‘Turkey’s Syria stance aggravates plight of Iran’s Turks’

[TheCommander]

1) the very azari speaking minority of Iran in discussion right now was "turkified" by the sword when the region fell under ottoman and turkish rule

Under the Persians nationalism in Iran, for the assimilation of Azerbaijanis, two theories were developed including Azeri Language and Theory of Aran. According to the theory of Azerbaijani language, Azerbaijani origin was the Farsi (Persians), and they began to speak in Turkish was claimed as a result of the invasion of the Mongols.

According to the theory of Aran, Azerbaijan was occupied by the Ottoman Empire. The Ottoman Empire could not hold the region so that it was given to Mehmet Emin Resulzade in 1918. Altough the Persians were living in that region, the region was named as Azerbaijan by Mehmet Emin Resulzade.

You see how Abii`s argument and theories for the assimilation align one another.

 

[Abii]

Hey, do you actually look at that map? You see Azerbaijani Turkic tribes even in South of Iran.

It's legacy of our past nomadic life style, and answers to all your questions about our roots. And don't forget Qashqais (our relatives) which moved to that region from Azerbaijan.

My grandfather was a Qashqai. I've talked about this before here. And you didn't touch on any of my points. You just said there is Turkish presence. I agree, there is presence, but it's dying because of the "persinification" and I don't agree with it. If you make a map of Western Canada, you can make a colourful map for Iranian people and cover half of vancouver in a colour. That just shows that there is a presence of IRanians, not that the city is full of them lol

I'm talking about the right hand panel where it shows the number of people who speak Azari as a first language. Without Turkish schools, this will continue to fall until it reaches single digits. It will reach single digits by 2020 and that's very unfortunate.

 

[ASQ-1918]

ASQ calling another person a clown. Even your Turkish bros are throwing you under the bus. You're like that weird kid in the school bus that nobody wants to sit beside.

Anyway, the Iranian govt is actually seeing success with their "persianification" agenda. But I'm 100 percent against it. I actually think we Shirazi people, the center of Persian Iran is in Shiraz for ppl that don't know, are the biggest supporters of Azari schooling etc... where is the power in Iran? South or north? Mostly north, where there is a lrg Azari presence, along with Kurdish etc... The only people pushing the Persian agenda are your own Azari brethren sitting in Qom who want to make Iran a shia saudi arabia. Azaris are famous for their shia ferver and are more religious than Parsi Iranians. There are countless high ranking azari clerics who would chop the heads off of any Azari that asked for their rights. I guess they're like the ultra orthodox Jews who are against Israel.

Anyway, as I said their 'persianification' is working. Wish they wouldn't do all this ****. I've said it many times here, I don't agree with their agenda.

Here's the proof. Azari speakers have decreased as a percentage by a great margin since the 60s and so have other minority languages (look on the right hand panel)

So how is that exactly related to cultural, language, idenity rights of Azeri Turks? These clerics sitting in Qom could care less about Azeri Turks in Azerbaijan itself. Are you denying the fact that Azerbaijani provinces are generally poorer than Persian ones, purposefully done by the government? Why do you think there are millions of Azeris in Tehran?

And that map does not show millions of Azerbaijani speakers in Tehran itself. Also, what about Qazvin, Karaj, Hamadan?

"Ana Dilim Ölən Deyil, Başqa Dilə Dönən Deyil" is the motto of Azerbaijani Turks in Iran. And your saying that amount of speakers are decreasing.

"My mother language will never die or turn into another language".

 

[Abii]

Under the Persians nationalism in Iran, for the assimilation of Azerbaijanis, two theories were developed including Azeri Language and Theory of Aran. According to the theory of Azerbaijani language, Azerbaijani origin was the Farsi (Persians), and they began to speak in Turkish was claimed as a result of the invasion of the Mongols.

According to the theory of Aran, Azerbaijan was occupied by the Ottoman Empire. The Ottoman Empire could not hold the region so that it was given to Mehmet Emin Resulzade in 1918. Altough the Persians were living in that region, the region was named as Azerbaijan by Mehmet Emin Resulzade.

You see how Abii`s argument and theories for the assimilation align one another.

I love your reading comprehension skills.

"1) the very azari speaking minority of Iran in discussion right now was "turkified" by the sword when the region fell under ottoman and turkish rule.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/turkey...avates-plight-iran-s-turks.html#ixzz1xvKrcvtN
"

I never said they were persians. They were most likely Armenians, Kurds and also Parsis and I'm not talking recent times. I'm talking hundreds and hundreds of years ago. Turks didn't fall out of the moon or planet mars did they? How did Iranians become Turkish? Did they just fall out of the moon one day? Of course they became Turkified.

Anyway, this is all irrelevant. I was just trying to point out an irony.

Turks are here today, they're in Iran and I'm in favour of Turkish schools. Now what do you wanna say?

So how is that exactly related to cultural, language, idenity rights of Azeri Turks? These clerics sitting in Qom could care less about Azeri Turks in Azerbaijan itself. Are you denying the fact that Azerbaijani provinces are generally poorer than Persian ones, purposefully done by the government? Why do you think there are millions of Azeris in Tehran?

And that map does not show millions of Azerbaijani speakers in Tehran itself (and exeggerating areas where Kurds populate).

Also, what about Qazvin, Karaj, Hamadan?

That is an UTTER LIE. You shoud be ashamed. You honestly have no shame man. First you call Kurds "mountain apes" and "goat fuckers," now you come up with this ****.

Azarbaijan is the center of Iranian industry along with Isfahan. Azarbaijan looks better than most IRanian cities. The poorest Iranian cities are the likes of Yazd which are 100 percent persian.

This year Tiraxtur FC has the LARGEST govt budget out of any Iranian football team, more than Perspolis and Esteghlal, which both have more supporters.
Sepah commander announces 8 billion toman budget for Teraktor
Skyscrapercity has more than 10 Iranian azaris. They also have tons of pictures from Tabriz. Go look at the projects and compare them with other parts of Iran which you claim are better. You're a troll.


Kurds are exeggerated??? How do you know Kurdish hater? Did you do a census? What a troll lol
Kurds have been in Iran for 2.5 millenia. Heck, they were here before us Parsis. Now he says their number is exeggerated.

 

[ASQ-1918]

LOL, they are Afshars, Qarapapakh, Qajar, Shahseven, Baharlu etc... as you can see in that map of yours.

Are you seriously that stupid or you are acting like one? I mean you should have at least checked the map you posted yourself, and see the clans that makes-up Azerbaijani ethnicity.

Afshars for instance are a well known Turkoman tribe, and a large part of Azeri Turks come from this tribe. Also the tribe of Nader Shah Afshar Turkmen.

 

[Abii]

LOL, they are Afshars, Qarapapakh, Qajar, Shahseven etc... as you can see in that map of yours.

You don't seem to have realized that Azerbaijani ethnicity consists of several Turkic clans.

You obviously aren't here to discuss anything.

Look at the panel. more than 1/5th of Iran spoke Azari AS MOTHER tongue in the 60s. In 2004, that number was down to 13 percent.

Again, I'm against this, but just wanted to point out that your earlier arguement, where you said this isn't working, is incorrect. It's working for them.

 

[TheCommander]

Turks are here today, they're in Iran and I'm in favour of Turkish schools. Now what do you wanna say?

As long as you do not insult I respect your opinion (even I am opposed it). You may or may not be in favor of Turkish schools, it is up to you. If you are in favor of Turkish school, then you got a .

 

[ASQ-1918]

Where did I call the Kurds as "mountain ape"?

The posts I made regarding Kurds was describing their society, anyone who knows anything about Kurds know these facts. Maybe it was a bit wrong language, but at the end I was only talking about the Kurdish society.

Because they even made Maku a Kurdish city, it was center of Kangarlı Khanate for God's sake. Urmiya are not even mixed Azeri-Kurdish city, it's an Azeri city populated by Afshars. Kurds was settled there by Iranian government, but they are still a tiny minority. Urmiya of course are the most important city there, and it will not turn into a Kurdish city, no matter how much the Iranian government tries.

 

[Abii]

As long as you do not insult I respect your opinion (even I am opposed it). You may or may not be in favor of Turkish schools, it is up to you. If you are in favor of Turkish school, then you got a .

I didn't live under shah's rule nor have I ever read anything about that society that wasn't filled with half lies and truths so I won't comment on that.

However under IR, any talk of nationalist ideas, be it Persian or Azari is banned. Now you will say what about "persinification"? That's obvious, they want a shia saudi arabia and having a multi-ethnic society is a headache. Right now the majority is Parsi so it's easier to make everyone the same. Now that doesn't mean Persian history and culture is respected completely, not at all. It's just more respected. When it comes to naming your children, not all Persian names are acceptable. In Iran it's very easy to name your children and get them registered if you have an arabic name. If you have a non-Iranian name or a name that isn't approved by the ministry of culture, than forget about it. My father had a nightmare to register my brother's name for example.

So yeah, this "persianification" has a religious element to it. That's why you see people like Khamenei and other high ranking Iranian Azari clerics, pushing the Parsi agenda. To them, Shia Islam should be Iran's culture.

I personally couldn't care who speaks what in Iran. If you want to send your kid to Azari schools, more power to ya.

 

[ASQ-1918]

Look at the panel. more than 1/5th of Iran spoke Azari AS MOTHER tongue in the 60s. In 2004, that number was down to 13 percent.

Officially, that is 24%. We all know that in reality it is at least 35%. So you should not base your argument on that map.

But that map does a good thing by showing you how stupid you are by showing you list of our Oghuz-Turkoman clans.

As I said, you will never suceed with claiming such stupid things, Azeri Turks are Turks and has a different culture, language and idenity than Persians, and for that reason they need their rights, or INDEPENDENCE.

 

[Abii]

Where did I call the Kurds as "mountain ape"?

The posts I made regarding Kurds was describing their society, anyone who knows anything about Kurds know these facts. Maybe it was a bit wrong language, but at the end I was only talking about the Kurdish society.

Because they even made Maku a Kurdish city, it was center of Kangarlı Khanate for God's sake. Urmiya are not even mixed Azeri-Kurdish city, it's an Azeri city populated by Afshars. Kurds was settled there by Iranian government, but they are still a tiny minority. Urmiya of course are the most important city there, and it will not turn into a Kurdish city, no matter how much the Iranian government tries.

irrelevant and false even.

Kurds and Iranian Azaris share the same geographical region of Iran. Number wise, Azaris are higher obviously, but they live in the same area.

Kurds are settled by IR? Are you insane? srsly are you insane? They were living there before Iran unified 2500 years ago. I'm talking 3 millenia ago!!! They've always been there.

And you wanna know an irony? The only time in history when the Kurds were forced to relocate was under the rule of an Iranian turkish dynasty (forgot which one, maybe the safavids or the one before), where they were moved to the Iran-AFG border and that's why we have Kurds near Afghanistan.

 

[ASQ-1918]

However under IR, any talk of nationalist ideas, be it Persian is banned.

LOL...

What a lie, Persian nationalism are a state ideology of Iran. Persian nationalism, even "Aryanism" are encouraged. But when you say that your a Turk and proud of it, you are jailed.

 

[Abii]

Officially, that is 24%. We all know that in reality it is at least 35%. So you should not base your argument on that map.

But that map does a good thing by showing you how stupid you are by showing you list of our Oghuz-Turkoman clans.

As I said, you will never suceed with claiming such stupid things, Azeri Turks are Turks and has a different culture, language and idenity than Persians, and for that reason they need their rights, or INDEPENDENCE.

okay buddy, you're right, I'm wrong, National census data are wrong, foreign NGO data is incorrect, that map is incorrect, common sense is wrong...



I keep saying the same things and you keep answering me with illiogical and nonsensical arguements. When there are no Turkish schools for a century, what do you think happens? This in an urbanized environment where every child is sent to pre-school, elementary school and high school at the bare minimum? What language is used? Persian. What do you think happens after decades and decades? Of course the numbers decline. So logic backs up all the data I posted above. The description on the map goes into more detail as well. Any logical and sane individual can deduce the truth here.

And for the millionth time, I'm against this. I live in Canada where the French and English have both found a way to co-exist. Everybody can send their childrend to either Francophone or Anglophone schools. Some of my Iranian friends were educated in Francophone schools here and now know Persian, French and English.

 

[ASQ-1918]

irrelevant and false even.

Kurds and Iranian Azaris share the same geographical region of Iran. Number wise, Azaris are higher obviously, but they live in the same area.

Kurds are settled by IR? Are you insane? srsly are you insane? They were living there before Iran unified 2500 years ago. I'm talking 3 millenia ago!!! They've always been there.

And you wanna know an irony? The only time in history when the Kurds were forced to relocate was under the rule of an Iranian turkish dynasty (forgot which one, maybe the safavids or the one before), where they were moved to the Iran-AFG border and that's why we have Kurds near Afghanistan.

I don't care about past, the Kurds which are there to the west of Urmiya was settled there recently only.

In past yes Kurds was deported from that area after they rebelled against Safavids, but Kurdish tribes was settled there during Shah era, continued by IRI.

Also, a great quote from Shah Abbas after defeating Kurds in battle of Dimdim;

"After the battle, Shah Abbas I has been documented to be laughing at the easy battle, quoting "These Kurds are not worthy of my time!"

Now, really, you are neither worthy of our time. None of Kurds are. Now please, this thread is not about your Kurdish people.

 

[Abii]

LOL...

What a lie, Persian nationalism are a state ideology of Iran. Persian nationalism, even "Aryanism" are encouraged. But when you say that your a Turk and proud of it, you are jailed.

I love how you selected part of that post. I will re-post what I wrote to show people what you tried to do. I explained what I meant and I clearly showed you what I meant.

However under IR, any talk of nationalist ideas, be it Persian or Azari is banned. Now you will say what about "persinification"? That's obvious, they want a shia saudi arabia and having a multi-ethnic society is a headache. Right now the majority is Parsi so it's easier to make everyone the same. Now that doesn't mean Persian history and culture is respected completely, not at all. It's just more respected. When it comes to naming your children, not all Persian names are acceptable. In Iran it's very easy to name your children and get them registered if you have an arabic name. If you have a non-Iranian name or a name that isn't approved by the ministry of culture, than forget about it. My father had a nightmare to register my brother's name for example.

So yeah, this "persianification" has a religious element to it. That's why you see people like Khamenei and other high ranking Iranian Azari clerics, pushing the Parsi agenda. To them, Shia Islam should be Iran's culture.

I personally couldn't care who speaks what in Iran. If you want to send your kid to Azari schools, more power to ya.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=3060748#ixzz1xvVRvJnj

I don't care about past, the Kurds which are there to the west of Urmiya was settled there recently only.

In past yes Kurds was deported from that area after they rebelled against Safavids, but Kurdish tribes was settled there during Shah era, continued by IRI.

Also, a great quote from Shah Abbas after defeating Kurds in battle of Dimdim;

"After the battle, Shah Abbas I has been documented to be laughing at the easy battle, quoting "These Kurds are not worthy of my time!"

Now, really, you are neither worthy of our time. None of Kurds are. Now please, this thread is not about your Kurdish people.

Then don't talk about them!
There is srsly smtg not right with you!

Do you see any Kurdish members on this forum? I don't. You obviously care about them enough to start cursing them out of nowhere and write mile long paragraphs about them that make very little sense.