Turkish - Armenian issues

[Worf]

And please feel free to provide a source for your second claim.
So please get out of your imagination world.

His source is wiki.... what do you expect lol?

Because i know there are Armenians in Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, Jordan, and Europe, even in U.S.

There Turks practically all over Europe, U.S. even south Japan? Does that mean we suffered from something? NO.

First of all 'Lion' of the desert sort the refuges coming in to my country then talk to me... Even Assads best mate fled ha; what a embarrassment for you're 'Lion' country BOI!

 

[Syrian Lion]

His source is wiki.... what do you expect lol?



There Turks practically all over Europe, U.S. even south Japan? Does that mean we suffered from something? NO.

First of all 'Lion' of the desert sort the refuges coming in to my country then talk to me... Even Assads best mate fled ha; what a embarrassment for you're 'Lion' country BOI!

Im not talking about immigrants, im talking about Armenian-Syrians, they live there. you want to get rid of those refugees tell your country to stop supporting terrorism.and this topic is about Armenia- Turkey, there is thread for Syria- Turkey.

Wait who promised the Kurdish people a free land, if they kill all the Armenians, and then the Kurd got nothing?hmmmmmm

 

[Kajutyun]

'I would advice you to read the Wikipedia entry'- I see you have learn you're facts from Wikipedia; the most reliable source on the world.

If we 'practically did' kill all Armenians, why are you still talking to me? I am no Historian but i am a researcher; And i am not stupid enough to get my information for Wikipedia. If you don't believe me, i can give you the archive codes of the documents from archives from Turkey and England. The reason i could not get in to the Armenian archives is because they are censoring their documents; I wonder why??



What makes you so 'sure'?



What is the meaning of *the term 'Troll-ism'?

Nowhere have I said that I got my facts from Wikipedia. However, Wikipedia is a compilation of a variety of sources, and is good for someone unfamiliar with the topic. Would work wonders for you.

I don't give a dam about your documents from Turkey. They have all been altered to fit with Article 301 so as to not insult Turkishness.

History and truth makes Syrian Lion sure, as it should.

How does that fit any kind logic when Azerbaijan's military budget are double the amount of whole Armenian state budget? With regards to military parity, Azerbaijan has both quality and quantity advantage in every field, and this is only going to increase. And please feel free to provide a source for your second claim.

Over the last 2 years your ally Russia has sold Azerbaijan 3 battalions of S-300PMU2, 36 Mi-35M, 60 Mi-17 and the two countries prepares to sign a contract for T-90 and BMP-3.

So please get out of your imagination world.

What was the point of this post? You have simply regurgitated some news, which I am already perfectly aware of.

Armenia has all of that ordnance as well genius, they just don't talk about it like Sultan Aliyev does.

Second source: Russia sells armaments to Azerbaijan for purely commercial purposes. It knows that it can destroy Azerbaijan no matter what it has. Why would it invade Azerbaijan. 1. Because of the pipelines and 2. because an Azeri invasion of NK is clearly against Russia's desire to preserve the status quo. Iran has commercial interests in NK (especially important now with increasing sanctions) and hates Azerbaijan anyway.

 

[Deno]

Because i know there are Armenians in Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, Jordan, and Europe, even in U.S.

If it was a genocide there wouldn't much Armenians in this world.... At its highest, Armenians in Ottoman controlled places were counted as 1.3-1.5 million and thinking that there are hundreds of thausands Armenians living in Levant alone and millions from Turkish origins in the world the number is too ridiculus to even debate.

And for genocide part, There isn't even a single document that states that Ottoman goverment/state planed any mass murder, or even kill one civilian Armenian. There was only one document as such and it was called Aram Andonian telegrams and they were proven fake... There is not a single legal document that states that Ottoman State wared against Armenian civilians...

 

[Syrian Lion]

If it was a genocide there wouldn't much Armenians in this world.... At its highest, Armenians in Ottoman controlled places were counted as 1.3-1.5 million and thinking that there are hundreds of thausands Armenians living in Levant alone and millions from Turkish origins in the world the number is too ridiculus to even debate.

And for genocide part, There isn't even a single document that states that Ottoman goverment/state planed any mass murder, or even kill one civilian Armenian. There was only one document as such and it was called Aram Andonian telegrams and they were proven fake... There is not a single legal document that states that Ottoman State wared against Armenian civilians...

They were displaced for no reason then? I heard stories from Armenians how they saw their family head chopped off, they have experienced it.

 

[Kajutyun]

Relations with Armenia should stay as it is and I would encourage more voilent tactics but thanks to our foreing policy we already have too many areas to focus on so no Armenian front for us in near times.

And for Azerbaijan, Azerbaijan can easily take back its lost territories but ''thanks'' Russian Caucasian policy it simply can't and if Russian support for Armenia continues this conflict will stay as it is. Russia already profits hell a lot from this conflict so I don't think they would be willing to do anything about it other than playing status quo for Armenian side.

Iran isn't that important when it comes to Caucasian politics... Russia is the top dog and everybody know that so anything Iran can do for its own good would be support Russia and Armenia but this already takes its toll on Turkish-Persian relations in Iran's domestic life so they are at bad stuation with either choice.

Turkey should stay put for now, like I said, we already have too many probems to deal with and Turkey's decision would be irrevelant unless we got US to support us on this subject and US strategicly supports Azerbaijan while at the same time supports Armenia on domestic policy because of ther religious conncetion and strenght of Armenian diaspora.

You have won the award for the most ignorant poster on this thread

Nobody cares about your encouragement of violent tactics. As long as Russia and Armenia have military pact, Turkey will keep its mouth shut and stay away.

Azerbaijan may have money, but there armed forces are terrible. And I mean really, really bad. Armenia whooped their @ss in '94, we'll do it again.

"Iran is not important".....I'm speechless.

"US strategically supports Azerbaijan"....more stupidity
Are you aware that Azerbaijan was recently removed from the list of countries that US is able to sell weapons to? Oh yeah, they are definitely best friends.

And for genocide part, There isn't even a single document that states that Ottoman goverment/state planed any mass murder, or even kill one civilian Armenian. There was only one document as such and it was called Aram Andonian telegrams and they were proven fake... There is not a single legal document that states that Ottoman State wared against Armenian civilians...

ROFL....there is a musuem full of letters personally signed by Enver and Talaat Pasha specifically calling for systematic murder.

 

[Zulkarneyn]

You have won the award for the most ignorant poster on this thread

Nobody cares about your encouragement of violent tactics. As long as Russia and Armenia have military pact, Turkey will keep its mouth shut and stay away.

Azerbaijan may have money, but there armed forces are terrible. And I mean really, really bad. Armenia whooped their @ss in '94, we'll do it again.

"Iran is not important".....I'm speechless.

"US strategically supports Azerbaijan"....more stupidity
Are you aware that Azerbaijan was recently removed from the list of countries that US is able to sell weapons to? Oh yeah, they are definitely best friends.



ROFL....there is a musuem full of letters personally signed by Enver and Talaat Pasha specifically calling for systematic murder.

Prove the bold part.

 

[Deno]

In Caucasia Russia is the top dog and anything else is a nuicanse at its best...

Iran has something to lose on both sides, They need Russian support and they need to make their Turkish population happy... They choose the first choice and still suffer because of it.

If you don't know that US strategicly supports Azerbaijan then We have nothing to discuss on this subject... And Azerbaijan already gets its advanced weapons from Israel, one of the best in this world and a US proxy...

ROFL....there is a musuem full of letters personally signed by Enver and Talaat Pasha specifically calling for systematic murder.

Like I told you... Those telegrams are called Aram Andonian telegrams and they are proven fakes... Look it up...

 

[Syrian Lion]

Human Right claim
Encyclopedia of Human Rights - David P. Forsythe - Google Books


Article from 1915
http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=F70A1FFC395C13738DDDAA0A94DA405B858DF1D3

 

[Kajutyun]

Prove the bold part.

I have personally seen the letters in the Genocide Museum in Armenia, can't find them online though:

Here some excerpts though:

"The Ottoman Empire should be cleaned up of the Armenians and the Lebanese. We have destroyed the former by the sword, we shall destroy the latter through starvation." -Enver

"Turkey is taking advantage of the war in order to thoroughly liquidate (grundlich aufzaumen) its internal foes, i.e., the indigenous Christians, without being thereby disturbed by foreign invervention"- Talaat

"The question is settled. There are no more Armenians."-Talaat

"I refer to those awful massacres. They are the greatest stain that has ever disgraced our nation and race. They were entirely the work of Talat and Enver. I heard some days before they began that they were intended. I went to Istanbul and insisted on seeing Enver. I asked him if it was true that they intended to recommence the massacres which had been our shame and disgrace under Abdul Hamid. The only reply I could get from him was: 'It is decided. It is the program.'' - Prince Abdul Mecid

"Surely a few Armenians aided and abetted our enemy, and a few Armenian Deputies committed crimes against the Turkish nation... it is incumbent upon a government to pursue the guilty ones. Unfortunately, our wartime leaders, imbued with a spirit of brigandage, carried out the law of deportation in a manner that could surpass the proclivities of the most bloodthirsty bandits. They decided to exterminate the Armenians, and they did exterminate them." - Mustafa Arif, Minister of the Interior (1918(

 

[Worf]

Nowhere have I said that I got my facts from Wikipedia. However, Wikipedia is a compilation of a variety of sources, and is good for someone unfamiliar with the topic. Would work wonders for you.

I don't give a dam about your documents from Turkey. They have all been altered to fit with Article 301 so as to not insult Turkishness.

History and truth makes Syrian Lion sure, as it should.

'I would advice you to read the Wikipedia entry'; You are advising me to go Wikipedia entry; you obviously tried to learn something an read the 'Wikipedia entry'. Isn't this a reference to Wikipedia?! YES IT IS!

Ha i said England archives as well and why are you not talking about Armenia censoring their documents?!; I see you reply to the parts where you brain capacity allows you to or you're ignorance just blinds you're eyes.

I specifically got details of some documents from the work of Justin McCarthy and many more. You should research via going around the world, not through Wikipedia and the internet. You are just talking. You have given two references of source one being Wikipedia; But i even offered to give you archive codes of numerous documents from a variety of countries, so you can go and look, if you can.

The so called truths of the 'Syrian Lion' and his leader is very similar you'res; so i am not surprised..

I have personally seen the letters in the Genocide Museum in Armenia, can't find them online though:

I did not even read this for a start because the first sentence gives away the reliability of the source. I can just write a letter, and claim it to be real. And it is unbelievably bias!

 

[Kajutyun]

'I would advice you to read the Wikipedia entry'; You are advising me to go Wikipedia entry; you obviously tried to learn something an read the 'Wikipedia entry'. Isn't this a reference to Wikipedia?! YES IT IS!

Ha i said England archives as well and why are you not talking about Armenia censoring their documents?!; I see you reply to the parts where you brain capacity allows you to or you're ignorance just blinds you're eyes.

I specifically got details of some documents from the work of Justin McCarthy and many more. You should research via going around the world, not through Wikipedia and the internet. You are just talking. You have given two references of source one being Wikipedia; But i even offered to give you archive codes of numerous documents from a variety of countries, so you can go and look, if you can.

The so called truths of the 'Syrian Lion' and his leader is very similar you'res; so i am not surprised..

You are assuming things. Yes, Wikipedia (at least for NK) is accurate.

Armenia has no need to censor any documents. Genocide was an Ottoman State policy.

What do you have to say about all the quotes above?

 

[Deno]

I have personally seen the letters in the Genocide Museum in Armenia, can't find them online though:

Here some excerpts though:

"The Ottoman Empire should be cleaned up of the Armenians and the Lebanese. We have destroyed the former by the sword, we shall destroy the latter through starvation." -Enver

"Turkey is taking advantage of the war in order to thoroughly liquidate (grundlich aufzaumen) its internal foes, i.e., the indigenous Christians, without being thereby disturbed by foreign invervention"- Talaat

"The question is settled. There are no more Armenians."-Talaat

"I refer to those awful massacres. They are the greatest stain that has ever disgraced our nation and race. They were entirely the work of Talat and Enver. I heard some days before they began that they were intended. I went to Istanbul and insisted on seeing Enver. I asked him if it was true that they intended to recommence the massacres which had been our shame and disgrace under Abdul Hamid. The only reply I could get from him was: 'It is decided. It is the program.'' - Prince Abdul Mecid

"Surely a few Armenians aided and abetted our enemy, and a few Armenian Deputies committed crimes against the Turkish nation... it is incumbent upon a government to pursue the guilty ones. Unfortunately, our wartime leaders, imbued with a spirit of brigandage, carried out the law of deportation in a manner that could surpass the proclivities of the most bloodthirsty bandits. They decided to exterminate the Armenians, and they did exterminate them." - Mustafa Arif, Minister of the Interior (1918(

I told you that these telegrams are proven fake.... Please, am I asking too much by wishing an knowledgeable debater....

 

[Kajutyun]

I did not even read this for a start because the first sentence gives away the reliability of the source. I can just write a letter, and claim it to be real. And it is unbelievably bias!

I figured that you might say that. Which might be true for one or two documents. But are you really prepared to question a musuem full of evidence, as well as the statements of Prince Abdul Micid and the Interior Minister

Can we at least agree that they actually said those things?

@Deno: Only the first 3 quotes are from the telegrams.

 

[Worf]

You are assuming things. Yes, Wikipedia (at least for NK) is accurate.

Armenia has no need to censor any documents. Genocide was an Ottoman State policy.

What do you have to say about all the quotes above?

If 'Genocide was an Ottoman State policy', you would not have been whining here right now.
I am not assuming things, because you know about the Wikipedia entry so you are advising me to look at it. Wiki boy, this is called common sense; something you need.

The quotes?, Ha. I replied to that already..