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Ukraine’s message to Pakistan

Ukraine would have tanked within a few years if it had tried to maintain its 1900 nukes and 780000 troops.
it,s not necessary to mantain 1900 nukes... afew hundreds would have been enough .... you can see pakistan,s example...just a few nukes and whole world on dialogue table... :lol:....one should never replay on others for security....specially Super powers...
 
Pakistan has accepted that their No 1 enemy is internal. Do they need so much of nuclear power for Internal enemy. Taliban are about to rich the Pakistan nuclear. Situation shall be very interesting once Taliban get a hand o nuclear weapons.
No Taliban are nowhere close to the Nukes, instead they are trying to sign a peace pact.
Secondly things will be exciting for you if they do get hands on some Nukes because you are the closest targets. Interesting indeed. :D
 
If the US or anyone else for that matter was to denuke Pakistan, they will have to destroy Pakistan, they will get our nukes over our dead bodies.....

No Taliban are nowhere close to the Nukes, instead they are trying to sign a peace pact.
Secondly things will be exciting for you if they do get hands on some Nukes because you are the closest targets. Interesting indeed. :D
dude let @HariPrasad have his wet dream....:rofl:
 
Same way in which they succeeded in reaching Kamra and Karachi naval base. I hope that they can never reach.

indian like you have issues and sick minds and thinking , if you know anything about nukes than you should know that . nukes are not hand grenades than you take off pin and throw it ...... please use a hammer on your head maybe it will break the thick ice inside your brain
 
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indian like you have issues and illiterate minds and thinking , if you know anything about nukes than you should know that . nukes are not handgrades

Calling us illiterate ? first learn how to spell hand grenade.

why is that, ukraine is still a better country than india? why doesn't india try to spend more money on its humans then on nukes and weapons of war

It applies to you more than us. Your PM visit every second country with a begging bowl. why doesn't Pakistan try to spend more money on its people and fix it economy rather then on nukes and weapons of war.
 
interesting to see indians here who are thinking that nukes of pak will fall into "wrong" hands, or why is pak increasing its nuke arsenal..... don't worry neither the weapon will fall into wrong hands and nor will we stop building more nukes.

Stay safe!
 
Shia,Sunni,Ahmadi What else ? Blow yourself up now nearby a mosque of another sect.

Religious divide are present in all modern societies , you have catholics, protestans, orthodox, jews, muslims living together all over europe. The caste divide that you have in your country is "special" only to your country and will always keep your country in check, I think pakistan does not need to worry at least from that point of view, yes we have to neutralize the war monger "brahmins" of india by keeping our defence up to date both in conventional and unconventional field.
 
Ukraine was/is not part of nato, therefore on paper it officially cannot count on the assistance of nato countries. Therefore Ukraine cannot be compared with Turkey fundamentally. i believe that nato will have to stand with Turkey as much as possible in order to 1) failing to stand with Turkey will tarnish nato imago 2) Turkey will change its future course permanently 3) non-nato nations will feel encouraged by nato's weak/hesitating stance 4) if the economical and military growth will continue like this for a few more decades, Turkey's increasingly importance will slowly become 'too big' for nato (and Israel which has some benefits thanks to nato too) to lose. However, the reality is different imo. i don't believe that nato will really back up Turkey when the benefits are less than the risks. Therefore Turkey must keep improving its economy and military and try to achieve independence in these fields as much as possible, and also stay away from entering EU (only keeping special trade agreements) while we are at it. We know the west is hypocrite and still quite hostile towards, but neither is Russia really trustworthy. we really should get nukes and bigger toys in the future for our own safety and not let our safety depend on another party, that is just naive.

100%!

Exactly my point!

However, entering into EU won't be a bad idea. Turkey will have the largest military in EU and the largest population with most dynamic outlook. Turkey can achieve the leadership role in EU if it goes by good strategy. Therefore, France and Germany are scared of Turks in the EU.
 
Following the end of the Soviet Union, the then nuclear-armed new black sea state of Ukraine- the third largest nuclear weapon state until May 1992- abandoned it’s massive nuclear arsenal amid US, British and Russian security guarantees that the territorial integrity, and sovereignty of the largest Euro-state will not be violated.

Well that was then, and this is now that Crimea has gone to Russia. The poor Ukrainians, as they gave up their nuclear deterrent, didn’t realize that a hollow foreign security guarantee, minus an indigenous military muscle, could only ensure a recipe for sheer aggression. The theory has materialized. Today, when the Crimean secession from Ukraine is no longer a mystery, it’s principal security guarantor, the super power USA and the West are noticeably absent from the zone of their commitment to the territorial defence of kiev. The US, and it’s allies have ruled out any military resolution of the conflict with Moscow.

Thus, comfortably trampling their own security guarantees, the US and its partners are telling the disarmed Ukraine that(1) the diplomatic solution is the only way forward over Crimea, (2) if diplomacy fails, a punishing sanctions-regime shall be imposed on the aggressor Moscow, and (3)in the mean time, the US-led moral support for Ukraine shall continue to reclaim Crimea. The news is that the US led reaction has found some 32 culprits though Ukraine has been promised more sanctions. How nations fall in their post independence period is exemplified by Ukraine’s leadership blunders. It’s leaders, as mentioned earlier, jettisoned their ultimate defence—their nuclear arsenal- under US-Russian guarantees.

They failed to rebuild their conventional forces. Their corruption did not let them manage the economy that remains in shambles. They could not understand the strategic sensitivities of relations with Moscow. They kept overlooking the fact that, despite becoming independent, and disliking the Russians, their fate was intertwined with Russia in almost every conceivable area from the bonds of common history, geography, culture, people, politics, trade, commerce, exports, and the energy supply from Moscow- their lifeline- to the presence of Russia’s strategic black sea fleet base in Crimea, and the list goes on.

Despite these evident realities, the men in Ukraine could not figure out that their desire for strategic integration with the West, and NATO coupled with a deliberate show of overt disdain for Russia could cost them, as it actually has, not only their sovereignty, but also their territorial integrity— which means the secession, in this case, of the Russian majority Crimea from Ukraine.

In fact, the other Russian speaking parts of Ukraine could very well follow the same route of secession for their ethnic linkage with Moscow. A small, defenseless state, Living in a supper power neighborhood, and challenging its might, and strategic interests, cannot get away with the arrogance as demonstrated by Ukraine’s interim leadership, particularly, in over throwing it’s elected pro-Moscow president, Mr Yanukovich, inadditionto the euphoric Anti-Moscow street celebrations, and governmental vows to be quickly associated with the EU, and the NATO—the main theme of anti Yanukovich campaign. The Ukrainian leadership is out of touch with the bitter reality even now when UKraine has fallen apart. While sitting next to US president, and later addressing the UNSC, Mr. Yatsenyuk, the interim prime minister of Ukraine vowed never to surrender to Moscow at a time when the preferred strategy, under similar circumstances, should have been one of deeply, and swiftly engaging Russia.

Ukraine’s blind reliance on the West and it’s mindless confrontation with Russia bear enough testimony to how the leadership failure ends up leading a beleaguered state to the very point of committing a strategic suicide. Ukraine befell its present predicament, not only for it’s political misjudgment, but also for the well orchestrated media- backed US-led incitement of anti-Yanukovich, anti-Russia hate-movement in Ukraine. The Western propaganda, that Ukraine belongs to the West, demonized the image of Russia as an obstacle, and sought the ouster of MR Yanukovich, with the direction that Ukraine has to be liberated from “evil Russia” like Lithuania, and the other ex-Russian republics It could have served as a great strategy if Ukraine had the requisite nuclear ,and conventional deterrent, strong economic punch, and the Western military assistance of which It has none. The 1994 Budapest security guarantees are a sitting duck.

Ukraine, decapitated via it’s denuclearization by the US and Russia, which is not even being alluded to in the current crises, is simply meandering in the US-Euro rhetoric . The Western calculation that Moscow would not so forcefully react against the US- led Ukrainian revolt miserably failed. Today, Crimea’s secession from Ukraines’s geography through a Moscow backed referendum, has, without a single bullet being fired in this process, exposed the hypocrisy, and the hollowness of the US-British guarantees to Kiev. Brother Ukraine, says the US, there is no military option on the table.

Lessons: At present, the militarily abandoned Ukraine can only complain before the comity of nations as it has, neither thise 1900 nuclear weapons it traded in 1994 for the empty guarantees given by the US , UK, and Russia, nor the conventional power it once had- 780,000 standing forces curtailed to under 100 thousand after independence in 1991. Today, the March 16 referendum based outcome—Crimea’s decision for secession— seals the dismemberment of Ukraine.

Thus, the lesson for Pakistan, and the Pakistani Arms forces is abundantly clear. The word betrayal defines US foreign policy, and who knows it better that the people of Ukraine, and the bleeding Syria. There is no second chance. No security guarantee equals the guarantee of nuclear deterrence which the US has been seeking to put an end to ever since Islamabad became a nuclear power.

The need is greater than ever to double the quantum and lethality of the Pak- nuclear warheads, as well as increasing the range and accuracy of their delivery systems. Pakistan cannot afford any betrayal. The United States cannot be trusted - a message from Kiev to Islamabad.

Ukraine’s message to Pakistan


Simply one of the best, most succinct articles I have read here.! But...

1. Ukraine had no choice.
2,. An army of 780,000 based on its economy? No, I don't think so. De-militarisation was the only choice.

But yes, international guarantees are often not worth the paper they are (often not) written on. You provide your own guarantee.

On a different note, can anyone imagine what would have happened if Ukraine had become part of Nato? Am I the only one who thinks expansion eastwards is both dangerous and ridiculous?
 
These "security guarantees" are nothing but BS.

Ukraine gave up its nukes for this security guarantee, and what happened?

per that logic all of the south china seas countries need to go nuclear to challenge China.

This is most ignorant line of thought by the author of the article, only to be justified by more ignorant folks who think " going nuclear" is the best way out for countries. you guys think more countries should be nuclear are living in la la land ...

Of course it would mean that one has to ignore the majority of the countries who are not nuclear, nor are they being annexed.

You come from a country like China, that with Taiwan and Hong Kong, they have not annexed them ( both non nuclear powers)

this is not an issue about having nuclear weapons , it is about russia and russia being totally, completely asinine.
 
why is that, ukraine is still a better country than india? why doesn't india try to spend more money on its humans then on nukes and weapons of war
FYI,India does spend more money on its people than on weapons.
 
We learned our lessons through SEATO and SENTO in 1971. Since then Pakistan has never trusted anyone with its security. Examples like Ukraine only prove our point and strengthen our resolve.

Thus, the lesson for Pakistan, and the Pakistani Arms forces is abundantly clear. The word betrayal defines US foreign policy, and who knows it better that the people of Ukraine, and the bleeding Syria. There is no second chance. No security guarantee equals the guarantee of nuclear deterrence which the US has been seeking to put an end to ever since Islamabad became a nuclear power.

The need is greater than ever to double the quantum and lethality of the Pak- nuclear warheads, as well as increasing the range and accuracy of their delivery systems. Pakistan cannot afford any betrayal. The United States cannot be trusted - a message from Kiev to Islamabad.

Ukraine’s message to Pakistan
 
Ukraine made a big mistake giving up its Nuclear Deterrent as well as Libya....Pakistan should be totally mental to do that. The day anyone tries, Pakistan should prepare to fire them rights up its throat.

Just like security guarantees to Ukraine, Pakistani security guarantees are hollow and never will be backed up by USA and West.
 

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