Turkish Politics & Internal Affairs

[SouI]

Don’t become “lazy” and “relaxed” in the times of peace and prosperity. Keep your survival instincts alive.

What exactly do you mean by that?

which includes better economics, more social safety net for families,

What do you mean by that?

 

[xenon54 out]

That’s one aspect and definitely should be worked on. However, let’s not kid ourselves.

You think life is Germany or US or Japan or Korea or France is very bad too, bc their fertility rates are way down as well.

It’s a cultural thing too. Which you folks have to fight against and keep your culture family and marriage oriented. Don’t become “lazy” and “relaxed” in the times of peace and prosperity. Keep your survival instincts alive.

Turkey should promote a culture of healthy fertility rates which includes better economics, more social safety net for families, AND values/culture geared towards families and communities rather than individuality and hedonistic “fun” that makes a society socially weak over time (example: West, Korea, Japan etc).

Even a 2.2-2.5 TFR will be enough for Turkeys long term survival and great power status, if not 3 TFR that Erdogan uncle preach

It has to do with the education grade of the society, in a socieity thats educated people tend to have less children if they are not sustainable with the current economic conditions in contrary to underdeveloped countries where people have more children despite the poverty.
The recent generations in Turkey enjoyed education and are aware that having children will be burden under these circumstances, its not about culture, Europeans also had lots of children decades ago but didnt suddenly change their culture, they just got educated which is also happening in Turkey.
Another exsample is Iran, you cant say they adopted European culture but they also have education for broad masses so the fertility rate dropped.

 

[AUz]

It has to do with the education grade of the society, in a socieity thats educated people tend to have less children if they are not sustainable with the current economic conditions in contrary to underdeveloped countries where people have more children despite the poverty.
The recent generations in Turkey enjoyed education and are aware that having children will be burden under these circumstances, its not about culture, Europeans also had lots of children decades ago but didnt suddenly change their culture, they just got educated which is also happening in Turkey.
Another exsample is Iran, you cant say they adopted European culture but they also have education for broad masses so the fertility rate dropped.

Dude, I am a professional statistician working in the field of demographics (although my work mostly focus on religious demographics globally, not general population demographics per say).

You’d think I’d know a thing or two about this topic? There are myriads of factors at play when it comes to demographics of any society...and yes, Education is a major one (even most significant according to many population studies experts).

However, education causes decrease in fertility rate, but having unhealthy fertility rates is not because of education. Israel is one of the most educated and technologically advanced nation. Yet they have healthy fertility rates (which I am arguing for Turkey oF Turkey wants the great power status in the long run). And oh, I know you aren’t familiar with demographics as I am....so let me tell you that Iran has actually reversed their fertility decline. Iranians have a fertility of above 2 kids per woman now (Stanford researchers did evaluations of the most recent available birth and age-cohort data from Iran. I’ve read the report myself on my desk)

If you google, Iranian fertility will still come up as 1.6 etc. But it’s not the case any longer (atleast for now).

Turkey has a window of opportunity for now, as your median age is still in early 30’s. You folks should figure out how to keep a healthy fertility rate instead of making dumb excuses for your failing and increasingly unhealthy demographic future by saying “oh we just got educated and hence it was expected. Blah blah” ....I’m not attacking you or saying you are dumb btw

It’s like Americans treating their obesity health crisis by saying “well you know, we are too rich and have soooo much to consume. So we just eat ALOT and drive automatically driven AI Tesla’s. What can we say? It makes us fat”....No American health body would even imagine justifying the health crisis by alluding to these facts. Yes, it’s a fact American wealth and prosperity makes us more susceptible to obesity but it is NOT a justification for our bad health. Hence so much resources are allocated for research about obesity problem and billions spent to decrease its bad effects.


Turkey should treat their falling birth rates the same way....while you have the opportunity to do so. Otherwise, here’s another surprise for you, Turkey’s median age will surpass that of RUSSIA Within few decades...without outside immigration (I can actually show you the population pyramids of both countries and write calculations with for you to verify yourself). Can you imagine Turkey being older than....Russia?! But it will happen if current trends continue.

I’m sure Turkish demographers explained these things for Erdogan and his govt. There’s a reason uncle Tayyip is SO concerned with Turkey’s falling birth rates. He knows things that average Turk does not.

As I said, Turks should rally around this issue as a National cause.

 

[Bismarck]

The highest birthrate in Germany is in Hamburg (Eppendorf), where the most educated and rich people live. Why in Hamburg- Eppendorf? Schools and Kindergartens on every corner. Children care like nannies everywhere. Every 100m medics. Sufficient and big flats, many playgrounds and sports clubs. And some churches of course.

 

[revojam]

Dude, I am a professional statistician working in the field of demographics (although my work mostly focus on religious demographics globally, not general population demographics per say).

You’d think I’d know a thing or two about this topic? There are myriads of factors at play when it comes to demographics of any society...and yes, Education is a major one (even most significant according to many population studies experts).

However, education causes decrease in fertility rate, but having unhealthy fertility rates is not because of education. Israel is one of the most educated and technologically advanced nation. Yet they have healthy fertility rates (which I am arguing for Turkey oF Turkey wants the great power status in the long run). And oh, I know you aren’t familiar with demographics as I am....so let me tell you that Iran has actually reversed their fertility decline. Iranians have a fertility of above 2 kids per woman now (Stanford researchers did evaluations of the most recent available birth and age-cohort data from Iran. I’ve read the report myself on my desk)

If you google, Iranian fertility will still come up as 1.6 etc. But it’s not the case any longer (atleast for now).

Turkey has a window of opportunity for now, as your median age is still in early 30’s. You folks should figure out how to keep a healthy fertility rate instead of making dumb excuses for your failing and increasingly unhealthy demographic future by saying “oh we just got educated and hence it was expected. Blah blah” ....I’m not attacking you or saying you are dumb btw

It’s like Americans treating their obesity health crisis by saying “well you know, we are too rich and have soooo much to consume. So we just eat ALOT and drive automatically driven AI Tesla’s. What can we say? It makes us fat”....No American health body would even imagine justifying the health crisis by alluding to these facts. Yes, it’s a fact American wealth and prosperity makes us more susceptible to obesity but it is NOT a justification for our bad health. Hence so much resources are allocated for research about obesity problem and billions spent to decrease its bad effects.


Turkey should treat their falling birth rates the same way....while you have the opportunity to do so. Otherwise, here’s another surprise for you, Turkey’s median age will surpass that of RUSSIA Within few decades...without outside immigration (I can actually show you the population pyramids of both countries and write calculations with for you to verify yourself). Can you imagine Turkey being older than....Russia?! But it will happen if current trends continue.

I’m sure Turkish demographers explained these things for Erdogan and his govt. There’s a reason uncle Tayyip is SO concerned with Turkey’s falling birth rates. He knows things that average Turk does not.

As I said, Turks should rally around this issue as a National cause.

Within next 50 years(my estimation) artifical wombs gonna be a thing then all this birth rate problem will gone.There is no need to turn your country another shithole in the name of keeping your population young.Once this technology matures birth levels of citizens wont be matter.

 

[AUz]

Within next 50 years(my estimation) artifical wombs gonna be a thing then all this birth rate problem will gone.There is no need to turn your country another shithole in the name of keeping your population young.Once this technology matures birth levels of citizens wont be matter.

What and how does having healthy fertility rates cause your country to become a shithole? Why be so laughably dumb and talk about things when you have no idea what you are saying?

Just stop.

The highest birthrate in Germany is in Hamburg (Eppendorf), where the most educated and rich people live. Why in Hamburg- Eppendorf? Schools and Kindergartens on every corner. Children care like nannies everywhere. Every 100m medics. Sufficient and big flats, many playgrounds and sports clubs. And some churches of course.

Take notes, Turks and Turkish authorities.

Easily available quality childcare, importance of the institution of marriage, and hopefulness for future are major cultural traits needed to sustain a healthy fertility rate in industrialized, educated, and high-income societies.

Turkish govt has identified the problem. Hopefully they don’t lose their focus on this issue. Otherwise, the aging crisis will be more painful for Turkey than it has been for Germany or even Japan

 

[Deliorman]

Dude, I am a professional statistician working in the field of demographics (although my work mostly focus on religious demographics globally, not general population demographics per say).

You’d think I’d know a thing or two about this topic? There are myriads of factors at play when it comes to demographics of any society...and yes, Education is a major one (even most significant according to many population studies experts).

However, education causes decrease in fertility rate, but having unhealthy fertility rates is not because of education. Israel is one of the most educated and technologically advanced nation. Yet they have healthy fertility rates (which I am arguing for Turkey oF Turkey wants the great power status in the long run). And oh, I know you aren’t familiar with demographics as I am....so let me tell you that Iran has actually reversed their fertility decline. Iranians have a fertility of above 2 kids per woman now (Stanford researchers did evaluations of the most recent available birth and age-cohort data from Iran. I’ve read the report myself on my desk)

If you google, Iranian fertility will still come up as 1.6 etc. But it’s not the case any longer (atleast for now).

Turkey has a window of opportunity for now, as your median age is still in early 30’s. You folks should figure out how to keep a healthy fertility rate instead of making dumb excuses for your failing and increasingly unhealthy demographic future by saying “oh we just got educated and hence it was expected. Blah blah” ....I’m not attacking you or saying you are dumb btw

It’s like Americans treating their obesity health crisis by saying “well you know, we are too rich and have soooo much to consume. So we just eat ALOT and drive automatically driven AI Tesla’s. What can we say? It makes us fat”....No American health body would even imagine justifying the health crisis by alluding to these facts. Yes, it’s a fact American wealth and prosperity makes us more susceptible to obesity but it is NOT a justification for our bad health. Hence so much resources are allocated for research about obesity problem and billions spent to decrease its bad effects.


Turkey should treat their falling birth rates the same way....while you have the opportunity to do so. Otherwise, here’s another surprise for you, Turkey’s median age will surpass that of RUSSIA Within few decades...without outside immigration (I can actually show you the population pyramids of both countries and write calculations with for you to verify yourself). Can you imagine Turkey being older than....Russia?! But it will happen if current trends continue.

I’m sure Turkish demographers explained these things for Erdogan and his govt. There’s a reason uncle Tayyip is SO concerned with Turkey’s falling birth rates. He knows things that average Turk does not.

As I said, Turks should rally around this issue as a National cause.

Things like that cannot be changed with demanding from people to have 3 or 4 kids. At the same time not only doing nothing to help them but with worsening the situation with your policies.

First you destroy the rural areas by destroying the agricultural sector which feeds millions there. You push those people out of their villages.

Then you put them into the big cities where many of them don’t even have proper jobs or homes and the last thing they think about is to make Uncle Erdo happy while trying to survive.

After that as a result of your bad policies prices for anything you need to feed and grow a baby/kid just skyrocket. The same for everything else on the market. The economy is in decline thanks to the credit bubble you made to have some fake economic growth and show hiw many stuff you built.

You provide no normal social services to parents and initiatives for them to make kids. Kindergartens are scarce and schools are overloaded and mostly with bad quality.

With your policies you make hundreds of thousands of young and educated people leave your country every year.

You provide no safety and security to your people. Rule of law doesn’t exist. From everywhere you see only lawlessness and unfairness.

While for millions in the East and Southeast and in “Refugee” camps everything is given for free from the state, the others in the rest of the country are getting their skins peeled off from taxes and bills.

In the end in such an environment I will go on the stage and say: Every woman should have at least 4 children!

Sounds funny right? Well that’s basically Erdogan’s demographic policy but who cares.

 

[SouI]

Otherwise, here’s another surprise for you, Turkey’s median age will surpass that of RUSSIA Within few decades...without outside immigration (I can actually show you the population pyramids of both countries and write calculations with for you to verify yourself). Can you imagine Turkey being older than....Russia?! But it will happen if current trends continue.

That is because russian elderly lives in extreme poverty and barely sees their 65.

In Turkey even old peeps with no social security gets free money from the gov every month, hence they live longer and increase the median age.

Abolish that and our median age would slump down to 25 within 5 years.

But of course our communist government wouldnt do that.

And btw, why didnt you answer my questions? Because it would be too embrassing to do here in our sub if you tried?

 

[Islamic faith&Secularism]

Dude, I am a professional statistician working in the field of demographics (although my work mostly focus on religious demographics globally, not general population demographics per say).

You’d think I’d know a thing or two about this topic? There are myriads of factors at play when it comes to demographics of any society...and yes, Education is a major one (even most significant according to many population studies experts).

However, education causes decrease in fertility rate, but having unhealthy fertility rates is not because of education. Israel is one of the most educated and technologically advanced nation. Yet they have healthy fertility rates (which I am arguing for Turkey oF Turkey wants the great power status in the long run). And oh, I know you aren’t familiar with demographics as I am....so let me tell you that Iran has actually reversed their fertility decline. Iranians have a fertility of above 2 kids per woman now (Stanford researchers did evaluations of the most recent available birth and age-cohort data from Iran. I’ve read the report myself on my desk)

If you google, Iranian fertility will still come up as 1.6 etc. But it’s not the case any longer (atleast for now).

Turkey has a window of opportunity for now, as your median age is still in early 30’s. You folks should figure out how to keep a healthy fertility rate instead of making dumb excuses for your failing and increasingly unhealthy demographic future by saying “oh we just got educated and hence it was expected. Blah blah” ....I’m not attacking you or saying you are dumb btw

It’s like Americans treating their obesity health crisis by saying “well you know, we are too rich and have soooo much to consume. So we just eat ALOT and drive automatically driven AI Tesla’s. What can we say? It makes us fat”....No American health body would even imagine justifying the health crisis by alluding to these facts. Yes, it’s a fact American wealth and prosperity makes us more susceptible to obesity but it is NOT a justification for our bad health. Hence so much resources are allocated for research about obesity problem and billions spent to decrease its bad effects.


Turkey should treat their falling birth rates the same way....while you have the opportunity to do so. Otherwise, here’s another surprise for you, Turkey’s median age will surpass that of RUSSIA Within few decades...without outside immigration (I can actually show you the population pyramids of both countries and write calculations with for you to verify yourself). Can you imagine Turkey being older than....Russia?! But it will happen if current trends continue.

I’m sure Turkish demographers explained these things for Erdogan and his govt. There’s a reason uncle Tayyip is SO concerned with Turkey’s falling birth rates. He knows things that average Turk does not.

As I said, Turks should rally around this issue as a National cause.

Despite i get it legit to some extent; Your example of Mullahistan has gotten the other factors involved before Quantity over Quality ''argument'' of yours sheds a long text of vocabulary into our time to spare?

A small torch... Why no Human habitat on the arctic or desert while among green,blue and brown are full of human habitats and still on the mass move towards it?

 

[Nein]

Within next 50 years(my estimation) artifical wombs gonna be a thing then all this birth rate problem will gone.There is no need to turn your country another shithole in the name of keeping your population young.Once this technology matures birth levels of citizens wont be matter.

That takes the fun away to be honedt.

 

[CAN_TR]

What did we say don't take refugees, let them to Europe or send them to their Arab brothers.

Kim bilir kac tane bunun gibi o.c var Türkiye'de.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1072773951896604672

 

[Islamic faith&Secularism]

Finally... A perfect answer to the PKK supporters in the Parliament...A very late but perfectly balanced ''slap''.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1072857052781912065

 

[mete]

The highest birthrate in Germany is in Hamburg (Eppendorf), where the most educated and rich people live. Why in Hamburg- Eppendorf? Schools and Kindergartens on every corner. Children care like nannies everywhere. Every 100m medics. Sufficient and big flats, many playgrounds and sports clubs. And some churches of course.

Maybe who want to build a family choose that city to live because of conditions. Moving to another city and building a new life requires resources which is accesible by having a good education.

Just a little idea based on information you have given. I do not know anything about social dynamics of that city.

 

[CAN_TR]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1074001909667762179

 

[Bismarck]

Trump told Erdoğan he's working to extradite Gülen, FM Çavuşoğlu says
DAILY SABAH WITH REUTERS
ISTANBUL
Published 4 hours ago

AA Photo
U.S. President Donald Trump told his Turkish counterpart Recep Tayyip Erdoğan that Washington was working on extraditing Fethullah Gülen, the U.S.-based leader of the Gülenist Terror Group (FETÖ), Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu said on Sunday.

"In Argentina, Trump told Erdogan they were working on extraditing Gülen and other people," Çavuşoğlu said at conference in 18th Doha Forum in the Qatari capital Doha, referring to the G20 summit in Argentina from Nov. 30 to Dec. 1.

FETÖ staged the July 15, 2016 coup attempt to overthrow the democratically elected Turkish government, in which 251 people were killed and more than 2,200 people were injured. The terrorist group is also accused of using its members in the police and the judiciary to launch two other coup attempts on Dec. 17 and 25, 2013, under the guise of graft probes, in addition to sham trials launched against its adversaries using illegal or fake evidence and trumped-up charges

The U.S. remains the main hub of FETÖ, where the shadowy group operates hundreds of charter schools and affiliated companies, providing visa and employment opportunities for thousands of its followers. Gülen has lived in a self-imposed exile in a secluded compound in the U.S. state of Pennsylvania since 1999.

Trump said last month he was not considering extraditing the preacher as part of efforts to ease Turkish pressure on Saudi Arabia over the killing of Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi in Istanbul.

Erdoğan said last week Turkey would start new initiatives abroad to target the financing of Gülen supporters.

"I have recently seen a credible probe by the FBI on how the Gülen organisation avoids taxes," Çavuşoğlu said.

"Everyone should consider working with Assad if he wins democratic elections"

Çavuşoğlu also told the conference that everyone including Turkey should consider working with Bashar al Assad if he wins a democratic and credible election in Syria.

The minister said that what Turkey is trying to do is to contribute to Syrians come up with a constitution themselves for the country.

"This process should be under the scope of the United Nations. It should be inclusive. Everyone should be given their rights. It should include everyone inside and outside Syria, it should include those who are located in my country, in other countries, as refugees. There should be transparent and democratic elections. After these elections, Syrians should decide who should run their country," Çavuşoğlu said.

Turkey backed the opposition to Assad in the Syrian civil war that broke out in 2011. Assad, whose family has been in power for nearly five decades, managed to stay in power thanks to massive Iranian and Russian military support, but large parts of Syria remain outside his reach, including regions in the north, under Turkish control, and in the east, ruled by a U.S.-backed coalition mainly consisted of PKK-affiliated People's Protection Forces (YPG) terrorists.

Çavuşoğlu said he believed Trump was considering a policy of leaving Syria.

https://www.dailysabah.com/diplomac...-working-to-extradite-gulen-fm-cavusoglu-says