What's new

US Ditches Nuristan Leaving Pakistan Army in the Lurch

zeeshan809

FULL MEMBER

New Recruit

Joined
Jan 5, 2009
Messages
93
Reaction score
0
The United States military has withdrawn its troops from all four bases of the Nuristan province in Afghanistan alng with the border in Pakistan. The reason given for such a move is the commencement of winter, choking of supply lines and elimination of isolated bases to prevent a run-over by militants.

Nuristan is now under the control of Qari Zia-ur-Rehman's network, which according to some media reports also makes it the first province to be taken over by Al-Qaeda linked Taliban group.

Read the rest at:
Wars of the World: US Abandons Afghan Province to Taliban as Pakistan Army Starts Operation
 
.
A very alarming move by the Americans (If the news is credible). Isolating Nuristan would only increase more terrorist outfits and training camps in the region. What's more alarming is that it might create an influx of Afghan fighters, crossing the border into Pakistan which in return would trouble Pakistan's tribal areas. US must not stop aerial and precision bombing in the Nuristan province. Packing up for the winter would lead to a fierce retaliation from the insurgents in future, IF the US forces plan to come back next year.
 
.
Is a blog a credible source? Was it copy/pasted on the blog? In that case, what is the original source?
 
.
U.S. Quietly Aids Pakistani Drives on Taliban
WASHINGTON — Even as the Pakistani government plays down the American role in its military operations in Taliban-controlled areas along the border with Afghanistan, the United States has quietly rushed hundreds of millions of dollars in arms, equipment and sophisticated sensors to Pakistani forces in recent months, said senior American and Pakistani officials.

During preparations this spring for the Pakistani military campaigns in Swat and South Waziristan, President Obama personally intervened at the request of Pakistan’s top army general to speed the delivery of 10 Mi-17 troop transport helicopters. Senior Pentagon officials have also hurried spare parts for Cobra helicopter gunships, night vision goggles, body armor and eavesdropping equipment to the fight.

American military surveillance drones are feeding video images and target information to Pakistani ground commanders, and the Pentagon has quietly provided the Pakistani Air Force with high-resolution, infrared sensors for F-16 warplanes, which Pakistan is using to guide bomb attacks on militants’ strongholds in South Waziristan.

In addition, the number of American Special Forces soldiers and support personnel who are training and advising Pakistani Army and paramilitary troops has doubled in the past eight months, to as many as 150, an American adviser said. The Americans do not conduct combat operations.

........................contd

What was the title of the thread again? And @ OP, please stop quoting some crappy material from a stupid blog!!!
 
.
Is a blog a credible source? Was it copy/pasted on the blog? In that case, what is the original source?

Have you read the blog? Its so lame! This guy wants to create sensational journalistic pieces but fails miserably!
No credible sources for the material posted on those blogs!
 
.
A very alarming move by the Americans (If the news is credible). Isolating Nuristan would only increase more terrorist outfits and training camps in the region. What's more alarming is that it might create an influx of Afghan fighters, crossing the border into Pakistan which in return would trouble Pakistan's tribal areas. US must not stop aerial and precision bombing in the Nuristan province. Packing up for the winter would lead to a fierce retaliation from the insurgents in future, IF the US forces plan to come back next year.

Et tu Bezerk?
I just posted an article from NYT, sort of contradicting the OP.
 
.
Et tu Bezerk?
I just posted an article from NYT, sort of contradicting the OP.

Good work, Gubbi! Even though it doesn't say much about Nuristan, we'd have to wait and see if this news breaks out on the International media.
 
.
Taliban take over Afghan province
By Syed Saleem Shahzad

ISLAMABAD - The United States has withdrawn its troops from its four key bases in Nuristan, on the border with Pakistan, leaving the northeastern province as a safe haven for the Taliban-led insurgency to orchestrate its regional battles.

The US has retained some forces in Nuristan's capital, Parun, to provide security for the governor and government facilities. The American position concerning the withdrawal is that due to winter conditions, supply arteries are choked, making it difficult to keep forces in remote areas. The US has pulled out from some areas in the past, but never from all four main bases.

The move by the top US commander in Afghanistan, General Stanley McChystal, follows the death on October 3 of eight US soldiers as well as a number of Afghan National Army forces when their outpost in Kamdesh was attacked by more than 300 militants. On July 13, 2008, nine American soldiers were killed when their outpost in Wanat was attacked by small-arms fire and rocket-propelled grenades.

Nuristan is strategically located in the Hindu Kush mountains, the vast and rugged region in which al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden and his associates are believed to hide.

The province is now under the effective control of the network belonging to Qari Ziaur Rahman, a Taliban commander with strong ties to Bin Laden. This makes Nuristan the first Afghan province to be controlled by a network inspired by al-Qaeda.

In a telephone conversation on Wednesday, a militant linked to Rahman said that now that they had control of Nuristan, the militants are "marching towards Mohmand and Bajaur to help their fellow Taliban fighting against Pakistani troops", referring to two tribal agencies across the border.

Rahman is not the son of a legendary mujahideen commander, but of a cleric named Maulana Dilbar. His ties do not lie with Pakistan, but with Bin Laden, having instructed him in the lessons of the Prophet Mohammed's life.

Ziaur, in his early thirties, was raised in the camps of Arab militants, who instilled in him the passion to fight against the Americans - not only in Afghanistan, but across the globe. Ziaur did not get his command as any hereditary right. First he had to prove himself on the battlefield, which he did by taking on US troops in Kunar and Nuristan provinces. He was the first to mount operations against the US in the Karghal district of Kunar and he engineered encounters in Nuristan. (See A fighter and a financier Asia Times Online, May 23, 2008.)

Mountainous Nuristan - and adjoining Kunar province and the Mohmand and Bajaur tribal areas - provide a natural labyrinth, ideal for insurgents to establish safe heavens. The majority of Nuristan's people adhere to the strict Salafi school of thought. As a result, Arab fighters, who are mostly Salafis, have always been drawn to the area. This happened during the jihad against the Soviets in the 1980s, when a virtually autonomous Salafi "kingdom" was established with aid from Kuwait and Saudi Arabia. This was later eliminated by the Taliban.

In recent years, several top al-Qaeda leaders have been spotted in the area, including al-Qaeda deputy Dr Ayman al-Zawahiri, who escaped two missile attacks by US Predator drones. During the Soviet invasion, Nuristan was one of the few areas of the country that was never under occupation. Since the US-led invasion of 2001, it, along with Kunar, has been a hot-bed of activity.

The Taliban's control of Nuristan coincides with the big Pakistani military operation in the South Waziristan tribal area against the al-Qaeda-backed Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan, which has been underway for the past two weeks. As the militant who spoke to Asia Times Online said, there is now the opportunity to open a new front, with Rahman's forces on the Afghan side and those of Moulvi Faqir Mohammad on the Bajaur and Mohmand side.

This region is also home to displaced militants from Pakistan's Swat Valley, who withdrew earlier this year after a military offensive in that area. They are believed to have regrouped and are preparing for new action in Swat once the winter snows block passes, making it difficult for the army's supply lines.

The latest developments in Nuristan mark a dramatic about-turn. In late 2008, coalition forces, along with the Pakistani military, launched Operation Lion Heart. The idea was that militants would be squeezed between coalition forces in Kunar and Nuristan on the one side, and Pakistani troops in Mohmand and Bajaur on the other. Several months later, both armies announced - clearly prematurely - that they had succeeded in flushing out the insurgent sanctuaries in the region.

Lion Heart was planned following US and Pakistani intelligence reports that the Taliban bases in Mohmand and Bajaur and in Nuristan and Kunar fed into a network that went on to the Taghab Valley in Kapisa province, which is just to the north of the capital, Kabul. From here, the Taliban have been able to launch suicide squads for attacks in Kabul.

The US withdrawal from Nuristan, if it becomes permanent, will give an unprecedented boost to the Taliban in the whole region. In the immediate term, they are better placed than ever to disrupt next month's presidential election runoff between the incumbent, Hamid Karzai, and his challenger, Abdullah Abdullah. The Taliban have already issued calls for people to boycott the voting.

In a foretaste of what is to come, the Taliban on Wednesday attacked a guest house in Kabul, killing at least 12 people, including six United Nations employees, two security officials and a civilian, according to police and UN officials. Kabul police said that three attackers, all wearing suicide vests, had also been killed.

Syed Saleem Shahzad is Asia Times Online's Pakistan Bureau Chief. He can be reached at saleem_shahzad2002@yahoo.com

Asia Times Online :: South Asia news, business and economy from India and Pakistan

==============

SS's comments on the Taliban looking to expand operations in Bajaur and Mohmand is validated by the recent upsurge in attacks on the security forces in those two agencies, especially Mohmand.

On another note, this supposed strategy of protecting the 'population centers' makes no sense in the short to medium term, at least. It appears a largely defensive strategy - the Taliban are free to recruit and train in the countryside, and capable of launching waves of attacks against the 'population centers' and elsewhere.

Does anyone know what proportion of the Afghan population is in these 'population centers' that will be the focus?

Thread opened
 
.
The failure of the 'population center' idea IMO is reflected in the Pakistani failure to use 'peace deals' in FATA and Swat to limit violence and Taliban expansion.

And in our case we continued to maintain a military presence at least, and had some sort of broad understanding with the Tribes and/or Taliban leadership - none of that has made much difference or brought peace, except in the Maulvi Nazir territory of South Waziristan.

The deals, and respite for the Taliban, have instead allowed them to expand their covert networks and cells into mainland Pakistan (the 'population centers' in Pakistan's case), and link up with other criminal and extremist organizations.
 
.
The failure of the 'population center' idea IMO is reflected in the Pakistani failure to use 'peace deals' in FATA and Swat to limit violence and Taliban expansion.

The earlier peace deals with people of Nazir and other pro-govt tribal leaders were harmed by betryals by govt on the behest of US. (mind you i am not talking about peace deals with TTP)

And in our case we continued to maintain a military presence at least, and had some sort of broad understanding with the Tribes and/or Taliban leadership - none of that has made much difference or brought peace, except in the Maulvi Nazir territory of South Waziristan.

US even is trying to add to our problems by creating rift between nazir and the govt which is going to take a big toll on us once again
 
.
I can bet on this that 2010 is their last year in this misadventure ...Adios yankees in advance .
 
.
The earlier peace deals with people of Nazir and other pro-govt tribal leaders were harmed by betryals by govt on the behest of US. (mind you i am not talking about peace deals with TTP)



US even is trying to add to our problems by creating rift between nazir and the govt which is going to take a big toll on us once again

Jana,

You should read the account by David Rhodes in the NYT of his time in captivity with the Taliban in NW - notice that he points out the NW Taliban rejoiced hearing about a bombing that killed civilians. He also pointed out that NW is full of foreign militants - Arabs, Uzbeks and Chechens.

Aside from Maulvi Nazir (and even that may change) I am not at all convinced that the Pakistani Taliban (Gul Bahdur included) are in any way loyal to the Pakistani state and will not seek to overthrow it and assist other groups in doing so.

We need to keep in mind that our 'deal' in NW may only last so long as major ops in SW continue. Today Gen. Athar Abbas mentioned that the SW militants are escaping into NW - do you think Gul Bahadur is going to capture them and hand them over to the PA?

He and his men are giving the sworn enemies of Pakistan sanctuary in NW - don't forget that, whatever short term 'deals' need to be made.
 
.
Agnostic..I think it's clear we will have to clear out North Wazrisitan too but we need to clear South first and then north.IMHO only good Talibans are dead taliban.Any Tailban victory in Afghanistan would mean extreme violence in Pakistan due to its fallout.So we'll have to eliminate all of them.
 
.
Jana,

You should read the account by David Rhodes in the NYT of his time in captivity with the Taliban in NW - notice that he points out the NW Taliban rejoiced hearing about a bombing that killed civilians. He also pointed out that NW is full of foreign militants - Arabs, Uzbeks and Chechens.

Aside from Maulvi Nazir (and even that may change) I am not at all convinced that the Pakistani Taliban (Gul Bahdur included) are in any way loyal to the Pakistani state and will not seek to overthrow it and assist other groups in doing so.

We need to keep in mind that our 'deal' in NW may only last so long as major ops in SW continue. Today Gen. Athar Abbas mentioned that the SW militants are escaping into NW - do you think Gul Bahadur is going to capture them and hand them over to the PA?

He and his men are giving the sworn enemies of Pakistan sanctuary in NW - don't forget that, whatever short term 'deals' need to be made.

Yes NW is full of Uzbeks and foreign terrorists. And they are given sheltter mostly by Mehsud factions

I would hardly believe Rhodes or anyone else without knowing the ground facts from the direct soruces.

As far as Nazir or Gul Bahadur are concerned yes these people can switch their loyalities but that also have some reasons, money here is not the reason.

So at this point we can not open another front specially when US have vaccated the basis and check points on the otherside of the border as soon as Pakistan has started operation in South Waziristan.

According to our direct sources the key commanders of TTP had crossed into Afghanistan with the help of US three days before the SW operation, it also include Fakqir Muhammad.
 
.
Yes NW is full of Uzbeks and foreign terrorists. And they are given sheltter mostly by Mehsud factions

I would hardly believe Rhodes or anyone else without knowing the ground facts from the direct soruces.

As far as Nazir or Gul Bahadur are concerned yes these people can switch their loyalities but that also have some reasons, money here is not the reason.

So at this point we can not open another front specially when US have vaccated the basis and check points on the otherside of the border as soon as Pakistan has started operation in South Waziristan.

According to our direct sources the key commanders of TTP had crossed into Afghanistan with the help of US three days before the SW operation, it also include Fakqir Muhammad.
I agree with extending the truce with Bahdur and Nazir so long as we continue with major ops in SW, I mentioned as much. I am merely pointing out that these so called 'good Taliban' are only 'good' in the short term, and are sheltering terrorists like the ones that carried out the bombings in Peshawar, and we need to be prepared to take them on at some point.

The TTP leadership may have escaped into Afghanistan, but I do not see why the US would help them do it, though it may have created more conducive conditions for their 'resettlement' by withdrawing from Nuristan.

Faqir Mohammed was after all targeted in a drone attack in Bajaur at a 'shura meeting', that killed two of his relatives, and escaped himself by minutes.

It is also highly probable that the TTP leadership is in NW - if the low lever fighters are escaping into NW as Gen. Abbas said, then why not the leadership? What better place to hide than under the protection of a leader (Gul Bahadur) with which the PA has had to make a 'deal of necessity' and the risk of military patrols, detection and capture is extremely low.
 
.

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom