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US Navy Builds Largest-Ever Amphibious Assault Ship for F-35 Fighters

Why us navy inducting a jet which is succesor of F 16 which US navy did not inducted

F 16 was small easily could have been handled on AC

F35 IS single engine F 16 also single dngine too
 
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Why us navy inducting a jet which is succesor of F 16 which US navy did not inducted

F 16 was small easily could have been handled on AC

F35 IS single engine F 16 also single dngine too

Obviously the navy would prefer a dual engine configuration but a single engine was a requirement for the F35.
They have had single engine before (A4)
 
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Hopefully the U.S can offer to sell Iran some high tech military gear which iran desperately needs after the sanctions are lifted. WIN-WIN coperation. :)
No, never, that protocol is achieved under the pushing from EU, China, American won't consider that regime a friendly government, Weapon selling? No... not yet
 
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No, never, that protocol is achieved under the pushing from EU, China, American won't consider that regime a friendly government, Weapon selling? No... not yet

Correct, Europe can still sell them stuff. Since 1979 US weapon sales to Iran have been frozen.
 
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Correct, Europe can still sell them stuff. Since 1979 US weapon sales to Iran have been frozen.

lol..........you should say since 1979, US have not officially sell US weapon to Iran......

Deal can always done under the table, maybe with France or may even with China, but during Iran-Iraq war, the under table deal was done via Israel...a la Iran Contra affair...
 
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lol..........you should say since 1979, US have not officially sell US weapon to Iran......

Deal can always done under the table, maybe with France or may even with China, but during Iran-Iraq war, the under table deal was done via Israel...a la Iran Contra affair...

The israeli story is a hoax , nothing was given to iran through israel , that's just straight impossible , there are lots of weapon dealers around the world , turks , latin americans and nowadays russians , it was them not the israelis
 
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Obviously the navy would prefer a dual engine configuration but a single engine was a requirement for the F35.
They have had single engine before (A4)
supposedly these days a dual engine configuration is apparently more prone to failure than a single one. Failures of engines these days tend to be catastrophic and take out the engine next to them (if there is one).
 
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Despite my admiration to many American weaponry products, bigger is not always better.
In general, the USMC seems to be embarked on a shopping spree for big toys that forgets
that the corps made its reputation on valor, not equipment. Lock-Mart won't disagree and yet …


Black Americans are the soul suppapowa! White folks are more into pop superpowers! :p: JK.

Good day all, Tay.
It is not really bigger than the Tarawa's etc LHA/Ds, which have been in use for decades.

USS Tripoli (CVE-64) was an Casablanca-class escort carrier in service from 1943 to 1958
USS Tripoli (LPH-10) was an Iwo Jima-class amphibious assault ship in service from 1966 to 1995
USS Tripoli (LHA-7) is an America-class amphibious assault ship with an expected commissioning date in 2018
 
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It is not really bigger than the Tarawa's etc LHA/Ds, which have been in use for decades.

Agreed but that period your examples cover is the one leading to the Lighting II.
Striking that all through, the USMC clamored for the ability to land on beachfronts
and other unprepared spots as part rationale for the big boats …
and that the capacity to do so is still unclear and the subject of discussions.

By this time, they could have let go of the plane on ground concept and use choppers
for the job with planes for support IMHoO.

Good day to you, Tay.
 
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Agreed but that period your examples cover is the one leading to the Lighting II.
Striking that all through, the USMC clamored for the ability to land on beachfronts
and other unprepared spots as part rationale for the big boats …
and that the capacity to do so is still unclear and the subject of discussions.

By this time, they could have let go of the plane on ground concept and use choppers
for the job with planes for support IMHoO.

Good day to you, Tay.

It actually means they are moving away from large scale beach assaults.

seabaseoverview.jpg


Seabasing%20Capability1.jpg


SeaBaseProposal.JPG

Information Dissemination: Observing a Possible Evolution With Sea Basing
http://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ship/seabase.htm
 
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It actually means they are moving away from large scale beach assaults.

OK, my bad as I did not make my phrase complete :
" …the USMC clamored for the ability to land fighter ACs on beachfronts
and other unprepared spots as part rationale for the big boats …"
In that respect, short legged STVOL jets that will replace all present fighters including F-18 Hornets
present in great numbers in the USMC air fleets is a mistake IMHoO. If sea basing is used, the long
range / long loiter aspect would be primordial even for CAS and that would be better served with F-35Cs.

If then USMC carriers were CATOBAR with a restrained number of STOVL units on more amphibious
platforms ( F_35Bs replacing only the AV-8B ), I'd agree. But the predominance of the F-35B in design
considerations for the entire program points to one-type future wings for the Marines. That is consistent
with the old idea of using them from beach front air strips ( or air pads in many internal USMC papers ).
It is confirmed in your second link :
"The Marine Corps aviation plan would substitute 5 squadrons (60 aircraft) of VSTOL
Joint Strike Fighters (JSF) for the two F/A-18A/B (12 plane), one F/A-18D (12 plane),
and one AV-8B (20 plane) squadrons."

What I'm saying is not that I oppose a change to bigger amphibious ships per say but only as based
on a STOVL centric fast jet force. Said yet otherwise, the aerial acquisition for the Corps runs contrary
to the sea-basing concept which being spread out over hundreds of nautical miles needs max range ACs.

That discrepancy is easy enough to resolve but until that happens the plan is flawed. One of the images
from your first link shows the coasts of the Northern Indian Ocean region. Fine but there are many many
ground airfields in the vicinity. How about doing the same in a westward attack in the Pacific? A relatively
compact sea basing operation would be faced with much longer ranged planes coming out of the mainland,
especially the spearhead MEUs? A two-tiered fighter force would defend such sea groups / packs better.

I'm not opposed to bigger boats for the Marines, only to them lacking the best fighter option. Carrier size
vessels should carry real jets again IMHoO. Same goes for 65K tons UK carriers with F-35Bs vs 42K tons
CDG with the bigger ship operating the lesser aircraft. Retain the CATOBAR carriers for 2/3 of the USMC
squadrons as F-35C and my objection in this thread disappears.
It may help you to know that I was always a proponent of Off-Shore Control over Air Sea Battle concept as
found here and don't hesitate to contact me with your opinion on that my friend.

Good day to you and all, Tay.

P.S. Yes, I do understand that Navy carriers can protect Corps assets or at minima support them but that means the future of the Marines to be subordinate to USN which I trust is not the case considering the aforementioned importance of the STOVL requirements in the JSF.program
 
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George Standridge, Vice President of Strategy and Business Development for Lockheed Martin Aeronautics, and a Naval Aviator who flew the F/A-18 Hornet in both the U.S. Navy and the Naval Reserve, predicted in 2006 that the F-35 will be four times more effective than legacy fighters in air-to-air combat, eight times more effective in air-to-ground combat, and three times more effective in reconnaissance and Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses – while having better range and requiring less logistics support and having around the same procurement costs (if development costs are ignored) as legacy fighters
Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Lockheed Martin F22 and F35 5th Gen Revolution In Military Aviation

United States Marine Corps - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Marine attack squadrons fly the AV-8B Harrier II; while the fighter/attack mission is handled by the single-seat and dual-seat versions of the F/A-18 Hornet strike-fighter aircraft. The AV-8B is a V/STOL aircraft that can operate from amphibious assault ships, land air bases and short, expeditionary airfields, while the F/A-18 can only be flown from land or aircraft carriers. Both are slated to be replaced by 340 of the STOVL B version of the F-35 Lightning II, beginning training operations in 2008,[144] and 80 of the carrier F-35C versions for deployment with Navy carrier air wings


Unlike Navy squadrons, VMFA's have not been transferring to F/A-18E/F
USMC: 238 F/A-18A/B/C/D Hornets in service as of 2008.

F/A-18C/D
Performance

Armament
  • Hardpoints: 9 total: 2× wingtips missile launch rail, 4× under-wing, and 3× under-fuselage with a capacity of 13,700 pounds (6,200 kg) external fuel and ordnance
McDonnell Douglas F/A-18 Hornet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
McDonnell Douglas F/A-18 Hornet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

000-Super-Bug-loadout.jpg


AV-8B+
Performance

Armament
McDonnell Douglas AV-8B Harrier II - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
post-78-1257858521.jpg



JSCFADT-SUB-10-2.jpg

F-35 JSF Program: APA Evidence to Parliament / ThanaMarketing, KPIs and the JSF Program

f35weaponarrangementdb5.jpg


F35_Payload_Wide.jpg


Range: STOVL variant at least as good or better relative to F-18C/D and significantly better than AV-8B+ (why call that "short legged"?)
Weapons load: STOVL variant has 18k lbs, significantly more than both F-18C/D and AV-8B+

The long range / long loiter aspect is addressed by having having tanker aircraft + Afloat Forward Staging Base MLP variants (designed to support low-intensity missions, allowing more expensive, high-value amphibious warfare ships to be re-tasked to more demanding missions) + ships like MPF(F), LHA(R), or T-LHA(R) for the Maritime Prepositioning Force (Future). Besides LHA/Ds, that is.
B 08 Mpf(F) Ship Studies

One could give the USMC that same version as the Navy. But that would mean (continuing) dependence on the CVNs. From the point of view of logistics and flexible deployment and risk reduction by not putting all eggs in one basket (CVN), F-35B is not a poor option. And the real difference in range between CTOL and STOVL versions has yet to be determined.
 
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Combat radius of 469NM for the F-35B is in sleek config with air-air mission so
with 2 AIMs and 2 Sidewinders. Considering gas guzzling ( fuel fraction ), one can wonder
what the yet undisclosed combat radius in full load the F35-Bs will get ( at cost of stealth ).
Due to "fifth gêne" design, the drop in efficiency compared to legacy fighters should impress.

This said, I darn well hope that an invincible perfect mega next generation machine can outperform
its predecessors on combat related metrics, it flocking better or what are the billions for??? We
are talking about planes from 1969 and 1983, respectively 46 & 32 years ago … think about cars
and computers progress since? Apply to fighters ...
Still the comparison is not from generation to Gen. but as a tool in a toolbox. The F-35B will serve
the exact same function as the Harriers did relative to the F-18s.
[ About which the absence of evolution to SuperH was a mistake IMHoO in part due to Navy oppo-
sition and in part because of budget decisions within the USMC. ]
This means that the B will not replace the Hornet. In fact, time of introduction for this variant ( first of
the JSF models IOCed although most complex to put in operation ) was dictated by early retirement
of the Harriers+.
The F-18 have until 2030 to go which will require a main frame central barrel replacement.
Screen-Shot-2014-11-03-at-4.46.31-PM.png

U.S. Marines to Retire Harrier Fleet Earlier Than Planned, Extend Life of Hornets - USNI News
But once they are gone, the new deal will be that only the Navy will have the best air assets at sea.
At which point the USMC will be joint ops dependent … just check it in a lll your documents …
I am opposed to that, I sincerely believe the Marines need to be as autonomous as possible unless
you consider them a simple Army carried on Navy force which I refuse and refute as their history does.
Your very first image contains a CSG smack in the middle as would be now for the Hornets, doesn't it?
Here then is my beef with present concept implementation : STOVL was made central to the JSF program
in the hopes of producing a fighter able to fully replace both the Harriers and Hornets at huge costs in
design and development schedule as well as money. It now seems that it will not do the job so clearly and
that it will not allow either of the USMC historical requirements of operating from expeditionary air pads easily
and of doing without the USN.
But it still requires bigger ships ( with tougher decks and/or problems ) to operate? That is what I meant!

I am not one of those who think the JSF is a total failure at least not in the sense that the fighter itself will
never work. I know America to well ( lived there have family, brother was USN ) to believe it can't be fixed
especially since at worst they'll go : -"… in doubt, throw it out!" and start anew. I do believe it is flawed in
its scope and further sullied by the attitude of the maker corp ( again not solely US case although MIC … ).
About which, even if he had flown on flying saucers ( at Area 51, one supposes ) the initial opinion of a major
Lock-Mart employee is not welcomed by me at all. They should just shut up and make it work already!

Good day, Tay.
 
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F-18C/D
Combat radius: 400 nmi (460 mi (740 km)) on air-air mission

Tay, what do you think an F-18C/D 'on air-air mission' carries?

If anything like this Swiss example, that's fairly comparable.

If need be, they can Always opt for CTOL version (I got the impression they were going to use a mix of B abd C anyway)
AIR_F-18Cs_Swiss_lg.jpg
 
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Agreed but that period your examples cover is the one leading to the Lighting II.
Striking that all through, the USMC clamored for the ability to land on beachfronts
and other unprepared spots as part rationale for the big boats …
and that the capacity to do so is still unclear and the subject of discussions.

By this time, they could have let go of the plane on ground concept and use choppers
for the job with planes for support IMHoO.

Good day to you, Tay.

You talking like we expect these ships to land on the beach itself. Have to remember that this is the 21st century where stealth fighters and bombers are becoming more common on other potential hostile nations along with long range anti ship missiles. Having a bigger ship with the ability to carry aircraft like the F-35 helps to deal with such threats. The Falklands War points that out.
 
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