Featured Time to bury the past and move forward: COAS Bajwa

[waz]

Pakistanis hated the Indians so much that we became as shrewd as them, and the Indians hated Pakistanis so much they became myopic religious nutjobs.

Lol.

 

[Chhatrapati]

No one in Pakistan expects India to do anything.

We know you’re a bunch of rabid hate-mongers, but Pakistan can tell the international we tried and the onus is in India to change her behavior.

Yeah no, throughout the discussion, you're pretending to be some dove that's being unfairly treated by everyone. There's a reason why Pakistan is being reprimanded twice by terror funding watch dogs. Pakistan is not doing anyone any favors, you're simply helping yourself from the difficult situation you are in.

Rabid hate mongers? Maybe you should look inward, as for your COAS comments, this is just a googly like we had in Kargil or the 2003 agreement. We have learned far too much from your behaviour to not trust a word. Don't get over-excited with the art 370 removals, India made it clear time and time again art 370 is a goner, J^K may get full statehood as promised before. Maybe you can spin that as a win when we do that.

 

[Robbie]

No one in Pakistan expects India to do anything.

We know you’re a bunch of rabid hate-mongers, but Pakistan can tell the international community we tried and the onus is on India to change her behavior.

Leaving your ad hominem's against a country people aside (considering everyone considers Pakistani's as terrorists), telling the international community anything won't lead to an iota of difference to either India or the international community.

So once again - what is the point of these statements from Pakistan? India is not going to reinstate the constitutional changes to J&K. That is done and over.

The only possible conclusion is that this is for Pakistan's domestic audience.

View attachment 725868

I hope it's this.

Won't make any difference. The Governments and think tanks in India do not trust anything Pakistanis say. The worst is assumed and actions taken accordingly.

 

[doorstar]

(considering everyone considers Pakistani's as terrorists), telling the international community anything won't lead to an iota of difference to either India or the international community.

yet here you are bitching incessantly about it

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Leaving your ad hominem's against a country people aside (considering everyone considers Pakistani's as terrorists), telling the international community anything won't lead to an iota of difference to either India or the international community.

So once again - what is the point of Pakistan doing this theatrical display?

Not against ALL of a country’s people, just those that support the rabid, hate and warmongering policies of the Indian government.

Narrative & perception building takes time. However, you are correct in a way - without Pakistan improving its economy & governance, narrative & perception building efforts will only go so far, so a big part on how successful these efforts will be depends on the parallel efforts of the civilian government to turn the economy around, broaden the industrial base, increase trade with non-traditional markets etc.

But both efforts need to occur in parallel. Can’t wait for everything else to turn around before trying to change perceptions/narrative. If anything, these efforts will also feed into the process of economic growth by making Pakistan appear a more inviting destination for investment.

 

[Trailer23]

Not to sound cynical, but all it takes a bullet - from across LoC (coming from either side) and all hell will break loose.

Lets be honest. How many Member want both nations to be at peace with one another or at the very least just accept the other?

These are two Nuclear States facing one another.

History. There is just too much between the two for there ever to be the possibility of peace.

India's list of demands is not just asking Pakistan to stop (so called) Terrorism, but they want Azad Kashmir (including Gilgit/Baltistan) and whatever else they can get a hand on. They also want to 'decimate' Pakistan - a term their media has repeated over and over.

PMIK & Gen. Bajwa have made their comments public and its been noted by the International Community - Mission Accomplished.

Now just move on, 'cause India is never gonna budge. They're already talking about demolishing mosques to build mandirs. They're planning on teaching Hinduism in Madrasa's to little kids.

What, do they think we're gonna just let our Azad Kashmiri brothers and sisters suffer the same fate as ones in IoK.

Yeah sure. Kiss my a**.

 

[Chhatrapati]

India's list of demands is not just asking Pakistan to stop (so called) Terrorism

No, the demand, if any will be, is to forgo the claim and make LOC, an IB. Which would work well for India not so sure about Pakistan who has drilled the Kashmir Banega Pakistan to every mind. You think your same obsession with Kashmir is the same as our interest in Pakistan. No. we don't dream of the annihilation of Pakistan or taking over Ajk GB from a realistic point as you claim.

 

[Robbie]

Not against ALL of a country’s people, just those that support the rabid, hate and warmongering policies of the Indian government.

Narrative & perception building takes time. However, you are correct in a way - without Pakistan improving its economy & governance, narrative & perception building efforts will only go so far, so a big part on how successful these efforts will be depends on the parallel efforts of the civilian government to turn the economy around, broaden the industrial base, increase trade with non-traditional markets etc.

But both efforts need to occur in parallel. Can’t wait for everything else to turn around before trying to change perceptions/narrative. If anything, these efforts will also feed into the process of economic growth by making Pakistan appear a more inviting destination for investment.

Or, this is a charade for the domestic audience, as is the traditional focus of the Pakistani establishment.

No, the demand, if any will be, is to forgo the claim and make LOC, an IB. Which would work well for India not so sure about Pakistan who has drilled the Kashmir Banega Pakistan to every mind. You think your same obsession with Kashmir is the same as our interest in Pakistan. No. we don't dream of the annihilation of Pakistan or taking over Ajk GB from a realistic point as you claim.

I don't understand where this Akhand Bharat comes to their mind as well. Nobody of any consequence even thinks about it and an overwhelming majority of Indians won't accept it.

I guess it serves the Pakistanis well in defining India as gunning for swallowing their country and makes their military even more important in their minds. That allows the military to maintain hegemony over the country.

 

[khansaheeb]

Why would India do that?

Because as recent events on the border have shown, India can lose more than Kashmir.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Or, this is a charade for the domestic audience, as is the traditional focus of the Pakistani establishment.

India is irrelevant in terms of the domestic electorate.

And Indians need to make up their minds on whether the Pakistani Military resorts to jingoism and war-mongering to stoke domestic opinion over Kashmir OR if it talks about peace to, as you’re suggesting here, carry out a charade for the domestic audience.

Come back when you lot have made up your minds on which propaganda line to use.

 

[HAIDER]

 

[Chhatrapati]

I don't understand where this Akhand Bharat comes to their mind as well. Nobody of any consequence even thinks about it and an overwhelming majority of Indians won't accept it.

I guess it serves the Pakistanis well in defining India as gunning for swallowing their country and makes their military even more important in their minds. That allows the military to maintain hegemony over the country.

It comes from those fringe RW groups that wished partition haven't taken place. You see, the RSS VHP etc.. were against partition. But now since those two majority Muslim nations have created, they don't want to increase the Muslim population even more. If you ask the staunch RSS types if they want a merger with Pakistan and Bangladesh they'll laugh you out of the room.

It does serve Pakistan well, their country came to be based on religion and the point that Hindus and Muslims cannot live together. But military hegemony in Pakistan is its own institutional weakness rather than the India scare, Then again, we don't really care how Pakistan run its government, the inverse may not be true for the current cabinet.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

those fringe RW groups

Those fringe right wing groups are the Indian government now.

 

[Chhatrapati]

Those fringe right wing groups are the Indian government now.

Maybe you should read the entire point or at least the first para, instead of writing rhetorics.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Maybe you should read the entire point or at least the first para, instead of writing rhetorics.

That is the point. What you attribute to ‘fringe right wing groups’, this fantasy about Akhand Bharat or a United India of lore, and the hatred, expansionism & othering that flows from it, is a mindset that is now part of the Indian government courtesy of the BJP.

You can no longer de-link fringe right wing groups from the Indian Government itself, which is why Pakistani concerns over India that you have dismissed so flippantly are completely valid.