What's new

Vietnam’s Dangerous Courtship with Washington

TaiShang

ELITE MEMBER
Joined
Apr 30, 2014
Messages
27,848
Reaction score
70
Country
China
Location
Taiwan, Province Of China
Vietnam’s Dangerous Courtship with Washington
May 15, 2016

President Obama’s upcoming visit to Vietnam will take place amidst increasing American tensions with China. Beijing recently scrambled a couple of fighter jets after an American naval ship sailed dangerously close to one of its disputed islands in the South China Sea, which was just the latest in a series of multiple provocations that have taken place all across the region ever since the US declared its Pivot to Asia in October 2011. As part of the US’s plan to “contain” China, the Pentagon envisages constructing a multilateral “China Containment Coalition” all across East, Southeast and South Asia, with the most active core of this prospective coalition being a Vietnamese-Philippine naval alliance.

With the election of Rodrigo Duterte as the President of the Philippines and his willingness to pragmatically negotiate with China, it is looking less likely that Manila will play as critical a “containment” role as the US had initially anticipated.

In response to this surprising shift in regional geopolitics, the US is expected to intensify its military-strategic relations with Vietnam, and President Obama’s visit might be just as important a catalyst for Hanoi’s pro-American pivot as Defence Secretary Carter’s visit to India was last month. Considering this, it is important to take a look at Vietnam’s recent moves with regards to China and explore the military-related avenues that it has to expand if it is to enter into a “containment” partnership with the US.

Redirecting Away From Russia

To start off, it is important to educate the reader about Vietnam’s massive arms buildup over the past couple of years.

According to the latest report from the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI), Vietnam was the eighth-largest arms importer in the world for the period 2011-2015, importing a whopping 699% more weaponry during this same period than it did in the preceding five years.

The overwhelming majority of these weapons – 93% – were Russian-made. Moscow’s willingness to supply weapons on such a scale to Vietnam bespeaks of Moscow’s traditional role in balancing rival foes, in this case Vietnam and China. Moscow has followed the same pattern of balancing between other regional foes such as Armenia and Azerbaijan and India and China.

In and of itself this ought to mean that Vietnam’s large increase in weapons imports should not be a cause for alarm. This is because in line with its policy of balance Russia’s weapons supplies to Vietnam are intended to reinforce the status quo between Vietnam and China in the South China Sea rather than upset it.

What is more worrying however is that Vietnam is now beginning to look elsewhere for its weaponry, in a way that might threaten the strategic balance between Vietnam and China, just as Dmitry Medvedev warned might happen between Armenia and Azerbaijan if either of them did something similar.

The discrete presence of leading US weapons companies such as Boeing and Lockheed Martin at a large defence-related gathering in Hanoi this week shows that the US is indeed aggressively angling to eat away at Russia’s market share in Vietnam, provided of course that the restrictions the US Congress has imposed on weapons sales to Vietnam are progressively lifted.

Vietnam is encouraging these US moves. Its Foreign Ministry has just announced that it would “welcome the United States’ acceleration to fully lift the lethal arms sales ban”.

Following In India’s Footsteps

It’s unclear why Vietnam, which has enjoyed decades-long military-technical cooperation with Russia, should be dissatisfied with its existing Moscow-provided weapons and should feel the need to solicit more weapons from its former American foe.

In just the same way that India is slowly moving away from Russian weapons, so too Vietnam might be preparing for a similar “transition” (or “rebalancing” as Vietnam’s media and its international supporters like to call it) away from reliance on Moscow.

As the saying goes, “if it’s not broke, don’t fix it”, so it is questionable why both of these countries should feel the need to turn to the US for more weapons when arms cooperation with Russia has always been very good.

The only explanation is that Vietnam, like India, is being courted by the US as part of the “China Containment Coalition”, and that Washington wants to ‘seal the deal’ with both of its newfound partners through a series of highly profitable and symbolic arms contracts.

The restoration of full US-Vietnamese relations, including in the military sphere, might appear as a superficially welcome sign for all other countries that are currently experiencing Western sanctions. It would however be a pyrrhic victory.

Since there is no legitimate reason why Vietnam would resort to importing weapons from the US when it can get from Russia all the weapons it needs to maintain the strategic naval balance with China, the only reason why Hanoi is now reaching out to Washington is that it must be genuinely interested in falling in with the US anti-Chinese strategy in a way that can only upset the regional balance with China.

US-Vietnamese collaboration against China is not just occurring out of the blue. Hanoi has already received $18 million last year to purchase US patrol boats after US Senator John McCain pushed through legislation to loosen the arms embargo. Adding another element to the mix, Vietnam is party to the restrictive TPP trading agreement that its top export partner is pushing for throughout the region.

In other words, Vietnam has already agreed to align itself with the economic component of the US’s hegemonic Pivot to Asia, so that it predictably follows that it should do so in the military sphere as well.

Losing Balance

It is too early to say Vietnam is fully pivoting towards the US at the expense of its traditional Russian ally. Clearly however Hanoi has thrown in its lot in with Washington in pursuing the shared objective of “containing” China.

Even if Vietnam were ever to make such an anti-Russian decision, it would take a long time for it to transition its entire military from using Russian to US weapons.

More likely, Hanoi wants to cooperate with the US to send a signal to China whilst simultaneously strengthening its future bargaining position with Moscow. After all, if Vietnam really wanted to break with Russia, it would have complied with US’ demands last March and barred Russia from using its airfields for military refuelling.

Instead, it appears Vietnam is looking to walk a geopolitical tightrope, balancing its historical military ties with Russia with its recent economic ones with the US.

Nonetheless, though it will take time, if Vietnam’s present pro-US course continues then the two former foes could surprisingly end up very close allies in the next decade, united by a shared desire to “contain” China. The fact this is just a hyped-up marketing gimmick from the US military-industrial complex is neither here nor there.

The most logical consequence of Hanoi’s progressive shift towards Washington will be that its relations with Beijing will suffer. As for the US, once it senses that its dominant position in Vietnam has been restored, it will inevitably pressure Vietnam to distance itself from Russia too.

Given the series of Hybrid Wars that the US has been waging all across the world lately, it is to be expected that the US will employ some elements of this strategy in one day blackmailing Vietnam to follow the course it wants for it. Although the exact scenarios cannot be foreseen, one possibility might be for the US to exploit the TPP’s on-paper labour regulations to foment a Colour Revolution movement in Vietnam that disguises itself as a “Solidarity”-type workers’ union to exert grassroots pressure on the Vietnamese authorities.

Concluding Thoughts

Every country has the sovereign right to choose whoever it wants to cooperate with in strategic, military, economic, and other affairs. Countries such as China and Russia cannot however help but be alarmed by Vietnam’s recent intensification of its relations with the US.

Were it not directed against any third party, then the US-Vietnamese Strategic Partnership (as historically odd as it may seem considering the Vietnam War) would not be a threat to anyone. The trouble is that it is intended as a threat, specifically against China, but with a long-term intention of weakening Russia’s position in Southeast Asia as well.

Moscow’s and Beijing’s diplomats will react calmly, with Russia probably avoiding direct mention of these developments at all. However there is no doubt Moscow and Beijing are worried and will be watching events closely to see what happens next.

If Washington ramps up its relations with Hanoi in response to Duterte’s victory in the Philippines, and and seeks to replace the Philippines with Vietnam in its Pivot to Asia strategy, then this could shift the centre of the regional confrontation with China that the “containment” strategy entails from the South China Sea to the Indochinese mainland.


TheDuran.com
 
.
Don't worry, even China is happy to see Vietnam normalizing relations with the US.
--------------------
World | Fri May 13, 2016 9:07am EDT
China says hopes U.S., Vietnam ties benefit regional peace
China is happy to see Vietnam normalizing relations with the United States and hopes it benefits regional peace, China said on Friday as the United States considers lifting a three-decade-old arms embargo on Vietnam.

A debate within the U.S. administration on lifting the arms embargo is coming to a head amid preparations for President Barack Obama to visit Vietnam this month. The former enemies are increasingly partners against China's growing territorial assertiveness in the South China Sea.

Vietnam says it would welcome the United States "accelerating" the lifting of a lethal arms embargo, which would reflect trust between the two countries and recognition of its needs to defend itself. The ban was eased in late 2014.

"From the Chinese government's point of view, we are happy to see Vietnam develop normal relations with the relevant country," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Lu Kang told a daily news briefing, when asked about the possible lifting.

"We also hope this relationship can benefit regional peace, stability and prosperity," he added, without elaborating.

The arms embargo is one of the last major vestiges of the Vietnam War era. The United States has not indicated publicly it would remove the embargo and has long said such a move would depend on Vietnam showing progress on human rights.

Lifting the embargo would mark a major step forward in ties 21 years after normalization began.

U.S. engagement with Vietnam was stepped up rapidly during 2014, in what experts say was a calibrated move by the United States to seize on deteriorating ties between Vietnam and communist neighbor China over rival territorial claims in the South China Sea.

Vietnam has been boosting its military deterrent as China intensifies its fortification of South China Sea islands it controls or has built from scratch.

(Reporting by Ben Blanchard; Editing by Robert Birsel)
 
.
Trying to cozying with American can only be seen as deception to Russia as what India did, this is nothing but good new for China, let Vietnam to set a zero sum game between US and Russia on this Military sale and geopolitical influence on this region, when Vietnam let US eat Russia's cake, Russia will certainly not sit Idle.
 
.
the article is biased and wrong. no wonder it is written by a typical chinese "expert" for chinese, looking through a chinese glas, living in a chinese world. containment here and there. as if VN policy toward Washington is all about it. no. actually the author should ask these questions:

- is the current Vietnam-Russia economic and defence relationship strong enough to deter chinese arrogance and aggression?

- what Vietnam must do to get prosperity and security?
 
.
the article is biased and wrong. no wonder it is written by a typical chinese "expert" for chinese, looking through a chinese glas, living in a chinese world. containment here and there. as if VN policy toward Washington is all about it. no. actually the author should ask these questions:

- is the current Vietnam-Russia economic and defence relationship strong enough to deter chinese arrogance and aggression?

- what Vietnam must do to get prosperity and security?

More like Chinese ignorance

Trying to cozying with American can only be seen as deception to Russia as what India did, this is nothing but good new for China, let Vietnam to set a zero sum game between US and Russia on this Military sale and geopolitical influence on this region, when Vietnam let US eat Russia's cake, Russia will certainly not sit Idle.

What you scared of the American? What are you going to do about it?
 
.
the article is biased and wrong. no wonder it is written by a typical chinese "expert" for chinese, looking through a chinese glas, living in a chinese world. containment here and there. as if VN policy toward Washington is all about it. no. actually the author should ask these questions:

- is the current Vietnam-Russia economic and defence relationship strong enough to deter chinese arrogance and aggression?

- what Vietnam must do to get prosperity and security?

What's wrong with Chinese expert? :lol: we don't worship westerner expert's opinions as you Viets. And let me answer you that question:

Vietnam-Russia economic and defense relation is not strong enough to deter Russia from siding with China over SCS issue. :rofl: You can label Chinese arrogance and aggression but that is not changing the fact that the geopolitic in SCS is been altered, Russia is not seen Vietnam as you used to be in 1970s to 2010.

Vietnam security is inherent to China, if you want to see us as enemy, your wish will be granted, if you consider China is a "potential" friend, then there is potentional room to improve our relation.

What you scared of the American? What are you going to do about it?

Why are we scare of Americans when we still earn a trade surplus with them?:dance3:China can readjust itself to the outcome of US-Vietnam relation, our military budget is far exceed Vietam, we have plenty options to take care of Vietnam.:dirol:
 
.
Nothing Vietnam can do to stop China's ascension. Vietnam is not China's real concern but if USA wants to throw Vietnam in China's path, then China will oblige by stepping on and crushing Vietnam. Vietnam needs to learn to accept the changing order of Asia or face being blown away, in the winds of change. Either way, China will get to where they want to go.
 
.
I appreciate the official point of view of China government stated by Lu Kang "China is happy to see Vietnam normalizing relations with relevant country".
From my point of view, I would be happy to see China develop good relations with neighbors and relevant countries too.
 
.
What's wrong with Chinese expert? :lol: we don't worship westerner expert's opinions as you Viets. And let me answer you that question:

Vietnam-Russia economic and defense relation is not strong enough to deter Russia from siding with China over SCS issue. :rofl: You can label Chinese arrogance and aggression but that is not changing the fact that the geopolitic in SCS is been altered, Russia is not seen Vietnam as you used to be in 1970s to 2010.

Vietnam security is inherent to China, if you want to see us as enemy, your wish will be granted, if you consider China is a "potential" friend, then there is potentional room to improve our relation.



Why are we scare of Americans when we still earn a trade surplus with them?:dance3:China can readjust itself to the outcome of US-Vietnam relation, our military budget is far exceed Vietam, we have plenty options to take care of Vietnam.:dirol:
Lol you are so naive.

Nothing Vietnam can do to stop China's ascension. Vietnam is not China's real concern but if USA wants to throw Vietnam in China's path, then China will oblige by stepping on and crushing Vietnam. Vietnam needs to learn to accept the changing order of Asia or face being blown away, in the winds of change. Either way, China will get to where they want to go.
Lol what a fool
 
.
Don't worry, even China is happy to see Vietnam normalizing relations with the US.
--------------------
World | Fri May 13, 2016 9:07am EDT
China says hopes U.S., Vietnam ties benefit regional peace
China is happy to see Vietnam normalizing relations with the United States and hopes it benefits regional peace, China said on Friday as the United States considers lifting a three-decade-old arms embargo on Vietnam.

A debate within the U.S. administration on lifting the arms embargo is coming to a head amid preparations for President Barack Obama to visit Vietnam this month. The former enemies are increasingly partners against China's growing territorial assertiveness in the South China Sea.

Vietnam says it would welcome the United States "accelerating" the lifting of a lethal arms embargo, which would reflect trust between the two countries and recognition of its needs to defend itself. The ban was eased in late 2014.

"From the Chinese government's point of view, we are happy to see Vietnam develop normal relations with the relevant country," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Lu Kang told a daily news briefing, when asked about the possible lifting.

"We also hope this relationship can benefit regional peace, stability and prosperity," he added, without elaborating.

The arms embargo is one of the last major vestiges of the Vietnam War era. The United States has not indicated publicly it would remove the embargo and has long said such a move would depend on Vietnam showing progress on human rights.

Lifting the embargo would mark a major step forward in ties 21 years after normalization began.

U.S. engagement with Vietnam was stepped up rapidly during 2014, in what experts say was a calibrated move by the United States to seize on deteriorating ties between Vietnam and communist neighbor China over rival territorial claims in the South China Sea.

Vietnam has been boosting its military deterrent as China intensifies its fortification of South China Sea islands it controls or has built from scratch.

(Reporting by Ben Blanchard; Editing by Robert Birsel)

We definitely encourage you to get closer. That will enable China-Russia cooperation go even deeper. I would trade the entire VT-PH-US trio for alliance with Russia.

the article is biased and wrong. no wonder it is written by a typical chinese "expert" for chinese

More like Chinese ignorance

The author is not Chinese. Neither is the website.
 
.
We definitely encourage you to get closer. That will enable China-Russia cooperation go even deeper.

I wonder what restrict the China-Russia cooperation go deeper now and then?
Why you need Vietnam - US normalize first ?

Have a look at Russia - Japan normalization right now
 
.
I wonder what restrict the China-Russia cooperation go deeper now and then?

You know, it is always a balancing act. China-Russia strategic partnership will go deeper with or without VT siding with the US.

But the 'getting closer to the US' will definitely reinforce the trend.

Have a look at Russia - Japan normalization right now

That's also encouraging, although the sides could not agree on much. But, still, it is a positive trend. See them as sign-posts not as absolute or final truths.
 
.
Nothing Vietnam can do to stop China's ascension. Vietnam is not China's real concern but if USA wants to throw Vietnam in China's path, then China will oblige by stepping on and crushing Vietnam. Vietnam needs to learn to accept the changing order of Asia or face being blown away, in the winds of change. Either way, China will get to where they want to go.
Your words remind me of that of the Mongols. Back them in the 13 Century, at the height of power, after these barbarians from the steppe conquered China, taking your women, killing half of Chinese population, they demanded Vietnam either surrender or total annihilation.

We offered them Vietnam paying tribute and accepting them as the ruler of China. But they refused. Understandable, considering the balance of power. And of course, ignorance of our history that we never back down.

We warned the Mongols. Should it come to bloodshed, that would not only our blood but yours. They didn't want to listen.

After 3 invasions, over a million of dead soldiers, they had given up. It came as predicted, dead bodies of Mongol and Chinese soldiers scattered our roads, on the surface on the Red river.

A total defeat. A military disaster for the Mongol empire.

It is a mistake if you think, you can intimidate Vietnam.

Time has changed, but obviously not the minds of some of our arch enemies.
 
Last edited:
.
Your words remind me of that of the Mongols. Back them in the 13 Century, at the height of power, after these barbarians from the steppe conquered China, taking your women, killing half of Chinese population, they demanded Vietnam either surrender or total annihilation.

We offered them Vietnam paying tribute and accepting them as the ruler of China. But they refused. Understandable, considering the balance of power. And of course, ignorance of our history that we never back down.

We warned the Mongols. Should it come to bloodshed, that would not only our blood but yours. They didn't want to listen.

After 3 invasions, over a million of dead soldiers, they had given up. It came as predicted, dead bodies of Mongol and Chinese soldiers scattered our roads, on the surface on the Red river.

A total defeat. A military disaster for the Mongol empire.

It is a mistake if you think, you can intimidate Vietnam.

Time has changed, but obviously not the minds of some of our arch enemies.

The Mongols most likely had 1 million as their entire population in the 13th century, so they cannot lose 1 million men in a war campaign against Vietnam. BTW, they rarely recruited the Han soldiers. When they subjugated other nations, they used Turks, Persians, Arabs as the foreign mercenaries, but not Hans.

BTW, Wikipedia is not a good source, mostly got edited by your fellow compatriots in this Mongol invasion of Vietnam section.
 
Last edited:
.
The Mongols most likely had 1 million as their entire population in the 13th century, so they cannot lose 1 million men in a war campaign against Vietnam. BTW, they rarely recruited the Han soldiers. When they subjugated other nations, they used Turks, Persians, Arabs as the foreign mercenaries, but not Hans.

BTW, Wikipedia is not a good source, mostly got edited by your fellow compatriots in this Mongol invasion of Vietnam section.
Where are your sources?

Wiki is just a source I use among many. Wiki is 100 times more accurate and neutral than xinhua, global times and other Chinese propaganda. I used to read them regularly, become bored and tired lately because the authors tend to re-use old texts.
 
.

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom