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Typhoon vs Rafale

T/W ratio and dry thrust- Tyfoon.
Weight carrying - Rafale.
EW and Electronics- Rafale.
RCS- Both have very low RCS but Tyfoon wins.

Over all winner- It depends on what do you expect from the planes. Both are excellent planes and comparable to anything in the world. They just loose out to Sukhois in close combat because 3D TVC and ofcourse in range.

Both are just Behind F22, F35 and PAKFA.

Gripen may win in the area of sensor fusion and cost effectiveness.
 
Yes that's why they have thoroughly evaluated the 3 aircrafts in air2air, air2ground and recce and they concluded that the Rafale was better in every mission.

And they made their decision based on real experimental data not just paper specifications. The Swiss Army has had in its hands the 3 aircrafts and has done numerous sorties with them.

The funny part is that despite a solid technical analysis they went for the gripen because it was the cheapest one lol.

As a new Swiss evaluation is on its way we may have updated data in the coming years. We will see if things have changed.
no you did not get my point, the swiss tested the 3 aircraft to their needs. and the swiss being a non actor means they don't need to fork out a huge amount on the raffle or the typhoon. air policing being an example. the size of the country is tiny as compared too saudi arabia which uses them for long range strikes in yemen and patrols. in air to ground i personally know the raffle is better but in air superiority the typhoon is far better.

when you have partners who don't wanna fork out a lot of money then theres problems. the successive 3b variants should enhance is capability
 
the size of the country is tiny as compared too saudi arabia which uses them for long range strikes in yemen and patrols. in air to ground i personally know the raffle is better but in air superiority the typhoon is far better.

Air superiority is fighters vs fighters in WVR or BVR. For both fight configuration we're talking of a range between a few km to a few hundreds of km. For this kind of stuff Switzerland is way large enough and the way the fighter deal with those combats won't be different in bigger countries such as India, France or Saudi Arabia.

It sounds like you don't make any difference between "air policing" and "air superiority".

in air to ground i personally know the raffle is better but in air superiority the typhoon is far better.

No you just making a statement based on a sightly better T/W ratio for the Typhoon ignoring all other aspects such as thrust/drag ratio, situation awareness, RCS, radar capabilities, weapon system (which should be in the first place) etc ...

If that was so easy why do you think armies from around the world are spendings months (if not years) and millions of euros to do detailed evaluations ?

When the Typhoon gets its new Captor-E AESA radar things may change but till then you have to be a fool or a British to think the "typhoon is far better".
 
Yes that's why they have thoroughly evaluated the 3 aircrafts in air2air, air2ground and recce and they concluded that the Rafale was better in every mission.

And they made their decision based on real experimental data not just paper specifications. The Swiss Army has had in its hands the 3 aircrafts and has done numerous sorties with them.

The funny part is that despite a solid technical analysis they went for the gripen because it was the cheapest one lol.

As a new Swiss evaluation is on its way we may have updated data in the coming years. We will see if things have changed.

They evaluated Gripen C, and selected Gripen E.
Capabilities have increased a lot.
 
They evaluated Gripen C, and selected Gripen E.
Capabilities have increased a lot.

Well that's a good thing because Gripen C capabilities were very low so I'm happy gripen's last flavour has seen it standards increased.
 
no big difference, both will be killed by 5th generation fighter. the network feature of Gripen is interesting,the 5th G should adopt this function.
 
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no big difference, both will be killed by 5th generation fighter. the network feature of Gripen is interesting,the 5th G should adopt this function.

I think the countermeasure to fifth generation is a mesh of network connected sensors which
will ensure that the position of each enemy aircraft is well known as soon as it enters the defended territory.

The sensor will be either ground based or carried by stealth drones.
A few Air Forces will have the capability of creating meshes over enemy territory using drones,

Gripen aircrafts can launch missiles on target info from the mesh way before they are detected by the fifth generation fighters.
Radar lock will be achieved late in the missiles flight making evasion tough.

https://fmv.se/Global/Dokument/Nyhe...osium 2016/4_sensor-symposium-mbergstrand.pdf
 
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View attachment 350901 View attachment 350902 View attachment 350903 View attachment 350904 What better way to kick off Fighter Jet Fight Club than to examine two frustratingly similar aircraft? Both are twin-engined "Eurocanards" of nearly identical size, power, and performance. They even share a common origin, but France decided to leave the Eurofighter party early and make its own aircraft. Was it worth it?

Let's find out.

Air-to-Ground:
Interdiction: Both aircraft carry incredibly advance electronic warfare (EW) suites equipped with jammers, decoys, and the like. Advantage: Tie

Deep Strike: Both aircraft have similar combat radius'. They are also both capable of delivering ALCMs like the Storm Shadow, AASM, or Taurus KEPD 350. Advantage: Tie

Payload: The Rafale can carry 21,000lbs worth of ordinance on 14 hard points. The Typhoon can only carry 16,500lbs on 9 hard points (it has 4 more dedicated strictly to BVR A2A missiles). The Rafale can even carry nukes. Advantage: Rafale, clear winner.

Close Air Support: Oddly enough, the Typhoon will have a much better selection of low collateral damage weapons like the Brimstone and SDB (small diameter bomb). The Rafale may be equipped with Brimstone missiles or similar in the future, but nothing is solid yet. The Rafale ultimately gets the edge here, however, as it close-coupled canard design makes it better a better flyer in the "low-and-slow" regime. Advantage: Rafale, but barely.

Winner: Rafale. The Typhoon is becoming a better air-to-ground fighter with every update, but the Rafale was built to be a ground-pounder from day one. Its only real weakness in the A2G role is the lack of low collateral damage weapons like the Brimstone. This could easily be rectified.

Air-to-Air:
First look, first kill: Both aircraft have roughly the same IR and radar signature. Both are equipped with AESA radars and IRSTs. The Typhoon has a big advantage, however. Its radar is 1/3rd larger (1,500 T/R modules vs an estimated 1,000) and it is mounted on a repositioner, giving it a wider field of view. Advantage: Typhoon, clear winner.

Beyond Visual Range: Both aircraft are capable of roughly the same speed as well as supercruise. Both are also capable of mounting the ramjet powered MBDA Meteor. Unfortunately for the Rafale, the Typhoon's better radar and two-way data-link (vs one-way for the Rafale) with said Meteor wins the day here. Advantage: Typhoon.

Within Visual Range: Again, both aircraft are quite evenly matched. The Typhoon does have a slightly better power-to-weight ratio, slightly better wing loading, and slightly better climb rates, however. The Rafale is really let down by its lack of HMD (helmet mounted display) however, giving the HMD equipped Typhoon a much better chance at lining up a shot. Advantage: Typhoon, clear winner.

Dogfight: Once things get down and dirty, the Rafale starts to redeem itself. The close-coupled canard design that allows it to take off from carriers gives it an advantage when both fighters have depleted their energy and missiles. The Typhoon is no slouch here, but the Rafale wins it. Advantage: Rafale.

Winner: Typhoon. While the Rafale comes close, the Typhoon is better in almost every way. Better radar, better Meteor missile link, HMD. The only time the Rafale pilot would have an advantage would be in a slow, high angle-of-attack dogfight relying strictly on cannons. A smart Typhoon pilot would likely not get suckered into this scenario however, having the full advantage in BVR and WVR missile targeting.

Versatility/Logistics:
Versatility: While one has to applaud the increasingly capable Typhoon, the Rafale stands out as a true "Jack-of-all-trades". It is equally capable as a bomber as it is an interceptor. It even has a carrier variant. While it may not be the best aircraft at any given mission, it is hard to imagine a mission the Rafale could not do. Advantage: Rafale.

Logistics: Both aircraft are advanced two-engined fighters with similar operating requirements. With over 400 Typhoons being flown by seven different nations, the Typhoon is the predominant non-American fighter of the western world. This has given it more flexibility when it comes to weapon selection. For example; for WVR missiles, the Typhoon has the option of mounting the ASRAAM, Sidewinder, or IRIS-T. For the Rafale, there is the choice between the MICA or the obsolete R550 Magic. While the guy down the street may curse the repair costs for his BMW or Jaguar, he can take solace in the fact that he doesn't have to do the same for a Citroen or Peugeot. Advantage: Typhoon.

Final score:
Air to ground: Typhoon 2 - Rafale 3
Air to air: Typhoon 3 - Rafale 1
Versatility/Logistics: Typhoon 1 - Rafale 1


Final Result: Typhoon 6 - Rafale 5
The Rafale is clearly the better air-to-ground attack aircraft. Conversely, the Typhoon is much better air-to-air.

What really makes the difference for the Typhoon, however, is its continued development and updates. Its increasing A2G capability, combined with the addition of the CAPTOR-E AESA really push it to the front. Then again, if these upgrades are cancelled, the story changes dramatically.

The Rafale would likely win this contest based on how the aircraft are equipped now. This changes somewhat when we look at the current upgrade paths for both aircraft. Unfortunately for the Rafale, its development has seemingly stagnated. While there is talk of HMDs and low-collateral-damage weapons, nothing substantial has been done yet. There are simply too many "ifs" and "maybes" when it comes to the Rafale's future capability. The Typhoon's larger investor base really makes a difference here.

If the Rafale gets a HMD and a wider weapon compatibility (something easily done, BTW), I would upgrade its WVR and logistics scores bringing it to a tie with the Typhoon. It would still come slightly behind the Typhoon in A2A combat however. The scores would be tied, but a better A2A score would be the tie-breaker needed to declare the Typhoon the winner.
Old article that was already discussed here and done.
 
Guys these two planes are very evenly matched with Rafale superior in air to ground and Typhoon in air to air.
No real difference between the two and it comes down to which area the customer thinks is more important.
 
Guys these two planes are very evenly matched with Rafale superior in air to ground and Typhoon in air to air.
No real difference between the two and it comes down to which area the customer thinks is more important.

Rafale leads in Electronics.
 

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