Thats the most important factor (technology transfer..), without such assistance there would be zero achievement
Many countries have attempted to achieve such milestones but have failed miserably due to lack of technical equipment, material and guidance from foreign powers..
We can get guidance and tech from China which is a proven all weather friend. Perhaps not the most advanced tech yet, but sufficient for Pakistan's needs and requirements at this moment. The US isn't going to provide any ToT with armed drones. The US isn't even going to provide the drones let alone tech. That's a grave illusion.
You are completely contradicting yourself one hand you’ve stated, we do not require foreign assistance to build drones yet your claiming Chinese support would be needed..considering the current reality..
No, I'm not contradicting myself because had you read my previous posts you would know that I've clearly stated that China should be sought for this capability. Please read my previous posts before presuming out of the blue.
Its not as easy as your making it to be as if; with a swing of a magical wand, Indigenous armed drones will appear out of thin air..acknowledge and understand the true nature of our lagging capacity and infrastructure, budget constraints, instability etc..., then accordingly ..
.. 100 American years would seem brief period compared to..... If it was this simple as your implying every country would have 5th Generation air capabilities.....
It may not be as easy as waving a magical wand, but it surely isn't as difficult as you're suggesting it to be. Again, it isn't rocket science. We can compensate our lagging capacity and infrastructure by joining hands with our friendly ally China. Something I've already proposed on numerous occasions in my previous posts. Please read them. Also, stop comparing 5th gen tech with UCAVs. There's a world of difference between the level of tech complexity of a 5th gen aircraft fighter and a UCAV. Don't compare apples with bananas.
You should educate yourself the amount of contribution pakistan provided in the Research& Development and manufacture of the JF-17...
I'm very well aware about the amount of contribution that the Pakistani side has had in the JF-17 project. You don't need to lecture me on that.
Missile: Hint: Ha(no info to hindustani trolls) you've just confirmed my line of reasoning, the best missiles we have at the present moment are based upon american designs, this is one of the reasons why i am Campaigning to obtain american drone tech due to their success in iraq and afghan
Mate, you're simply not going to get any American tech. That's the whole crux of the problem that you're not willing to understand. The Americans have made it time and time again very clear that this tech is simply not on offer. I understand that it's the best tech available, and preferably we should be getting it. However, that's not going to happen for the reasons we all know. You should really think about alternatives like I am.
My friend, RC air planes have better air stability and maneuverability than this UAV you have just mentioned
Perhaps, but that still doesn't negate the fact that we ought to gain UCAV tech.
Has the puzzle of your jigsaw been able to bear fruit in the battleground of swat and Waziristan or protect our border. We need equipment immediately to thwart these terrorist, who are murdering tens of thousands of innocent pakistanis.
No, that's because we don't have any active UCAVs deployed across Swat and Waziristan. Of course, we need equipment on short notice to be able to effectively fight the war, but are we getting it? The answer is no. The US which you're heavily reliant on, haven't delivered on their promises. Another shortcoming in the ever growing trust deficit between Pak and US relations. Isn't that something that you should be concerned about before pleading for US drones? How reliable is the US? Can we trust the US?
We were once offered typhoons did it mean U.S.A began tendering f-18s to pakistan, it doesn't quiet work that way..
Once we were offered many things. Forget once and focus on now and the future. Many things have changed since once upon a time... Would Pakistan today again be offered the EF and F-18? Ask yourself this question before going on about acquiring US drones.
Again you have a false perception we are not producing f-16s Indigenously or anything close to it. furthermore FC-20 planes are expected to be delivered, quote "Pakistan Air Force - Initial delivery of 36 FC-20 scheduled for 2014-15.[30]"
Well, that's your false perception. I believe in the word of the ACM and other official sources of PAF. It's a well-known fact that the current JF-17 is very close capability wise with F-16A/B. That has also been disclosed by our PAF officials. So, what's possibly wrong with the FC-20s being delivered at a certain year? I don't understand your concern.
I have Absolutely no idea where you get your facts from, read below
"The US has proposed its largest arms sales package to Pakistan in more than 14 years, underlining the country's role as a close ally of Washington in the war on terror. The Pentagon notified Congress about the $1.2 bn package late on Nov. 16. It includes eight P3-C Orion surveillance aircraft, six Phalanx rapid fire guns for the Pakistan navy, and more than 2,000 TOW 2 missiles for the army."
it's time we show a bit of gratitude and strengthen our relationship which hindustan has been rentlessly striving to destroy.
Where are you getting your one-sided facts from? Ever considered that the US also offered advanced nuke tech to India? The US is also offering most advanced fighter aircraft to India. Just because the US tries to compensate Pakistan with such lousy offers, we shouldn't get excited. Besides, we can already obtain such offers from other sources. Again, you've to understand that the US will never provide anything high tech to Pakistan. That's out of the question.
How about if the US showed some gratitude for our soldiers and innocent people dying in the WoT? How about that the US showed some respect to the people of Pakistan instead of always pressuring to do more?
We need to compete with the hindustan for exact same deals.
If we decide to isolate ourselves it doesn't mean we will benefit
No, you cannot compete for the same deals as India because A) you don't have the money and B) regardless, the US will not provide it due to Indian factor. Don't get me wrong. I'm not in favour of isolating ourselves from the US. I'm just being realistic and proposing alternatives.
Whether some indian agents, like it or not (or hang themselves upside down..) we're getting this tech
P and it was not rejected.. so stop pulling s** out of your *** and claiming it to be facts
Well, I'm not stopping you from asking from the US. LOL If you feel like asking, by all means go ahead. However, I'll just reveal the outcome which isn't so favourable. Why so abusive? What's the need to get so low? Please mind your language and discuss in a civil manner. We can have a disagreement, but there's no need for you to pull things from your bottom.
just to name a few f-16s, AWACS, apache helicopter, are Junk
Only Four countires have AWACS, America, Isreal, pakistan and india
When did I claim that F-16, Apache and AWACS are junk? Please don't put words in my mouth and stop taking things out of their context. I specifically referred to the UAV deal as being too late and too little. Yep, I regard the latest UAV offer as junk. I'm sure the Americans can do better than offering some outdated UAVs which Pakistan has never asked for. Besides, we already have better UAVs at our own disposal.
You can't disregard such significant foundation. Every relationship has a history..The measure of foreseeable ties are based upon history, such fundamental factors influence mutual foreign polices of nations. To this day the rivalry between Russia and USA still prevails. History will always repeat itself, it's crucial we remain vigilant and cease our opportunity.
We had a history with the US because they needed us and we needed them. As far as I'm concerned, the US back stabbed Pakistan the moment they left Afghanistan after the Cold War. They left the whole region to deal with the aftermath and eventually they themselves got bitten by the monster that they once created. Today, the US are again in need of Pakistani assistance in their so-called WoT. Why should we again trust such an ally that left Pakistan high and dry? At least the former USSR was a clear visible enemy. In comparison, the US is an untrustworthy hypocritical snake.
again your mistaken RD-93 is a variant of RD-33... any further changes are made by china for Re-export
What are you going on about? Stop putting words in my mouth. I've never denied that the RD-93 was a derivative of RD-33. You keep on assuming things incorrectly for your own convenience. The Russian company providing the RD-93 has promised to come up with an even improved version of RD-93 with better thrust and other improvements. That's a fact.
Don't compare apples to oranges: JF-17 There have been some problems. The engine was emitting black smoke, which makes it easier for the enemy pilot to spot the plane. This puts the pilot in inferior position during a dogfight. It is not clear whether the fuel or the engine was responsible for the smoke and the issue has been resolved
Again, where have I refuted the claim that there have been no problems with the engine? You keep on putting words in my mouth for no apparent reason. You're completely avoiding my arguments and going off topic by putting words in my mouth. Please, I kindly request to remain on topic and not to avoid the debate at hand.
You can't run if you don't know how to walk. it would be extremely reckless for the goverment to targert it's own people, rather we need concentrate on ground Reconnaissance to prevent indian agents from sneaking into our border..
Such negativity was also prevalent when Pakistan was on the verge of becoming a nuke power. People doubted and kept on questioning our capability. We proved all the cynics and critics wrong at the end of the day. There is no question about rooting out mostly foreign miscreants in areas which unfortunately happen to be populated. What I'm suggesting is that instead of CIA agents the PA should carry out any surgical strikes. Reason being, the PA will be acting in the best interest of the country, but also be wary and sensitive of causing mass collateral damage. Don't you have any faith in your army?
America floated the offer of Advance drones and surveillance equipment similarly when the initial offer of f-16 was tabled.. it did not include hot zinger, planes etc.. we have to be shrewd negotiators and obtain superior tech, stop playing into Indian games of conquer and divide. I believe it would be utter lunacy on the part of GOP and Military to decline such offers
It seems that you're oblivious of the US Indian nexus which have ulterior motives against Pakistan and China in particular. No, this isn't a conspiracy theory, but the dire reality. The US will make many rosy promises, but they won't deliver. The F-16s (which were long due) have been delivered after years of embargoes and delays. Something you shouldn't expect from a trustworthy ally such as the US. What difference will 18 F-16 C/D make when India is being offered F-18, F-16 IN etc.
if we want to improve our relations pakistan needs to initiate a genuine dialog and demonstrate by abiding to some american terms since, we need them more than they need us, thooray jok na say koi bara chotay, Ne hoi jai ga, be a bigger country, put the ppl of afghanistan and pakistan ahead of all this bickering...
Why do we always have to show our genuine side when the US doesn't really care. Dialogues have been ongoing for years and years now. We've not seen any tangible results. On the contrary, all we hear is to do more and be prepared for more missile strikes. You're sorely mistaken. Pakistan doesn't need the US when it has a trustworthy and prospering ally in its backyard, namely China. We need to strengthen our relations with China. The people of Pakistan are first priority for me. Otherwise, I wouldn't be having this argument in this thread.
PS. Don't take my reply as an offence. We both want the best for Pakistan. It's just that we happen to differ in how we ought to reach those goals.
