Desert Fox
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Anti-Trump Protesters Riot, Smash Police Cars & Attack Trump Supporters
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saw that earlier, people with Mexican flags beating up people with American flags, how does that even work ?Anti-Trump Protesters Riot, Smash Police Cars & Attack Trump Supporters
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Again, which "comment" of his was racist? Back your claim. The onus is on YOU to prove he's racist, which you have thus far failed to provide any evidence of.
I don't!
No, the onus is NOT on me (or Trump) to prove anything because those illegals should not be in this country to begin with. By illegally coming into this country is already breaking the law. I don't have to prove zilch.
Secondly, my point still stands: we don't know who these people are, where they're headed, or what their intentions are. They should enter through legal channels.
I am saying it has not demonstrated itself as such to the extent that we need to spend money on a wall plus the necessities to make that wall effective.You're telling me a unsecure border through which anyone can come in is not a security threat?? What a magnificent logic, or lack there of.
We already have legal channels for immigration. Sneaking in through the border is not one of them.
How am i getting personal? All you have been doing is accusing Trump of racism but have failed to prove where he said anything racist. The onus is on YOU to prove Trump is racist, PS Hispanic is not a race, neither is a Muslim/Islam.
I think we may be at an impasse here, I view the wall as a waste of money in and of itself. I do view the expense as, while not crippling, as being entirely unnecessary. It would be pointless to try to sway me with arguments related to its affordability, it is still in the billions, and I view it as unneeded. You will want to direct your arguments on proving its necessity rather than its economic unaffordability. The best way to do that is to convince me that those immigrants are either pose a net demerit to us, or show that the immigrants are a current national security threat, instead of a potential one. As in extremist sentiment among large percentages of these immigrants, hatred for the United States, widespread threats of Hispanic terrorism, etc.The US spends more money in one year on maintaining a military presence abroad all over the world + the trillions spent on ongoing military interventions. Building + maintaining a border at HOME won't somehow cripple the US economy. The money can be easily made up for through cutting useless spending elsewhere.
It's not about hate, its about common sense.
Apparently not good enough.
Whether it goes to congress, or if it ever gets to that, lets wait and see. Only circumstances will decide what's sensible, and as history has proven the constitution is trampled upon in times of necessity.
I think you missed my point, not sure if deliberately, or you just don't understand. You made a claim of "well integrated" aren't prone to extremism and i I clearly gave you an example of "well integrated" second to third generation well-to-do Muslims from a Western country who did not live in "ghettos", yet still joined a terrorist organization. It doesn't matter if its Europe, America, or Australia because they are "integrated" and well-to-do yet still an extremist ideology appealed to them, that was my point. I hope you were able to understand it this time.
Also some outright general signs that he is a bad human being.
Frankly I'm not going to bother verifying whether that reporter actually mocked the people who lost their lives on 9/11, because it is irrelevant.If that reporter didn't mock the 3000 American lives lost on 9/11, Trump wouldn't have had to mock him.
Trump chose to mock his disability in action, utterly unnecessary on the campaign trail.
They prove Trump's point that they are all nothing but hate filled, intolerant, racist bigots who will attack and injure those who do not agree with them. If these people have their way there will no more freedom of speech or Democracy.saw that earlier, people with Mexican flags beating up people with American flags, how does that even work ?
was the same story in Chicago where he had to cancel his rally because of violent leftists like people for bernie, black lives matter, the muslim student association, and other marxist groups.
cant help but wonder if these violent anti Trump protests might actually end up helping the Trump campaign.
Okay, fair point, but you did stubbornly refuse to provide any evidence of racism from Trump (which you now acknowledged there is none).Well if you are willing to continue the debate without beginning to assert anything denigrating like implying I am a SJW', then we can continue. I don't have the inclination or will to deal with that, or respond in kind. Attack the comments, not the speaker. Anyways....
Anyone coming into this country illegally is by default breaking the law, thus making them a criminal. Secondly, American citizens have suffered from crimes like rape, gang violence, & drug smuggling at the hands of illegals who otherwise should not have been in this country. Whether its all illegals or a small percentage who take part in these crimes, that doesn't matter as they should not have been here to begin with. They're termed illegals for a reason.“When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.”
“I don’t think it’s a small percentage, it’s a lot. But it’s not Mexicans necessarily. They’re coming from all over.”
Anyways, whenever I read this series of remarks on hispanics, My mind goes back to 'The New Colossus'.
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
A reputable source for these quotes would be nice.Interestingly enough and as an aside, here are his racist quotes against blacks from before the election and what he says during the election.
Black guys counting my money! I hate it. The only kind of people I want counting my money are short guys that wear yarmulkes every day.
“Laziness is a trait in blacks.”
“And, you know, I have a great relationship with African Americans, as you possibly have heard. I just have great respect for them and you know they like me.” (this one was during 2015, so actually during the primary season.
There's videos of Hillary outright lying and infringing on the (now recognized) fundamental rights of homosexuals. So what's your point?Also some outright general signs that he is a bad human being.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/wo...blican-US-Presidential-candidates-gaffes.html
Quote me where i claimed "x amount are rapists and druggies". And im not sure where Trump gave an exact number either, and if he did maybe you should take that up with him. I did say we don't know who's sneaking through the border or where they're going, what their intentions are, what their past history is, etc... I'm sure any sane person wouldn't be okay with complete strangers breaking into their home through their windows instead of entering the house through the front door with the owners knowledge & consent.Actually, if you or Trump asserts that x amount of illegal immigrants are Rapists and druggies, the onus is on you to prove it. So either don't defend Trump for that assertion or provide evidence that a 'huge' percentage of illegal immigrants (lets say 10%) are bringing drugs and rape, or don't continue to assert that a 'big' percentage are doing so.
Oh well, too bad. If anyone has a problem with the immigration policy then they can change it through legal means rather than justify something illegal.
Lets ask the people who are actually guarding that "border" what they think:I am saying it has not demonstrated itself as such to the extent that we need to spend money on a wall plus the necessities to make that wall effective.
I think we may be at an impasse here, I view the wall as a waste of money in and of itself. I do view the expense as, while not crippling, as being entirely unnecessary. It would be pointless to try to sway me with arguments related to its affordability, it is still in the billions, and I view it as unneeded. You will want to direct your arguments on proving its necessity rather than its economic unaffordability. The best way to do that is to convince me that those immigrants are either pose a net demerit to us, or show that the immigrants are a current national security threat, instead of a potential one. As in extremist sentiment among large percentages of these immigrants, hatred for the United States, widespread threats of Hispanic terrorism, etc.
Not according to the people who are actually guarding that border and witnessing what's going on on the ground. They hold more credibility than you or anyone else who opposes the wall.No its about simple and absolutely shallow and inefficient 'solutions' to complex problems.
Terrorism is unpredictable so 50 in past 15 years is no way to determine what could happen in the future, and you can't be for certain that what's happened in the past won't happen again, especially with someone like Hillary who wants to bring in thousands of refugees.http://securitydata.newamerica.net/extremists/deadly-attacks.html
I'd say they've done well enough for a decade and a half, and we've nowhere near reached the levels where we should think about banning muslim immigration simply on the basis of being Muslim. If we didn't do so after 9/11, we certainly shouldn't do so now.
Just because it has happened before doesn't mean we should do it again, especially not over, what, 50 deaths over 15 years?
You and I will see what the American people think about this in November. I am very confident Trump will lose. I hope he loses badly.
You are generalizing 2nd and 3rd generation Muslims in the UK to 2nd and 3rd generation Muslims in the US, and I am telling you you cannot do that. The cultures are different when it comes to immigration, the history is different, doing so doesn't work.
If you insist, then please provide a similar credible study showing many 2nd and 3rd generation Muslims in the US are radicalizing.
We have had individual cases, but there is no trend. They are integrating/ integrated.
Well you originally stated well integrated Muslims are not susceptible to extremism and i gave your proof that they are, whether its Europe (who's loose immigration policy you want the US to mimic) or America, that's a different point. Secondly, i never generalized, i just pointed out the fact that an extremist ideology can appeal to any Muslim, whether integrated or not. It only takes one lone wolf to kill hundreds, even thousands.
Anyone coming into this country illegally is by default breaking the law, thus making them a criminal. Secondly, American citizens have suffered from crimes like rape, gang violence, & drug smuggling at the hands of illegals who otherwise should not have been in this country. Whether its all illegals or a small percentage who take part in these crimes, that doesn't matter as they should not have been here to begin with. They're termed illegals for a reason.
A reputable source for these quotes would be nice.
That's the thing about his arguments, they are vague. He gives 'big percentage', but never specifies, because he can't. He knows how to be slippery.Quote me where i claimed "x amount are rapists and druggies". And im not sure where Trump gave an exact number either, and if he did maybe you should take that up with him.
Oh well, too bad. If anyone has a problem with the immigration policy then they can change it through legal means rather than justify something illegal.
Lets ask the people who are actually guarding that "border" what they think:
Union Representing 16,000 Border Agents Endorses Trump-NPR
More like the guy did not come to actually rob your house but wanted to maintain your plumbing for you and your 5 other roommates in return for being allowed to live there and possibly contribute to the rent in the future when he got a job.That's like saying "unless someone enters my house and robs me first i won't lock my door". Not a sound logic at all. We're better of ending it here.
I'd say a structural engineer has more credibility on the wall. On top of a union being self-interested in increasing their membership.Not according to the people who are actually guarding that border and witnessing what's going on on the ground. They hold more credibility than you or anyone else who opposes the wall.
Terrorism is unpredictable so 50 in past 15 years is no way to determine what could happen in the future, and you can't be for certain that what's happened in the past won't happen again, especially with someone like Hillary who wants to bring in thousands of refugees.
Well you originally stated well integrated Muslims are not susceptible to extremism and i gave your proof that they are, whether its Europe (who's loose immigration policy you want the US to mimic) or America, that's a different point. Secondly, i never generalized, i just pointed out the fact that an extremist ideology can appeal to any Muslim, whether integrated or not. It only takes one lone wolf to kill hundreds, even thousands.
I'm sorry to hear you have such bad opinions about your fellow Muslims, but Muslim extremism in the US is not quite the problem they have in Europe. 2nd and 3rd generation immigrants have tended to integrate, they haven't been forced into ghettos.
Source: https://defence.pk/threads/us-presi...6-news-and-views.374363/page-29#ixzz47SoDeiLn
Well i am actually looking for answers and information, as i mentioned in starting posts, i am not following the campaign and what i say is based on whatever little i know. However i am open to learning new things here.With all due respect, you’re comparing apples and oranges, primary elections are different from general elections, so far, Trump has won 38% of Republican primary votes, but he still has not secured the nomination of his party, but if he does somehow secures the nomination, according to many national polls, he would be the most unpopular candidate to represent either party in modern times.
Seven in 10 national adults have an unfavorable view of him, he is unpopular with majority of women, men, young, old, liberals, moderates, conservatives, Blacks and Hispanics.
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trumps-unpopularity-stays-sky-high-cruz-hits-high/story?id=38370127
Trump's Unpopularity Stays Sky High
You say, “the chances of his party are already strong”, may I ask, on what basis, please elaborate?
I think it’s the other way around, in the general elections, majority of the voters are not angry white middle-age men.
That’s absolutely false, Kovaleski (disabled reporter) has never mocked September 11 victims.If that reporter didn't mock the 3000 American lives lost on 9/11, Trump wouldn't have had to mock him.