paritosh
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well said...that is actually the only way to defeat them.it's a long hard road mate...
Video - Girl of 17 flogged by Taliban savages in Swat
- Thread starter BaburCM
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well said...that is actually the only way to defeat them.it's a long hard road mate...
osamaziadxb
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wait n c. .
notsuperstitious
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True.
Sadly education is no guarentee of sanity. i was watching some urdu program on a pakistani channel and a young handsome educated host was doing all sorts of mental gymnastics to support the talibs and blame the 'maghrib'!!!
how did this happen? how educated opinion makers became so morally bankrupt?
How much pakistani media is like this?
H2O3C4Nitrogen
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some quotes of Einstine
"Peace cannot be kept by force. It can only be achieved by understanding."
"The most incomprehensible thing about the world is that it is comprehensible."
"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones."
"Peace cannot be kept by force. It can only be achieved by understanding."
"The most incomprehensible thing about the world is that it is comprehensible."
"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones."
AchtungSpitfire
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The point is mass ignorance. Education creates a general awareness in the population that builds natural defense against hate, intolerance and lies. There will be always highly educated leaders who're subversive and enigmatic who can rally people to do anything but having a population at least aware enough of their circumstances and natural world can guard against that even if it forms a minority opinion.
Just look at this forum. The very act of posting here indicates the person has the luxury off accessing a PC and the internet but that doesn't stop the tr0lls and bigots from spouting off their ignorant crap. But they usually get laughed out or engage in a debate where they're either summarily embarrassed or resort to name calling and soon enough people just don't take them seriously.
Same things goes for these tribal area's. Even a simple objective philisophical teaching of the Koran and Islamic literature/history would do so much to counter the Taliban and these vicious Mullahs in the local population. It's this state of ignorance which helps these nutjobs.
It's that silent majority that you need to awaken and education is they key.
Contrarian
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You also need a govt that doesnt capitulate to terrorists. Which is exactly what Pakistani Govt has done. You also need the local public to be not so damn gullible. Anything wrong that happens in Pakistan is blamed pronto on "Jewish Conspiracy/Hindu/Indian conspiracy" and everyone believes it.
And Finally, you need to stop the spread of religious extremism of Pakistan, decouple Pakistan from religion. All these years of fanning religion in Pakistan has resulted in this. Its all a result of Islamic Pakistan, and Jehad, and Mujahid's and whatnot Pakistan has bred in its territory that is resulting in all this. Frankly, the way i see it, Pakistan is going deeper and deeper in a mess, further than ever before in history and no one there has any idea.
And Finally, you need to stop the spread of religious extremism of Pakistan, decouple Pakistan from religion. All these years of fanning religion in Pakistan has resulted in this. Its all a result of Islamic Pakistan, and Jehad, and Mujahid's and whatnot Pakistan has bred in its territory that is resulting in all this. Frankly, the way i see it, Pakistan is going deeper and deeper in a mess, further than ever before in history and no one there has any idea.
ejaz007
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COMMENT: The video that shook Pakistan Syed Mansoor Hussain
By establishing a bench to look into the matter and demanding production of the victim in the court, the CJ has done the right thing. The unfortunate fact though is that it is extremely unlikely that any branch of the government of Pakistan has the ability or even desire to fulfil the orders of the honourable court
The Honourable Chief Justice of Pakistan has taken suo moto notice of the flogging of a young woman in Swat. That is a good thing for sure.
I had waited patiently for the CJ to take notice of the fact that a part of the country over whose judicial system he presides functions outside the law. I waited equally patiently for the leaders of the lawyers movement and their allies in the world of politics to do the same.
It was disappointing when the Long March ended in Gujranwala. I had hoped that having achieved the restoration of CJ Chaudhry, the marchers would have gone straight on to Swat. If indeed the real purpose behind the Long March was restoration of the rule of law, then what better place to bring that message to than the valley under sway of Taliban-style justice.
Just imagine Mian Nawaz Sharif leading a caravan that included Chaudhry Aitzaz Ahsan and his lawyers, Qazi Hussain Ahmad and his Jamaat-e Islami, members of the Sunni Tehreek, and Mr Imran Khan all by his magnificent lonesome self riding into Swat demanding the restoration of the aforementioned rule of law. Even the most hardened Talib would have shuddered in awe at such star power. But it was not to be.
Now comes the horrific video of a young woman being flogged in public. The inhuman treatment meted out to women in the Land of the Pure has been documented often enough, but then a picture is worth pages covered with black ink and a video commands immediate and total attention. The whole world had seen the video on the Internet before it was shown on Pakistani TV. Whatever motives might be imputed to the TV channels for showing the video, it did succeed in catching the attention of the high and mighty of the land, including the honourable Chief Justice of Pakistan.
By establishing a bench to look into the matter and demanding production of the victim in the court, the CJ has done the right thing. The unfortunate fact though is that it is extremely unlikely that any branch of the government of Pakistan has the ability or even desire to fulfil the orders of the honourable court. And sadly, the court, as Stalin once said of the Pope, has no legions of its own. In essence, all the CJ and his court have to offer is moral suasion in this matter.
But then moral suasion might not be all bad. Leaders of most major political parties, including Mian Nawaz Sharif, have in the wake of the CJs action come out and forcefully condemned the flogging. Perhaps we might finally see all the moderate political parties getting together around the issue of preventing Pakistan from slip sliding towards Talibanisation. Before anything else is done, it is imperative that the young woman shown in the video is located and placed in a secure environment.
As I have said before, Mian Nawaz Sharif is the right person to help mobilise public opinion in the struggle against the impending Talibanisation of Pakistan. He has impeccable Islamist credentials, is a popular leader and has developed into a forceful public speaker. If Mian sahib indeed decides to lead this particular fight, he will definitely be remembered by history as a great benefactor of Pakistan. Whether or not he becomes prime minister again will then be of little consequence.
Having led the fight for the restoration of the CJ, Mian sahib has already established his credentials as someone who now believes in the rule of law and the independence of the judiciary. And by leading the fight against religious extremism, he will also undo the harm he did to his reputation by trying to pass the 15th Amendment. Here I will freely admit that I have no idea if Mian sahib is even remotely interested in taking on such a challenge.
An important point, however, is that there does exist a considerable undertow of sympathy for Taliban-style justice in the hearts if not the minds of many Pakistanis. This is because of a lack of access to justice and an abiding sense of helplessness that ordinary people feel when confronted by a high handed and frequently uncaring bureaucracy, a corrupted legal system and an equally corrupt but entirely ineffectual police force.
It is in this context that the Honourable Chief Justice can provide the greatest benefit. He has already established that he is willing to stand up against the powerful. Now he has to make sure that ordinary people can also do the same and have the protection of the courts when they do so. More importantly, he should try and reform the lower judiciary to provide Pakistanis access to justice and not just to adjudication based upon financial wherewithal.
There is an idea that might or might not be relevant to this discussion. It is about the circuit courts in the US. Originally, members of the US Supreme Court used to ride the circuit. This meant that Supreme Court Justices travelled to the lower courts in their circuit or assigned areas and considered cases alongside local judges. Not a bad way to keep an eye on what goes on in the lower courts.
Finally, a total digression: I would like to welcome back Mian Shahbaz Sharif as Chief Minister Punjab. It seems that during his most recent forced absence from the Chief Ministers Secretariat, he has developed a taste for the poetry of Habib Jalib. I hope that he will also read Jalibs poem Musheer (Advisor) every so often. That will surely make it possible for him to maintain strict objectivity about the quality of and the motives behind the advice he receives from his advisors.
Syed Mansoor Hussain has practised and taught medicine in the US. He can be reached at smhmbbs70@yahoo.com
Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan
By establishing a bench to look into the matter and demanding production of the victim in the court, the CJ has done the right thing. The unfortunate fact though is that it is extremely unlikely that any branch of the government of Pakistan has the ability or even desire to fulfil the orders of the honourable court
The Honourable Chief Justice of Pakistan has taken suo moto notice of the flogging of a young woman in Swat. That is a good thing for sure.
I had waited patiently for the CJ to take notice of the fact that a part of the country over whose judicial system he presides functions outside the law. I waited equally patiently for the leaders of the lawyers movement and their allies in the world of politics to do the same.
It was disappointing when the Long March ended in Gujranwala. I had hoped that having achieved the restoration of CJ Chaudhry, the marchers would have gone straight on to Swat. If indeed the real purpose behind the Long March was restoration of the rule of law, then what better place to bring that message to than the valley under sway of Taliban-style justice.
Just imagine Mian Nawaz Sharif leading a caravan that included Chaudhry Aitzaz Ahsan and his lawyers, Qazi Hussain Ahmad and his Jamaat-e Islami, members of the Sunni Tehreek, and Mr Imran Khan all by his magnificent lonesome self riding into Swat demanding the restoration of the aforementioned rule of law. Even the most hardened Talib would have shuddered in awe at such star power. But it was not to be.
Now comes the horrific video of a young woman being flogged in public. The inhuman treatment meted out to women in the Land of the Pure has been documented often enough, but then a picture is worth pages covered with black ink and a video commands immediate and total attention. The whole world had seen the video on the Internet before it was shown on Pakistani TV. Whatever motives might be imputed to the TV channels for showing the video, it did succeed in catching the attention of the high and mighty of the land, including the honourable Chief Justice of Pakistan.
By establishing a bench to look into the matter and demanding production of the victim in the court, the CJ has done the right thing. The unfortunate fact though is that it is extremely unlikely that any branch of the government of Pakistan has the ability or even desire to fulfil the orders of the honourable court. And sadly, the court, as Stalin once said of the Pope, has no legions of its own. In essence, all the CJ and his court have to offer is moral suasion in this matter.
But then moral suasion might not be all bad. Leaders of most major political parties, including Mian Nawaz Sharif, have in the wake of the CJs action come out and forcefully condemned the flogging. Perhaps we might finally see all the moderate political parties getting together around the issue of preventing Pakistan from slip sliding towards Talibanisation. Before anything else is done, it is imperative that the young woman shown in the video is located and placed in a secure environment.
As I have said before, Mian Nawaz Sharif is the right person to help mobilise public opinion in the struggle against the impending Talibanisation of Pakistan. He has impeccable Islamist credentials, is a popular leader and has developed into a forceful public speaker. If Mian sahib indeed decides to lead this particular fight, he will definitely be remembered by history as a great benefactor of Pakistan. Whether or not he becomes prime minister again will then be of little consequence.
Having led the fight for the restoration of the CJ, Mian sahib has already established his credentials as someone who now believes in the rule of law and the independence of the judiciary. And by leading the fight against religious extremism, he will also undo the harm he did to his reputation by trying to pass the 15th Amendment. Here I will freely admit that I have no idea if Mian sahib is even remotely interested in taking on such a challenge.
An important point, however, is that there does exist a considerable undertow of sympathy for Taliban-style justice in the hearts if not the minds of many Pakistanis. This is because of a lack of access to justice and an abiding sense of helplessness that ordinary people feel when confronted by a high handed and frequently uncaring bureaucracy, a corrupted legal system and an equally corrupt but entirely ineffectual police force.
It is in this context that the Honourable Chief Justice can provide the greatest benefit. He has already established that he is willing to stand up against the powerful. Now he has to make sure that ordinary people can also do the same and have the protection of the courts when they do so. More importantly, he should try and reform the lower judiciary to provide Pakistanis access to justice and not just to adjudication based upon financial wherewithal.
There is an idea that might or might not be relevant to this discussion. It is about the circuit courts in the US. Originally, members of the US Supreme Court used to ride the circuit. This meant that Supreme Court Justices travelled to the lower courts in their circuit or assigned areas and considered cases alongside local judges. Not a bad way to keep an eye on what goes on in the lower courts.
Finally, a total digression: I would like to welcome back Mian Shahbaz Sharif as Chief Minister Punjab. It seems that during his most recent forced absence from the Chief Ministers Secretariat, he has developed a taste for the poetry of Habib Jalib. I hope that he will also read Jalibs poem Musheer (Advisor) every so often. That will surely make it possible for him to maintain strict objectivity about the quality of and the motives behind the advice he receives from his advisors.
Syed Mansoor Hussain has practised and taught medicine in the US. He can be reached at smhmbbs70@yahoo.com
Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan
Omar1984
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Swat video ‘conspiracy to malign Islam’: PIHR
Updated at: 1844 PST, Sunday, April 05, 2009
SWAT: Chairman Pakistan International Human Rights, Raja Liaquat Ali has said that the video footage of a 17-year old Swat girl being aired on media is fictitious and termed it a conspiracy to malign Islam.
Addressing a press conference in Swat Press Club, he said the video footage of a girl being flogged in public has nothing to do with Swat and that it is a made-up video.
“The purpose of displaying this video is to tarnish the image of Islam.”
He said some elements want the Swat peace agreement to fizzle out.
Swat video conspiracy to malign Islam: PIHR - GEO.tv
Updated at: 1844 PST, Sunday, April 05, 2009
SWAT: Chairman Pakistan International Human Rights, Raja Liaquat Ali has said that the video footage of a 17-year old Swat girl being aired on media is fictitious and termed it a conspiracy to malign Islam.
Addressing a press conference in Swat Press Club, he said the video footage of a girl being flogged in public has nothing to do with Swat and that it is a made-up video.
“The purpose of displaying this video is to tarnish the image of Islam.”
He said some elements want the Swat peace agreement to fizzle out.
Swat video conspiracy to malign Islam: PIHR - GEO.tv
Solomon2
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What sick cowards. They are trying to hide their own personal shame and responsibility for their heinous action by imputing themselves as excellent representatives of Islam, so that any criticism of themselves must be defended by other Muslims.
AcidBurn
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FLOGGED GIRL DENIED FOR FLOGGING
ISLAMABAD: The teenage girl who was filmed being flogged by the Taliban in Pakistans restive Swat valley has denied that the incident ever occurred in a statement made to government officials, media reports said on Monday.
Chand Bibi, the 17-year-old girl who was shown being held down by three men while a fourth flogged her, reportedly told the judge of a Qazi or Islamic court and Divisional Commissioner Syed Mohammad Javed yesterday that such an incident had never happened.
The incident was condemned in Pakistan and around the world and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani ordered an inquiry into it after TV channels last week aired the video of the girl being flogged.
Supreme Court Chief Justice Iftikhar Chaudhry too took suo moto notice of it and directed the interior secretary and other officials to appear before him to give an explanation.
North West Frontier Province Information Minister Mian Iftikhar Hussain told The News daily that Chand Bibi had made a statement to the two officials who visited her village of Kala Killay in Kabal sub-division yesterday.
Quoting the divisional commissioner, Hussain said the girl made it clear she was married to a man named Adalat Khan. She refuted reports that both of them were flogged by the Taliban as punishment for having illicit relations and then forcibly married.
Hussain also said Chand Bibi had expressed her inability to appear in the Supreme Court as she and her family felt it was not appropriate for a purdah-observing Pashtun girl to do so in the presence of TV cameras and onlookers.
She requested the judge and the commissioner to spare her from appearing in the court in Islamabad, he said, adding the two officials visited the village to record the statements of the couple on the directive of the NWFP chief secretary.
The incident caused outrage in Pakistan where civil society and rights activists organised protests across the country. The incident was also condemned by most political parties and religious scholars.
Chand Bibis husband said he was ready to appear in the Supreme Court. The Qazi court judge also recorded his statement and he too denied reports that he or his wife had been lashed by the Taliban.
Hussain claimed a fake video had been used to tarnish the reputation of the people of Swat and to disrupt the peace process in the area. We condemn the acts of repression against women But the incident depicted in the videotape never took place in Swat, he said.
He claimed the videotape was released as part of a conspiracy to foil the peace agreement in Swat and put pressure on President (Asif Ali) Zardari not to sign a regulation for implementing Islamic law in the region.
Meanwhile, the man who filmed the Taliban flogging Chand Bibi has said that the incident occurred about two weeks ago. Shaukat told Dawn News that the treatment meted out to the girl was actually a punishment for her refusing a marriage proposal from a militant.
The man who proposed to marry Chand Bibi joined the Taliban after the rejection and this was how he took revenge on the girl, Shaukat said.
Asked about the reaction of the people who had witnessed the incident, Shaukat said the people in Swat are so scared that no one has the courage to stand up and speak out against the Taliban and their verdicts.
NEW STORY OF INJUSTIC
ISLAMABAD: The teenage girl who was filmed being flogged by the Taliban in Pakistans restive Swat valley has denied that the incident ever occurred in a statement made to government officials, media reports said on Monday.
Chand Bibi, the 17-year-old girl who was shown being held down by three men while a fourth flogged her, reportedly told the judge of a Qazi or Islamic court and Divisional Commissioner Syed Mohammad Javed yesterday that such an incident had never happened.
The incident was condemned in Pakistan and around the world and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani ordered an inquiry into it after TV channels last week aired the video of the girl being flogged.
Supreme Court Chief Justice Iftikhar Chaudhry too took suo moto notice of it and directed the interior secretary and other officials to appear before him to give an explanation.
North West Frontier Province Information Minister Mian Iftikhar Hussain told The News daily that Chand Bibi had made a statement to the two officials who visited her village of Kala Killay in Kabal sub-division yesterday.
Quoting the divisional commissioner, Hussain said the girl made it clear she was married to a man named Adalat Khan. She refuted reports that both of them were flogged by the Taliban as punishment for having illicit relations and then forcibly married.
Hussain also said Chand Bibi had expressed her inability to appear in the Supreme Court as she and her family felt it was not appropriate for a purdah-observing Pashtun girl to do so in the presence of TV cameras and onlookers.
She requested the judge and the commissioner to spare her from appearing in the court in Islamabad, he said, adding the two officials visited the village to record the statements of the couple on the directive of the NWFP chief secretary.
The incident caused outrage in Pakistan where civil society and rights activists organised protests across the country. The incident was also condemned by most political parties and religious scholars.
Chand Bibis husband said he was ready to appear in the Supreme Court. The Qazi court judge also recorded his statement and he too denied reports that he or his wife had been lashed by the Taliban.
Hussain claimed a fake video had been used to tarnish the reputation of the people of Swat and to disrupt the peace process in the area. We condemn the acts of repression against women But the incident depicted in the videotape never took place in Swat, he said.
He claimed the videotape was released as part of a conspiracy to foil the peace agreement in Swat and put pressure on President (Asif Ali) Zardari not to sign a regulation for implementing Islamic law in the region.
Meanwhile, the man who filmed the Taliban flogging Chand Bibi has said that the incident occurred about two weeks ago. Shaukat told Dawn News that the treatment meted out to the girl was actually a punishment for her refusing a marriage proposal from a militant.
The man who proposed to marry Chand Bibi joined the Taliban after the rejection and this was how he took revenge on the girl, Shaukat said.
Asked about the reaction of the people who had witnessed the incident, Shaukat said the people in Swat are so scared that no one has the courage to stand up and speak out against the Taliban and their verdicts.
osamaziadxb
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omerhhh
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Yeah well,ometimes force is the only way.
muse
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All those indignant, WHY?
You want Islamism, well, you got it, so what's the indignation about?
This is not, not, Islam? Say's who? The real Muslims say that this is Islam and for second and third class Muslims such as Pakistanis, will have to learn this Islam, or die learning Islam.
UNless ofcourse, there are those Pakistanis who remember they are Muslims and not Islamists and will confront the Islamists and in doing so vanguish them and save not just themselves but all Musloms and therefore the world
You want Islamism, well, you got it, so what's the indignation about?
This is not, not, Islam? Say's who? The real Muslims say that this is Islam and for second and third class Muslims such as Pakistanis, will have to learn this Islam, or die learning Islam.
UNless ofcourse, there are those Pakistanis who remember they are Muslims and not Islamists and will confront the Islamists and in doing so vanguish them and save not just themselves but all Musloms and therefore the world
omerhhh
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