To whom does the term 'Aryan' belong?

[BelligerentPacifist]

Y. A. W. N.

 

[Spring Onion]

Dravidians are a language group not related to skin color or North or South.

There are dravidians in Pakistan also, " Brahui people in the central Balochistan region of Pakistan" are also can be called Dravidians since they also speak Dravidian Language.

To tell you Brahmin is not by birth but by his profession.

In Ancient Indian society there is no such thing as by birth , If you learn Vedas and other sanskrit texts you will become a Brahmin. If you learn Warrior skill then you will become Kshatrya.

But during the course of centuries the greed for power among the people who are occupying the top positions twisted this rule, and so we see this kind of caste system now a days in India.

who were brahmins in the first place

forget about ancient or new India is the same High cast and Low cast thats all.

inbetween these two, the ones feel left out and tend to portray they are Aryans so basically

Dravidians Vs Aryan complex prevails

Y. A. W. N.

------------

 

[Fuego]

By your definition the entire world is Aryan then whats the fuss and indians need to debate it anyway

I was talking about the word. It was first used in the world's oldest script the Rigveda, and it was a title given to noble people.

Then it merged with India and Indians of course.

 

[Arya Desa]

I was talking about the word. It was first used in the world's oldest script the Rigveda, and it was a title given to noble people.

Then it merged with India and Indians of course.

Don't respond to her. Jana insults our caste system but conveniently forgets Islam has its own.

To whom does the term 'Aryan' belong to? How can white nationalist claim? What right do they have?

Please refer to my thread

http://www.defence.pk/forums/members-club/220703-aryan-supremacist-stolen.html

 

[genmirajborgza786]

Was staying out of this thread till I saw your reply. West Iran was unknown even to ancient Iranians themselves. The word Aryan seems to have been used originally by the people of the Rg veda, specifically a sub sect of one of the tribes - the Bharatas of the Puru tribe. How it went on to encompass all the other tribes & the connection to Iran remains a mystery.

don't know mate its quite confusing, you have the Germany angle, then the Iranian one & the Indian one, the Iranian & Indian ones have some proximity but the German ones, is what makes this whole issue extremely complicated

 

[Spring Onion]

I was talking about the word. It was first used in the world's oldest script the Rigveda, and it was a title given to noble people.

Then it merged with India and Indians of course.

what was the definition of NOBEL?

Don't respond to her. Jana insults our caste system but conveniently forgets Islam has its own.



Please refer to my thread

[/URL]

Cast system in itself is an insult

 

[Arya Desa]

what was the definition of NOBEL?





Cast system in itself is an insult

Then you have insulted Islam. Please do not do that.

 

[ExtraOdinary]

Aryan-Dravidian divide a myth: Study

HYDERABAD: The great Indian divide along north-south lines now stands blurred. A pathbreaking study by Harvard and indigenous researchers on ancestral Indian populations says there is a genetic relationship between all Indians and more importantly, the hitherto believed ``fact'' that Aryans and Dravidians signify the ancestry of north and south Indians might after all, be a myth.

This paper rewrites history... there is no north-south divide,'' Lalji Singh, former director of the Centre for Cellular and Molecular Biology (CCMB) and a co-author of the study, said at a press conference here on Thursday.

Senior CCMB scientist Kumarasamy Thangarajan said there was no truth to the Aryan-Dravidian theory as they came hundreds or thousands of years after the ancestral north and south Indians had settled in India.

The study analysed 500,000 genetic markers across the genomes of 132 individuals from 25 diverse groups from 13 states. All the individuals were from six-language families and traditionally ``upper'' and ``lower'' castes and tribal groups. ``The genetics proves that castes grew directly out of tribe-like organizations during the formation of the Indian society,'' the study said. Thangarajan noted that it was impossible to distinguish between castes and tribes since their genetics proved they were not systematically different.

The study was conducted by CCMB scientists in collaboration with researchers at Harvard Medical School,

Harvard School of Public Health and the Broad Institute of Harvard and MIT. It reveals that the present-day Indian population is a mix of ancient north and south bearing the genomic contributions from two distinct ancestral populations - the Ancestral North Indian (ANI) and the Ancestral South Indian (ASI).

The initial settlement took place 65,000 years ago in the Andamans and in ancient south India around the same time, which led to population growth in this part,'' said Thangarajan. He added, ``At a later stage, 40,000 years ago, the ancient north Indians emerged which in turn led to rise in numbers here. But at some point of time, the ancient north and the ancient south mixed, giving birth to a different set of population. And that is the population which exists now and there is a genetic relationship between the population within India.''

The study also helps understand why the incidence of genetic diseases among Indians is different from the rest of the world. Singh said that 70% of Indians were burdened with genetic disorders and the study could help answer why certain conditions restricted themselves to one population. For instance, breast cancer among Parsi women, motor neuron diseases among residents of Tirupati and Chittoor, or sickle cell anaemia among certain tribes in central India and the North-East can now be understood better, said researchers.

The researchers, who are now keen on exploring whether Eurasians descended from ANI, find in their study that ANIs are related to western Eurasians, while the ASIs do not share any similarity with any other population across the world. However, researchers said there was no scientific proof of whether Indians went to Europe first or the other way round.

Migratory route of Africans

Between 135,000 and 75,000 years ago, the East-African droughts shrunk the water volume of the lake Malawi by at least 95%, causing migration out of Africa. Which route did they take? Researchers say their study of the tribes of Andaman and Nicobar islands using complete mitochondrial DNA sequences and its comparison those of world populations has led to the theory of a southern coastal route'' of migration from East Africa through India.

Aryan-Dravidian divide a myth: Study - Times Of India

 

[Srinivas]

who were brahmins in the first place

forget about ancient or new India is the same High cast and Low cast thats all.

inbetween these two, the ones feel left out and tend to portray they are Aryans so basically

Dravidians Vs Aryan complex prevails

Brahmins are the learned ones not related to race.

You can also find Brahmins in South, Dravidian Brahmins.

Dravidian vs Aryans is related to Language.

High status and low status, which was a flexible one in the ancient one is made a rigid one later.

 

[ExtraOdinary]

Common ancestor says hi

 

[Bang Galore]

don't know mate its quite confusing, you have the Germany angle, then the Iranian one & the Indian one, the Iranian & Indian ones have some proximity but the German ones, is what makes this whole issue extremely complicated

The German angle is derived from the Indian one. It starts with people in the 18th century figuring out that North Indian languages have similarity to European languages & then for a very short period assuming that Sanskrit was the mother language of all Indo-Europeans and hence adopting the word Aryan for all Indo Europeans. Racism & further research necessitated that India wasn't the homeland which was them moved to different parts of Europe as suiting the proponents of the original homeland theory. The Nazis favoured Germany as the Urheimat but still decided to hang on to the old Sankrit name to describe the people which had by then gained wide currency.

 

[DRaisinHerald]

I hardly think anyone really cares about the term.

By bet is on Iran and/or the surrounding region.

 

[Srinivas]

The German angle is derived from the Indian one. It starts with people in the 18th century figuring out that North Indian languages have similarity to European languages & then for a very short period assuming that Sanskrit was the mother language of all Indo-Europeans and hence adopting the word Aryan for all Indo Europeans. Racism & further research necessitated that India wasn't the homeland which was them moved to different parts of Europe as suiting the proponents of the original homeland theory. The Nazis favoured Germany as the Urheimat but still decided to hang on to the old Sankrit name to describe the people which had by then gained wide currency.

Germany associating with India and Sanskrit has to do with British, at that time India was the driving engine for Britain. So the propaganda of Indian and German belonging to same race.

 

[Bang Galore]

Germany associating with India and Sanskrit has to do with British, at that time India was the driving engine for Britain. So the propaganda of Indian and German belonging to same race.

Well...there are all the same language family & hence the direct connection. Btw, the Germans didn't think that Indians were necessarily of the same race, they thought that the Aryan race was very diluted in India by mixing. It was racism that necessitated (among other things, including more language research) the moving of the "Urheimat" towards Europe

 

[Spring Onion]

Aryan-Dravidian divide a myth: Study

HYDERABAD: The great Indian divide along north-south lines now stands blurred. A pathbreaking study by Harvard and indigenous researchers on ancestral Indian populations says there is a genetic relationship between all Indians and more importantly, the hitherto believed ``fact'' that Aryans and Dravidians signify the ancestry of north and south Indians might after all, be a myth.

This paper rewrites history... there is no north-south divide,'' Lalji Singh, former director of the Centre for Cellular and Molecular Biology (CCMB) and a co-author of the study, said at a press conference here on Thursday.

Senior CCMB scientist Kumarasamy Thangarajan said there was no truth to the Aryan-Dravidian theory as they came hundreds or thousands of years after the ancestral north and south Indians had settled in India.

The study analysed 500,000 genetic markers across the genomes of 132 individuals from 25 diverse groups from 13 states. All the individuals were from six-language families and traditionally ``upper'' and ``lower'' castes and tribal groups. ``The genetics proves that castes grew directly out of tribe-like organizations during the formation of the Indian society,'' the study said. Thangarajan noted that it was impossible to distinguish between castes and tribes since their genetics proved they were not systematically different.

The study was conducted by CCMB scientists in collaboration with researchers at Harvard Medical School,

Harvard School of Public Health and the Broad Institute of Harvard and MIT. It reveals that the present-day Indian population is a mix of ancient north and south bearing the genomic contributions from two distinct ancestral populations - the Ancestral North Indian (ANI) and the Ancestral South Indian (ASI).

The initial settlement took place 65,000 years ago in the Andamans and in ancient south India around the same time, which led to population growth in this part,'' said Thangarajan. He added, ``At a later stage, 40,000 years ago, the ancient north Indians emerged which in turn led to rise in numbers here. But at some point of time, the ancient north and the ancient south mixed, giving birth to a different set of population. And that is the population which exists now and there is a genetic relationship between the population within India.''

The study also helps understand why the incidence of genetic diseases among Indians is different from the rest of the world. Singh said that 70% of Indians were burdened with genetic disorders and the study could help answer why certain conditions restricted themselves to one population. For instance, breast cancer among Parsi women, motor neuron diseases among residents of Tirupati and Chittoor, or sickle cell anaemia among certain tribes in central India and the North-East can now be understood better, said researchers.

The researchers, who are now keen on exploring whether Eurasians descended from ANI, find in their study that ANIs are related to western Eurasians, while the ASIs do not share any similarity with any other population across the world. However, researchers said there was no scientific proof of whether Indians went to Europe first or the other way round.

Migratory route of Africans

Between 135,000 and 75,000 years ago, the East-African droughts shrunk the water volume of the lake Malawi by at least 95%, causing migration out of Africa. Which route did they take? Researchers say their study of the tribes of Andaman and Nicobar islands using complete mitochondrial DNA sequences and its comparison those of world populations has led to the theory of a southern coastal route'' of migration from East Africa through India.

Aryan-Dravidian divide a myth: Study - Times Of India

So to begin with there are NO Aryans in India be North or South