. Possibly routing them from Europe or Afghanistan. Biggest help from Russia side to India will be in abstaining to vote in UNSC and remaining neutral in US entry into Indo China conflict.

 

[Han Patriot]

Well, China has more to loose as well. Few explosions in High Speed Trains will cause much bigger headache for Chinese government than say derailing 10-50 trains in India. Perception of peace in both the countries is not same.

Indians percieve most of their governments as incompetent. Chinese government will be shaken more if they loose their 'In Control' image.

In unconventional war, if India retaliates, Chinese government will have bigger problem. Remember a single 9/11 caused much bigger disrruption to US than years of war in middle east?


Russia is not exactly pro-China. Russia needs money to revitalize her economy. Thats all. In a conflict, Russia will keep supplying weapons to both sides. Possibly routing them from Europe or Afghanistan. Biggest help from Russia side to India will be in abstaining to vote in UNSC and remaining neutral in US entry into Indo China conflict.

Agree, but attacking China proper would be like China attacking India proper. It's best to confine it to a border conflict, fight it over and see who prevails. The victor will get to keep the spoils.

I have to disagree with you on Russia, I believe Russia will remain neutral and won't supply weapons to India during the conflict. I think Russia will supply weapons big time after the conflict. US OTOH is a wild card, they might or might not enter the battle, I believe initial stage they will not enter but in a prolonged conflict, they might get involved. Therefore, it is imperative China finish this battle fast and furious before US gets involved.

Hope we can fight this off professionally.

 

[EndangeredSpecies]

Agree, but attacking China proper would be like China attacking India proper. It's best to confine it to a border conflict, fight it over and see who prevails. The victor will get to keep the spoils.

Well, if China promotes insuergency within India thats the only option left for India. To respond to an unconventional war in an unconventional manner. The skewness of aftermath favors India fortunately. For India it is not best to resolve conflict on the border in a military manner right now. For India it is best to do what China had done to her claims in 70s or 80s. Keep the claims intact and maintain control over territories, keep a deterance and assert control properly when in a stronger position in future. Do not get suckered into a war but also do not let the enemy bully you. Thats a delicate dance China also did with US in the past.

 

[Bharat Muslim]

Even the second alternative in the poll is a negative vote for INSAS because it means the rifle is used against weak opponents like Naxalites who are almost as ill-armed as civilians and not against army or real militants like in Kashmir.