Ummah Yearnings

[Burger Boy]

These self acclaimed "Islamists" are really funny people.

Almost to the last one of them, they are obviously hypocrites and themselves disprove everything that is generally claimed about Islam.

In fact, they prove every stereotype that the decent people within their community want to get away from.

For us, they don't matter. They are an impotent lot, big on words. Only words.

The real struggle is within their own society to shun them and put them in their real place. Good to see a beginning being made about that.

There are extremists on all sides. Within India, there are some Hindu nationalists who believe in a hindu reconquista, Bharatvarsha to take over Pakistan , Bangladesh, Nepal, Bhutan, Burma, parts of China, and sometimes they even include Iran and Afghanistan and beyond.

 

[AAtish]

The Arabs are just asking to taste a beating from us Pakistanis... dont worry... its the regimes that is the problem... not the people...

As for those who oppose the concept of "Ummah" for whatever reasons... be careful... you are clashing with the very words of the Quran which addresses Muslims as Ummah Wahida (one nation)...

Enough of Musharaf's deception of Pakistan First... We have seen what he did to Pakistan... Khalas!!!

MBQ.. Sorry for late reply.. I was not following this thread as I had given my share in here..

As far as Arabs are concerned, my whole family lived there for 11 years, we were always “kharji”, so if you are known as kharji (outsider) you are not one of them. And believe me, I met Shaikh Zaid only once, most of the time it was the people..

There is no opposition of Ummah Wahida here, we are not the problem, the problem is “Ummah wahida” doesn’t want us right now, you know why? Most of them think that we are going to be a burden on them. We are poor, arrogant, Ignorant, undeveloped, uneducated bunch of people who they don’t want to be part of them, though most of them are more uneducated than us, but still, they are Arabs (higher race according to them) or Persian (higher race According to them) or Turks (higher race according to them).. The bottom line is, no matter how much you want, you will NOT be accepted by them.

So, take my word for it, You wanna be part of “Ummah Wahida”? then develop yourself so much that they “need” you to be their part..

Just my two cents..

 

[Vinod2070]

Some months back i've seen you you saying any attack on pakistan by U.S should be retaliated by nuking india..what a peace lover!

In my understanding, such people don't even realize their constantly shifting stand and what it says about them and what they claim to represent.

It is actually baffling how they cause the most damage to what they really say they cherish so much.

 

[Vinod2070]

There are extremists on all sides. Within India, there are some Hindu nationalists who believe in a hindu reconquista, Bharatvarsha to take over Pakistan , Bangladesh, Nepal, Bhutan, Burma, parts of China, and sometimes they even include Iran and Afghanistan and beyond.

And they are equivalent to those who are killing people to lay their hands on the 72 and want to establish a primitive ideology by force? Who are killing thousands and thousands in Pakistan, Afghanistan and all over the world, burning schools, blowing up markets... You get the idea.

Yes, there are extremists evrywhere. The difference is in scale and their capability and intent to do damage on a massive scale.

Such talk actually takes the focus away from the massive challenge that one is facing.

 

[justanobserver]

When has there ever been an ancient state called the "Indian Empire"??

Called by whom ? The West?

India, Persia and even China were names given by outsiders.

Forget trying to equate Pakistan and India.

 

[punit]

britsh east India company was perhaps founded after 15 Aug 1947

 

[Moorkh]

Yes but T Faz we all know that the British Empire kept going on the basis of buying loyalties... I mean do I have to point out to you that the forefathers of the feudal landlords of Pakistan got their land by doing acts of treason against their own people... I describe the British as masters of division actually... and their history books mention the 1847 struggle for independence as the "Indian Mutiny"... go figure the rest...

The british are not too far from the truth in calling it a mutiny. It wasnt a war by a long stretch. It was a mutiny by some of the units of indian soldiers. Some of the 'vassal' states that the british had created rose up against them at the same time.
If you study why 'the mutiny"/"first war of independence" failed you would realise this. It wasnt a war to rid India/Pakistan of the british. The various groups were fighting to rid their small area from the british. The kings of petty kingdoms were fighting to not remain british vassals anymore. No group went to aid others after winning in their part. There was no cohesion, not even a unifying idea except hatred for the british.
Also not everyone rose up against the brits. Soldiers were brought in from North and south to quash this indian uprising with indian troops. I havent read anything about uprisings in the territories of modern day pakistan or in what was the huge madras province.

 

[Al-zakir]

In sura al-Imran talk about one unified nation(Ummah wahida). It's the words of Allah Subhanahu wa-ta'ala.

كُنتُمْ خَيْرَ أُمَّةٍ أُخْرِجَتْ لِلنَّاسِ تَأْمُرُونَ بِالْمَعْرُوفِ وَتَنْهَوْنَ عَنِ الْمُنكَرِ وَتُؤْمِنُونَ بِاللّهِ وَلَوْ آمَنَ أَهْلُ الْكِتَابِ لَكَانَ خَيْرًا لَّهُم مِّنْهُمُ الْمُؤْمِنُونَ وَأَكْثَرُهُمُ الْفَاسِقُونَ

Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors.

In Sura al-Al-'Anbya Allah Subhanahu wa-ta'ala said:

إِنَّ هَذِهِ أُمَّتُكُمْ أُمَّةً وَاحِدَةً وَأَنَا رَبُّكُمْ فَاعْبُدُونِ

So, this community of yours is one single community of the same faith, and I am your Lord so worship Me alone.

Our prophet(s.a.a.s) has said:"A believer with respect to other believers is related like the head is related to the body. A believer feels the pain of other believers as the head feels the pain of the body."

So therefore the concept Muslim Ummah can not be brush off that easy. Ummah exist otherwise there is no reason for state of Pakistan not to have a good relation with the state of Israel.

We Bangladeshi and Pakistani Muslim aware of the event of 71 and no one would have through 38 years ago that Bangladesh-Pakistan would have been closed again yet we are seeing brotherly relation is increasing as day goes by. Why? Because we are Muslim. One common believe, one Allah and one rasul(s.w.s). la ilaha illa allah muhammad rasul allah

OIC also an example of Ummah wahida. It has disappointed performance so far and we all condemn it however it can be strengthened to accommodate the concern of Ummah.

At the end, not believing in the concept ummah fall under the category of denying part of Quran and ignoring the teaching of our leader (s.a.a.w). Not a good practice for practicing Muslim.

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

MBQ.. Sorry for late reply.. I was not following this thread as I had given my share in here..

As far as Arabs are concerned, my whole family lived there for 11 years, we were always “kharji”, so if you are known as kharji (outsider) you are not one of them. And believe me, I met Shaikh Zaid only once, most of the time it was the people..

There is no opposition of Ummah Wahida here, we are not the problem, the problem is “Ummah wahida” doesn’t want us right now, you know why? Most of them think that we are going to be a burden on them. We are poor, arrogant, Ignorant, undeveloped, uneducated bunch of people who they don’t want to be part of them, though most of them are more uneducated than us, but still, they are Arabs (higher race according to them) or Persian (higher race According to them) or Turks (higher race according to them).. The bottom line is, no matter how much you want, you will NOT be accepted by them.

So, take my word for it, You wanna be part of “Ummah Wahida”? then develop yourself so much that they “need” you to be their part..

Just my two cents..

JazakAllah khair for the post...

I can say with a certainty that no such feelings of superiority exist in the minds of ordinary Turks about Pakistanis... If experience is any basis then I ve felt more at home in Turkey than I have in my native land of Pakistan... I wont comment on Persians because it has been almost thirty years the last time I was in Iran... however we need to keep one thing in mind all the time and that is we cannot become a thief (or for that matter indulge in any sin) just because others are indulging in it... an Arab who thinks he is superior race (no such thing in Islam) will go in his own grave and you will go in your grave... You wont be asked about what that Arab thought of the world... however if you made the mistake of sticking to an arbitrary notion of natioalism then you are going to be in serious trouble... If you were to ask today of ordinary Arab about Nationalism they ll instantly say Haram... the reason why they tend not to mingle much with Pakistanis is because we treat them badly also... so its a vicious circle...

As far as your other point is concerned about they not needing us and we should not need them... let me be clear on that... we dont need anyone... Pakistan in itself is enough to be a super power on its own... however part of this power projection would mean that other states will start coming under our influence... when I said the Arabs are waiting to get a beating from us I meant this exact Arab elite mentality that shuns the concept of Ummah... even if the idea seeps down to the poorest of them, its wrong and it is the product of the minds of our enemies... We need to be careful when we adopt opinions and ideas... The Ummah is here to stay... I dont care what the Arabs think or what the Bengalis think... A Muslim is a brother to another Muslim and this cannot change... If the brother tries to wrong me... I ll give the brother a beating but will continue to call him a brother... Hope you get my point...

and of course I forgot this part... we need to start from somewhere... so why not start from Pakistan... lets get it to the status that we are called out in the prayers of the oppressed Ummah... when our sisters and mothers call out to us Pakistanis as Muslims to come and help them and save them... we can be those who hold the flag of righteousness, of justice... not just for ourselves but for others too... but for all this we need to start at home first... so there is no disagreement on this point with you...

btw... I dont think Arabs not needing us is entirely true... Hundreds and Thousands of dead Iraqis (and Afghans_ certainly needed us... our guns to defend their honor and lives... not coz they were Iraqis, Arabs or even Muslims... but because they were innocent and were mercilessly annihilated by the Firaun of our times... the US of A...

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

In sura al-Imran talk about one unified nation(Ummah wahida). It's the words of Allah Subhanahu wa-ta'ala.

كُنتُمْ خَيْرَ أُمَّةٍ أُخْرِجَتْ لِلنَّاسِ تَأْمُرُونَ بِالْمَعْرُوفِ وَتَنْهَوْنَ عَنِ الْمُنكَرِ وَتُؤْمِنُونَ بِاللّهِ وَلَوْ آمَنَ أَهْلُ الْكِتَابِ لَكَانَ خَيْرًا لَّهُم مِّنْهُمُ الْمُؤْمِنُونَ وَأَكْثَرُهُمُ الْفَاسِقُونَ

Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors.

In Sura al-Al-'Anbya Allah Subhanahu wa-ta'ala said:

إِنَّ هَذِهِ أُمَّتُكُمْ أُمَّةً وَاحِدَةً وَأَنَا رَبُّكُمْ فَاعْبُدُونِ

So, this community of yours is one single community of the same faith, and I am your Lord so worship Me alone.

Our prophet(s.a.a.s) has said:"A believer with respect to other believers is related like the head is related to the body. A believer feels the pain of other believers as the head feels the pain of the body."

So therefore the concept Muslim Ummah can not be brush off that easy. Ummah exist otherwise there is no reason for state of Pakistan not to have a good relation with the state of Israel.

We Bangladeshi and Pakistani Muslim aware of the event of 71 and no one would have through 38 years ago that Bangladesh-Pakistan would have been closed again yet we are seeing brotherly relation is increasing as day goes by. Why? Because we are Muslim. One common believe, one Allah and one rasul(s.w.s). la ilaha illa allah muhammad rasul allah

OIC also an example of Ummah wahida. It has disappointed performance so far and we all condemn it however it can be strengthened to accommodate the concern of Ummah.

At the end, not believing in the concept ummah fall under the category of denying part of Quran and ignoring the teaching of our leader (s.a.a.w). Not a good practice for practicing Muslim.

Agreed with all parts... except OIC... OIC is run by the Devil himself in case you did nt know...

It is an organization to fool Muslims... it can never bring good to anyone...

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

I would rather prefer the Pakistanis themselves to take you on in this thread. They are doing a mighty fine job.

Frankly, I have seen a lot of Islamists on this forum and elsewhere and let's just say they have not impressed with their consistency, coherence, ability to be specific (and not abstract when it suits them) and really providing a workable alternative to any degree of detail.

In fact , most of them obviously don't practice what they preach (which they do mostly from the safety of a Western kaffir democracy, having a riba based bank account etc.).

Ad homonem speculations...

what a loser...

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

Some months back i've seen you you saying any attack on pakistan by U.S should be retaliated by nuking india..what a peace lover!

I still maintain that if we are to be annihilated then it would be best to drag India our arch enemy into it...

Anything to tie the hands of America... I m all for a tit for tat response against any/all hostile forces to Pakistan...

Infact if I remember the discussion correctly, brother LeGend agreed with me that threatening nukes against India is a trump card and could be vital for our survival...

so yes... I am a peace lover... unlike you bhartis who only want trouble for Pakistan and trying to fool people with Aman Ki Asha fraud...

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

Your command on history never fails to impress me. Nor do your ideas

Ever heard of a typo?

and yes... my command of what I say here is scary for people like you... this is why the only manner in which you ever engage is antics such as the above post... If you had any substance you could take the opportunity to discuss... but hey I kill roaches without mercy...

Now be nice and do me a favor... and join the rest of the cockroaches on this forum... they all sit in the corner and only ever engage in one line silly amusements from time to time... everyone else... please continue to participate...

smiling and shaking my head

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

Your command on history never fails to impress me. Nor do your ideas

and your command OF English never fails to impress me.

 

[Muhammad-Bin-Qasim]

what kind of a question is that and what has this got to do with ones posts here? Are you a munafiq. Trsut me MBQ we won;t hold it against you we just need to know where you are coming from.

It was the kind of question that only an intelligent person like T Faz could answer... was nt for you...

as for me being a Munafiq... cant you tell??

LOL