The US-China tech war has forced a Chinese smartphone maker to halt production

[Götterdämmerung]

I have an idea and I would name it Fair Reciprocity on Export and Import Treatment (FREIT).

As the US regime bans export of chips to ZTE, all China has to do is invoking FREIT.

What is FREIT? FREIT stipulates that China can retaliate to ban the import of certain products of the same nature as its own company is not allowed to import, e.g. Apple is not allowed to import certain chips for its production into China from the US. All that happens without outright banning Apple from operating in China. China is just conducting FREIT.

 

[Viet]

this is atually good news. you are forcing ZTE to innovate and produce its own chips(though i think Huawei's Kirin will simply move in to fill the gap)- it has the same effect as the Western arms embargo.

The US demands opening up of China's financial sector to Rothschild domination like the rest of the world- that's not possible for reasons of national security national security.

Huawei's Kirin consists of 8-core CPU: 4x Cortex A73 and 4x A53. the first comes from ARM, the second from Qualcomm. the graphic ship comes from ARM: Mali-G72. All western technologies. Correct me if I am wrong. How can you circumvent Western sanctions?

Not sure whether the dual image processing chip comes from Huawei R&D or just imported.

Huawei most credit: it masters 10nm technology by bringing 5.5 billion transistors on a 1 square cm space.

 

[Beast]

The supposedly domestic supercomputer Taihu-Light is also a highly specialized system, and its existence doesn't overshadow the (behind-the-scenes) reality of overwhelming Chinese dependence on American technologies for day-to-day operations in practice.

ZTE, Huawei, BATX (Baidu, Alibaba, Tencent, Xiaomi), Didi (China’s Uber), ICBC, Bank of China, China Mobile, China Telecom, Petro China, SAIC Motor and many others rely American technologies (components, software and intellectual properties) to function. Notable American/Western suppliers include Apple, 3M, AMD, Applied Materials, Cisco, Corning, Google, Intel, Micron, Microsoft, Qualcomm, Seagate and Western Digital.

ZTE episode has shook the Chinese state to the core, to the point that even Chinese primier Xi had to issue a statement and promise Chinese tech-independence drive.

However, statements are easy to make; implications are to be accounted for.

I get the impression that US is trying to extract concessions from China in the ongoing trade war between the two. A shot at ZTE has been fired to send a message. Huawei might be next on the line.

At this rate, China will have to reboot its economic order if it is to seek tech-independence. And this is an uncertain journey with implications for Chinese geopolitics.

I wish your country well at personal capacity but this doesn't imply that I will not speak my mind on various issues. Like it or not, a war with the US is not in the best interests of your country.

If Pakistan, UK, South Korea and Japan weren't cooperating with your country - YOUR country wouldn't be as strong as it is today.

Stick your pride in your pockets. And be thankful to those who have supported your country over the course of years.

That is not what u claimed. You claim China is totally dependent on US for CPU chips set which is totally proven wrong by me. You claimed Tianhe-2A removed US intel processor and it will become nothing which is another false statement. Tianhe-2A with modification will run with Loongso domestic produced chips.

China has long predicted that a big country like China cant depend on US or foreign for important CPU chips set. The loongson CPU program has long started many years ago. Do you know the Chinese beidou GPS, DF-21D missile, KJ-2000, Type052D destroyer, including all Chinese weapons and national data server are all using domestic made Loongson CPU?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loongson

The civilian sector is still using of US intel chips is through the blessing of China. Not becos the civilian sector has no domestic substitution. Just like the hollywood movie allow by CPC to be showed in China. Hollywood is now dependent on China market for growth. But can China do without hollywood movies? Of cos. This is to allow leverage against foreign countries. China cannot totally dont buy anything from other countries.We need to buy something to allow certain level of leverage when some situation comes.

Now the stupid American try burn the bridge, we will let them see who called the shot

 

[rott]

Huawei's Kirin consists of 8-core CPU: 4x Cortex A73 and 4x A53. the first comes from ARM, the second from Qualcomm. the graphic ship comes from ARM: Mali-G72. All western technologies. Correct me if I am wrong. How can you circumvent Western sanctions?

Not sure whether the dual image processing chip comes from Huawei R&D or just imported.

Huawei most credit: it masters 10nm technology by bringing 5.5 billion transistors on a 1 square cm space.

@xunzi

 

[j20blackdragon]

Qualcomm needs China more than China needs Qualcomm.

Nearly half of Qualcomm's (QCOM) sales were from China.
http://money.cnn.com/2015/07/27/investing/united-states-companies-exposure-china/index.html

Qualcomm, which tallies 64 percent of sales in China, could stand to lose a lot.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/04/25/qualcomm-earnings-q2-2018.html

China makes up nearly two-thirds of San Diego-based Qualcomm’s revenue.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/in-u-s-china-tech-rivalry-whose-side-is-qualcomm-on-1520943148

Chinese phone-makers have Hisilicon, MediaTek, and Spreadtrum.

Chinese consumers can even buy Samsung Galaxy powered by Exynos chips.

But who is Qualcomm going to sell to during the trade war with China? China is their largest customer. Use some common sense people.

 

[xunzi]

Huawei's Kirin consists of 8-core CPU: 4x Cortex A73 and 4x A53. the first comes from ARM, the second from Qualcomm. the graphic ship comes from ARM: Mali-G72. All western technologies. Correct me if I am wrong. How can you circumvent Western sanctions?

Not sure whether the dual image processing chip comes from Huawei R&D or just imported.

Huawei most credit: it masters 10nm technology by bringing 5.5 billion transistors on a 1 square cm space.

lol It's the little Vietnamese, what do they know about technology to begin with? They should be allow to only talk about pho, rice, banana stuff that are more easily recognized by Jungle people. LOL

This little Vietnamese doesn't understand that in the age of globalization, you source various components from different vendors to put in your products. It also mean the relationship is healthy as in if Western sanction China, they basically sanction themselves as they can't sell but also force China to adopt more of domestic chip builder design.

In this case Huawei, as a SoC designer, source their CPU architecture and GPU from ARM. Even Qualcomm source their CPU architecture from ARM. LOL With that said, IP components are "replaceable" by others or in-house custom built as was the case with Samsung using their own GPU and soon Apple/Huawei will follow the same. In fact, you can argue that the phone makers with the most vertical integration will be the one with the most success as they can control their path design and differentiate from others. Right now, you can argue that only Huawei, the phonemaker, who has the most vertical integration, especially with the upcoming Kirin 980 where CPU will be source domestically by Capricorn, Modem by Huawei iself. I repeat, currently no phonemakers have complete self-sufficiently yet. Though, it is important to know that the future Top 3 phonemaker are all doing in-house built and working toward complete freedom which mean the future for Qualcomm and ARM doesn't look very bright unless they enter the phonemaking business and compete with current Big 3 which are not possible for them due to lagging far behind in how to make a proper high-end phone. This is why they focus on being a chipmaker instead of competing in the public commercial domain.

 

[conworldus]

Facepalm is given when you spread false information. ARM licenses architecture and no... The Kirin cores are not from ARM or Qualcomm... Cortex is ARM licensed architecture, much like Intel x86 for PC. The information is open but to build on it for commercial purposes you need to pay ARM IP licensing fees. HiSilicon does NOT buy Qualcomm cores for Kirin. They are competitors.

Huawei's Kirin consists of 8-core CPU: 4x Cortex A73 and 4x A53. the first comes from ARM, the second from Qualcomm. the graphic ship comes from ARM: Mali-G72. All western technologies. Correct me if I am wrong. How can you circumvent Western sanctions?

Not sure whether the dual image processing chip comes from Huawei R&D or just imported.

Huawei most credit: it masters 10nm technology by bringing 5.5 billion transistors on a 1 square cm space.[/QUOTE

Huawei's Kirin consists of 8-core CPU: 4x Cortex A73 and 4x A53. the first comes from ARM, the second from Qualcomm. the graphic ship comes from ARM: Mali-G72. All western technologies. Correct me if I am wrong. How can you circumvent Western sanctions?

Not sure whether the dual image processing chip comes from Huawei R&D or just imported.

Huawei most credit: it masters 10nm technology by bringing 5.5 billion transistors on a 1 square cm space.

 

[jhungary]

Why you ignore the ZTE issue as one of the reasons??

Your point no 3 cannot be the reason of the Qualcomm stock price drop in April 2018 while EU fine was on January 2018; hence the fine by EU should be reflected in qualcomm stock price in Jan 2018. Investors will react soon after the announcement, thats the way stock price work in near efficient market (if you understand finance).

The fact I've given above has mentioned the ZTE one of the triple effect is very obvious, hence you can't ignore it.

I repost Triple Threat from other source:

TRIPLE THREAT
The ZTE issue could create a triple threat for Qualcomm: the loss of an important customer, rivals bolstered as they step in to fill the vacuum, and a potential hit as China looks to retaliate against the United States.
..........
Qualcomm’s shares dropped 1.7 percent on Monday. Smaller U.S. optical components firms such as the ZTE supplier Acacia Communications fell more steeply.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...s-zte-another-blow-for-qualcomm-idUSKBN1HO0XT​

And why you cannot accept it could be Not because of ZTE? I am just providing an alternative to the reason.

Again, as I said, 1.7% is nothing.

Not as long as you imagine.

In fact they already have smartphones products with Mediatek and even with Aliyun. Once China ban Qualcomm and Android products, chinese consumers will have no choice than buying Chinese smartphones with mediatek/kirin/speadtrum/S2 and aliyun or other chinese OS.

6 chinese smartphones maker has released smartphone with Aliyun 5 years ago:
https://www.techinasia.com/alibaba-rebrands-aliyun-yunos-new-phones

That indicate that the aliyun ecosystem might have been ready.

You know there is a reason why Chinese government do nothing and let ZTE die, right?

Of course you can go back to use all Chinese system, that would be a giant step backward.

There is a reason why Huawei still use android based system instead of using Aliyun, guesss to venture and guess what ?

You say goodby to foreign market? Chinese doesnt want, but remember this is must be due to US ban on supply of technology to all chinese makers right? In that scenario - Chinese makers will loose foreign market but still can survive with her huge market with government help by banning other foreign smartphone with US tech content, while US qualcomm etc will die because chinese smartphone maker are their major clients, thats why I said US will loose more and china get something (self reliance ecosystem)

There are no "self-Reliance" system on earth. Again, China was not a big market in US eyes before it open, did US died back then? China is a big market, but compare to the world? It's still small. Isolationist is never a good idea. If you live in China during 1950s to 1970s and you will know. Again, this is the reason why nobody is doing anything, no changes toward the Chinese mobile ecosystem, no retaliation over US product over this.

Thinking otherwise (China is bigger than the world) is nothing but a egoistic maniac. Because you are saying world cannot survive without China. That's BS to begin with.

That couldn't be the reason. This is business, every body want revenue.

In fact the Qualcomm ban will be good opportunity for Huawei and other vendors like mediatek, samsung, arm, xiaomi, etc. Huawei could make a bit different Kirin for other smartphone makers if they want to differentiate.

Huawei recent statement amid ZTE ban: that they will use kirin exclusively may apply for short term period due to limited current production capacity, or for political reason in order not to scare their competitors.



Chinese company doest want, but China government can control by impossing high tarriff for qualcom and high tax for android application, if US attack.

You ask why currently ZTE doesnt go to other suppliers? Very simple => Because if only ZTE alone use their all products with mediatek and alliyun , while their competitors (Huawei, Xiaomi, Vivo, Oppo, Lenovo, TCL, Meizu, One1, etc etc) are still can offer with Android, then consumers still prefer Android due to maturity of Android ecosystem, hence releasing all Aliyun smartphones is the same as committing suicide for ZTE at the current situation.

But if China ban Android & Qualcomm in her market, then ZTE's competitor and consumers has no choice than go for aliyun, mediatek/kirin/S2, etc.

But then China is not banning Qualcomm or Android now does it? You can paint me a rosy picture of what if when you never even get to that point. I mean, I can tell you Huawei will shit their pants if they were banned in the US, I can too paint you a rosy picture how US can get along without Huawei without any repercussion.

Fact is China didn't do shit regarding this, that mean what you are saying or thinking is a moot point. As much as I can discuss with you what if alien come and conquer the earth tomorrow.

LOL. That is your own (wrong) assumption. Because you dont know how company run business and have no clue about corporate financial practice.

As the matter of fact: if Qualcomm has got fund from issuance of bonds or stocks or get bank loan for the business expansion or for acquisition (NXP), hence Qualcomm should not deviate the fund for other purpose. It should be stated in the agreement with the bank or in the indenture of the bond. Hence the fund should not be used for other SBU (strategic business unit). The use of fund for other cashflow requirement will be Illegal!

Furthermore the loss or revenue drop should remain in that SBU (SOC), and the loss or revenue drop may not be cleared up with other incoming fund, hiding loss is manipulation and forgery. Then they have to release the P/L to investors and public. This loss should impact company market value hence the stock price should drop. However in the stock market usually investors are buying rumours or signals, hence the stock price will drop even before Qualcomm release Q2 P/L information, because investors has anticipated the potential decline of revenue due to this ban.

The bond did not cover operating cost of other department, it only used to cover the cost for such a acquisition. However, that does not mean the company is not reportable to the issuer of the bond the net loss (or future net loss incur) because that will impact the payment/repayment/interest on the bond itself. The bond may have been issued to Qualcomm, but it wasn't their money. So if and when Qualcomm hit big in the red, the issuer would have to know. Qualcomm themselves have to disclose the loss, otherwise it will violate the term of the bond.

I mean what if I lend your company money to buy another company but before you can do that, you go bust? The bnak have to know the financial situation of a company before the transaction is finished. You cannot cover up other department even if your bond is not going to use for those department, because it matter when that decide your overall equity, and for which, decide whether or not I loan you the bond to buy NXT.

So, no, you are wrong.

If that is your definition of "being isolationist" then being isolationist is good for China and other country. As you can see China economy has grown fantastically by being issolationist (according to your own definition).

lol, whatever, you can always think China can survive being an isolationist. Since you don't even live there.

Again, there is a reason why actual Chinese government didn't do most of the stuff PDF member here say, and most of the stuff you say. If you cannot see the reason, then I can only say I am glad you are not in charge of Chinese government.[/quote][/QUOTE]

 

[Viet]

lol It's the little Vietnamese, what do they know about technology to begin with? They should be allow to only talk about pho, rice, banana stuff that are more easily recognized by Jungle people. LOL

This little Vietnamese doesn't understand that in the age of globalization, you source various components from different vendors to put in your products. It also mean the relationship is healthy as in if Western sanction China, they basically sanction themselves as they can't sell but also force China to adopt more of domestic chip builder design.

In this case Huawei, as a SoC designer, source their CPU architecture and GPU from ARM. Even Qualcomm source their CPU architecture from ARM. LOL With that said, IP components are "replaceable" by others or in-house custom built as was the case with Samsung using their own GPU and soon Apple/Huawei will follow the same. In fact, you can argue that the phone makers with the most vertical integration will be the one with the most success as they can control their path design and differentiate from others. Right now, you can argue that only Huawei, the phonemaker, who has the most vertical integration, especially with the upcoming Kirin 980 where CPU will be source domestically by Capricorn, Modem by Huawei iself. I repeat, currently no phonemakers have complete self-sufficiently yet. Though, it is important to know that the future Top 3 phonemaker are all doing in-house built and working toward complete freedom which mean the future for Qualcomm and ARM doesn't look very bright unless they enter the phonemaking business and compete with current Big 3 which are not possible for them due to lagging far behind in how to make a proper high-end phone. This is why they focus on being a chipmaker instead of competing in the public commercial domain.

The first sentence with little Vietnamese knowing nothing you made proves you are just a troller. The second with jungle remark makes you to an idiot.

Actually I knew little to nothing about Huawei capacity of making CPU chips until coming to this thread. I googled some minutes because of a Chinese poster claiming the company can deliver CPU or chips made in China. It turns out Huawei is SoC maker, basically the company assembles major foreign components on Huawei chips. Zte uses estimated 80 to 90 percent foreign components. Can you tell me how much the percentage at Huawei?

If critical components are involved then a US ban on Huawei can bring the company down similar to the case of Zte.

Of course a sanction hurts everybody including Qualcomm and other US component maker. The question is who gets hurt more?

 

[xunzi]

The first sentence with little Vietnamese knowing nothing you made proves you are just a troller. The second with jungle remark makes you to an idiot.

Actually I knew little to nothing about Huawei capacity of making CPU chips until coming to this thread. I googled some minutes because of a Chinese poster claiming the company can deliver CPU or chips made in China. It turns out Huawei is SoC maker, basically the company assembles major foreign components on Huawei chips. Zte uses estimated 80 to 90 percent foreign components. Can you tell me how much the percentage at Huawei?

If critical components are involved then a US ban on Huawei can bring the company down similar to the case of Zte.

Of course a sanction hurts everybody including Qualcomm and other US component maker. The question is who gets hurt more?

When I speak the truth, I am trolling? LOL How am I trolling?

You are correct that you know very little about SoC maker. And no it's not about just assembling foreign components. That shows how you shouldn't be talking about technology when you live in the jungle. LOL If it was that easy to assemble components then we would have ALL phonemaker doing their own SoC design but you'll see only the Big 3 (Apple, Samsung, Huawei) are making their own SoC. And only Huawei/Apple are exclusively putting their SoC in their flagship phone.

And no, Huawei was granted license to use ARM architecture (think of it like building a house in a shape of a square). What you put in it is very different from other SoC makers but they all must contain a dining room, bedroom, bathroom, etc.. and conforming to the square shape. If ARM no longer want to grant their architecture to Huawei which is the stupidest thing a company can do, then it will be their loss as other alternative like open source SPARC, MIPS, Super-H will take over. In fact, our supercomputer is already using MIPS and show how powerful it can be! But why everyone use ARM architecture then you might ask? Well I teach you why. LOL It is because the ARm architecture license is cheap and easy to manufacture and contain instruction that is easily adoptable across different mobile operation system. LOL

 

[Viet]

When I speak the truth, I am trolling? LOL How am I trolling?

You are correct that you know very little about SoC maker. And no it's not about just assembling foreign components. That shows how you shouldn't be talking about technology when you live in the jungle. LOL If it was that easy to assemble components then we would have ALL phonemaker doing their own SoC design but you'll see only the Big 3 (Apple, Samsung, Huawei) are making their own SoC. And only Huawei/Apple are exclusively putting their SoC in their flagship phone.

And no, Huawei was granted license to use ARM architecture (think of it like building a house in a shape of a square). What you put in it is very different from other SoC makers but they all must contain a dining room, bedroom, bathroom, etc.. and conforming to the square shape. If ARM no longer want to grant their architecture to Huawei which is the stupidest thing a company can do, then it will be their loss as other alternative like open source SPARC, MIPS, Super-H will take over. In fact, our supercomputer is already using MIPS and show how powerful it can be! But why everyone use ARM architecture then you might ask? Well I teach you why. LOL It is because the ARm architecture license is cheap and easy to manufacture and contain instruction that is easily adoptable across different mobile operation system. LOL

oh I forgot. you are just a small chinese racist.

 

[antonius123]

And why you cannot accept it could be Not because of ZTE? I am just providing an alternative to the reason.

Again, as I said, 1.7% is nothing.

Because it doesnt make sense. As I said tt will impact qualcomm sales significantly.

In fax qualcomm plan to acquire NXP is positive news that could move qualcomm share upwards. China hold the acquisition was coming later after the ZTE case.

You know there is a reason why Chinese government do nothing and let ZTE die, right?

Of course you can go back to use all Chinese system, that would be a giant step backward.

There is a reason why Huawei still use android based system instead of using Aliyun, guesss to venture and guess what ?

Who said chinese government do nothing on ZTE? this is your assumption.

I have explain you why Huawei still use android => market demand. Dont you understand it?

There are no "self-Reliance" system on earth. Again, China was not a big market in US eyes before it open, did US died back then? China is a big market, but compare to the world? It's still small. Isolationist is never a good idea. If you live in China during 1950s to 1970s and you will know. Again, this is the reason why nobody is doing anything, no changes toward the Chinese mobile ecosystem, no retaliation over US product over this.

Thinking otherwise (China is bigger than the world) is nothing but a egoistic maniac. Because you are saying world cannot survive without China. That's BS to begin with.

You miss the point.

Nobody said issolasionist is a good idea.

But then China is not banning Qualcomm or Android now does it? You can paint me a rosy picture of what if when you never even get to that point. I mean, I can tell you Huawei will shit their pants if they were banned in the US, I can too paint you a rosy picture how US can get along without Huawei without any repercussion.

You miss the point again.

Because US has not yet embargo other chinese company yet. As I said, if US dare to embargo Huawei, Vivo, Oppo, Xiaomi, Lenovo, TCL, etc etc; most probably China will take advantage by banning all smartphone containing US technology to enter china, this is in order to protect Alliyun and Speadtrum/Mediatek.

LOL. US has already banned Huawei from her market, but Huawei is not shaken at all. In fact Huawei will ignore US market and getting big without US market.

Fact is China didn't do shit regarding this, that mean what you are saying or thinking is a moot point. As much as I can discuss with you what if alien come and conquer the earth tomorrow

Because US didn't dare to embargo /ban most chinese technology company from buying US technology (processor).

Dont be so stupid.

The bond did not cover operating cost of other department, it only used to cover the cost for such a acquisition. However, that does not mean the company is not reportable to the issuer of the bond the net loss (or future net loss incur) because that will impact the payment/repayment/interest on the bond itself. The bond may have been issued to Qualcomm, but it wasn't their money. So if and when Qualcomm hit big in the red, the issuer would have to know. Qualcomm themselves have to disclose the loss, otherwise it will violate the term of the bond.

You still dont understand.

The bond has been issued, the money has been collected, hence the bond cannot be cancelled anymore, and Qualcomm cannot be sued as long as they dont violate the terms in the indenture.

The fund from the bond is aimed for NXP acquisition, hence nothing to do with Qualcomm's other SBU's performance. As long as the new SBU (NXP under qualcomm) is good and can sustain the coupon and repayment.

Everything goes on as plan, and in case the new SBU (acquired NXP under qualcomm) doesnt go well and Qualcomm cannot repay the bond, then it is the risk of bondholder.

I mean what if I lend your company money to buy another company but before you can do that, you go bust? The bnak have to know the financial situation of a company before the transaction is finished. You cannot cover up other department even if your bond is not going to use for those department, because it matter when that decide your overall equity, and for which, decide whether or not I loan you the bond to buy NXT.

So, no, you are wrong.

What to be busted from qualcomm? are you accusing them do forgery hence not creditworthy?

Dont be idiotic, Qualcomm is still OK and far from bankruptcy, they are only threatened to be mediocre player in the future due to potential sales decline that make them cannot sustain same strong R&D.


[quote
lol, whatever, you can always think China can survive being an isolationist. Since you don't even live there.

Again, there is a reason why actual Chinese government didn't do most of the stuff PDF member here say, and most of the stuff you say. If you cannot see the reason, then I can only say I am glad you are not in charge of Chinese government.[/quote][/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

You are idiot. China has been surviving and getting stronger and stronger and threatening US position, though she is being issolationist (according to your own definition).

 

[Kai Liu]

Actually I knew little to nothing about Huawei capacity of making CPU chips until coming to this thread. I googled some minutes because of a Chinese poster claiming the company can deliver CPU or chips made in China. It turns out Huawei is SoC maker, basically the company assembles major foreign components on Huawei chips. Zte uses estimated 80 to 90 percent foreign components. Can you tell me how much the percentage at Huawei?

Huawei is a monster which possesses tons of patents, and USA can do nothing against it except ban it from the US market for "security concerns" which it never entered anyway... You little clown still knows nothing about Huawei but your Bphone shit...

If critical components are involved then a US ban on Huawei can bring the company down similar to the case of Zte.

Of course a sanction hurts everybody including Qualcomm and other US component maker. The question is who gets hurt more?

 

[jhungary]

Because it doesnt make sense. As I said tt will impact qualcomm sales significantly.

In fax qualcomm plan to acquire NXP is positive news that could move qualcomm share upwards. China hold the acquisition was coming later after the ZTE case.

Again, why it didn't make sense?

Can you be perfectly clear as to how to account for the share drop? Nobody can, hence making your point moot.

Who said chinese government do nothing on ZTE? this is your assumption.

I have explain you why Huawei still use android => market demand. Dont you understand it?

You know Chinese have banned Intel right in China? Why not Android? Why nothing is done on American parts, which up til today, still contribute to 25% of Huawei Phones and Up to May 9, 40% of ZTE phone according to their company public report.

Nothing is being done by Chinese government. And I did not assume anything ZTE publicly stated they have shut down their main operation (main operation, which mean everything, not just production) it is impossible for them to restart unless a serious capital inflow into the company, because at this point, ZTE have an business equity of 0.

If Chinese government would have did something, they would have done so BEFORE ZTE roll offline, not after.

You miss the point.
Nobody said issolasionist is a good idea.

If that is my point, why would I miss that? You have misinterpret my point, or this was not your point, you cannot say I miss my point then agree with what I said.

You miss the point again.

Because US has not yet embargo other chinese company yet. As I said, if US dare to embargo Huawei, Vivo, Oppo, Xiaomi, Lenovo, TCL, etc etc; most probably China will take advantage by banning all smartphone containing US technology to enter china, this is in order to protect Alliyun and Speadtrum/Mediatek.

LOL. US has already banned Huawei from her market, but Huawei is not shaken at all. In fact Huawei will ignore US market and getting big without US market.

US already have embargo Huawei and banning them from their contract.

It doesn't quite matter what Huawei perform well or not, if they do, good on them, if they aren't then better luck next year, the point is, Why China still in today, at probably the most adverse stage in telecommunication with the US did not start developing the Chinese system, when such system has already exist since 2014.

Because US didn't dare to embargo /ban most chinese technology company from buying US technology (processor).

Dont be so stupid.

You sure? Don't be stupid

1. ZTE
2. Micron
3. Fairchild

Just to name a few. As I said I have no intention to debate what US dare or not dare to do on you. As that is your personal opinion. I have my opinion that you don't dare to streak outside in the street, does that mean you have to streak outside to proof/disproof my opinion?

You still dont understand.

The bond has been issued, the money has been collected, hence the bond cannot be cancelled anymore, and Qualcomm cannot be sued as long as they dont violate the terms in the indenture.

The fund from the bond is aimed for NXP acquisition, hence nothing to do with Qualcomm's other SBU's performance. As long as the new SBU (NXP under qualcomm) is good and can sustain the coupon and repayment.

Everything goes on as plan, and in case the new SBU (acquired NXP under qualcomm) doesnt go well and Qualcomm cannot repay the bond, then it is the risk of bondholder.

Umm, it WASN'T THEIR (QUALCOMM) ASSET (MONEY).

If you know anything in accounting at all, it would still be in the bank account receivable. And in your account payable, which mean the transaction is continue and on going, it will still be the bank money, just because you can use it doesn't make it your cash. Try lending money from a bank and buy a house and using "This is my money" when you fail to repay your mortgage and sheriff show up and foreclose your house, see if that flies.

hence your whole argument is false, and to be honest, illegal, but hey, you do what you have to do, right? LOL.

What to be busted from qualcomm? are you accusing them do forgery hence not creditworthy?

Dont be idiotic, Qualcomm is still OK and far from bankruptcy, they are only threatened to be mediocre player in the future due to potential sales decline that make them cannot sustain same strong R&D.

That is about the overwatching of a loan in process in the western world, I am just showing you an example. Looks like you have no idea how loan works. Have you even ever bought a car or home with a bank loan?

You are idiot. China has been surviving and getting stronger and stronger and threatening US position, though she is being issolationist (according to your own definition).

lol, you call what happened during 1950 to late 1970 is surviving? I have personally know many people who talked about the hardship during those time, and those people are barely hanging on, some people they knew actually died over that. But then that was after some tough time, not just China is doing that, Germany, France, Britain, Japan, Korea, Austria, and everywhere that was affected by WW2 have the same background. Imagine that happens again today. Would you be able to survive another "Cultural Revolution"? Oh wait, you don't live in China.

 

[antonius123]

Again, why it didn't make sense?

Can you be perfectly clear as to how to account for the share drop? Nobody can, hence making your point moot.

I've told you many times => because it impact Qualcomm sales. Sales to ZTE is not small.

Link has been given to you. I dont understand why it is so difficult for you to understand this simple thing.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...s-zte-another-blow-for-qualcomm-idUSKBN1HO0XT
https://wccftech.com/qualcomm-half-a-billion-potential-loss-zte-ban/

You know Chinese have banned Intel right in China? Why not Android? Why nothing is done on American parts, which up til today, still contribute to 25% of Huawei Phones and Up to May 9, 40% of ZTE phone according to their company public report.

Nothing is being done by Chinese government. And I did not assume anything ZTE publicly stated they have shut down their main operation (main operation, which mean everything, not just production) it is impossible for them to restart unless a serious capital inflow into the company, because at this point, ZTE have an business equity of 0.

If Chinese government would have did something, they would have done so BEFORE ZTE roll offline, not after.

I've told you many times => because US has not dare to ban her tech to most China suppliers.

China did not ban intel, from where you heard that? Lenovo and other notebook brand have been selling with intel inside.

If that is my point, why would I miss that? You have misinterpret my point, or this was not your point, you cannot say I miss my point then agree with what I said.

I've told you issolationist in real definition is not good for trading and economy.

US already have embargo Huawei and banning them from their contract.

It doesn't quite matter what Huawei perform well or not, if they do, good on them, if they aren't then better luck next year, the point is, Why China still in today, at probably the most adverse stage in telecommunication with the US did not start developing the Chinese system, when such system has already exist since 2014.

Banning to US market idiot. But US not ban her technology (qualcomm etc) to Huawei. What we are talking here is banning the same way as US ban technology supply to ZTE.

Which system do you mean?

I've told you china has develop her own OS, and processor, did not you read it?

You sure? Don't be stupid

1. ZTE
2. Micron
3. Fairchild

Just to name a few. As I said I have no intention to debate what US dare or not dare to do on you. As that is your personal opinion. I have my opinion that you don't dare to streak outside in the street, does that mean you have to streak outside to proof/disproof my opinion?

LOL. You obviously can't distinguish ZTE case and other case (Micron & Fairchild) you mentioned above.

China has no trading/economic issue with the banning from acquisition.

Be a little bit smarter

Umm, it WASN'T THEIR (QUALCOMM) ASSET (MONEY).

If you know anything in accounting at all, it would still be in the bank account receivable. And in your account payable, which mean the transaction is continue and on going, it will still be the bank money, just because you can use it doesn't make it your cash. Try lending money from a bank and buy a house and using "This is my money" when you fail to repay your mortgage and sheriff show up and foreclose your house, see if that flies.

hence your whole argument is false, and to be honest, illegal, but hey, you do what you have to do, right? LOL.

LOL. It is you who doesnt understand accounting and finance and how bank work. For bank loan case, when it already booked as bank's account receivable or company's account payable, means the money has been disbursed to the company/borrower, and it is under the control of the company and they have even right to move the fund to other account in other bank though they dont use it yet.

For the bond case, once the bond sold then fund raised, then the money is under company (qualcomm) control.

So for both bank loan or bond, the money is under the borrower control; however the borrower is bound with the requirement as stated in the loan agreement or in bond indenture. Hence if the company misuse the fund they are taking risk being defaulted.

That is about the overwatching of a loan in process in the western world, I am just showing you an example. Looks like you have no idea how loan works. Have you even ever bought a car or home with a bank loan?

LOL. it is you who doesnt understand how loan works.

I've bought cars and house and land through banks.

And business loan is not the same like mortgage /house/car loan as you think

Please educate yourself.

lol, you call what happened during 1950 to late 1970 is surviving? I have personally know many people who talked about the hardship during those time, and those people are barely hanging on, some people they knew actually died over that. But then that was after some tough time, not just China is doing that, Germany, France, Britain, Japan, Korea, Austria, and everywhere that was affected by WW2 have the same background. Imagine that happens again today. Would you be able to survive another "Cultural Revolution"? Oh wait, you don't live in China.

LOL. Yeah those were real issolationism.

China is not doing real issolationism anymore. China is just building their own domestic competitors, and that is issolationism in your definition, but not in real definition.