Arron Bert
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I think Tesla is growing and will also soon be selling cars all across the world.
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wait til the Gigafactory is complete we'll see about a bubble.
if anything Tesla could outsource it's fuel cells to other start ups.
not like Elon Musk is looking for a monopoly
I don't think Tesla cars use fuel cells. Just batteries. Gigafactory 1 will take care of everything when it launches in 2017.
I think Tesla is growing and will also soon be selling cars all across the world.
Tesla is a dead end and needs to die and get out of the way so real innovators can make real cars. If the bubble is bursting, that's great news for everyone else.
Tesla is a scam. The company has never turned a profit and never will. Elon Musk is a cocaine addict with a made-up name who mooches off every government program there is. No successful consumer innovation, from the Model T to the Apple II, has ever started at the top and worked its way down. Successful consumer innovations start by building a useful product as minimalist as possible and pricing it so the greatest possible number of ordinary people can afford it.
Elon Musk the cocaine addict has a pathological hatred of fuel cells. He promotes change by insisting the most clean, efficient, and economical energy storage system mathematically possible is heresy and anyone who suggests fuel cells are a good idea whose time has come is a heretic and should be stoned to death.
The 'real innovators' are all making electric cars now though. BMW themselves are stating the i3 series is a huge success and that they will scale up all future cars from there, and that EV is the future for them.
Amazon has never made a profit either and the iPhone wasn't exactly cheap when it launched either, many competitors like Ballmer of Microsoft simply laughed it off as being overpriced. Look at where we are now with iPhones making up 92% of smarphone profits last quarter. Once the Tesla Model III consumer model hits in 2017, EV cars are going to go mainstream.
Fuel cells are worthless. Nobody wants to use Hydrogen. Pure hydrogen gas is far too reactive to be found in natural environments, unlike natural gas. It would have to be made from using techniques like water electrolysis, a process that is inefficient and expensive. Not to mention hydrogen gas is actually more reactive and dangerous than oil. Fuel cell Chevy Volt is dead, the new thing for GM is EV Chevy Bolt. The only ones pushing the dead concept of fuel cells are Toyota and Honda.
Okay...so what's Tesla have to offer that BMW doesn't?
Faulty comparison. Amazon sold at a loss for years until it wiped its competitors out (which is called market dumping, and is illegal, and should have been punished). Tesla can't cut costs below its competitors. Tesla III is not mainstream, simple as that. When they come out with a $28,000 car that a journeyman household electrician can service, we'll call them "mainstream".
Hydrogen is an energy storage medium. Gasoline and CNG are also reactive and dangerous. Aluminum isn't found in nature either, and is also produced through electrolysis, but it's cheap enough we can sell half a liter of Coca-Cola in it. Even if hydrogen isn't the best solution, Musk's hatred of the technology is irrational and unproductive and speaks volumes about the guy and his actual motivations.
GM consumer vehicles are trash, the company is incapable of doing anything right and has been since the days of DeLorean and Nader.
Tesla has committed to deep vertical integration with their heavy investments in the Gigafactory. Unlike BMW, they have already gone all-in on EV cars, meaning that they will have an early mover advantage with substantially less baggage holding them back.
Tesla Model III is being pegged at the low-mid $30k range before government subsidies and tax benefits. It is going to be affordable for the masses.
Aluminium has some unique properties that allow it to still maintain its shape and remain strong despite being cut in paper thin sheets. Hydrogen has nothing to offer that current ICE cars can't. It is an even more expensive solution and requires even more energy to produce than fossil fuels. Musk is right in stating that you might as well switch over to using natural gas as an energy storage medium, and start synthesizing methane instead of H2. It rightly deserves ridicule, consumers won't accept pricey H2 just because it offers zero emissions. EV cars offer the possibility of being outright better and cheaper than ICE cars, when the technology matures, as well as having zero emissions.
Knowing how to build a decent car in the first place is more substantial than the electric drive system. Novice hobbyists convert ICVs to electric all the time. It's far easier to do than to build a car from scratch. For this reason, BMV EVs are functionally superior to Tesla vehicles (and Chevy/GMs are much worse than either).
What you are trying to do here is to claim Tesla's hype is equivalent to actually knowing how to build a car - any car.
.assuming the price doesn't go up at the last minute (as it typically does with anything Tesla) and it actually hits the market in two years. If Tesla were capable of pricing and manufacturing a car to match its boasts, they already would be
Hydrogen is clean and renewable. I thought that was the point?
Battery cost is throttled by economy of scale at approximately the same rate as gasoline or hydrogen, except that it's also throttled by the supply of lithium.
You're missing my point about aluminum. My point is that it is indeed economical to produce it through an energy-intensive process despite not being found in nature - same as hydrogen
The only disruptive event that I can think of is if hydrogen fuel cell technology takes off in a big way.