VIEW: Success lies in secularism —Dr Irfan Zafar

[Janubaba]

so as per you, God says that any one who follows a path to God other than Islam are evil followers and you are the Good one here in the Planet. Your statements are the worst of the worst that I have read in PDF. GOOD LUCK mate and may Allha come in your dreams and make you learn how to co-exist.

Sir for Muslims ALLAH has sent humans for one purpose to follow the DEEN which he sent for mankind that is ISLAM so people have to follow Islam as this world is the test for humans

 

[Bang Galore]

Since you are not debating any particular religion but also not helping yourself in giving your views about religion and then asking the other person to not make you understand in the light of religion.Are you sure of your self what you are doing.Well you know That's Ok.I understand

All I said is that I won't debate a particular piece of scripture that you quoted, since in my experience it only leads to unnecessary friction without adding any value to the discussion.

Completely rheotric and contradicts with your first point.

Seems you have a comprehension problem! Read again & slowly this time. I make no reference to any particular religion & have outlined principles that should govern behavior in any country that aspires to be secular. Searching for religious sanction of secularism, as the author does is plain silly. Nobody gives up power willingly. When framed within a religious context, it will always be prone to hijacking by people like you and the likes of the author can never hope to convince the likes of you. No contradiction anywhere in sight.

 

[ashokdeiva]

Sir for Muslims ALLAH has sent humans for one purpose to follow the DEEN which he sent for mankind that is ISLAM so people have to follow Islam as this world is the test for humans

Crap with you and you idiotism, if God is capable of any thing why does he show up in the sky and say that Islam is every thing and if you don't follow it I am going to destroy the people who stand in my path. if you follow your way of life with out interfearing in other than you are moving a step closer to God, if you do selfless help to the people who are in need of help you take another step close to God, if you attain peace that means you have become part of God. its not that you die and God will put you in hell for not following Islam.
I feel pathetic for you and from my observation from the way you use the word "SIR" in each of your post, i can sure say that you have been under someone who demands respect from you and you have become habitual to that behaviour.

 

[Black Widow]

oops! I didn't see this,

Janubaba
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Sorry , I can't discuss with you... I don think I am matured enough to have a discussion with you... have fun...

 

[*Awan*]

@Nomi965



Secularism is a attribute of democracy.. It separate religion from state so that state don't discriminate minorities.. For a state all pupil should be equal, only secularism can guarantee that... Take an example Islamic countries Pork is prohibited, what if a cristian wnat to eat pork??? Isn't state doing discrimination ???

What secularism has to do with democracy?Greeks invented the democracy many centuries ago where as secularism is the child of yesterday born just 1-2 centuries ago.In my previous post i showed how this secularism was born and i also post the views on secularism of its fathers.
In Islamic states minorities has equal rights as muslims although in some fields their rights are limited but this thing is compensated in other fields.Go in detail how people of minority are discriminated in Islamic state?
Saudia is a country where Islamic laws are applied very strictly.In superstores pork is available.

Secularism doesn't means Aethism, It doesn't means state don't approve any religion. instead it means, State believe in many religion, It doesn't favor or discriminate any religion...

official name of Pakistan is Islamic repblic of Pakistan.so Pakistan is Islamic state not secular state,so it is the duty of Islamic state to provide such a environment where an individual can observe and practice Islam more easily.

 

[Bang Galore]

Crap with you and you idiotism, if God is capable of any thing why does he show up in the sky and say that Islam is every thing and if you don't follow it I am going to destroy the people who stand in my path. if you follow your way of life with out interfearing in other than you are moving a step closer to God, if you do selfless help to the people who are in need of help you take another step close to God, if you attain peace that means you have become part of God. its not that you die and God will put you in hell for not following Islam.
I feel pathetic for you and from my observation from the way you use the word "SIR" in each of your post, i can sure say that you have been under someone who demands respect from you and you have become habitual to that behaviour.

Completely unnecessary. You can disagree without being disagreeable. I also find the mocking of his using of "sir"odd. There isn't anything in his arguments that I find myself in agreement with. However, every one of his points is reflective of what he believes in & remarkably for this forum, it is put forward without any great anger directed at anyone else. There is no evidence that "God" can be attained in the manner of your choice either. If you start getting worked up over these trivial matters (and they are trivial!), I'm afraid your stay here will be a much reduced one.

 

[*Awan*]

@ Indians

you people are discussing something that does not belong to you.you have your country and we have ours.

 

[ashokdeiva]

@ Indians

you people are discussing something that does not belong to you.you have your country and we have ours.

you are right, the problem is that when ever secularism is talked about some people like Janubaba come up that all the world should follow Islam and abandon his/her faith that is practised for thousands of years. do you agree that Janubaba's comments are right? i hope not.

 

[ashokdeiva]

Completely unnecessary. You can disagree without being disagreeable. I also find the mocking of his using of "sir"odd. There isn't anything in his arguments that I find myself in agreement with. However, every one of his points is reflective of what he believes in & remarkably for this forum, it is put forward without any great anger directed at anyone else. There is no evidence that "God" can be attained in the manner of your choice either. If you start getting worked up over these trivial matters (and they are trivial!), I'm afraid your stay here will be a much reduced one.

belive is not the problem her, not using the reasoning ability is the problem here and as far as Janubaba is considered, he does not question "Why", why should Islam alone survie? why should the rest of the religions be scraped? why shuold some one go on a business of preaching a religion door to door?
can he answer any of the questions with regards to all humans that inhibit the planet.

 

[*Awan*]

you are right, the problem is that when ever secularism is talked about some people like Janubaba come up that all the world should follow Islam and abandon his/her faith that is practised for thousands of years. do you agree that Janubaba's comments are right? i hope not.

show me his post where he write these words.

 

[ashokdeiva]

show me his post where he write these words.

post number 46 is a typical example

 

[*Awan*]

post number 46 is a typical example

its his personal opinion.next time if you came across this type of statement from a muslim simply quote following lines

"for you your religion and for us our religion"surae qafiroon

 

[ashokdeiva]

its his personal opinion.next time if you came across this type of statement from a muslim simply quote following lines

"for you your religion and for us our religion"surae qafiroon

my quest is not to tech him about religion, but why does he not use his reasoning ability, why is he blind to say that? why is he not interested in part where he can have a hindu as a friend and invite him for a feast on Ramzan and why can't he be a friend to a Hindu that he be invited for a party by the HIndu on Deepawali

 

[EjazR]

Some people think that the fact that Secularism is compatible with Islam and infact part of Islam should not brought up.

But the fact is anyone who actually advocates the political Islamic philosophy belong to a group of people who DO NOT have any traditional Islamic learning.

The initial concepts came around in the early 1930s notable by Maududi and Syed Qutb. Neither of them were Islamic scholars, one was a journalist and the other a school teacher.

This idea of political Islam is anti-thetical to traditional Islam and the reason why Islamic scholars reject it. There is no verse in the Quran that calls for establishing a so called "Islamic state" and implementing Islam in a top down approach. You can't create a law that says all Muslims should pray and then force Muslims all over to pray. This creates hypocrisy because then Muslims will be praying because of the law instead of for Allah alone.

The on concept of this Islamic political philosophy is a subset of religious nationalism that came about as a counter point to the Marxist Communism philosophy. Similar movements in Judaism like Zionism with is political Judaism or India you have political Hinduism as well took root around the 1930s as well.

For example, the idea of a vanguard that would lead a revolution to smash the current political order and finally lead to the establishment of utopia of equality is very similar to concepts that both Marxist and religious nationalist movements advocate.

For people who want to read up more on this, particularly confused Muslims who think what Hizbut Tharir advocates or JI advocates is correct, they can read this thread in full detail
http://www.defence.pk/forums/curren...wered-questions-case-pakistan.html#post550583

 

[Cloakedvessel]

Crap with you and you idiotism, if God is capable of any thing why does he show up in the sky and say that Islam is every thing and if you don't follow it I am going to destroy the people who stand in my path. if you follow your way of life with out interfearing in other than you are moving a step closer to God, if you do selfless help to the people who are in need of help you take another step close to God, if you attain peace that means you have become part of God. its not that you die and God will put you in hell for not following Islam.
I feel pathetic for you and from my observation from the way you use the word "SIR" in each of your post, i can sure say that you have been under someone who demands respect from you and you have become habitual to that behaviour.

He got the best of you. You're now ranting just like him.