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Turkey wants to lead Muslim world

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Dear PracticalGuy;
Thank you for you kindness. i sometimes may over react but as i said above i m tired of prejudgements. What happened to this muslim world is happened because of our misunderstanding the orders of islam and because of our laziness. i admit this. and i m also aware of our problems. what we need is people who can offer solution after criticising the sickness of the muslim world. we need people who can give us shoulder while we try to carry the burden of this poor world. and orientalists from orient makes me sick... i guess i can express how i feel, what i think about this subject.

i apologize from people i hurt.
Thanks for understanding.
Regards

ps: i think pakistan and indian culture is the subject of another thread. even if they seem similar, they are very different in reality. because we are muslims and we have a different understanding of life.

Brother..you dont need to apologize to anyone...and reading your post makes my earlier post even more clear about the perception of Turkey and it's greatness in the Islamic world. Every race/religion/region of the world has it's own share of problems in today's world which are to be addressed by none other than the aggrieved party itself while the rest of the world is busy in pointing fingers towards each other ...and the first and important step to solve the problem is to identify the problem itself....hopefully common sense prevails over the entire world and peace prevails... and as i said previously.. I( Non-Islamic world) would prefer Turkey at anytime to lead the Islamic world rather than KSA. All the best.

And I always believe that culture is different from religion.. even though Pakistan is Muslim and India a secular country..still you will find sub-continent Muslims share similar style of life with the subcontinent's non Muslims when compared to an Arab Muslim.. I think same goes true with the Turks..
 
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Mr. PracticalGuy!
KSA, Yemen, the tribal areas of Pakistan, Afghanistan, Somalia and a few other places are the most repressive and repressed people in the world but they are certainly a tiny minority by every count in the over-all picture of the Muslim world. There are plenty of countries with Islamic majority which allow a fair amount of openness and modernity.
The 'Arab Street' has spoken loudly and in favor of Turkey. The Arab League's 20+ foreign ministers recently hailed--yes, officially!-- Erdogan as a hero in a recent conference in Istanbul and yet you are deluding yourself with the notions of 'who is more Muslim and who will judge other as less Muslim' kind of thinking. This is not too dissimilar from the simplistic notions circling around that 'Sunni' states would like to see a 'Shia' Iran being bombed.

Look am not trying to point fingers ..what am trying to say is there is a difference between Arab world and the Turkey and every one knows what are those differences.. I only sincerely hope that Turkey in it's quest of becoming a leader of the Muslim world wouldnt fall in the Arab world's line and change it's way of thinking.. living in Pakistan ..you should clearly know the difference of Pakistan from today's to 70's-80's Pakistan... and I dont have to tell you the reasons for that change.
 
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Turkey could be a leader of muslim world. Turkey had shown aspiration of being leader of muslim world. It has cordial relation with the rest of muslim world and many countries would except turkies leadership.

But could also be an ally of U.S.A at the expense of israel. The us has all the reason to prefer turkey over israel
because of growing stature of turkey in the muslim world it could help us to improve its relation with muslim world.
secondly turkey is a democratic country and a stable state.
It could be a gateway for the western world to middle east.
 
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Letter to the People of Turkey

By Dr. Arash Irandoost


Ever since you decided to trade in the Secularism of Ataturk for the Islamism of Erdogan, you also seem to have decided to forego your willingness to coexist with non-Muslims on a peaceful basis. These days all we ever seem to get from you, is video clips of your leader, Prime Minister Erdogan, behaving erradically and barking like a dog that its owner carelessly let off the leash. And if you don't know that Erdogan's master lives in Riyadh, then you don't know very much of what goes on in your own country.

But your affairs are your own. If you want to let a fanatic in a cheap suit destroy Turkish nationalism in the name of Islam, that's your business. But when he gets into business with terrorist organizations that attack, rape and murder our mothers and sisters (Iranian pro democracy women demonstrators), then it becomes our business. And when a country that persecutes its Kurdish, Assyrian and Armenian citizens, treat Iranian refugees like 3rd class citizens and hands them over to IRI thugs at every opportunity, and works tirelessly to appease a criminal regime, she must remember that we will not forget her erroneous ways.

You say you want an international investigation into the flotilla raid? Sure. Right after you allow an international investigation into that minor matter of Armenian genocide that you've been ducking for quite a while. As the new "standard bearer" in fighting for human rights, I'm sure you will agree that it's only fair that Turkey should undergo the same scrutiny it demands for other countries.

And then we can move on to the more than 10,000 political prisoners in your jails. A number that at times has topped 100,000. An independent investigation could also begin by looking into the torture and murder of political activists such as Engin Ceber. They could meet with representatives of TAYAD, the organization representing the families of prisoners. And they would no doubt be fascinated by the more than 1500 children in your prisoners who are there on "terrorism" charges. Like that 12 year old you arrested in 2008 for singing a Kurdish folk song. So by all means wrap yourselves in the banner of "Human Rights" and it will surely turn it into a noose and strangle you with it.

In Israel, Arabs are a legally recognized minority. Arabic is taught in schools and used as a legally recognized language. Meanwhile Kurdish identity is all but banned in Turkey and Iranian heritage and nationalism is under attack by the Islamist invaders. Kurdish names, folk songs and even the Kurdish language itself has been repressed.
Your regime has actually prosecuted and removed officials for simply incorporating a Kurdish phrase into a greeting. You screech self-righteously about the "Palestinian children"-- perhaps we should talk about the hundreds of Kurdish children arrested for throwing stones at protests. Arrested and charged with terrorism. Just more of the thousands of political prisoners of oppressed minorities in your prisons.

And perhaps next time your dog Erdogan gets up to bark up about human rights and gets through lecturing us on the use of force against Islamic terrorists, shall we discuss how many times you used jets to bomb Kurdish rebels who were lightly armed at best. Including in 2008 when you invaded sovereign Iraqi soil in order to continue your genocide of the Kurdish people in cooperation with criminal mullahs of Iran.

You talk about stolen land, when your entire country is stolen land, from Cyprus to Istanbul. Your regime is a racist illegitimate entity based on the oppression of the Kurds, the Armenians, the Assyrians, Iranians, and numerous others.
You went directly from being Imperialists to Fascists to Islamists, a truly dubious achievement for any nation. Your history is filled with slavery, ethnic cleansing, genocide and invasion. And that's just in the last century alone. If you had any sanity or shame, you would dig a hole, crawl into it, and hope that no one mentions words like "Minority Rights" or "Territorial Legitimacy" in your presence, instead of trying to use them as a club against Iranians and Israelis (Two nations whose national history predates yours by thousands of years).

But let us get back to your precious Islamist flotilla, decorated with Turkish flags that used to be more than just red versions of the Saudi flag. That ship you filled up with Muslim Brotherhood members and Islamist radicals bound for Gaza. Over in your wonderful nation of boundless freedom, reporters have been put on trial for even interviewing leaders of terrorist groups.

You sentenced the head of a Kurdish party to six months in prison for calling the head of the PKK, Mr. Ocalan, instead of just Ocalan. He joins the more than 800 Kurdish politicians you imprisoned in the last year alone. And after all that you actually have the nerve to pretend to be "outraged" when Israel intercepts your flotilla full of political terrorists?

You blockaded Armenia for Sixteen Years.

But of course we know how strongly you feel about blockades. Like the time you blockaded Armenia for Sixteen Years. Very well then. If you insist on sending vessels flying the Turkish flag to aid Hamas, perhaps Israel should begin sending tanks flying the Israeli flag to aid the PKK. And when a new democratic Iran is established, we surely will cut the flow of gas and oil to your arid, natural resource starved and useless land.

We're not big fans of the PKK, but since you've decided to friend Hamas and IRI murderers, then what's good for the turkey, just might be good for the gander. Or perhaps for every boat flying the Turkish flag that is sent to Gaza, Israel should donate a million to the Iranian pro democracy movement and PKK. I wonder how along IRI could last with direct financial help form Israel.

And then there's the Republic of Cyprus. They might benefit from significantly upgraded air defenses. While the US insists on equalizing weapons sales to Turkey and Greece, Israel just might have something tastier to offer to one side. And the citizens of the Republic of Cyprus might actually be able to sleep peacefully in their beds, instead of being intimidated by savages showing off their F-16's over their heads.

Oh I know, what you're going to say. This means war. But you might want to reconsider. And what exactly was the last war you won single-handedly? And no, bombing starving Kurdish rebels from the air, or occupying Cyprus doesn't count. And how long could you fight that war, before a domestic Kurdish insurgency overthrows your little empire.

If that doesn't happen, you might want to think about the big Russian bear at your back. The bear has been eyeing you for a long time now. And with your military engaged in a disastrous war for the Great Caliphate, your borders would be temptingly open. And who exactly would bail you out then?

Oh I know you've made many great news friends, such as Ahmadinejad and that fat king in the Arabian Desert, who tells your Erdogan when to jump and how high., but if you think mullahs care about their Sunni brethren, you've got another surprise coming. Meanwhile old Abdullah in the desert can't even protect himself without the US Marines.
And if you think Obama would send them in to save your *****, you've got another thing coming. I'm sure if there were Russian tanks headed to Ankara, he'd make a vocal statement about it. And Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov would pretend not to laugh while hanging up the phone.

There is of course the European Union. Last time Russia pulled that trick, it was Britain that bailed you out in the Crimean War. But these days Her M(N)ajesty's Empire isn't quite in the same shape it used to be. Sure Cameron, Clegg and Harman will lick Erdogan's feet. But none of them want to be the next Tony Blair either.

Germany doesn't like you very much anymore. Perhaps that time when it got enmeshed in WW1 to protect your Ottoman Empire may have put them off. Or your internal campaign of subversion exploiting Germany's horde of Turkish laborers. What are you left with then? France, Italy or perhaps Austria will forget that whole pesky Gates of Vienna thing and this time ride to your rescue.

No, when Russian commandos are ripping off your wife's head scarf-- there will be no one left to save you. Not your newfound allies, or Erdogan who will take the first plane to Riyadh, with as much of the 18 billion in gold and cash he stole from Iran as his sweaty hands can shove into the pockets of his cheap suit. And just think of it, as the Hagia Sophia church that you turned into a mosque, will become a church again.

Istanbul will once again be Constantinople, which means a certain catchy 20's song will require a rewrite. Of course it may not happen exactly that way. But something close to it might happen. Erdogan's plan to change Turkey into a Muslim country will not succeed if alert pro democracy and secular Turks who have seen the human rights violation under Islam in Iran, have something to say in the next elections.

So when that day of reckoning comes, you will find that you have made enemies of former allies such as pro democracy Iranians, Israel and the US-- and that the new allies Erdogan has found for you in Islamic Republic and Syria would prefer a Russian controlled Turkey, that has no chance of ever reverting to a Kemalist government. And Erdogan's godfather in Saudi Arabia commands oil money, not troops. And while he might be willing to sink Turkey for the sake of Islam, perhaps there are Turks who value their nation, more than Islamism. If not, you can look forward to Erdogan "reforming" your country, until it has the military might of Pakistan, the literacy level of Saudi Arabia and the poverty rate of Egypt and rapist reputation of Iran’s mullahs. It is of course your choice.

People have the right to choose their destiny, for good or ill. And if you find that this letter is filled with contempt, it is a contempt fully merited by a regime that seeks to cloak its shameful betrayal of a former allies in the guise of human rights, when it brutally suppresses the rights of its own minorities. You may wish to go on dancing to the tune being played by Erdogan, to sheet music composed in Riyadh and Tehran. It is a very good tune. Filled with hate, violence and religious fanaticism. That also is your choice. But know that whatever you have was bought and paid by your ancestors who understood that Turkey would either modernize out of the gutter of Islam, or it would be washed away by the colonial tide. Your power does not come from Islam, it comes from the bread crusts of civilization that fall from the table of Europe and ineptitude of the corrupt mullahs of Iran. Abandon them for the red hued madness of the Jihad, and you will not rule over an empire, but over a wasteland. If you doubt that, look to the south and to the east. Look to the desert. You came from there once. And if you throw away your once secular and democratic country for the fanatical madness of Islam-- you will return there again.

Sincerely,

Your Secular Pro Democracy Iranian Former Friend

Dr. Arash Irandoost is a pro-democracy activist who advocates regime change in Iran. He denounces those who have corrupted the religion of Islam, make war with all free nations and intend to dominate the world with their theocracy. Dr. Irandoost's work has been published in numerous magazines around the world, as well as in hundreds of Internet magazines, websites and blogs. He is also a researcher and literary translator. He blogs at hakemiat-e-mardom. blogspot. com/

Letter to the People of Turkey | EuropeNews
 
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Turkey wants to lead Muslim world but does the Muslim world want to be lead by Turkey ?
 
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Sraja;

i think the shape of your reaction reflects what kind of democracy you want to have. insulting someone, insulting to Turkish PM in such a way doesnt make you change the people's mind in Turkey. %47 the country voted for them and it is strange that people who mention about democracy ignore the voice of the voters in Turkey. So let me ask you, democracy is democracy when someone who can be used by EU or USA comes to charge? if we take our own decisions and vote for someone else, it is a fascist-radical- extremist movement?

i could respond you in a different way as a Northern Turk but first we need to know our place in protocol as the people who carry such a rich and heavy legacy.right?
So i shouldnt bark with dogs. i constantly say this; dog barks but caravan goes on...
 
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As the official spokesperson for the United States of America here on this forum, I hereby give our (America's) permission for Turkey to lead the Muslim world. Obviously whoever leads it today is so totally screwed up that we don't even know who it is. At least if Turkey led the Muslim world we would have a well defined point at which to concentrate our subtle and very helpful advice and wisdom as to how to improve the Muslim world. :yahoo: :usflag: :usflag: :usflag: :usflag:
 
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"Istanbul will once again be Constantinople" :sniper:


and then you wake up from your dream..

Well, atleast i know now that indish people are fags. Thank you. :)

Be careful while responding, who are you calling fags?? ha i am not like you so i will not call you a Turkish dog and insult Turkey but you are a Troller thats what you are :angry:
 
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Letter to the People of Turkey

By Dr. Arash Irandoost

It is not a problem of discussion about his opinion
even i know that he is very stuborn and hatreful towards anyone in Islamic Republic of Iran. Even Mousavi and Karroubi are much insulted by his group.

What i focus on .. is the stupidity of such a letter:
1/ turkish people are not stupid
many times turkish friends said me this
Thanks your islamic revolution. because of this we get richer than you
we were far more rich than them and now they have better conditions
for me it is not islamic republic problem but war and the bad guys in power, especially khamenei who stole his position and did everything to destroy our great country and the great religion we have : Islam

2/ should be more wise and modest . it is laking very much in behavior of this guy
 
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As the official spokesperson for the United States of America here on this forum, I hereby give our (America's) permission for Turkey to lead the Muslim world. Obviously whoever leads it today is so totally screwed up that we don't even know who it is. At least if Turkey led the Muslim world we would have a well defined point at which to concentrate our subtle and very helpful advice and wisdom as to how to improve the Muslim world. :yahoo: :usflag: :usflag: :usflag: :usflag:

laughing out loud

by the way america is also badly screwed up now a days, why cannot you recall that, please focus more on your internal issues then external ones, it will be better not for others but for you!!!!
 
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Turkey looks east and makes waves

The Muslim nation is in NATO and a candidate to join the European Union. But it's busy making inroads to the east, a region looking for and suspicious of fresh leadership.



Reporting from Istanbul, Turkey — Turkey has long been a map of possibility — its eastern fringes touching Iraq and its western borders brushing Europe, a place where the music of Beethoven played amid the call to prayer.

This predominantly Muslim nation is a member of NATO and a candidate, although an unwelcome one, to join the European Union. But Turkey is peering east, dispatching financial brokers, pistachio merchants and diplomats across a restless region that is both looking for and suspicious of any gleam of fresh leadership.

By default and through its own designs, Turkey has gained stature in a Middle East where old Arab powers are fading and gulf states are preoccupied with the global financial crisis and the prospect of a nuclear-armed Iran. Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has strengthened relations with former enemy Syria, improved ties with Iran and, to the agitation of Egypt, arisen as a provocative Muslim voice for Palestinians in the Gaza Strip.

"The country's conservative government has an ideological fit with the Middle East and the larger Muslim world," said Asli Aydintasbas, a columnist with the newspaper Milliyet. "And, practically speaking, there's no place for Turkey in Europe, at least in the short term."

The crisis over the recent deadly Israeli raid on a humanitarian flotilla bound for Gaza upset the strategic relationship between Israel and Turkey, which has been the Jewish state's closest Muslim ally. The two cooperate on defense and amassed $2.5 billion in bilateral trade last year. But Turkey's fierce reaction to the killing of nine Turkish activists by Israeli commandos highlighted the nation's growing disenchantment with the Jewish state.

The U.S. worries that the eastward tilt of Turkey's Islamic-oriented government runs counter to Washington's ambitions. Ankara has increasingly insinuated itself into Palestinian affairs and has appeared to embrace Hamas, which controls Gaza and is considered a terrorist group by the U.S. and Israel. But this tack has turned Erdogan, who once sold sesame buns in Istanbul's poor neighborhoods, into a hero in the Muslim world.

A father in Gaza named his newborn son after him. Arab writers asked why their own leaders, regarded as corrupt and cowed by the West, weren't as scrappily eloquent in supporting Palestinian rights. Turkey has usurped the limelight from Iran, which funds and supports Hamas, and from Egypt, which for years has been trying to broker an Israeli-Palestinian peace.

This has fueled jealousies in some Middle East capitals that view Ankara as interfering in the balance of power, even as its overall regional trade has jumped to more than $31 billion from about $5 billion over the last eight years. But others in the region see Turkey's Islamic brand of democracy and free markets as a pragmatic approach not only to Israel, the U.S. and Europe but also to political cooperation and business deals with the emerging powers of China and India.
"Turkey has been a role model for Islamic countries," said Reza Kaviani, an Iranian analyst. "Turkey has proved that Iranian policy of exporting Islamic revolution has only led to extremism, in contrast with Turkish democratic policy, which has led to true sympathy toward Palestinians and further international pressure on Israel."

For Egypt, the problem with Turkey is its resonance with the "common people," said Sameh Sorour, a Cairo-based political analyst.

"Egyptians have always endorsed any regime that opposed Israel, let alone publicly condemned an Israeli act or policy.... But Turkey is also a secular country with great financial developments and close ties to the West. It represents everything the Egyptian regime is trying to stand for, and that's why Cairo won't be able to discredit Turkey," Sorour said.

Ankara's venturesome diplomacy has limits. A recent effort by Turkey and Brazil to negotiate a nuclear deal with Iran was viewed as naive and angrily discarded by Washington. Turkey faces other challenges in engaging the Middle East: ensuring that it doesn't let its improving human rights record slip and understanding that courting Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Sudanese President Omar Hassan Ahmed Bashir, who is wanted on war crimes charges, may harm its image in the European Union.

Straddling East and West is the historic Turkish riddle. Founded by Kemal Ataturk in 1923 upon the ruins of the Ottoman Empire, Turkey, where the military held sway for decades, hammered itself into a secular state.

It was an uncomfortable, often raucous, fit. In 2002, Erdogan's Justice and Development Party, or AKP, swept to power and religion played a more prominent role.

The country positioned itself as an Islamic democracy that would fit into the EU. Despite making political and human rights reforms, however, Turkey felt ostracized by Berlin and other capitals that believed a country with thousands of minarets was not truly European.

Its pride damaged, Turkey kept its Western alliances and its bid for EU membership open but shifted its focus in the opposite direction.

"The AKP party's blend of Islam and nationalism very much looks toward the East," said Mustafa Karahan, director of an energy investment company. "The party figured, 'Instead of being a small brother in the West, let's be a big brother in the East.' The only problem with this is that a lot of Arabs, especially Egyptians, don't like Turks. But Egypt's time is done. It's over."

It is not likely that Turkey will become the unifying voice in the Middle East, especially in the disparate Arab world, where these days leaders are more consumed with preserving their power.

Cultural differences and historical animosities further complicate Ankara's role. Turkey was once the seat of the Ottoman Empire, which for centuries harshly ruled much of the Middle East. But the country's ascent is a reminder that Arab states have lacked a shared vision since the 1960s, when Egyptian President Gamal Abdel Nasser held up the hope of pan-Arabism.

"Turkey is rising. Iran is rising. Where are the Arabs?" said Mesut Ozcan, assistant professor of international relations at Istanbul Commerce University.

"Erdogan is filling this gap, but Turkey doesn't really want to be the leader of the Middle East. This is about markets and security, of creating an atmosphere to benefit Turkish businessmen. Turkey is trying to create a new language."

Turkey looks east and makes waves - latimes.com
 
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One thing you might have noted is the capacity of Western-inspired journalism to zero-in on the personalities of the leaders of non-Western countries to promote foreign policy agenda: Saddam from Iraq, A'jad from Iran, Kim from N.Korea, Erdogan from Turkey, Castro from Cuba, Chavez from Venezuela...

Bringing the personalities to a sharp-relief makes it possible to divide n rule as well as appearing 'rational', even 'humane': We are not against you common folks. But against your XYZ 'junta' or XYZ 'leader' and so our attempt is to 'liberate' you from that.

I am not saying all these leaders I mention above are saints. But they, no doubt, are doing what they think is right for their own country's interests and most of them, if not all, have significant popular support in their respective countries.
 
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Saddam from Iraq, A'jad from Iran, Kim from N.Korea, Erdogan from Turkey, Castro from Cuba, Chavez from Venezuela...

they, no doubt, are doing what they think is right for their own country's interests and most of them, if not all, have significant popular support in their respective countries.

You got to be kidding!! Maybe Erdogan fits that mold, but the others are nutcase megalomaniacs. They are ruining their "own" people.
 
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@TruthSeeker,
No, I was not kidding and I clearly said they were not necessarily saints. But they represent their countries and the people in their country in varying degrees. They are demonized, singled out by the Western-inspired journos while the Kings of KSA and Jordan and the Mubarak of Egypt--equally repressive and unrepresentative--are spared the 'limelight' and these countries are called 'Moderate' repeatedly en-mass from these journalists.
Even without a background in journalism I can see through the ploy. Quit defending everything coming from your sphere.
 
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Do the Muslim countries really need any particular country to be a leader??? In other words,does anybody really give damn???
 
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