Three Chinese engineers arrested in India

[Communist]

Ok let me answer you one by one

Thanks. And sorry for the delayed reply from me.

As a responsible engineers they should have known the real strength and whether it can with hold the pressure..i mean that's what a real engineers should do right?

Of course they had responsibility. Of course the concerned responsibility is professional responsibility in the real sense of the term. Of course they should have known the real strength. But real strength of what? Of course the real strength of the materials (sand, bricks, iron rods, cement etc etc) to build the chimney. Of course the materials they used were not brought from China or from any foreign country. Of course, the materials they used were bought in India.

Now we should remember that they went to India from China empty handed. They had a structural design to build a chimney. They hired laborers from India. They bought materials from India. How could they be sure that the materials they were buying in a foreign land do not have the real strength? How could they be sure that the materials the were going to use would not lead to the collapse of the chimney? Similarly, how could they be sure that the materials would have the real strength required for the chimney? And how could they be sure that the materials would lead to the fatal collapse of the chimney?

If you insist they were sure about all these predications, then you are saying that they went to India and then somehow acquired the information regarding some construction materials that would not have the strength and would therefore lead to a fatal collapse.

Had they been able to know that before, they would not have been working till the collapse of the chimney because they would have the minimum common sense that they might get arrested and tried. But they were working till the collapse of the chimney and this clearly indicates that they did not have the knowledge or information about the genuineness of the materials used for the construction of the chimney.

Now please do not say, every real engineer (as you used the term) first need to examine the materials in a laboratory after buying them from the market. Every real engineer has to depend on the materials while buying them from the market with the predications that those materials would not lead to any unfortunate incident. And in this case, those engineers, no matter how much you paid, were working in a foreign land and had to depend on the suppliers of materials as well as assistant engineers who work in the field and laborers. And all of such helping hands were from India. You get my point?

No but sometimes inorder to get profit companys will do some third rate activities like buying substandard cements,not mixing in the right quality etc etc..The engineer has to ensure they get high quality products while building..

You are right. Companies do third rate activities. But it is highly unlikely that a foreign company after getting a tender to build a chimney in a foreign land would even dare to do these illegal things. As a side note I can say, every company has a budget for every project. It is not like you have a non-stop supply of money and so you just continue your construction project without any budget.

Those Chinese engineers definitely had a budget and they tried to finish the construction staying within the budget. They had to rely on the quality or standard on the materials as they could afford to buy from the market. And as I have said already, they could not predict that the materials they were buying according to their budget would prove to be substandard, specially in a foreign land.

Now tell me, if you still insist that they had the knowledge of the standard of the materials, are not the producers as well as suppliers of the sub-standard materials also guilty? Should police also arrest the cement company's owners, the sand-pebbles suppliers, iron rod producers, and all the producers of all concerned materials?

No but they know that there building was not strong as intend to and bad luck for them it collapse..they can avoid it if they wanted to ...

Engineers cannot predict the strength of the building, there is no such measurement yet invented. They have to rely on the strength of the materials and read my above mentioned lines to know whether it was possible for them to know at all in a foreign land.

You used the word bad luck and bad luck is something that one can hardly avoid.

Yes they had the knowledge that it may collapse because they are using substandard items or structural flaws in the design.its their responsibility to deliver a flawless building..Thats what we paid them for ...i mean if its that simple to build then whats the need of Engineers?

Already answered.

No body is claiming anything dude..simple logic can be used here..They were the one responsible for building that chimmney..it collapsed and after investiagtion police found out who was responsible and they arrested them..they have their chance to proove their innocence in court..dont have to worry about it..

They were responsible for the construction of the chimney, but were they responsible for any unwanted accident? I do not know why the Indian police charged them with culpable homicide, if i could proceed in the court, I would first question the irresponsible charge. And about Indian police... what can I say... you know how much educated and intelligent they are. You know how much qualification is needed for appearing in your Indian Police Service exam.

There will be no issue.. offcource China will be concerend about their citizens but they will be sentenced after the trail only and they can prove their innocence there..

and now my question when you give a job to the engineer to build a house and it falls in to your family in the second day after finishing..who will you blame?who are you going to complain against?

I would first examine whether it was an accident or a deliberate act. I am a human being... I cannot go beyond my rational sense.

 

[toxic_pus]

Some of you called me a Nepali Maoist, some used to call me Pakistani before, now you are calling me Bangladeshi Muslim!!!

Neither I live in india, nor am I a Nepali or Bangladeshi.... I am what I am... here I am as Communist which is my username...

What is your problem? If you have education then refute my points, why are you getting personal? Why do you want to discover my personal identity?

What the hell? You want to threaten me? What do you mean by big brother watching...?

Scoundrel.... how can you call me a Bangladeshi Muslim what I am not, who gave you the right to call me whatever you want...?

Also you must understand what individual rights mean.

I am now calling you a scoundrel... Go report the mods... let them decide who first got personal....

And you are threatening me... how dare you...?

I could have reported your post, but I am calling you scoundrel so that you would do that for me... I want you to report the post.


Dear Mods,

This is an open internet forum. Here all the members's identities are virtual. Here members come to share their free opinions and participate in debates. But can you tell me why some people should get personal and why some other people should tolerate them? If anyone wants to attack anyone, he can attack the post, what is the point of attacking the poster?

Just read the post of toxic pus and tell me from which angle the post was made to refute my point. That poster even quoted me copying one of my posts from a different thread and making his post entirely off topic, insulting and threatening. Now, why should I tolerate insult and threat?

If you allow such postings then next time I would like to get personal with members with whom I disagree and start insulting and threatening. If toix pus is allowed to impose imagined religious identities on other members, then you have to allow me to do so to other members if you believe in equal rights.

Can you please tell me why should not any action be taken against toxic pus for such post?

Regards,

Netaji used to say, 'If the Brits are praising me, then I must have done something wrong. If they are cursing me, then I must have done something right'.

Your hissy fit tells me that I must have said something right.

Relax. I don't report any thread unless it is derogatory to my country. You can say anything to me. I wear a rhino's skin.

Irony 101.

The person who makes the following post...

No... just let me know your physical features... You make fun of a Mongoloid woman... let me know about you...

Describe your own nose, eyes, hair type and color, skin color, height...

...complains...

Why do you want to discover my personal identity?

You remain the same.

 

[toxic_pus]

Section 299 of IPC is the charging section and is slapped evertime there is manslaughter. That is the standard practice.

It will be the job of the defense attorney to disprove Mens Rea.

Move on already.

 

[Communist]

Netaji used to say, 'If the Brits are praising me, then I must have done something wrong. If they are cursing me, then I must have done something right'.

Your hissy fit tells me that I must have said something right.

Relax. I don't report any thread unless it is derogatory to my country. You can say anything to me. I wear a rhino's skin.

Irony 101.

The person who makes the following post...

...complains...

You remain the same.

Again another off topic insulting post.

I dont have the energy and time to use derogatory words against your country. I will not earn a penny doing so. Yes I do criticize your country's policies and may be some internal affairs also as I criticize some policies of even China's CPC!! But you cannot see that.

And if I ever used criticism that goes against your country, I certainly did not say that myself, I must have used some one's criticism. For example, once I opened a thread titled "RAW the Rascal", but read the concerned post and tell me whether it was me who said RAW the Rascal or some other person who said RAW the Rascal.

Actually, you guys are not well educated, you guys now can afford internet and so you start thinking that you are super wise persons. You use some insulting words that are not allowed in any civic society. Here you are deliberately posting off topic insulting comments and you do not feel ashamed. You are boasting instead...!!! Excellent... !!!

Here mods tolerate you, but go to any other forum apart from your BR, and see how long mods take to kick you out...

 

[Communist]

Section 299 of IPC is the charging section and is slapped evertime there is manslaughter. That is the standard practice.

It will be the job of the defense attorney to disprove Mens Rea.

Move on already.

And what about IPC Section 302?

 

[Iggy]

Thanks. And sorry for the delayed reply from me.

No problem..And also let me be clear to you.i mean by real engineers means the engineers with sound knowledge of what they are doing..

Of course they had responsibility. Of course the concerned responsibility is professional responsibility in the real sense of the term. Of course they should have known the real strength. But real strength of what? Of course the real strength of the materials (sand, bricks, iron rods, cement etc etc) to build the chimney. Of course the materials they used were not brought from China or from any foreign country. Of course, the materials they used were bought in India.

Now we should remember that they went to India from China empty handed. They had a structural design to build a chimney. They hired laborers from India. They bought materials from India. How could they be sure that the materials they were buying in a foreign land do not have the real strength? How could they be sure that the materials the were going to use would not lead to the collapse of the chimney? Similarly, how could they be sure that the materials would have the real strength required for the chimney? And how could they be sure that the materials would lead to the fatal collapse of the chimney?

If you insist they were sure about all these predications, then you are saying that they went to India and then somehow acquired the information regarding some construction materials that would not have the strength and would therefore lead to a fatal collapse.

Had they been able to know that before, they would not have been working till the collapse of the chimney because they would have the minimum common sense that they might get arrested and tried. But they were working till the collapse of the chimney and this clearly indicates that they did not have the knowledge or information about the genuineness of the materials used for the construction of the chimney.

Now please do not say, every real engineer (as you used the term) first need to examine the materials in a laboratory after buying them from the market. Every real engineer has to depend on the materials while buying them from the market with the predications that those materials would not lead to any unfortunate incident. And in this case, those engineers, no matter how much you paid, were working in a foreign land and had to depend on the suppliers of materials as well as assistant engineers who work in the field and laborers. And all of such helping hands were from India. You get my point?

Brother every materials they wanted for the construction is supplied by the parties who quote the right price and right quality.. ..there is a large no of suppliers with different qualities and different prices..its up to the firm to select the right raw materials which suited to them..and even if you still think that its the fault of raw materials,they can proove that in court easliy..The trial is not for time pass dude..

You are right. Companies do third rate activities. But it is highly unlikely that a foreign company after getting a tender to build a chimney in a foreign land would even dare to do these illegal things. As a side note I can say, every company has a budget for every project. It is not like you have a non-stop supply of money and so you just continue your construction project without any budget.

Those Chinese engineers definitely had a budget and they tried to finish the construction staying within the budget. They had to rely on the quality or standard on the materials as they could afford to buy from the market. And as I have said already, they could not predict that the materials they were buying according to their budget would prove to be substandard, specially in a foreign land.

Now tell me, if you still insist that they had the knowledge of the standard of the materials, are not the producers as well as suppliers of the sub-standard materials also guilty? Should police also arrest the cement company's owners, the sand-pebbles suppliers, iron rod producers, and all the producers of all concerned materials?

mate as i said the company with low rate quoted won the tender to construct the chimney now its up to them to construct it below the quoted rates so that they can get some profit..No company is working for charity ..And as for the quality of the raw materials i answered you above

Engineers cannot predict the strength of the building, there is no such measurement yet invented. They have to rely on the strength of the materials and read my above mentioned lines to know whether it was possible for them to know at all in a foreign land.

You used the word bad luck and bad luck is something that one can hardly avoid.

Brother i used bad luck because every company uses some unethical practices to increase their profits..but not every one is caught doing it Its bad luck for these engineers that they got caught due to the collapse of the chimney ..Also you have to take notice that if we dont use the raw materials in the right mixture it will also affect the strength of the building ..

They were responsible for the construction of the chimney, but were they responsible for any unwanted accident? I do not know why the Indian police charged them with culpable homicide, if i could proceed in the court, I would first question the irresponsible charge. And about Indian police... what can I say... you know how much educated and intelligent they are. You know how much qualification is needed for appearing in your Indian Police Service exam.

Toxic pus answered you about this..and for Police service exam its very hard to pass a civil service exams..you have to go through different exams and interviews..I had concussion seeing the preliminary books of it ...

I would first examine whether it was an accident or a deliberate act. I am a human being... I cannot go beyond my rational sense.

Then good for you..

 

[Communist]

No problem..And also let me be clear to you.i mean by real engineers means the engineers with sound knowledge of what they are doing..

Its OK. But the term should have been professional instead of real. For example, when you pass the final semester of your civil engineering, you become a civil engineer who is supposed to have all the required knowledge, and when you come to the market with the degree, you are a professional civil engineer.

Your use of the term real is actually misleading as it has a double meaning. Because the opposite word of real engineer stands for artificial engineer...

Anyway, I guess, you did not mean that.

Brother every materials they wanted for the construction is supplied by the parties who quote the right price and right quality.. ..there is a large no of suppliers with different qualities and different prices..its up to the firm to select the right raw materials which suited to them..and even if you still think that its the fault of raw materials,they can proove that in court easliy..The trial is not for time pass dude..

Thats exactly what I wanted to say.

OK, let me clarify my point to some extent more. Any kind of heavy engineering is a team work. Here division of labor is as important as the chain of supply lines.

Suppose you are a civil engineer working for a company, your company got a tender and you come to China to say build a flyover. Now what should you do first? You need to hire laborers, you need to advertise asking all the well reputed suppliers to contact you so that you can select one of them to supply you the required materials according to your budget. Now, you are a foreigner and you do not know whether the suppliers are going to cheat you or not. You have to rely on the reputation of the supplier. Now its a risky job and you have to depend on your luck. If you luck betrays then you are helpless. You have a time bound project and a budget. You need to keep in your minds the deadline as well as the certain amount of money.

Now, above you is your boss, the manager who will be pressurizing you all the time to finish the project as early as possible and within budget. Now think of your condition. It was easy for the Indian police to detain anyone with charges, but was it that much easy for those engineers to work in the project?

mate as i said the company with low rate quoted won the tender to construct the chimney now its up to them to construct it below the quoted rates so that they can get some profit..No company is working for charity ..And as for the quality of the raw materials i answered you above

I do not think in such big projects the concerned company needed to save some little amount of money cutting the budget short. The company before working on the project, calculates everything including their profit. Engineers only get salaries may be contract basis. But engineers do not need to use substandard materials so that they can earn some extra money without being noticed by the company manager. Well, it generally happens, I could be wrong though, as I said I do not know the modus operandi in this case.

Brother i used bad luck because every company uses some unethical practices to increase their profits..but not every one is caught doing it Its bad luck for these engineers that they got caught due to the collapse of the chimney ..Also you have to take notice that if we dont use the raw materials in the right mixture it will also affect the strength of the building ..

Your Govt should have sent an inspection team for routine checking of the ongoing project. In every heavy engineering project, supervisors are recruited to examine the development of the work. But your point makes it appear that some foreign company got the tender and then went to India and then work on the project with unlimited freedom or liberty. Now it sounds absurd...!!


Well, its too early to say what will happen to those three engineers, lets see what happens next. But I hope they as human beings get a fair trial, sufficient judicial aid for their defense and good treatment. And hope the charges came from proper investigation, hope the charges are not fabricated out of hostility.

Thanks.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

Read my above post and tell me the questions:

Section 299. Culpable homicide says:

Who ever causes death by doing an act with the intention of causing death, or with the intention of causing such bodily injury as is likely to cause death, or with the knowledge that he is likely by such act to cause death, commits the offence of culpable homicide.

First forget everything, just answer from your common sense.

1. Do you believe those three Chinese engineers had the intention of causing death or bodily injury while building the chimney?

2. Can any professional engineer think of having such intention which might bring serious charges against him and bring a bad reputation to the company concerned?

3. How can you be so sure that they had the knowledge that they are likely by such act to cause death?

4. Even if you believe they are responsible, how can you say their act was a deliberate one, since culpable homicide says the person involved must have the intention or knowledge?

5. If you still believe that they had the intention or knowledge before working on the project, then you are saying that their intention was not to build the chimney but to cause death. And if it be so, then you are labeling very serious charges against them, you are saying they have gone to India just to cause death, not to build anything. Consequently one can then claim the concerned company itself had the plan to cause death, and subsequently, since the company is from China, one can go further by claiming that, China has the intention to cause death.

Can you imagine, how much serious the issue might become?

And if you cannot not believe, then it was just an accident. And accident is accident where none should be held responsible.

I do not know the modus operandi as I am not dealing with the case, but from the news reports it is clear that there should be an investigation to discover the real causes of the collapse. There could be a conspiracy, there could be negligence on part of the laborers, there could be some unfortunate happenings.

Crime and criminology is not that simple dude, there are many dimensions.

Did you read the recent news that was posted here, seems they SCAPEGOATED a Korean national for the same "alleged" crime. Indians build faulty structures which have a horrendous track record of collapses, yet they blame the FOREIGNERS. Dude, have a look at Korea, Japan, China, Taiwan, Malaysia, etc, do you see the horrendous track record of collapses there??? NO you don't.

Continue with your witch-hunt and scapegoating. When you mistreat dignified foreigners who come in earnest to help build your nation or tourists interest in experience the "Incredible India" --- but instead they experience RAPE, discrimination and FALSE ACCUSATIONS leading to being tried in a KANGAROO COURT and MURDERED --- do you know the tens of millions of Japanese people who now know about how your police officer watched while 2 japanese ladies were being raped in public, during one of India's "holiest" celebrations. When you beat and rape and steal from foreign tourists and business people, yet you complain about the same being done to your people. That is called being a HYPOCRITE.

So go ahead. Go and scape goat them. Go and murder them.

Do it. Do it and you will see no one will be willing to help pull you out of your misery and backwardness. The decision you can decide, but the outcome you won't be able to control. Do it and your cries against attacks you suffer in Australia will fall on deaf ears, as your very own GOI behaved in even worse cruel behavior.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

Thanks. And sorry for the delayed reply from me.



Of course they had responsibility. Of course the concerned responsibility is professional responsibility in the real sense of the term. Of course they should have known the real strength. But real strength of what? Of course the real strength of the materials (sand, bricks, iron rods, cement etc etc) to build the chimney. Of course the materials they used were not brought from China or from any foreign country. Of course, the materials they used were bought in India.

Now we should remember that they went to India from China empty handed. They had a structural design to build a chimney. They hired laborers from India. They bought materials from India. How could they be sure that the materials they were buying in a foreign land do not have the real strength? How could they be sure that the materials the were going to use would not lead to the collapse of the chimney? Similarly, how could they be sure that the materials would have the real strength required for the chimney? And how could they be sure that the materials would lead to the fatal collapse of the chimney?

If you insist they were sure about all these predications, then you are saying that they went to India and then somehow acquired the information regarding some construction materials that would not have the strength and would therefore lead to a fatal collapse.

Had they been able to know that before, they would not have been working till the collapse of the chimney because they would have the minimum common sense that they might get arrested and tried. But they were working till the collapse of the chimney and this clearly indicates that they did not have the knowledge or information about the genuineness of the materials used for the construction of the chimney.

Now please do not say, every real engineer (as you used the term) first need to examine the materials in a laboratory after buying them from the market. Every real engineer has to depend on the materials while buying them from the market with the predications that those materials would not lead to any unfortunate incident. And in this case, those engineers, no matter how much you paid, were working in a foreign land and had to depend on the suppliers of materials as well as assistant engineers who work in the field and laborers. And all of such helping hands were from India. You get my point?




You are right. Companies do third rate activities. But it is highly unlikely that a foreign company after getting a tender to build a chimney in a foreign land would even dare to do these illegal things. As a side note I can say, every company has a budget for every project. It is not like you have a non-stop supply of money and so you just continue your construction project without any budget.

Those Chinese engineers definitely had a budget and they tried to finish the construction staying within the budget. They had to rely on the quality or standard on the materials as they could afford to buy from the market. And as I have said already, they could not predict that the materials they were buying according to their budget would prove to be substandard, specially in a foreign land.

Now tell me, if you still insist that they had the knowledge of the standard of the materials, are not the producers as well as suppliers of the sub-standard materials also guilty? Should police also arrest the cement company's owners, the sand-pebbles suppliers, iron rod producers, and all the producers of all concerned materials?




Engineers cannot predict the strength of the building, there is no such measurement yet invented. They have to rely on the strength of the materials and read my above mentioned lines to know whether it was possible for them to know at all in a foreign land.

You used the word bad luck and bad luck is something that one can hardly avoid.





Already answered.




They were responsible for the construction of the chimney, but were they responsible for any unwanted accident? I do not know why the Indian police charged them with culpable homicide, if i could proceed in the court, I would first question the irresponsible charge. And about Indian police... what can I say... you know how much educated and intelligent they are. You know how much qualification is needed for appearing in your Indian Police Service exam.




I would first examine whether it was an accident or a deliberate act. I am a human being... I cannot go beyond my rational sense.

You missed a big piece of evidence. It is not the material that is the main cause of the accident, rather the actual labour.

Do you know the tiny little Indian Metro, the PRIDE of all of India, since it began construction in 1998, over a 100 people have died from construction failures!!!!!!

India has no good track record. They "engineers" are incompetent. They lack the experience, and they hire UNSKILLED locals from states like Bihar because they are CHEAP and can cut corners and POCKET THE MONEY. These are the real reasons for India's horrid track record of structural collapses.

Come the CWG 2010, they better PRAY that none of the buildings or bridges or metro doesn't collapse and kill hundreds and thousands. These relatively simple buildings were supposed to be completed AT LEAST one year, so tests and foreign athletes can come to train. Yet what happened??? Instead so many work place accidents and deaths occured, and have been swept under the rug. Luckily this has been documented by local Indian labour rights groups.

 

[Red Dwarf]

Did you read the recent news that was posted here, seems they SCAPEGOATED a Korean national for the same "alleged" crime. Indians build faulty structures which have a horrendous track record of collapses, yet they blame the FOREIGNERS. Dude, have a look at Korea, Japan, China, Taiwan, Malaysia, etc, do you see the horrendous track record of collapses there??? NO you don't.

Continue with your witch-hunt and scapegoating. When you mistreat dignified foreigners who come in earnest to help build your nation or tourists interest in experience the "Incredible India" --- but instead they experience RAPE, discrimination and FALSE ACCUSATIONS leading to being tried in a KANGAROO COURT and MURDERED --- do you know the tens of millions of Japanese people who now know about how your police officer watched while 2 japanese ladies were being raped in public, during one of India's "holiest" celebrations. When you beat and rape and steal from foreign tourists and business people, yet you complain about the same being done to your people. That is called being a HYPOCRITE.

So go ahead. Go and scape goat them. Go and murder them.

Do it. Do it and you will see no one will be willing to help pull you out of your misery and backwardness. The decision you can decide, but the outcome you won't be able to control. Do it and your cries against attacks you suffer in Australia will fall on deaf ears, as your very own GOI behaved in even worse cruel behavior.

I assume that you got your personal satisfaction by this post.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

NGOs voice concern over workers death at CWG sites


File photo of Metro workers and rescue men near the collapsed cranes which tumbled at the Jamrudpur.
PTI-Press Trust of India


# Anurag Sharma
New Delhi, Sept 30


With the national capital furiously gearing up to meet the deadlines of the Commonwealth Games, the alarming number of deaths of construction workers in absence of proper safety norms and adequate compensation is a cause of concern, say social activists.

The actual number of accidents and casualties are much more but many such cases never get reported, they add.

Fifty nine construction workers were killed and 115 suffered serious injuries in the city during the year 2008-2009, according to Commonwealth Games Citizens for Workers, Women and Children (CWG-CWC), an independent agency, which documents fatalities amongst construction workers in the capital.

"Workers on CWG are being made to work 12 hours at stretch to meet the deadlines, which is a complete violation of the Construction workers act of 1996 which recommends a 48 hour working cycle per week," says Subhash Bhatanagar, who heads Nirman Mazdoor Panchayat Sangam (NMPS), a NGO.

"Unlike metro rail construction sites, deaths at other CWG sites are in isolated place and mostly unreported. According to our survey, most of the contractors don't follow the safety norms," he adds.

As per Building and Construction Workers Act, the employers are supposed to ensure checking and testing of equipment and machinery deployed at the sites, occupational health hazards and stress among workers at construction sites.

The activists also wonder whether the kin of deceased labourers have been compensated as per workers act. "Delhi Construction Workers Welfare Board was constituted in 2002, but none of the construction workers, not even a single one, has got any death compensation from the Rs 300 crore plus cess collected by the Board for such emergency relief because none of their workers is registered with the Board," says Bhatanagar.

Industry insiders say the normal practice in the construction industry is that after an accident all the relatives of the victims are immediately made to disappear from the accident site. Thus making it impossible to ascertain if the compensation has been paid. In these circumstances there is absolutely no question of the compensation being paid in accordance with the construction workers Act," they say.

The Delhi Human Development Report of 2006 suggested that there were around two to three lakh construction workers in Delhi but CWG-CWC estimates that there are about 8-10 lakh workers presently in the capital, largely migrants brought in from Uttar Pradesh, Bihar, Chhattisgarh and Jharkhand by contractors and sub-contractors.

"There are supposed to be safety committees with worker representation and qualified safety officers for every establishment employing 500 or more workers. But none of the provisions of the Act has ever been followed in any of the construction sites," says Kanarindhana, Research and Campaign Officer, CWG-CWC.

During 2002 to 2008, 290 deaths and 481 injuries were reported from construction sites, reveals NMPS data. According to a report by the People's Union for Democratic Rights (PUDR), an Indian civil rights group, thousands of workers are not being paid the minimum wages due to them and have been working in extremely unsafe and inhuman conditions, especially at the construction site near Yamuna river bed.

"None of the workers employed by the contractors is paid the legally stipulated minimum wages or overtime. Unskilled workers are paid Rs. 85 to 100 per day as against the stipulated minimum wages of Rs. 142 for eight hours of work. Workers are made to work all seven days a week on normal wages and are not given any leave," says Moushumi Basu, Secretary, PUDR.

The PUDR report claimed labourers had to share 10ft by10ft brick huts between six to eight people. The rooms, which have tin roofs, have no fans.

There were unreported deaths of more than 100 construction workers at the CWG Village due to outbreak of Meningitis last year due to unhygienic living conditions, says Kanarindhana. "Workers on Commonwealth Games project are being made to work 12 hours at a stretch. This is in complete violation of the Construction Workers Act of 1996 which recommends a 48-hour working cycle per week," she says.

A study by Building and Woodworkers International (BWI), a global union with members in construction industry, estimated that 300,000 workers will be needed for this level (CWG) of activity, over 3 years. Among them will be 100,000 unskilled construction workers, at least 5,000 of whom will be women, and their 10,000 migrant children. In all, 5 lakh jobs are likely to be created in Games related activities (airlines, airports,tourism, transport, etc).

"Children and families of the migrant construction workers are not at all taken care of at most of the sites. Infact having children or women deprives work availability at few sites. Medical facilities, Schooling, Maternity homes and other basic equipments are not available at most of the sites. There are one or two 'show piece sites' but generally no such facilities are available," says Bhatanagar.

The high profile Delhi Metro construction sites are also no stranger to accidents. According to Urban Development ministry report, more than 100 people, including 93 labourers, have died in accidents at sites of the Delhi Metro since October 1998 when the construction started.

The report also said that the Delhi Metro has no policy to provide employment to the dependents of the person who die in accidents at the construction sites.

 

[notsuperstitious]

Again another off topic insulting post.

I dont have the energy and time to use derogatory words against your country. I will not earn a penny doing so. Yes I do criticize your country's policies and may be some internal affairs also as I criticize some policies of even China's CPC!! But you cannot see that.

And if I ever used criticism that goes against your country, I certainly did not say that myself, I must have used some one's criticism. For example, once I opened a thread titled "RAW the Rascal", but read the concerned post and tell me whether it was me who said RAW the Rascal or some other person who said RAW the Rascal.

Actually, you guys are not well educated, you guys now can afford internet and so you start thinking that you are super wise persons. You use some insulting words that are not allowed in any civic society. Here you are deliberately posting off topic insulting comments and you do not feel ashamed. You are boasting instead...!!! Excellent... !!!

Here mods tolerate you, but go to any other forum apart from your BR, and see how long mods take to kick you out...

Taimikhan and Agnostic muslim - communist is Indian, posts from India.

I dont live in india.... I traveled to india many times.

I'm pure chinese

I'm a hindu brahmin

Moderators - its against policies to fake one's national identity, many members have been banned in the past for this, this is why the issue of this commie fellows true identity comes up and he comes up with different answers everytime

low life, slimey, coward? I don't know, has a long leash, yes.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

Moderators - its against policies to fake one's national identity, many members have been banned in the past for this, this is why the issue of this commie fellows true identity comes up and he comes up with different answers everytime

low life, slimey, coward? I don't know, has a long leash, yes.

It's is the Indian members who repeatedly fake identities with the INTENTION to create mistrust between nations and peoples. Has Communist ever done that?

Also, the REAL reason so many Indians are debating his racial background is because....... they really believe he is indeed an Indian (or at least some South Asian like "Nepali Maoist" or "Bangladeshi Muslim") and cannot take the possibility that one of their "own" could be so much against them. They think he may be some lower class or perhaps a Naxalite, and the thought of having an insider working against them, drives these Hindus mad. These insecure Indians do not believe him when he says he is pure-blood Chinese. The thought of an Indian so strongly supporting China is to them unforgivable!

That is the real reason Communist gets under their skin.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

Its OK. But the term should have been professional instead of real. For example, when you pass the final semester of your civil engineering, you become a civil engineer who is supposed to have all the required knowledge, and when you come to the market with the degree, you are a professional civil engineer.

Your use of the term real is actually misleading as it has a double meaning. Because the opposite word of real engineer stands for artificial engineer...

Anyway, I guess, you did not mean that.



Thats exactly what I wanted to say.

OK, let me clarify my point to some extent more. Any kind of heavy engineering is a team work. Here division of labor is as important as the chain of supply lines.

Suppose you are a civil engineer working for a company, your company got a tender and you come to China to say build a flyover. Now what should you do first? You need to hire laborers, you need to advertise asking all the well reputed suppliers to contact you so that you can select one of them to supply you the required materials according to your budget. Now, you are a foreigner and you do not know whether the suppliers are going to cheat you or not. You have to rely on the reputation of the supplier. Now its a risky job and you have to depend on your luck. If you luck betrays then you are helpless. You have a time bound project and a budget. You need to keep in your minds the deadline as well as the certain amount of money.

Now, above you is your boss, the manager who will be pressurizing you all the time to finish the project as early as possible and within budget. Now think of your condition. It was easy for the Indian police to detain anyone with charges, but was it that much easy for those engineers to work in the project?




I do not think in such big projects the concerned company needed to save some little amount of money cutting the budget short. The company before working on the project, calculates everything including their profit. Engineers only get salaries may be contract basis. But engineers do not need to use substandard materials so that they can earn some extra money without being noticed by the company manager. Well, it generally happens, I could be wrong though, as I said I do not know the modus operandi in this case.




Your Govt should have sent an inspection team for routine checking of the ongoing project. In every heavy engineering project, supervisors are recruited to examine the development of the work. But your point makes it appear that some foreign company got the tender and then went to India and then work on the project with unlimited freedom or liberty. Now it sounds absurd...!!


Well, its too early to say what will happen to those three engineers, lets see what happens next. But I hope they as human beings get a fair trial, sufficient judicial aid for their defense and good treatment. And hope the charges came from proper investigation, hope the charges are not fabricated out of hostility.

Thanks.

Charges will be fabricated out of hostility, prejudice and hatred if the past is any indication. India's kangaroo courts is notoriously known around the world, much worse than places like Somalia. At least in Somalia they look at actual evidence.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

Did you read the recent news that was posted here, seems they SCAPEGOATED a Korean national for the same "alleged" crime. Indians build faulty structures which have a horrendous track record of collapses, yet they blame the FOREIGNERS. Dude, have a look at Korea, Japan, China, Taiwan, Malaysia, etc, do you see the horrendous track record of collapses there??? NO you don't.

Continue with your witch-hunt and scapegoating. When you mistreat dignified foreigners who come in earnest to help build your nation or tourists interest in experience the "Incredible India" --- but instead they experience RAPE, discrimination and FALSE ACCUSATIONS leading to being tried in a KANGAROO COURT and MURDERED --- do you know the tens of millions of Japanese people who now know about how your police officer watched while 2 japanese ladies were being raped in public, during one of India's "holiest" celebrations. When you beat and rape and steal from foreign tourists and business people, yet you complain about the same being done to your people. That is called being a HYPOCRITE.

So go ahead. Go and scape goat them. Go and murder them.

Do it. Do it and you will see no one will be willing to help pull you out of your misery and backwardness. The decision you can decide, but the outcome you won't be able to control. Do it and your cries against attacks you suffer in Australia will fall on deaf ears, as your very own GOI behaved in even worse cruel behavior.

Let me also add, that the ONLY foreigners who shown real genuine interest in building your nation are other Asians, mainly Chinese, Koreans and Japanese. Do you see other foreigners take such risks in India? No you don't.

Without us, your power projects (hydro, gas-turbine, etc), water purification, sewage treatment, industrial, telecom infrastructure, etc will go to the wayside. Your people will die of lack of sanitary water and sewage, and be deprived of basic modern technological advances. India Shining will lose its lustre. Incredible India will become Incredulous India. If you think you are hurting us, you are hurting yourselves even more. India is known as a 'cost-competitive', in other words it is India that is reaping the majority of the benefits from such trade, commerce and cooperation. As such, it is India that stands the most to lose.