Twist in MMRCA

[jha]

although i doubt the genuineness of the news , i would thoroughly support the deal if given at good price. in that case INDIA can just buy 120 MRCA and have a formidable 4.5+ gen. air force...plus the mirages will also be enough in numbers so no need to increase no. of MRCA ...

so in place of buying more costly MRCA we can use the money to further develop LCA...just 2 cents..

 

[ramu]

Guys.. this is not a cheap knock off like you know what

Its a used plane and that too not in any war.. And each of them is probably newer and better than all the planes in Indian Inventory except the flankers and some fulcrums.. Pride should not be an issue here.. Get 80 of them to plug the gap in Mig 21s and go directly to LCA Mk II or buy them instead of next batch of flankers..

If the price is good, its a waste to let a good deal slide by...

Totally agreed. Under 40M, we should go for it.

 

[desiman]

the contract has already been awarded to Thales.

 

[genetic_nomad]

Not really the same.. And since you live in the US, you know how easy it is to buy a good used car if you do enough due diligence. Admiral Gork is a good example.. and most of the additional F 16 Pakistan is getting a really refurbished oldies.. arent they..

I really wouldnt mind buying 80 of these(fully refurbished) for the price of 30-40 gripens and buy 100 super hornets instead of 126.

I mean, give me 100 super bugs and 80 M2ks-9 over 126 Super bugs any day...

do you really think admiral gork is a good example of buying used stuff (in a good way)? The insane level of cost escalations and the lack of detailed inspections(before signing the deal) is public knowledge.
anyway, I'll stay on topic since I highly doubt we'd actually buy used planes.

 

[duhastmish]

people are so funny loool

its not a used car.


ITS 2009 mirage - its extremyly good with all the suitable equipement and more over it can stand heat since its done for arabs.

it will be great decision to go for mirage 2009. since it will help india maintain their current infra for these fighters.

and for - navy india should go for f-3 or f/a super hornet. with a good number such as 4 squadron.

and dude althoguh out of context but aircraft carrier is stil lan amazing deal - for what india is getting all that new gizmo its redone ship

 

[ramu]

do you really think admiral gork is a good example of buying used stuff (in a good way)? The insane level of cost escalations and the lack of detailed inspections(before signing the deal) is public knowledge.
anyway, I'll stay on topic since I highly doubt we'd actually buy used planes.

GN, no doubt Adm. Gosh was a disaster but it was a disaster as the relation between India and Russia is much more than business. We need Russians and considerations not entirely business led things to the current state. With this news, I doubt India will take anything but what they want and will pay on their own terms. There is no global market for second hand Mir2K and India is a good buyer.

 

[Peshwa]

Karan.1970 mentioned, as a stopgap to the MIG-21, these planes fit as a perfect replacement....
If the cost is reasonable....this may not be a bad proposition....

However has anyone considered the timeline for delivery of these?.....
UAE and Qatar will not just let IAF fly away these birds tomorrow....Since these will be replaced by Rafales, there will definitely be a very slow and gradual process in procuring these....

Now the question is, 5-7 years from now, will these plane still be worth their weight?...do they come with any upgrades?....Will the armament be upgraded?....

 

[jha]

This article is from a magazine which you need to subscribe to read it....so chances of being true a little more..my 2 cents..

 

[jha]

if this deal goes through...i am all for GRIPEN...

 

[Dash]

Karan.1970 mentioned, as a stopgap to the MIG-21, these planes fit as a perfect replacement....
If the cost is reasonable....this may not be a bad proposition....

However has anyone considered the timeline for delivery of these?.....
UAE and Qatar will not just let IAF fly away these birds tomorrow....Since these will be replaced by Rafales, there will definitely be a very slow and gradual process in procuring these....

Now the question is, 5-7 years from now, will this plane still be worth its weight?...does it come with any upgrades?....Will the armament be upgraded?....

However has anyone considered the timeline for delivery of these?.....
UAE and Qatar will not just let IAF fly away these birds tomorrow....Since these will be replaced by Rafales, there will definitely be a very slow and gradual process in procuring these....

Now the question is, 5-7 years from now, will this plane still be worth its weight?...does it come with any upgrades?....Will the armament be upgraded?....

very good point, I mean to say every new plane has a service life of 30-40 years.
Now if we buy these planes then they will be oit of service in 15-20 years or so.
Just like Admiral Gork.

Then if they are oit of service you will need another bunch of aircraft to replace it, So the value for money is not really served here. Coz after you include these jets, by the time you retire them we would have attained certain level in squadron strength and then you would not simply just let it deplete.

I would not suggest to go for these planes just to fill the numbers.

I mean guess, if it were about filling the numbers then MMRCA wouldnt have been here, we could have bought stand off Mirages post kargil war.

Going for this simply doesnt make any sense as aquiring figheter jets have simply crossed the aim of some one to fil.l the gap.

Now its all about technical advancement and business.
And buy saying business I mean the buy back we will have after winner of MMRCA investing 30% in our industry.

IAF is looking at strategic things. not filling gaps.

 

[jha]

These will increase number of a quite capable aircraft in our inventory...and we will not have to increase the no. of MRCA to 200...

 

[KEETARP]

Actually i posted abt this speculation months back in MMRCA thread .

Here is the link - http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/4347-mrca-news-discussions-96.html#post715181

Source of original news -
Google Translate
(Read the first part of article and esp sale of mirage to india )

Des mouvements de Mirage 2000 pour supporter le Rafale (Partie 2). | Aviation militaire
(2nd part of article)

 

[karan.1970]

very good point, I mean to say every new plane has a service life of 30-40 years.
Now if we buy these planes then they will be oit of service in 15-20 years or so.
Just like Admiral Gork.

Then if they are oit of service you will need another bunch of aircraft to replace it, So the value for money is not really served here. Coz after you include these jets, by the time you retire them we would have attained certain level in squadron strength and then you would not simply just let it deplete.

I would not suggest to go for these planes just to fill the numbers.

I mean guess, if it were about filling the numbers then MMRCA wouldnt have been here, we could have bought stand off Mirages post kargil war.

Going for this simply doesnt make any sense as aquiring figheter jets have simply crossed the aim of some one to fil.l the gap.

Now its all about technical advancement and business.
And buy saying business I mean the buy back we will have after winner of MMRCA investing 30% in our industry.

IAF is looking at strategic things. not filling gaps.

No one is talking about this in lieu of MMRCA deal.. Its a simple question of grabbing a deal if the money is right.. Why wouldnt we buy a plane at 50% of cost with 80% of shelf life remaining. Specially when we have the infrastructure for maintaining and supporting that plane already existing in the country... The delivery of half of these planes started in 2003, which makes them about 5-6 years old.. Thats really nothing...

 

[genetic_nomad]

Karan.1970 mentioned, as a stopgap to the MIG-21, these planes fit as a perfect replacement....
If the cost is reasonable....this may not be a bad proposition....

However has anyone considered the timeline for delivery of these?.....
UAE and Qatar will not just let IAF fly away these birds tomorrow....Since these will be replaced by Rafales, there will definitely be a very slow and gradual process in procuring these....

Now the question is, 5-7 years from now, will these plane still be worth their weight?...do they come with any upgrades?....Will the armament be upgraded?....

good points, but the next question arises, what about LCA? Isn't that the actual replacement for the mig-21s? If we have to wait for 5-7 years, why not just invest the same amount in LCA and prop-up our local defense industry.

 

[syntax_error]

I think India should go for these ...
80+ planes ... we have the cash these are quite ok planes
its a known platform so less time and money in ingerating thme
it will stop the no. of squadrons in IAF dropping.
we then can quickly phase out the migs
and we need stop gap aircrafts now... 10-15yrs later when we will have to replace these planes we will be buying (making it ourselves) MCA ,FGFA so till then if we get these planes quick they will be really worth it

Also : if we dont take them u know where the will go ... these are quite potent aircrafts and the time being taken by mrca ... i think its a must for us