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U.S., Pakistan stumble in private talks over drones

fatman17

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U.S., Pakistan stumble in private talks over drones

By Phil Stewart, Reuters January 5, 2011


WASHINGTON - A U.S. offer to supply Pakistan with its own fleet of surveillance drone aircraft delighted Islamabad a year ago but now threatens to turn into another source of friction between the two nations.


The offer was made by U.S. Defense Secretary Robert Gates during a trip to Islamabad in January 2010 but talks have failed to gain traction, with Pakistan privately voicing concern about what it says are exorbitant prices and a snail-pace delivery timeline.


A U.S. military official in Islamabad said Washington was still working with Pakistan to decide what pilotless drone system its army needed. A Pakistani official familiar with the matter denied that was the hold-up.


"It's not because of product choice, that we're unable to make a decision," the Pakistani official told Reuters, speaking on condition of anonymity.


"The negotiations were delayed because of two issues. One is the delivery timeframe, the other is the price."


The Pakistani official said the United States quoted a price well above market value for the surveillance drones and is stipulating that it may take up to three years for delivery.


The Pentagon declined to comment on the details of the talks but a spokeswoman said both sides were working hard to provide "the capability they need in order to be successful in this counterinsurgency effort."


The aircraft would be delivered as quickly as possible, once a final decision is made, she said.


The disagreement comes at a delicate moment in U.S. relations with Pakistan. Washington wants Islamabad to do more to drive Taliban militants from sanctuaries used as launchpads for attacks on U.S.-led forces in neighboring Afghanistan.


The White House last year accused Pakistan of being unwilling to aggressively pursue Afghan Taliban militants. U.S. officials said elements of Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence Agency (ISI) were maintaining contact or even supporting the Taliban and its allies.


The CIA withdrew its top officer from Pakistan after his name was deliberately leaked, allegedly by elements of the ISI, U.S. officials said in December.


The Pakistani official did not link the snag in negotiations over the drones to any tensions between Islamabad and Washington, however. U.S. officials said both sides were still working to complete the project.


OVERPRICED?


Gates offered Pakistan 12 Shadow drones, manufactured by AAI Corporation, a unit of Textron Systems. They are not the weaponized versions being used by the CIA to track and kill al-Qaida and Taliban insurgents in Pakistan but are used strictly for surveillance and intelligence gathering.


The Pakistani official questioned why the drones could not be supplied more quickly, given that the aim was to bolster Pakistan's ability to battle insurgents.


"We need it immediately because we're in the middle of this war on terrorism," the official said.


Pakistani officials make no secret about their desire to have attack drones as well as the unarmed models.


"We require primarily attack capability, not just surveillance. They should enhance our capability. Why are they providing us a capability which we already have?" a senior Pakistani security official told Reuters. The official requested anonymity because of the sensitivity of the issue.


The second official would not comment on the status of the talks but acknowledged Pakistani concerns that the U.S. drones on offer were expensive.


A U.S. military official had estimated last March that Pakistan could get its surveillance drones within a year. Given the current impasse in negotiations, that now looks very unlikely.


"At present we are in the early stages of defining the Pakistan-specific requirements," said Lieutenant Colonel Michael Shavers, a spokesman at the U.S. military's Office of the Defense Representative-Pakistan.


Lieutenant Colonel Elizabeth Robbins, a Pentagon spokeswoman, said there was "no set timeline from the start of discussions to a final decision."
©(c) Reuters
 
Pakistan can make its own survelliance drones or at best import the ANKA from turkey which is the best in class, endurance and fuel efficiency!
 
Maybe we should take them from Turkey, not only they would be better for us, but even a muslim state would gain, what was to be gained by US. :tup:
 
Well......if Pakistan becomes more sensible in its approach and uses public resentment and political instability and the US action of civilian casualties and stops drone attacks altogether.......the US will need to operate them somehow, this is how politics will work on the advice of its Military and Intelligence agency......

US POV - Keep these drone attacks going as well as feedback from the ISI with upto date intelligence to contineu hitting the targets on the ground....any move by Pakistan Military or Government will be met with iitial hostility and threats of defaming Pakistan again over the media, on the economical front of stopping aid and to expand the attacks. A three prong attack to prevent such a move by Pakistan........

Pakistan POV - Use the political crisis, humanitarian crisis, economical crisis and every other crisis to public resentment of such attacks and the future of Pakistan being in terrible danger and for this reason a stop to these drone attacks..........The US will clearly be unhappy and make its move but always keeping it to a level of return as Pakistan too can further stop its land routes and withdraw intelligence support from the ISI......eventually the US will offer, or Pakistan can suggest the PA using these drones and as such the US will eventually agree as they will need these drone strikes as nmuch as possible as it is the only access they have into Pakistan, but with clauses, most likely of having CIA operatives in the control centres where these drones are monitored from to collaborate further with launching attacks.........

Pakistan needs to play its cards right and get the media on board and blast stroies about the pressure on PA and PG for use in any negotiation process
 
DSC00135_RQ-7b.JPG

Just look at this $hit RQ-7b Robert Gates offered to us, over priced and delivery time 3 years for 12 units such a incompetent moron Sec Def.:hang2:

These 12 toys will cost around $150millions, Turkish ANKA project completed in 100million$.
We better invest this money in ANKA-B and CH3 both are unmanned combat aerial vehicles there is absolutely no need for another operation in Waziristan when we get them we will target militants without taking risks of precious lives.


Turkish ANKA
TAI_Anka_A_2010_v2.jpg


CH3
2ikrwj9.jpg
 
Do we really need this trash. I mean why cant the army also use the Falco system the airforce has? Moreover if drones are a must, then the turkish system should be our preference combined with the Chinese CH-3.
 
Pakistan can make its own survelliance drones or at best import the ANKA from turkey which is the best in class, endurance and fuel efficiency!
How can you say it is the best around? The surveillance drone has just been inducted and has to yet seen action. On topic, I feel that importing Turkish weapons would enable you to be a bit more autonomous of American control.

But then again, it depends on them.
 
Pakistan was offered the Shadow drone. According to Aviation experts Pakistan has the ability to create more advanced UAVs that the Shadow and for less. This is a very bad idea, if there is anything that the Shadow has the Pakistan UAV manufaturers cannot make than Pakistan should just buy the hardware to upgrade PAkistani UAVs. This is a waste
 
why the hell we buy this scrap when we can mande better then this junk . or we smoke something ?


look here
DSC00135_RQ-7b.JPG


look made in pakistan
mediumrangeuavflamingo3kf8.jpg


Tactical&


IMGP08361.JPG


barrett-albums-random-picture1968-border-eagle.jpg
 
Well......if Pakistan becomes more sensible in its approach and uses public resentment and political instability and the US action of civilian casualties and stops drone attacks altogether.......the US will need to operate them somehow, this is how politics will work on the advice of its Military and Intelligence agency......

US POV - Keep these drone attacks going as well as feedback from the ISI with upto date intelligence to contineu hitting the targets on the ground....any move by Pakistan Military or Government will be met with iitial hostility and threats of defaming Pakistan again over the media, on the economical front of stopping aid and to expand the attacks. A three prong attack to prevent such a move by Pakistan........

Pakistan POV - Use the political crisis, humanitarian crisis, economical crisis and every other crisis to public resentment of such attacks and the future of Pakistan being in terrible danger and for this reason a stop to these drone attacks..........The US will clearly be unhappy and make its move but always keeping it to a level of return as Pakistan too can further stop its land routes and withdraw intelligence support from the ISI......eventually the US will offer, or Pakistan can suggest the PA using these drones and as such the US will eventually agree as they will need these drone strikes as nmuch as possible as it is the only access they have into Pakistan, but with clauses, most likely of having CIA operatives in the control centres where these drones are monitored from to collaborate further with launching attacks.........

Pakistan needs to play its cards right and get the media on board and blast stroies about the pressure on PA and PG for use in any negotiation process
Problem with your assertions is that you are simply generalizing about US responses to options presented by us.

The Americans are well aware of ground realities in Pakistan. And yet they are giving aid slowly. They know that Pakistan is economically very weak and this is their trump card. America knows that we need more funds to do more but it is playing a game with us or is unhappy with some of our policies or reactions.

The top brass of Pakistan is trying to protect its interests despite all odds, which is a commendable accomplishment.
 
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What happened to Burraq UCAV? WE should be asking for x-47 or fund the Boeing Phantom Ray so we can own part of the projects and import some.

They're cheaper than F-16s and have much more potential
 
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Do we really need this trash. I mean why cant the army also use the Falco system the airforce has? Moreover if drones are a must, then the turkish system should be our preference combined with the Chinese CH-3.

The Falco is no match for the Reapors or Predator Drones. Even Turkey bought these drones from USA.

But I am pre-plexed why Pakistan needs drones.

USA uses drones to operate in Pakistani territory because it can't send in ground troops. But FATA is Pakistani territory. Why can't they use the drones they have for surveillance and then use F-16 and Gunships to take them out.

And besides half of India's Generals will see their hair turn white once they hear the news that USA has given Pakistan UAV Drones.
 
The Falco is no match for the Reapors or Predator Drones. Even Turkey bought these drones from USA.

But I am pre-plexed why Pakistan needs drones.

USA uses drones to operate in Pakistani territory because it can't send in ground troops. But FATA is Pakistani territory. Why can't they use the drones they have for surveillance and then use F-16 and Gunships to take them out.

And besides half of India's Generals will see their hair turn white once they hear the news that USA has given Pakistan UAV Drones.

Neither Predator nor reaper is on an offer to Pakistan. I am talking about the shadow drone. Shadow does not offer anything which we already dont have and better. As for the armed version, Pakistan is already working on Burraq plus the CH-3. Also i believe there is a turkish program going on also for am armed version of their drone. We need to join in these collaborations and stop pursing paths which lead us nowhere.
 

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