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The UK has left the European Union

@waz

It looks ok to me on the surface, hopefully some legal eagles can go over the 2,000 page treaty and see if there are any hidden pitfalls. Waiting for for 5+ years to get full fishing stocks is fine to me, as it will take time to rebuild the fleet. We will still negiotate some access to the EU as we do with Iceland and Norway, but we are in the driving seat on that then. Fisherman will complain as ever, but then that is all they do. We must actively reduce fishing to allow stocks to recover. The agreement is on quotas/shares of the catch. We must reduce the overall size of the catch now. The EU will fish, "fish" to extinction, left to their own devices.

Now, that we have fully left the EU, we should look to diverge our economy away from the EU, both by exports and imports so that they dont have the level of influence over us, that they currently do.

What the French did with cutting of UK access to force the negiotations was unacceptable and stepped over the line. Elbows and needs in the fight is fine, but what they did was not acceptable, there must be rules. The fact they do not understand they stepped over the line, just shows why we have no business being part of the EU. We need to invest in ports in cornwall and build better sea lanes to Spain to places like Bilbao. We also need to work with the Netherlands to try and expand our sea lanes to Rotterdam. We need to actively reduce the influence that our connection to Europe has, via France..

We must make France pay a long term cost to her recent behaviour... it is a must.

Good points bro.
 
Leaving the EU was the best thing the UK could do. It will thrive again without being accoutable for the socialist policies of the EU. They don't need to import paupers from the EU anymore and can make policies as sovereing country.

2016: UK is doomed
2017: UK will become a third wolrd country
2018: UK on the brink of suicide
2019: Great Britain no more - 200 cities want to cede from the UK
2020: UK will be the 51st state of the USA

2021: Effects of Brexit are not as severe as previously thought
2022: UK is the fastest growing economy in Europe
2023: UK still most popular expat domicile
2024: Spain, Portugal, Italy want to join the United Kingdom

The Anglo-saxons are different from the continental Europeans and they will be fine.
 
Guys I found this interesting, by the way Katya Aldar is very pro EU. It looks like this deal is very good, and we gave up very few concessions. I think Covid has helped, and with the UK leading the way in vaccine efforts the EU is relying on breakthroughs a great deal and decided to play nice. Services are yet to be decided but so far they are only asking we don't diverge, but the UK already has a massive advantage, so it shouldn't be an issue.




"The clock is no longer ticking."
These were pretty much the first words out of the mouth of the EU's chief negotiator, Michel Barnier, as he announced the just sealed EU-UK trade and security agreement on Thursday.
No more looming "no-deal" threats; no more almost painful uncertainty about future relations across the Channel. This was a historic moment.
A fair and balanced deal for both sides, said the European Commission.

But you'd have to have been half-asleep (or halfway through a bottle of eggnog, cava or pint of Glühwein) to miss the stark difference in tone between UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson's triumphalist announcement on Thursday afternoon and the sombre statement by the European Commission.



For Mr Johnson, 1 January heralds some kind of rebirth for the UK outside the EU.
For Brussels, this whole negotiating process has been - as summed up today by Finland's Europe minister - a damage limitation exercise.

The 2016 Brexit vote, leading to the loss of such a key member state, was a huge slap in the face for the EU.
Its aim since then has been to sign a deal with the UK that protects EU business and security interests - but not so advantageous as to tempt other member states to leave the bloc.
French President Emmanuel Macron commented on Thursday that the EU was right to have remained "steadfast and united" since the Brexit vote. He said they could all now proudly look to the future instead.
IMAGE COPYRIGHTREUTERS
image captionAnti-Brexit signs at the gates of Downing Street in London
But this is by no means the end of the EU-UK conversation.
The treaty must still be ratified. And it's not only the UK parliament that wants a peek.
Spare a thought for the 27 ambassadors who represent EU member states in Brussels. They're being dragged to a meeting on Christmas morning with Mr Barnier to discuss the details of the deal.
The text must be approved by EU capitals before the year's end. Each country has a veto, though they're not expected to use it. Mr Barnier and team kept them on board and in the loop every step of the way, throughout the negotiations.
The same goes for the European Parliament. It's expected to ratify the deal early next year.
Until that moment, the agreement will be adopted provisionally, as allowed under EU law.

The new year is when we start to find out what Brexit really means. We don't really know what it feels like yet, what impact it will have on all our lives.
The transition period kept EU-UK relations pretty much the same in practical terms but that all ends on 31 December.
A far cry from the "friction-free" trade deal once promised by former Prime Minister Theresa May, this is the "hardest" of Brexits - not the costly chaos of no deal at all - but nonetheless it means out of the EU's customs union and single market. There will be considerable non-tariff barriers from 2021.
Remember, the UK is a service-based economy, yet this agreement hardly deals with services at all.
UK financial services must wait, possibly for months yet, for the EU to decide unilaterally what access they can have to the single market.

The UK also impatiently awaits a ruling from the EU on data adequacy - how free the flow of data can be between the two sides.
Despite the relief expressed by a number of EU leaders on Thursday that this trade deal was finally agreed, the bloc begins its new relationship with the UK in quite a defensive, wary frame of mind.
EU leaders have not forgotten the controversial clauses the UK government introduced into its Internal Market Bill this autumn, contravening the Brexit Divorce Deal, signed with them less than a year before.
It was because of that, the EU said it pushed so hard for tough retaliation mechanisms in this trade deal - in case the UK doesn't keep to its part of the bargain (and vice versa, of course).
Brussels' assumption is that the UK will be keen to diverge and yank away from the EU's gravitational pull as soon as it sees fit.
It was quite a remarkable achievement of both negotiating teams that they managed to marry the two sides' very different priorities. For the government: to be able to say it had protected national sovereignty after Brexit, avoiding signing up to a new Brussels rule book in exchange for a trade deal.

The EU's main focus was protecting the single market from what they feared could be unfair competition from UK businesses, aggressively undercutting their European rivals.

Oven-ready and cooked to perfection? Rushed to completion in a record-breaking nine months, this deal clearly won't be faultless.
All those devils in the 1,800 pages of detail, some allowing different interpretations on issues by both sides, will become apparent in the coming days and months.
But frankly, neither the UK nor the EU would have completed the agreement if they hadn't felt they could sell it to their domestic audiences as a big win.
And that is what they are now busy doing. On both sides of the Channel.

 
From the European Commission:

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More on that here: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_2531
 
Bloomberg Economics - U.K. Economy Still Faces Trade Pain After Dodging No-Deal Brexit

By David Goodman and Lucy Meakin

Britain averted the damage of a complete breakdown in formal trade ties with the European Union, but it’ll still confront the biggest reset of an advanced economy’s commercial relations since World War II.

The 11th-hour pact clinched by Prime Minister Boris Johnson on Thursday allows the final phase of Brexit to proceed with a relatively orderly divorce on Jan. 1.

The U.K still faces a rude awakening though, as a new customs regime of form-filling and monitoring ends the seamless trade arrangements that have been in place since the 1970s. That risks disruptions at ports and even food shortages in supermarkets, while bottlenecks could immediately translate into softer economic growth and higher prices.

The agreement avoids the shock from a no-deal, which Bloomberg Economics had forecast would knock an additional 1.5% off output in 2021 as tariffs took effect, deepening an expected recession from the latest coronavirus restrictions. Yet longer term, the new frictions mean growth is forecast to be 0.5 percentage point lower a year for the next decade than if the U.K. had stayed in the bloc.

Economic Blow
- WTO trading terms would add to the scarring already inflicted by the virus

The country got a taste of potential chaos this month, when France shut down cross-Channel traffic because of the escalation of the virus outbreak in the U.K. That left thousands of trucks backed up on roads outside the port of Dover.

Britain will at least enjoy a tariff-free cushion for its manufacturers as they trade with a market that currently buys more than 40% of the country’s exports. But that comfort eludes the bankers, architects and consultants in its lucrative service industry -- they weren’t part of the accord.

New immigration rules are also set to replace free movement of people, making it trickier to hire experienced labor from abroad. Foreign investment could suffer once the U.K. no longer offers simple access to the EU’s single market, which has long been a major incentive for companies.

Just this month, Nissan Motor Co., which had been considering its Sunderland plant for its new electric vehicle, opted instead to make it in Japan.

Citigroup Inc.’s Benjamin Nabarro said in a report that the new deal constitutes “threadbare access combined with fewer medium-term assurances” that will weigh heavily on U.K. growth over the coming years.

Economic Destiny

The Brussels agreement closes a chapter on a rare period when voters were granted full consent in a referendum to determine the U.K.’s economic destiny.

Four and a half years on, the economy will start weathering the challenges of the 21st century alone, less able to access the opportunities of its biggest and closest trading area, but also less constrained by its rules.

The gamble that such a break will pay off in the long run is what Johnson is wagering. The government will likely now set off on a series of bilateral negotiations over trade deals, with the U.S. among the priorities. It will have more power over regulations and taxes, which it can use to help businesses.

Worst Performer
- Britain is further below pre-crisis levels than any other G-7 economy

Any near-term economic pain will be overshadowed in any case by the immediate bounce from a year of unprecedented shutdowns to contain the coronavirus outbreak.

The U.K. economy is set to grow more than 5% in 2021 as it rebounds from the huge slump forced by the pandemic, according to economist forecasts compiled by Bloomberg earlier in December -- though Covid-19 restrictions may mean there is a downside risk to those numbers.

The accord also lessens the urgency for more emergency fiscal or monetary stimulus to cushion any blow. The Bank of England already cut its benchmark interest rate to 0.1% and resumed bond-buying this year to help the economy through the pandemic.

Still, BOE Governor Andrew Bailey has been blunt about the limited upside from an agreement, saying there’s no such thing as a frictionless deal.”

While no-deal would have been worse -- crushing parts of Britain’s dwindling manufacturing sector -- the poorer commercial relations with continental Europe, as well as slower population growth due to tighter immigration, will probably leave the U.K. on a lower growth path for much longer.

A weaker pound may provide some support by making exports cheaper. Sterling never fully regained its initial losses in the aftermath of the 2016 vote, reflecting persistent uncertainty.

But that uncertainty has also translated into feeble business investment, which has grown well below the levels seen in the U.S., Germany and France.

The situation could yet worsen. A study by University College London and the London School of Economics forecasts that foreign investment into the U.K. could drop 37% post-Brexit.

Despite the finance industry accounting for about 7% of Britain’s economy and more than 1 million jobs, the issue of its access to the EU was left out of negotiations for a free-trade agreement. Other services professions face a similar fate.

A number of major banks, including Goldman Sachs Group Inc. and JPMorgan Chase & Co., have already been making plans to shift some operations from London to the continent. Whether that trickle becomes a flood could become one of the more critical economic tests of Brexit’s success in coming years.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...faces-trade-pain-after-dodging-no-deal-brexit

I work in the financial services sector in London, I've already seen London bleed business to the continent, in particular to Paris and Frankfurt. And lately, there some deals that came across my desk that were being shifted out of London markets to their respective EU nations. Let's see what transpires. :)

Bad news.. looks like there might be a deal.


I am dissappointed, i wanted a clean break from the EU.. no idea what Bojo has given up now..

Am worried now ... alot...
A trade deal is a clean break, a lack of it would be clean breaking the neck of the UK economy.

Leaving the EU has been achieved, leaving the Single Market and EEA (+Schengen free movement) has been achieved, we don't even have a customs union anymore. So that is definitely a 'clean break', what more is being asked for?
 
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Yes yes, we've heard it before from Bloomberg;

The UK will suffer, it hasn't.
Car industry is tatters, it is the world over, with German manufactures facing the worst of it.
Non tariff barriers can be get passed quite easily with today's tech, we're not in the 70's anymore.
Forecast growth, blah, it's an estimate.
Why would FDI drop, especially since the UK leads the world in future technology?
Yes some financial services will be lost, most of this is European specific i.e. passporting and it's true the deal hasn't had specific provision for services. This will be negotiated later, if they play hard ball so will we. No way can Frankfurt or Paris match the UK's economies of scale.

The EU is currently a complete and utter mess. Falling population numbers, failing economies, not a single university in the top 50, future growth industries poor, innovation i.e. no country aside Sweden ranked above the UK (fourth position) on the WIPO world innovation index, numerous EU states with debt to GDP ratios at or over 100%! ( Greece, Italy, Portugal, Belgium, France, Spain).
Now with the loss of the UK as one of the main net contributors they'll have to pull a miracle from a deep dark pit to make up the loss of funding. :woot:
So long to the drinking club where only 10 members, five of any real large sums, paid and everyone else enjoyed the free ride :lol:

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Yep, looks like a good deal.

Fisheries is ok as well as UK gets 25% of EU catch which will be progressively increased over the 5 year period.
 
The UK can cause alot of problems for the financial service industry in the EU, if we team up with Switzerland and agree to combine forces !!!!!!! So far, the UK has taken a passive approach to the EU attempts to corner our financial services, but now they become an economic competitor, versus a collaborator and the deal in trade goods is done, expect that to change.

A few French banks have relocated some of their front, middle and back office functions to Paris, in the hope that they can corner the "migration" of financial customers "forced" to work with EU based companies and even smaller amount of german banks have moved some staff. That pretty much sums up the situation.

EU may be able to force some asset managers to move to the EU, and but so far it is tiny. Even if the assets are held in EU "companies", they are all shells, with the people "managing" those assets in the UK. The real capital markets and its ecosystems exist in the UK and Switzerland as far as "Europe" is concerned. They are very few people who live and work in the UK who want to live in Paris(what a shit hole that place is ) or Frankfurt ( have fun slitting your own wrists as that is the most fun you will have there ). I have lived in Frankfurt.... boring !!!!

The EU would have to adhere to UK standards for financial services if it wants access to the Financial services and Capital Markets based in London. If companies in Europe want access to Capital Markets, they have to go to London, or Switerland in Europe as that is where the investors with money end up and that is where they insist deals are regulated under UK law.
 
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Not surprised one bit about this. Scotland is never going to leave. UK was anti-Huawei way before even trump, UK played both sides. EU officials who approved this deal are cucks.

London is more rotten to the core than Washington and Isreal. The banksters and industrialists and Oligarchs are not going to let the UK collapse when they don't have Corbyn in. If Corbyn was in, there would be no deal and economic collapse would be blamed on Corbyn. This is how bankers operate.

This is how US/UK alliance operates, they punish anybody who is anti-them and reward those who support US/UK hegemony.

All around the world this is their policy:

 
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Not surprised one bit about this. Scotland is never going to leave. UK was anti-Huawei way before even trump, UK played both sides. EU officials who approved this deal are cucks.

London is more rotten to the core than Washington and Isreal. The banksters and industrialists and Oligarchs are not going to let the UK collapse when they don't have Corbyn in. If Corbyn was in, there would be no deal and economic collapse would be blamed on Corbyn. This is how bankers operate.

This is how US/UK alliance operates, they punish anybody who is anti-them and reward those who support US/UK hegemony.

All around the world this is their policy:


huh ?!?!? :what::what::what::confused::confused::confused:....
 
But, but little Britain will become a third world country? The Brits were a global power before the EU and will stay one after that.

I know it’s sounds odd that a Pakistani living in Germany defends the UK (doesn’t mean I like the things they did in the Muslim world) but man the newspapers just make me angry. When something doesn’t fit their narrative (educated conservative Muslims, Trump, Brexit...) they will stop reporting objectively and start pushing for their leftist agenda 24/7.

If you want to play this game and you truely believe that the UK will lose everything short their stocks. I bought some UK stocks and men it’s all in the Green :D.
 
Nobody is claiming that the sky is falling, people only projected the worse case scenario under a no deal and having to default to WTO rules. However, any deal we could have gotten with the EU in the short to medium term would undoubtedly, categorically, leave us worse off than being within the Single market.

The current projections that we’ll bleed 0.5% growth a year for the next decade is huge. A half percentage for the UK can mean the difference between stagflation or recession and slow but +ve growth. It can mean being closer to BoE inflation targets, and collecting enough tax revenue, and instead needing monetary and fiscal stimulus.

As for investment, it’ll definitely be lower. We’ve separated ourselves from frictionless trade, passporting rights etc, from one of the largest markets in the world. You can continue strawmanning remainers, but that doesn’t change the ground reality that Brexit it at best a mildly harmful exercise based on lies and fantasies peddled by leave campaigners. Sold mostly to nostalgic older folks who themselves were uninformed enough to easily be misinformed into supporting leave. That and immigration.

As for the city of London. I work here, I know plenty of bankers, you can dream about playing hardball with the EU. Hardball is possible when you’re dealing with equals. You can at best hope goodwill from them when your economy is USD3tn vs their USD20tn. You all should have seen the reaction some of in the city had on the day of the result. It’s almost unanimous among us that Brexit was mostly quite stupid and undoubtedly harmful to the city and the wider economy, and it basically removed a lot of the avenues of growth and prosperity for the city.

Good luck trying to convince people who are seeing their employers and colleagues relocating to FFM and Paris, that Brexit isn’t bad for financial services or that we can team up with the Swiss to do xyz. Good luck trying to convince them that Brexit is a net benefit when they’ve seen worse economic forecasts as a result for years, and are now seeing an initial migration of European deals back to the continent. The changing of terms on existing deals to exclude UK intermediaries, and much lower growth for the city’s financial sector as compared to European capitals.

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Leaving the tyranny of the EU was a page that will go down in the history books under the chapter "FREEDOM", just after the victory in the second world war.

No more unlimited unskilled immigration.
No more toeing the EU line of ridiculous regulations such as the output of your vacuum cleaner!
No more of a foreign entity controlling our trade policy.
No more funding of states which can't even make babies, can't produce a single top university, and have no stake in the industries of the future.
No more dampening of British identity for some pseudo European identity which never really existed, apart from the papers in Brussels.
No more sidling of our great nation at the behest of two powers who run the EU (Germany and France).

The remainers wanted you to stay in perpetual slavery, they wanted to destroy this country.

They blamed the old, the same old who charged the beaches of Normandy, the same old who built this country, and gave the young the wonderful standard of life they have. Their ungrateful behaviour knew no bounds, having contributed nothing themselves, and then insult the elders who they should thank day and night for their freedoms.

Stand proud folks, stand strong.



:)
 

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