The Sikh Empire is not "ours"

[Hamza913]

Some people (cough cough @M. Sarmad ) seem to think that the Sikh Empire were liked by people of the Indus for defending the region from the Durrani Empire, since the latter came from Afghanistan. Since they also came from the Indus, people seem to think this makes them "ours", when this couldn't be further from the truth.

First of all, it's important to remember that the Durrani Empire itself was Pashtun, and Pakistan itself has the world's largest population of Pashtuns. Not only that, but Durranis are present in Pakistan, with well-known individuals such as Asad Durrani belonging to the very same tribe (as his name would suggest). The Durrani Empire also had not just Pashtuns fight in their army, but also Balochis and even Punjabis (Gakhars specifically). Both of these ethnicities are also major communities in Pakistan (as we all know):

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...ved=0ahUKEwiBk-nu1erfAhVUuHEKHZufBFIQ6AEIKDAA

http://www.uob.edu.pk/journals/TREATY OF KALAT 1758 BETWEEN QANDHAR AND KALAT AND ITS IMPACTS.pdf

http://dsal.uchicago.edu/reference/gazetteer/pager.html?objectid=DS405.1.I34_V06_284.gif

The founder of the Durrani Empire (Ahmed Shah Durrani), is also believed by many to have been born in Multan, a city in Pakistan:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmad_Shah_Durrani#Early_years

Sources cited in the Wikipedia link:

1. Nichols, Robert (2015). "Aḥmad Shāh Durrānī". In Fleet, Kate; Krämer, Gudrun; Matringe, Denis; Nawas, John; Rowson, Everett. Encyclopaedia of Islam, THREE. ISSN 1873-9830. Aḥmad Shāh Durrānī (r. 1160–86/1747–72), of the Sadozay section of the Popalzay lineage of the Abdālī Afghans, was the first Sadozay ruler of Afghanistan, founding the Durrānī empire in 1160/1747. Born in Multān (which was disputed with Herat) as Aḥmad Khān, second son of Zamān Khān Abdālī (d. 1135/1722), then governor of Herat, he arose from the lineage, regional, and imperial competitions of the age to establish an independent Afghan power.
2. ^ Hanifi, Shah Mahmoud (2008). Connecting Histories in Afghanistan: Market Relations and State Formation on a Colonial Frontier. Stanford, California: Stanford University Press. p. 42. ISBN 978-0804777773. Ahmad Shah (ruled 1747–72), the ephemeral empire's founder, was born in Multan in 1722.
3. ^ Roy, Kaushik; Lorge, Peter, eds. (2015). Chinese and Indian Warfare – From the Classical Age to 1870. Routledge. p. 95. ISBN 978-1317587101. Ahmad Khan later known as Ahmad Shah Durrani/Abdali was born in 1722 at Multan.
4. ^ Mehta, J. L. (2005). Advanced study in the history of modern India 1707–1813. Sterling Publishers Pvt. Ltd. p. 247. ISBN 978-1-932705-54-6. Retrieved 23 September 2010.

Peshawar was also the winter capital of the Durrani Empire, making it one of their major cities:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durrani_Empire

Sources cited in the Wikipedia link:

1. Hanifi, Shah Mahmoud. "Timur Shah transferred the Durrani capital from Qandahar in 1775-76. Kabul and Peshawar then shared time as the dual Durrani capital cities, the former during the summer and the latter during the winter season." p. 185. Connecting Histories in Afghanistan: Market Relations and State Formation on a Colonial Frontier. Stanford University Press, 2011. Retrieved 2012-08-04.
2. ^ Jump up to:a b Singh, Sarina (2008). "Like the Kushans, the Afghan kings favoured Peshawar as a winter residence, and were aggrieved when the upstart Sikh kingdom snatched it in 1818 and levelled its buildings." p. 191. Pakistan and the Karakoram Highway. Retrieved 2012-08-10.

Beyond that, many people from the Indus fought bitterly against the Sikh Empire, such as (but not limited to):

Ahmed Khan Karral, Punjabi rebel who resisted the Sikh Empire until their very collapse, after which he fought against the British and was finally defeated:

https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmad_Khan_Kharal

Source cited in Wikipedia link:

AD Ejaz 'Ahmad Khan Kharal', 1985

The Karlal tribe. In 1822, Ranjit Singh sent a large force under famous General Amar Singh Majitta which was defeated by Karlals with great slaughter. Amar Singh was also murdered by the Karlal. Lepel Griffin, the author of Colonial History of Hazara, writes in his book about this battle of Sumandar Khata. From 1822 to 1845 Karlal tribe fought many battles with Sikhs and were able to retain their independence. In 1844 once again Lahore Darbar sent a large force under Diwan Mulraj and Hari Singh to subdue Karlal country. Taking advantage of the difficult geographical terrain of their country, the Karlals were able to defeat Sikh army at a place called Nah and killed more than 150 Sikh soldiers:

https://newpakhistorian.wordpress.com/tag/karlal/

Ruhullah Khan, Gujjar from Kashmir who defeated Ranjit Singh three times in battle:

https://javaidrahi.files.wordpress.com/2018/02/the-gujjars-vol-1-ed-dr-javaid-rahi.pdf (page 33)

The Sikh Empire's oppression of Muslims is also well known. They banned the Azaan, turned Masjids into stables, sold Muslim women as slaves, killed thousands of Muslim children, etc. Their worst enemies were also Muslim (as already proven):

http://materiaislamica.com/index.php/Persecution_of_Muslims_in_the_Sikh_Empire_(1799—1849)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Muslims#Sikhs_and_Sikh_Empire

Sources cited in Wikipedia link:

1. Syad Muhammad Latif (1964), History of the Panjab: From the Remotest Antiquity to Present Time, pp. 111–21
2. ^ Lawrence, Sir Walter Roper (1895). The Valley of Kashmir. ISBN 978-8120616301.
3. ^ "Languages of Belonging".
4. ^ Deol, Harnik (2000). Religion and Nationalism in India. ISBN 978-0415201087.
5. ^ Explore Kashmiri Pandits. ISBN 9780963479860.
6. ^ Joshi-Ford, Sunita (2008-07-11). Jihad. ISBN 978-1606931615.
7. ^ Metcalf, Barbara D; Metcalf, Thomas R (2002). A Concise History of India. ISBN 978-0521639743.
8. ^ "Full text of "Gulab Singh 1792 1858"". Archive.org. Retrieved 2016-02-09.
9. ^ Bakshi, G.D. (2002). Footprints in the Snow. ISBN 978-8170622925.

To summarise, the Sikh Empire were the enemies of our people, not their friends. Anyone who thinks otherwise doesn't know history.

@Pan-Islamic-Pakistan @PAKISTANFOREVER @MultaniGuy @Samlee @DESERT FIGHTER @Desert Fox @JohnWick @Talwar e Pakistan

 

[Sugarcane]

All the History of Pakistan doesn't need to start from Bin-Qasim and Ahmed Shah. No, Need to turn everything into Us & Them and let the history remain history.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

All the History of Pakistan doesn't need to start from Bin-Qasim and Ahmed Shah. No, Need to turn everything into Us & Them and let the history remain history.

Beautiful advise.

People take note.. achi baat bhi parh liya karo.

 

[Darwin]

Some people (cough cough @M. Sarmad ) seem to think that the Sikh Empire were liked by people of the Indus for defending the region from the Durrani Empire, since the latter came from Afghanistan. Since they also came from the Indus, people seem to think this makes them "ours", when this couldn't be further from the truth.

First of all, it's important to remember that the Durrani Empire itself was Pashtun, and Pakistan itself has the world's largest population of Pashtuns. Not only that, but Durranis are present in Pakistan, with well-known individuals such as Asad Durrani belonging to the very same tribe (as his name would suggest). The Durrani Empire also had not just Pashtuns fight in their army, but also Balochis and even Punjabis (Gakhars specifically). Both of these ethnicities are also major communities in Pakistan (as we all know):

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...ved=0ahUKEwiBk-nu1erfAhVUuHEKHZufBFIQ6AEIKDAA

http://www.uob.edu.pk/journals/TREATY OF KALAT 1758 BETWEEN QANDHAR AND KALAT AND ITS IMPACTS.pdf

http://dsal.uchicago.edu/reference/gazetteer/pager.html?objectid=DS405.1.I34_V06_284.gif

The founder of the Durrani Empire (Ahmed Shah Durrani), is also believed by many to have been born in Multan, a city in Pakistan:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmad_Shah_Durrani#Early_years

Sources cited in the Wikipedia link:

1. Nichols, Robert (2015). "Aḥmad Shāh Durrānī". In Fleet, Kate; Krämer, Gudrun; Matringe, Denis; Nawas, John; Rowson, Everett. Encyclopaedia of Islam, THREE. ISSN 1873-9830. Aḥmad Shāh Durrānī (r. 1160–86/1747–72), of the Sadozay section of the Popalzay lineage of the Abdālī Afghans, was the first Sadozay ruler of Afghanistan, founding the Durrānī empire in 1160/1747. Born in Multān (which was disputed with Herat) as Aḥmad Khān, second son of Zamān Khān Abdālī (d. 1135/1722), then governor of Herat, he arose from the lineage, regional, and imperial competitions of the age to establish an independent Afghan power.
2. ^ Hanifi, Shah Mahmoud (2008). Connecting Histories in Afghanistan: Market Relations and State Formation on a Colonial Frontier. Stanford, California: Stanford University Press. p. 42. ISBN 978-0804777773. Ahmad Shah (ruled 1747–72), the ephemeral empire's founder, was born in Multan in 1722.
3. ^ Roy, Kaushik; Lorge, Peter, eds. (2015). Chinese and Indian Warfare – From the Classical Age to 1870. Routledge. p. 95. ISBN 978-1317587101. Ahmad Khan later known as Ahmad Shah Durrani/Abdali was born in 1722 at Multan.
4. ^ Mehta, J. L. (2005). Advanced study in the history of modern India 1707–1813. Sterling Publishers Pvt. Ltd. p. 247. ISBN 978-1-932705-54-6. Retrieved 23 September 2010.

Peshawar was also the winter capital of the Durrani Empire, making it one of their major cities:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durrani_Empire

Sources cited in the Wikipedia link:

1. Hanifi, Shah Mahmoud. "Timur Shah transferred the Durrani capital from Qandahar in 1775-76. Kabul and Peshawar then shared time as the dual Durrani capital cities, the former during the summer and the latter during the winter season." p. 185. Connecting Histories in Afghanistan: Market Relations and State Formation on a Colonial Frontier. Stanford University Press, 2011. Retrieved 2012-08-04.
2. ^ Jump up to:a b Singh, Sarina (2008). "Like the Kushans, the Afghan kings favoured Peshawar as a winter residence, and were aggrieved when the upstart Sikh kingdom snatched it in 1818 and levelled its buildings." p. 191. Pakistan and the Karakoram Highway. Retrieved 2012-08-10.

Beyond that, many people from the Indus fought bitterly against the Sikh Empire, such as (but not limited to):

Ahmed Khan Karral, Punjabi rebel who resisted the Sikh Empire until their very collapse, after which he fought against the British and was finally defeated:

https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmad_Khan_Kharal

Source cited in Wikipedia link:

AD Ejaz 'Ahmad Khan Kharal', 1985

The Karlal tribe. In 1822, Ranjit Singh sent a large force under famous General Amar Singh Majitta which was defeated by Karlals with great slaughter. Amar Singh was also murdered by the Karlal. Lepel Griffin, the author of Colonial History of Hazara, writes in his book about this battle of Sumandar Khata. From 1822 to 1845 Karlal tribe fought many battles with Sikhs and were able to retain their independence. In 1844 once again Lahore Darbar sent a large force under Diwan Mulraj and Hari Singh to subdue Karlal country. Taking advantage of the difficult geographical terrain of their country, the Karlals were able to defeat Sikh army at a place called Nah and killed more than 150 Sikh soldiers:

https://newpakhistorian.wordpress.com/tag/karlal/

Ruhullah Khan, Gujjar from Kashmir who defeated Ranjit Singh three times in battle:

https://javaidrahi.files.wordpress.com/2018/02/the-gujjars-vol-1-ed-dr-javaid-rahi.pdf (page 33)

The Sikh Empire's oppression of Muslims is also well known. They banned the Azaan, turned Masjids into stables, sold Muslim women as slaves, killed thousands of Muslim children, etc. Their worst enemies were also Muslim (as already proven):

http://materiaislamica.com/index.php/Persecution_of_Muslims_in_the_Sikh_Empire_(1799—1849)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Muslims#Sikhs_and_Sikh_Empire

Sources cited in Wikipedia link:

1. Syad Muhammad Latif (1964), History of the Panjab: From the Remotest Antiquity to Present Time, pp. 111–21
2. ^ Lawrence, Sir Walter Roper (1895). The Valley of Kashmir. ISBN 978-8120616301.
3. ^ "Languages of Belonging".
4. ^ Deol, Harnik (2000). Religion and Nationalism in India. ISBN 978-0415201087.
5. ^ Explore Kashmiri Pandits. ISBN 9780963479860.
6. ^ Joshi-Ford, Sunita (2008-07-11). Jihad. ISBN 978-1606931615.
7. ^ Metcalf, Barbara D; Metcalf, Thomas R (2002). A Concise History of India. ISBN 978-0521639743.
8. ^ "Full text of "Gulab Singh 1792 1858"". Archive.org. Retrieved 2016-02-09.
9. ^ Bakshi, G.D. (2002). Footprints in the Snow. ISBN 978-8170622925.

To summarise, the Sikh Empire were the enemies of our people, not their friends. Anyone who thinks otherwise doesn't know history.

@Pan-Islamic-Pakistan @PAKISTANFOREVER @MultaniGuy @Samlee @DESERT FIGHTER @Desert Fox @JohnWick @Talwar e Pakistan

Obvious. If Hindus and Sikhs were similar to the Muslims,, what was the point of asking for Pakistan ?
The west is west and the east is east , never the twain shall meet.

 

[Hamza913]

All the History of Pakistan doesn't need to start from Bin-Qasim and Ahmed Shah. No, Need to turn everything into Us & Them and let the history remain history.

I'm talking about who people take as their heroes. For Pakistanis (other than the Sikhs) to view the Sikh Empire as their heroes is stupid, they fought against our people regularly.

 

[bananarepublic]

I'm talking about who people take as their heroes. For Pakistanis (other than the Sikhs) to view the Sikh Empire as their heroes is stupid, they fought against our people regularly.

you should first define what is our people ??
sikh empire was a typical empire in the Indian subcontinent it didn't do anything different from any Hindu/Muslim rulers
they oppressed and fought against those against them but it doesn't make us enemies now a great enemy in the past can become a great ally in the future or vice-versa.

 

[Saiful Islam]

If the Sikh empire encompasses what is now present day Pakistan then surely it's part of your history. The Pala and Sena empires constitute what is present day BD but many people also regard it as Jahilliyah too

 

[Hamza913]

you should first define what is our people ??

First and foremost, Muslims. Secondly, we are people of the Indus.

If the Sikh empire encompasses what is now present day Pakistan then surely it's part of your history.

But that doesn't make them our heroes.

 

[Kaniska]

you should first define what is our people ??
sikh empire was a typical empire in the Indian subcontinent it didn't do anything different from any Hindu/Muslim rulers
they oppressed and fought against those against them but it doesn't make us enemies now a great enemy in the past can become a great ally in the future or vice-versa.

you should first define what is our people ??

The answer to this question lies about how people of Pakistan defines them or Pakistan that stands for today.
If Pakistan stands for only Muslims, then history of Pakistan can be with the events associated with all Muslim rulers in your region even if they invaded the current day Pakistan...

 

[khanz]

This is a load of crap History involves more than just muslims -Please stop embarassing yourself yes Sikh empire history also belongs to Pakistan anything that happened in what is now Pakistan is part of Pakistani history. You can't be selective picking and choosing some and denying other history just because it involved Sikhs. Lahore was once the capital of the Sikh empire for gods sake !
Really I know you are proud muslims but some of you take it to another level you are the same as the Hindu nationalists in India who try to erase Mughal empire from indian history because they were a muslim empire. Pakistan has amazing history and culture both muslim and other religions and it belongs to Pakistan !

 

[Zibago]

It also belongs to us though its affect on Muslims of that time can be debated but the sikh empire was and is our national heritage

 

[Hamza913]

The answer to this question lies about how people of Pakistan defines them or Pakistan that stands for today.
If Pakistan stands for only Muslims, then history of Pakistan can be with the events associated with all Muslim rulers in your region even if they invaded the current day Pakistan...

Yes, and this is strengthened by the fact that Lahore has always been a major centre of Islamic power in the region, and that so many people from the Indus fought as soldiers for these Muslim empires or established their own.

 

[Nein]

Sikh Empire is part of your history but that part should be forgotten as the Sikh Empire is the time period which Muslims in Pakistan should forget as those were not the best of times.

Just like the Sikhs do not see the Mughal Empire as the best of times but a dark age for them.

 

[Hamza913]

This is a load of crap History involves more than just muslims -Please stop embarassing yourself yes Sikh empire history also belongs to Pakistan anything that happened in what is now Pakistan is part of Pakistani history. You can't be selective picking and choosing some and denying other history just because it involved Sikhs. Lahore was once the capital of the Sikh empire for gods sake !
Really I know you are proud muslims but some of you take it to another level you are the same as the Hindu nationalists in India who try to erase Mughal empire from indian history because they were a muslim empire. Pakistan has amazing history and culture both muslim and other religions and it belongs to Pakistan !

I don't think you understood my point.

the sikh empire was and is our national heritage

In the sense that it came from what is now Pakistan, yes, but ideologically, they were opposed to us.

 

[Nein]

This is a load of crap History involves more than just muslims -Please stop embarassing yourself yes Sikh empire history also belongs to Pakistan anything that happened in what is now Pakistan is part of Pakistani history. You can't be selective picking and choosing some and denying other history just because it involved Sikhs. Lahore was once the capital of the Sikh empire for gods sake !
Really I know you are proud muslims but some of you take it to another level you are the same as the Hindu nationalists in India who try to erase Mughal empire from indian history because they were a muslim empire. Pakistan has amazing history and culture both muslim and other religions and it belongs to Pakistan !

Muslims being proud of the Sikh Empire is like a Greek being proud of the Ottoman Empire.

It will never work you dont deny history but neither do you take them as something to be proud about.