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US lawmakers strongly oppose weapon sales to ‘snitch’ Pakistan

You make no sense. U.S does not determine pakistan or india's policy towards each other. If anything, we are victims of terrorism from pakistan too. Obama is a fool for selling weapons or giving aid to Pakistan. But i also see why he does- we need to pay off pakistan for the supply route.
do you thin the usa as a whole is stupid enough to let business with pakistn go? even if it is little.

remember the gunship fiasco. they wanted zulus and they said no. all of a sudden china, turkey and russia stepped in and offered to fill the void. then the usa jumps in and gives an offer to good to refuse. and they take it as well as some from russia and china too. but the later 2 were not worth $900+ million. the usa got the big chunk
 
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You make no sense. U.S does not determine pakistan or india's policy towards each other. If anything, we are victims of terrorism from pakistan too. Obama is a fool for selling weapons or giving aid to Pakistan. But i also see why he does- we need to pay off pakistan for the supply route.
Putting money on Karzai does not pay off, it was better if Pashtoons being the majority been engaged in talks so US could have gotten out earlier, now proxy wars are being played from all sides. This is the problem no one is honest or no one is acting sensibly. The game of OBL is more than it meets the eye as it appears. Now that Iran is in check the World has to go after Pakistan, Turkey and Saudi Arabia. Just hear Donald Trump's speeches it is all clear. There will be plenty reasons for doing what is the intention. How many people died due terrorism in Pakistan? Guess that does not count han?
 
guilty by association lol. very heartfelt and emotional arguments right from the bollywood movie.
Indian lobby must spend more money so that such opposition doesnt fail yet again when despite everything the sales did take place.

Common man, you know better.......if the California event hadn't happened, I think Pakistan was going to get the jets. This terror attack wasted NS and RS's entire effort spanning over two months!! There was a relationship that had started to take form. But this attack has left a HUGE mark on stuff and on people's hearts and minds. And Pakistan's name was in it big times again. I am actually surprised that this time, the US media played a very mature role and as always, didn't grill Pakistan to the degree it usually does. But nevertheless, one of the attackers was going to a religious school in Pakistan so there is serious association and the fact remains, how deep is this religious mess inside Pakistani cities??

There are serious sentiments inside the US, whether it be the people or the government and for all the right reasons. I don't think Indians or any other lobby has to do anything with it. The damage is done, will the Indian lobby make use of it and will further tell the US law makers "we told you so, they'll keep attacking you", you bet!!

Can the US lawmakers deny that? I don't think so. We just got attacked YET one more time. There is no argument that beats the sad and scary reality!!
 
How about the US stop selling weapons to the Saudis? You know the actual ones who's ideology was exported to Pakistan thanks to US approval for fighting the soviets, the same ideology that flew planes in to the twin towers. The same ideology that founded Al qaeda. The same ideology that ISIS takes its roots from. The same ideology that this woman was radicalised with.

Any chance of stopping weapons sales to the Saudis ? Or you just love their money?
 
It will go through no worries its all about saving jobs and taxes

Really?? You truly think the largest economy on the globe is REALLY worried about a few hundred jobs and EIGHT jets??

And you think we have no national pride or respect for our country? You need to wake up and look around. We've been in Afghanistan for over a decade and a half due to our national pride. And it has cost us trillions. Not sure how a billion dollar worth of deal is such a big deal!!

The US has respected Pakistan as a partner and has worked with her for decades. But if there will be attacks on us, trust me, even a 1000 jobs won't matter!!
 
Common man, you know better.......if the California event hadn't happened, I think Pakistan was going to get the jets. This terror attack wasted NS and RS's entire effort spanning over two months!! There was a relationship that had started to take form. But this attack has left a HUGE mark on stuff and on people's hearts and minds. And Pakistan's name was in it big times again. I am actually surprised that this time, the US media played a very mature role and as always, didn't grill Pakistan to the degree it usually does. But nevertheless, one of the attackers was going to a religious school in Pakistan so there is serious association and the fact remains, how deep is this religious mess inside Pakistani cities??

There are serious sentiments inside the US, whether it be the people or the government and for all the right reasons. I don't think Indians or any other lobby has to do anything with it. The damage is done, will the Indian lobby make use of it and will further tell the US law makers "we told you so, they'll keep attacking you", you bet!!

Can the US lawmakers deny that? I don't think so. We just got attacked YET one more time. There is no argument that beats the sad and scary reality!!
She did not go to religious school, she attended a university. Blaming a nation for a person's individual actions to this extent is wrong. Britain dealt with IRA, did not punish all Irish people or Ireland. But people in US like to generalize. By reacting the way people are reacting in US they help these terrorists but that it is too complicated to understand once people belong to a big country, they want to put everybody in same bracket. Yes Pakistan has issues but it is or never was US enemy. Even everybody has forgotten the Cold War era. Loyalty, fairness, justice, values are disappearing from World and terrorists are succeeding day by day.
 
How about the US stop selling weapons to the Saudis?

Why do you think they bought EFT's???? They have heard the message loud and clear.

But the topic isn't about KSA, nor was one of the shooters radicalized there. That took place elsewhere. Who would you like to bring into the picture in the next post to divert the attention?
 
Really?? You truly think the largest economy on the globe is REALLY worried about a few hundred jobs and EIGHT jets??

And you think we have no national pride or respect for our country? You need to wake up and look around. We've been in Afghanistan for over a decade and a half due to our national pride. And it has cost us trillions. Not sure how a billion dollar worth of deal is such a big deal!!

The US has respected Pakistan as a partner and has worked with her for decades. But if there will be attacks on us, trust me, even a 1000 jobs won't matter!!
It appear she lived most of her life in Saudi Arabia and briefly studied in Pakistan in a University. So are we gonna stop selling to KSA? If one pro life goes and kills people in abortion clinic are all pro life declared terrorists? But this is going nowhere nature will takes its course and History will judge better.
 
She did not go to religious school, she attended a university. Blaming a nation for a person's individual actions to this extent is wrong. Britain dealt with IRA, did not punish all Irish people or Ireland. But people in US like to generalize. By reacting the way people are reacting in US they help these terrorists but that it is too complicated to understand once people belong to a big country, they want to put everybody in same bracket. Yes Pakistan has issues but it is or never was US enemy. Even everybody has forgotten the Cold War era. Loyalty, fairness, justice, values are disappearing from World and terrorists are succeeding day by day.

She went to a Pharmacy school and she also attended a Maddrassa or a religious institute. Everyone knows it. I am sure the FBI will provide all the details sooner or later and we can all be more frustrated listening to how these people turn into killing machines without mercy for anyone!!

But, no one's blaming a nation for it. But everyone will question it. You have to think of the loss the other party suffered too. So this will have some draw backs, even temporarily. If I was in the Pakistani leadership, I would've started to contact the US leadership in congress. Initiating contact and reminding the other party of the relationship and offering sincere help, is never a bad idea.
 
guilty by association lol. very heartfelt and emotional arguments right from the bollywood movie.
Indian lobby must spend more money so that such opposition doesnt fail yet again when despite everything the sales did take place.

The "Indian" Lobby isnt necessary, just the American Media is sufficient.
 
Fair enough, you say we have low intellect. Then why do you send General Sharif to our country begging for more aid? You got super duper J17 you could buy from China or J 31! we are totally replaceable.
So you are irreplaceable, we get that. But so are we. Best of luck for solving that Afghan puzzle without us.
 
Really?? You truly think the largest economy on the globe is REALLY worried about a few hundred jobs and EIGHT jets??

And you think we have no national pride or respect for our country? You need to wake up and look around. We've been in Afghanistan for over a decade and a half due to our national pride. And it has cost us trillions. Not sure how a billion dollar worth of deal is such a big deal!!

The US has respected Pakistan as a partner and has worked with her for decades. But if there will be attacks on us, trust me, even a 1000 jobs won't matter!!
After the attack on the Twin Towers, there was a no-fly-zone enforced all over the U.S. Only one plane was allowed to fly that day, non-stop, to Saudi Arabia. The jet contained all members of the Bin Laden family who were living in the U.S. The Bush family still has billions invested in their oil business. Guilty through association?
 
She went to a Pharmacy school and she also attended a Maddrassa or a religious institute. Everyone knows it. I am sure the FBI will provide all the details sooner or later and we can all be more frustrated listening to how these people turn into killing machines without mercy for anyone!!

But, no one's blaming a nation for it. But everyone will question it. You have to think of the loss the other party suffered too. So this will have some draw backs, even temporarily. If I was in the Pakistani leadership, I would've started to contact the US leadership in congress. Initiating contact and reminding the other party of the relationship and offering sincere help, is never a bad idea.
Yes agree with you and Pakistan needs to really remove the root causes of this issues for the sake of Pakistan and the World. However the media in US is not highlighting how many people are dying in terrorists attack in Pakistan. If that is reported fully in US then ordinary person will sympathize to some extent with Pakistani people too, while still asking them to take more responsibility and clean the mess in Pakistan. But I do not see that, just a rare mention once in a great while. That makes me worried and then People who support Donald Trump who want to bracket 1.6 billion in the same category of a few thousand terrorists. Common sense tells me World should isolate them. Yes Muslims have problems but is the reaction right? Or would the current reaction solve the problem or make it worse for the whole World?
 
It appear she lived most of her life in Saudi Arabia and briefly studied in Pakistan in a University. So are we gonna stop selling to KSA? If one pro life goes and kills people in abortion clinic are all pro life declared terrorists? But this is going nowhere nature will takes its course and History will judge better.

I think you are making a mistake in doing a comparison. The reality is, the American people have always welcomed immigrants as American foundations are based on immigration. The Muslims from all over were welcomed to America like everyone else as long as they came in legally.

Just one example. the Indians started to come in numbers like a decade and a half ago. They have Muslims too. But you tend to see more radicalization in Pakistan? It is a sad fact. Also, I can make this distinction because of my personal background and experiences in life. But to an average American family who doesn't know about Pakistan, Malaysia or Yemen, they just know that these guys were muslims and went to a mosque and all. So they will classify them as Muslims. You guys don't care about your own actions and how they make you look bad. There are so many threads on this forum where Pakistanis, write so much hatred about each other, due to their personal affiliations, family structure, military affiliation, etc. The reader often wonder if you guys can ever be trusted as one nation, or is it always divided. You (average Pakistanis) are responsible for creating a better image for your country with your actions (talking, respecting the law, posts on this forum, etc, etc). No one else will do it for you. Do you see the Indians writing so much crap about their system, leaders, or each other? NO!! Whatever they do, they know they are representing India and India has to come up as a peaceful, fun, colorful country. And they have made the world believe in it through peace and working with everyone (even if the reality may be different).

Also, on the comparison of the mass shooter vs. the California terrorists....here's an analogy. If your own son beats up your younger son for wrong reasons, you'll get upset as a dad, you'll yell at your older son but it remains inside the family and you deal with it.

But if a stranger guy from some far away place, came to you and asked you to live with you. And many years down the road, he beat the living out of your younger son, would you tolerate it? HELL NO!! So the way the American public sees this, is from that standpoint, that Muslims today, have more freedom here in the US then what they can get in their home countries. But instead of being appreciating of the fact, they are out there to hurt us? I am not generalizing the entire religion, I am just presenting an American perspective on it.

Why hurt the US if you LIVE here and are given all the rights like what people from the US enjoy?? If you have issues with the US, her foreign policy, or anything else, and you'll get pissed of and hurt the locals one day, perhaps, this isn't the place for you. Perception is reality and unfortunately, with this example I gave you, everyone else does look bad "One bad apple spoils the whole barrel"!!

When you go live somewhere else, you adapt the law of the land, try to assimilate in the local culture and accept that land as is. Because the land accepted you first. In this case, the land accepted others and told them they can practice their belief system too. Then why hurt other people living on that land??

After the attack on the Twin Towers, there was a no-fly-zone enforced all over the U.S. Only one plane was allowed to fly that day, non-stop, to Saudi Arabia. The jet contained all members of the Bin Laden family who were living in the U.S. The Bush family still has billions invested in their oil business. Guilty through association?

This is the beauty of American freedom actually. They were given safety as someone would've killed them. In fact, I would almost bet, the sad and terrible nature of that event since the Pearl Harbor, was SO grave, that even if you gave them police for protection, I don't think the police officers would've taken the assignment, or done it right.

What do you expect the US to have done? Locked the women and children into Gitmo for terrorist events that OBL did???? The American nation and principles don't stand for it. But the government is responsible for providing security to residents of the US. So IMO that was a good call to send them out by President Bush. Granted that actually happened the way you are stating it did. Not sure in that time, only one flight was allowed by the US President and it leaked out to you :disagree::fie: sitting thousands of miles away....when things like these are usually confidential and secret !!

On Bush's business connections, I am sure the connections are there and its natural to do business globally in today's world. But I can ALSO assure you, when Bush or anyone else, including myself thinks about doing business with another country, we expect "PROFIT", not terror attacks on our homes !!!!

Its unbelievable to see the ignorance, arrogance and low quality attitude from people who just LOVE to point all fingers back to the US WITHOUT taking ONE cent's worth of responsibility for the craziness that goes on in Pakistan!!
 
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I think you are making a mistake in doing a comparison. The reality is, the American people have always welcomed immigrants as American foundations are based on immigration. The Muslims from all over were welcomed to America like everyone else as long as they came in legally.

Just one example. the Indians started to come in numbers like a decade and a half ago. They have Muslims too. But you tend to see more radicalization in Pakistan? It is a sad fact. Also, I can make this distinction because of my personal background and experiences in life. But to an average American family who doesn't know about Pakistan, Malaysia or Yemen, they just know that these guys were muslims and went to a mosque and all. So they will classify them as Muslims. You guys don't care about your own actions and how they make you look bad. There are so many threads on this forum where Pakistanis, write so much hatred about each other, due to their personal affiliations, family structure, military affiliation, etc. The reader often wonder if you guys can ever be trusted as one nation, or is it always divided. You (average Pakistanis) are responsible for creating a better image for your country with your actions (talking, respecting the law, posts on this forum, etc, etc). No one else will do it for you. Do you see the Indians writing so much crap about their system, leaders, or each other? NO!! Whatever they do, they know they are representing India and India has to come up as a peaceful, fun, colorful country. And they have made the world believe in it through peace and working with everyone (even if the reality may be different).

Also, on the comparison of the mass shooter vs. the California terrorists....here's an analogy. If your own son beats up your younger son for wrong reasons, you'll get upset as a dad, you'll yell at your older son but it remains inside the family and you deal with it.

But if a stranger guy from some far away place, came to you and asked you to live with you. And many years down the road, he beat the living out of your younger son, would you tolerate it? HELL NO!! So the way the American public sees this, is from that standpoint, that Muslims today, have more freedom here in the US then what they can get in their home countries. But instead of being appreciating of the fact, they are out there to hurt us? I am not generalizing the entire religion, I am just presenting an American perspective on it.

Why hurt the US if you LIVE here and are given all the rights like what people from the US enjoy?? If you have issues with the US, her foreign policy, or anything else, and you'll get pissed of and hurt the locals one day, perhaps, this isn't the place for you. Perception is reality and unfortunately, with this example I gave you, everyone else does look bad "One bad apple spoils the whole barrel"!!

When you go live somewhere else, you adapt the law of the land, try to assimilate in the local culture and accept that land as is. Because the land accepted you first. In this case, the land accepted others and told them they can practice their belief system too. Then why hurt other people living on that land??



This is the beauty of American freedom actually. They were given safety as someone would've killed them. In fact, I would almost bet, the sad and terrible nature of that event since the Pearl Harbor, was SO grave, that even if you gave them police for protection, I don't think the police officers would've taken the assignment, or done it right.

What do you expect the US to have done? Locked the women and children into Gitmo for terrorist events that OBL did???? The American nation and principles don't stand for it. But the government is responsible for providing security to residents of the US. So IMO that was a good call to send them out by President Bush. Granted that actually happened the way you are stating it did. Not sure in that time, only one flight was allowed by the US President and it leaked out to you :disagree::fie: sitting thousands of miles away....when things like these are usually confidential and secret !!

On Bush's business connections, I am sure the connections are there and its natural to do business globally in today's world. But I can ALSO assure you, when Bush or anyone else, including myself thinks about doing business with another country, we expect "PROFIT", not terror attacks on our homes !!!!

Its unbelievable to see the ignorance, arrogance and low quality attitude from people who just LOVE to point all fingers back to the US WITHOUT taking ONE cent's worth of responsibility for the craziness that goes on in Pakistan!!
I agree with most of the things you say, another example is did UK declare all Irish terrorist for having IRA as terrorists? Yes Pakistanis are not really united and there is corruption and lack of education. However I never worked in Pakistan so to me you go by individual actions. Natural instinct is to be biased but one has to resist that temptation. I am not wrong the reaction by ordinary people and Donald Trump will make things worse and help the terrorists. If you cannot see that I will not drag it further.
 

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