The role of militancy in the rise of atheism?

[haviZsultan]

"To every action there is always an equal and opposite reaction"
Newton​

As I have been writing my book, Badal one of the primary concepts I have been promoting is that a single act of injustice leads to a never-ending cycle of violence that is near impossible to stop. In the same way it is smart to assume every action results in a reaction.

Perhaps it's true that until the government doesn't stop being seen as a US stooge and fighting a fruitless war in the North-West the Taliban won't stop their attacks. A reaction to an action, you may say-brutal of course but still a reaction. However there are even reactions to reactions.

In recent years there has been a rise in atheism in Pakistan. I have increasingly come to hear from and personally engage with more and more Pakistani atheists over the years. All have 'converted' from Islam. Most of these atheists cite reasons of intolerance, fanaticism and terrorism as the primary causes for giving up on their faith though there are some who were simply non-religious from the very beginning.

In other words the atheists are reactionaries to reactionaries. Fanaticism and terrorism has made them what they are just as current American policy has turned many into terrorists.

To understand the rise of atheism we must in essence explore the word itself and understand its meaning. Atheism means "Disbelief in, or denial of, the existence of a god." So since the atheists were Muslims before this means they are people who have lost or given up their belief in the existence of God. But atheists sometimes describe themselves in a different way.

"Basically an atheist is someone who has lost his faith in God, just in the 'righteousness' of God, not necessarily his existence. That's how I see myself," says Ali, a 20 year old student.

"How did you become an atheist?" I ask.

"Well it was always the party lifestyle for me from the beginning. Drinking, dancing, you name it. I just never felt the same way about religion as others."

Party lifestyle, I wondered. Almost all of those who identify themselves as Atheists belong to the affluent upper or upper-middle classes."How much did militancy, terrorism and intolerance have a role in you choosing atheism?" I asked. "Is terrorism the reason you left Islam?"

"Somewhat," Ali replies. "I just can't understand why these Mullahs were so intolerant. I can't understand what these terrorists seek to achieve by their violence. When I saw these people killing innocents around me I felt loathing not just for the terrorists but also with myself because I shared something in common with them. I guess I wanted to be as far apart from them as possible. That was part of the reason I chose to be an atheist."

Such reactions to the Taliban and their quest to impose religion on the entire population are rare but increasing. That's why I have always claimed imposing religion never works. In Ali's case it has done exactly the opposite of what it wished to achieve. It has driven a person away from religion instead of bringing him closer.

"I am not trying to offend you but I feel terrorism may kill off Islam," Ali says.

"Of course those are your personal views..." I began, trying not to sound too offended. After all I do happen to be a Muslim, though I am not by any means a terrorist sympathizer.

No, it's true. When you kill innocent people you create a sense of antipathy for your religion. I mean I am not religious but I think it's something the Mullah's should watch out for, people being driven from their religion due to terrorism. Someone has to start condemning terrorism before it causes some massive reaction."

Atheism is an opposite reaction to the strife and the destruction taking place in our country in the name of religion. After our conversation I thought back on Ali's reasons. Maybe it was true. Maybe the terrorism was causing people to loathe Islam, not just within our own society but outside too. Muslims today have a much bigger job countering opinions of them as terrorists.

I have always pondered over this and have thought if we Muslims are just a little more tolerant we can do a much better job countering hate against ourselves. Plus it would leave a better image in the minds of people about our religion.

Another atheist I contacted prefers to remain anonymous. Not strange considering the intolerance prevalent in Pakistani society. He talks about how he gradually grew distant from his religion and beautifully describes the turning points that made him an atheist.

"My friend wanted me to be more religious," he says eventually coming to the problems he has faced as an atheist. "She tried to prove God's existence but failed."

A number of questions shot through my head. "Why couldn't your friend just accept you were non-religious?" I wondered. "Do you think it was right for her to impose her beliefs?" I didn't ask any of them. Instead I encouraged him onwards though I did display my disdain at his friend's quest to impose religion.

"After this she decided she didn't want to be friends."

"So if you're not a Muslim, you cannot be a friend" I said to myself, appalled. That moment I realized just how hard it must be to be a minority in our country. Atheists went against the norms in society and made themselves targets of bias and discrimination. They must have some strong conviction to do that.

It set the wheels in my mind turning again. Trying to impose religion only distanced the person further and further from Islam. Shouldn't we try to abandon this fruitless quest to convert everyone to our thinking and rather concentrate on winning people over with honourable and true intentions and actions?

The conversation carried on and it appeared sharing his atheist beliefs, opinions and conviction's is no easier for him. "At least three friends distanced themselves from me when I shared this," He refers to atheism as "this" unlike other atheists, probably in fear of what it means.

My anonymous friend was too afraid to say it in the fear of offending me somehow but I understood how sad his 'friends not being friends anymore' must have made him. It was like having a black mark on him forever. As long as he was anything but a 'Muslim' he would always be treated differently.

However as the conversation continued he did mention how frustrating things were for him. "I've told a few close friends and they feel repelled. It's worse than being a Hindu or Christian."

As long as intolerance, fanaticism and bigotry remains ingrained in our thinking we can expect to see more and more atheists-again a reaction to intolerance. It proves one thing beyond doubt. That trying to impose religion never works but can rather cause the opposite of what it seeks to achieve.

The purpose of militants has been to bring Muslims closer to their religion but their actions are causing exactly the opposite reaction. Some people, annoyed with the violence the militants are preaching are turning away from Islam despite the guaranteed fact that they are going to suffer bias and discrimination as a consequence.

Meanwhile my anonymous friend says nervously, "I was and to some extent still am afraid of becoming an atheist.

Needless to say I understand the fear of "becoming an atheist". It means you will forever be mistreated and your rights ignored. Pakistani society does not go easy on atheists and Non-Muslims. If atheists have come out and spoken about their experiences it is a truly remarkable feat for them. It takes courage to admit to being something that is despised in society.

Let's hope tolerance prevails and we leave at least the atheists out of the violence that has befallen Hindus and Christians in the past.

Militancy & Intolerance causing a rise in Atheism in Pakistan

^^^^ This is my unpublished article. If you know someone who wants it in his paper let me know. Do comment and rate.

Interesting to see what @muse, @Redbull and @Chak Bamu thinks about this other than other secular members.

 

[forcetrip]

I enjoyed it. Somewhat simplistic view of "one" individual" but a lot of others who are not affluent or party all month share exactly that feeling. Lot of undercover agnostics and atheists are getting bolder. Its like religious extremists from both ends feel they have to be heard by violent means only. Both sides just feel the world is going on without them and they are not wrong. No one cares for either side so this is how they scream for attention.

 

[muse]

Trying to impose religion only distanced the person further and further from Islam

HaviZ, do some search on the threads on this forum, for years we have been suggesting exactly this - that the worst thing that can and will happen from this Wahabi lunacy is that it will be the totality of Islam that will be what people will blame for this, and justifiably, in my opinion.

Already you see this, in Pakistan and where ever the Wahabi tyranny exists, religiosity is now devoid of the notion of "Faith", and all about "Certitude", of a love (personal relationship) with the Divine - it's all about outward appearances, of do's and dont's , entirely devoid of ethics and of morality, of inquiry, of search.

On this forum - do a search for "Types of Religiosity"

 

[Leader]

@haviZsultan send it to blogs in Tribune, dawn, the news.

 

[notsuperstitious]

Fear of death, of afterlife but most importantly of cultural rejection is more powerful than reason.

My experience is most young muslims rediscover god around the time they get married.

Bangladesh with their strong intellectual traditions is more religious since terrorism became mainsteam news.

Wahhabism seems to win more followers than it loses.

 

[somebozo]

After researching wahabism i discovered that..

Islam has everything to do with Arab imperialism and it gave them the moral legitimacy to invade, loot and plunder in the name of religion which they earlier lack. I terms of tradition it is no different to what Romans, Persians and Europeans did by claiming god to be on their side.

 

[Chak Bamu]

@haviZsultan, I am really not a secularist, neither would I describe myself as a liberal. I am a democrat with right-of center views, though some of my views do lean to the left. I believe that we have a good constitution and I wish to celebrate the fact by my commitment to democracy. We can both agree especially when it comes to democratic activism, but we may also have to agree to disagree when it comes to nationalism, view of religion's role in a state, etc... My identity follows a certain hierarchy (Islam, Pakistan, Lahore, Punjab, South Asia). And no, I have not been sulking Havi. I just do not feel motivated enough, unlike today.

Having said the above, which may clarify a few misconceptions that you might have, I shall now turn to the subject at hand. I would post the comment that I left on your website, and expand with my notion of Wahabism's place in Pakistan.

"I had a friend like that. I did not de-friend him. Instead I viewed him as an interesting case and a challenge. I turned him around eventually. Apparently atheism is full of doubts itself. It may seem terribly liberating. But then one stares at that terror of liberation and blinks. Religion is instinctive, one just has to feed that instinct.

Once I find a person who turns atheist, I try to find what got them there to begin with. It is always some psychological event that triggers the process of questioning and rebellion.

It is worthwhile to note that Atheism is a religion by itself. There is dogma, logic, and a god (self) but no ritual. And it is terribly lonely.

Mir Hamza Khan Shinwari was a famous Pashto poet. In an interview on PTV he said that he turned atheist in his youth, but slowly came around because of Sufi influence."

Wahabism is synonymous with intolerance in a certain sense. It deprives one of having to think much. It robs religion of the nuances and shades of religious experience and perspective. For some people this is just as well. But for society, it is pretty much a bane. I should know. I used to have Wahabist and Salafist views. My religious learning apart from learning to read Quran was unguided and on self-help basis. This is pretty much a recipe for a person to grow into Wahabism. Be wary of anyone who decries the presence of different sects in Islam. Most likely such a person is an Ahle-Hadith, or some other pseudo-Wahabist.

I read Shahabnama and got an introduction to Sufism, which til then I had thought was anti-Islam mumbo jumbo. Incidentally Shahabnama's last chapter is an enigmatic but short and straight introduction to Sufism. Qudratullah Shahab tells us who he is in a number of chapters, and then at the end tells us why he is the way he is. He died shortly after having written the book. He had a premonition. But he put to rest some controversy about his Sufi status. And raised some controversy about his role in governance of the country at the same time. He did retire as secretary of Education after all. He worked on key posts all his life while in Pakistan and was close to a number of heads of state. How he got there, he leaves unsaid, but anyone with imagination can guess how it happened he does leave some clues. Any Indian posters here, if you can read Urdu, get Shahabnama at all costs. Any Pakistanis who have not read it, pls do so. You would get an idea why certain things happened and get an idea of how come certain things would never happen in Pakistan.

Pls excuse the apparent tangentiality of my thought, but there is a purpose. Though Shahabnama does not state so clearly, an idea steadily gained a hold on my mind: Wahabism shall never ever take hold of Pakistan. This is important. Let me repeat: Wahabism shall never ever take hold of Pakistan. Wahabism does not suit us. The thought process behind Wahabism is not organic to this country. You may ask me where does it say so in Shahabnama? It does not do so anywhere explicitly actually.

As I said it was my introduction to Sufism. I read some more, and I finally read the iconic 'Kashf-Al-Mahjoob'. There ended my need to read anymore about Sufism. It is an intensely personal and practical path and not something to be extracted out of books. Anyone born in Lahore, who needs to learn about Sufism would invariably turn to this book. It was written by none other than Hazrat Usman bin Ali AlHajvery, the Data Sahib of Lahore. The anchor in the social & religious life of this bustling mega metropolis through many centuries of waxing and waning. It is no wonder that one probably never sees anything older in Lahore than Data Durbar itself.

Over time I wandered spiritually and finally found my home in a Sufi order that was ordained exactly when Wahabism arose and that too in Arabia. Wahabists really hate us Idreesis. Because we stand in stark contrast to Wahabism. I should caution anyone who may think that Sufism is a Chocolaty gooey, buttery, smooth lullaby sort of all embracing philosophy. That it most emphatically is not, no matter who may say so. It is a window that opens to possibilities, and it does nothing to oppose Fiqh or Shariah, merely re-orients the person. I have been with people who might have excused Alcoholic drinks in the name of Tassawwuf (Sufism), but genuine Sufis are not like that. I briefly observed a national gathering of Western Order of Sufism, and saw their terribly heterodox ways - and why not, they were mostly jews there who were searching for authentic religious experience that they perhaps could not find in their religion of birth (if they believed at all that is).

Ours is the land of Sufis. It was they who spread Islam. They converted the individuals, clans, and sometimes tribes. They had the breadth of compassion which carries a healing touch. These people are buried all over Pakistan. Their graves are points of light that attract believers. They pointed to Allah and Rasool (peace and blessings be upon him) during their lives and in the awakening of death they still point to Allah and Rasool (peace and blessings be upon him). They converted the natives, they embraced the doubters, and they pulled people to the straight path. I already gave the example of Mir Hamza Khan Shinwari who had turned atheist in his youth. He stayed that way for a couple of years or so. But he had respect for a Sufi Master, who eventually pulled Mir Hamza Khan Shinwari to true religion. Sufis have this power. They are given these powers because they rid themselves of personal ego.

So, no need to worry overmuch. In the end no matter what we may fancy ourselves capable of doing or what we may assign to ourselves. The result rests not in our hands. Havi, do not imagine that it is up to you to do this or that, or to accomplish this or that. Your job is to go for it. But whether or not you get it is not up to you. If you understand this, you shall never be disillusioned.

 

[Chak Bamu]

After researching wahabism i discovered that..

Islam has everything to do with Arab imperialism and it gave them the moral legitimacy to invade, loot and plunder in the name of religion which they earlier lack. I terms of tradition it is no different to what Romans, Persians and Europeans did by claiming god to be on their side.

Highly superficial view of history. It may be pleasing to some, but certainly misleading.

 

[livingdead]

@Chak Bamu atheism in theory is not a religion, its just not believing in existance of god because of insufficient evidence. Some atheist may display behaviour of a religious person (offensive to other's views, dogmatic and in some case proselytising) though.

Its not much different from a-flat-earthist or a-santa-clausist ...

Agree about the way you described many people become atheist ... but quite a lot do it by trying to make sense of things without any specific event happening to them.(or as a rebel)

 

[muse]

Highly superficial view of history. It may be pleasing to some, but certainly misleading.

Could you please elaborate? How is this misleading and superficial?

 

[haviZsultan]

HaviZ, do some search on the threads on this forum, for years we have been suggesting exactly this - that the worst thing that can and will happen from this Wahabi lunacy is that it will be the totality of Islam that will be what people will blame for this, and justifiably, in my opinion.

Already you see this, in Pakistan and where ever the Wahabi tyranny exists, religiosity is now devoid of the notion of "Faith", and all about "Certitude", of a love (personal relationship) with the Divine - it's all about outward appearances, of do's and dont's , entirely devoid of ethics and of morality, of inquiry, of search.

On this forum - do a search for "Types of Religiosity"

Exactly muse. Have to wonder what is left when literally each and every person can be declared a Kaffir by the Wahabis and hence killed.

It has now become a quest to impose one worldview on the other and the freedom loving have never, ever accepted that. I know people who used to be on the right once but gave up because of how people demanded things from them, wanted to impose their ideas on them.

I believe our destruction was assured when we gave up on Ijtehad. Allama Iqbal notes this in penned poem:

There is' no place in Ind where from to learn
The tenets that the Muslim Faith concern.
They are devoid of zeal for godly acts,
And are not wont to seek its basic facts.
The mystics, who were keen their Faith to spread,
Are silent now and thought for them a dread.
Alas! the state of bondage deprives of zest,
Slaves tread 'the beaten path and relinquish quest.
The jurists are helpless to such extent
Can't change themselves, but would change Koran's content.
How sad, the jurists can't shift their outlook,
But would prefer to change the Holy Book
These abject slaves opine and cling to creed
That Holy Book is full of flaws indeed.
They think it incomplete for this fact
Because it fails to teach the slavish tact.

It is about Ijtehad (Liberalism in Islam the first step to which is scholarly debate-once used to start with people saying I may be wrong before stating their point)

 

[Indrajith]

Every religion goes through different phases , Islam being the most modern will also go through these phases

Birth--> growth--> maturity (confidence) --> over confidence & rules of theocratic or priests (all evil starts here) --> illogical ,disbelief & content --> atheism or logical belief (accepting the religion according to ones own personal logic & belief & no much value for theocratic & priest class)

Now Islam is in the 4th stage

 

[SQ8]

@haviZsultan
It would be good that we differentiate Wahabbism for its malignment of being a Wahabbi.
The history of the order would be a good place to start.
The father of the creator of the "Wahabbi" sect was a very respected scholar whose knowledge of Islam was well respected in the circles. So when Ibn ʿAbd al-Wahhab started propagating his own understanding in cahoots with the Saud Tribe people started listening to him thinking that "Wahabbi" meant that this was approved from the very knowledgeable and respectable ʿAbd al-Wahhab. Infact, when ʿAbd al-Wahhab heard of what his son was preaching he disowned him and even has his younger son write a pamphlet denouncing him.(this pamphlet can still be found in the Libraries of Osmania University in Hyderabad and in the Deoband libraries along with Orientalist collections..any other traces of it have been systematically eliminated by the Saudi Religious council).
So you may very well understand what has been taught by a person whose own father disowned him.

 

[Kompromat]

I strongly object to linking wahabism to militancy.

 

[haviZsultan]

@Chak Bamu... a must read article. To have a proper debate on the matter we need to separate what was taught by Zia from our minds. He promoted the concept that Islam and secularism are 2 distinct concepts and run on opposing tracks. This is the one thing I have noticed that limits or destroys any chances of debate with an Islamist. I have been having the same debate with Zarvan and co and it is tiring. Plus no one cares about the posts either and I feel like I am talking to myself.

If you can think of a hypothesis where the two are one I may try to convince you of the benefits of a secular system.

I would personally favour mu'tazili school of thought though but do read this article if you favor Sufism:

Sufism & Secularism


Sufism belongs in spirit to the modern age. It has an affinity with it; it is in tune with secularism, with the modern thirst for objective knowledge

The founders of the Sufi tradition came from mixed urban populations, and their ideals of tolerance were born out of a daily interaction with people of other faiths. They created heterogeneous multicultural traditions and absorbed influences from mnay sources and cultures thus inviting the accusations from puritanical Isalm about Sufism's being a heresy.

Sufism is not a heresy but its an immensely adaptive and universal creed.Sufis were far ahead of their time as they accepted any faith into their fold.
The tolerance that Sufis advocated for on a spiritual level has been accomplished by many Western societies based on a practical need.The Sufis’ interfaith exchange could be resurrected to encourage interfaith harmony.

Multiculturalism;

Sufi mystics lived in multicultural societies, where some of their followers were Sikh, Hindu or Muslim. Bulleh Shah famously stated “

Somewhere he is called Ramdas and elsewhere Fateh Muhammad
This dispute is from the eternity
Once the quarrel between them was settled
Something else came out of it.”
Bulleh Shah breaks down the divisions between Hinduism and Islam to claim that all holy men belonged to the human order and should thus be embraced by all humans equally. Sufis belonging to the Chistia School held such a tolerant and inclusive view, that some of their writings were included in the most holy of books for Sikhs.

Sufi Separation of Mosque and State:

Sufis encourage disciples to separate their politics from their spirituality in order to maintain purity of both. Sufism decrees that the Mosque and State must be separated, but not in order to preserve the State, but in order to preserve religion or spirituality itself.

Shah Hussain stated: “Kings are busy in their kingdoms, the moneylenders are collecting their debts and the tiller is concerned about his village. We only seek the pleasure of our Sain (Lord, Beloved).”

Sufi Rejection of Rituals:In many ways, the Wahabi Islam adopted by many, focuses greatly on the rituals of the faith rather than attempting to espouse the spirit of their religion. These styles focus on outward appearance rather than on a spiritual introspection.

In response, Bulleh Shah would yell, “burn the prayer mat and lota (earthen pot)/ Don’t take the prayer rosary and holy stick/Lovers are announcing over and over/Leave the kosher and eat non-kosher. Oh Bullah drink wine and eat kebobs, burn the fire of your bones under [them]. Rob the robber of robbers”. Rather than merely adopting the rituals and appearances of piety, Sufi mystics say one should emulate the ideas of equality and love for humanity that their Prophet (PBUH) imbued.
This rejection of rituals as a means to enlightenment is a concept that could greatly serve many Muslims, it would give them the ability to critically examine their own spiritual beliefs rather than relying on dogma or rituals.

Rather than relying on a ritualistic form of militant Islam that creates identity crises, the Muslim community should study the tolerant and open ideas of Sufi mystics.

There are certain qualities of Islam that meld with secularism... but its the different schools of thought that are the issue. Hanafis are neutral, Wahabis are terrorists, Sufis mystics and Mu'tazili's secularists. We adopt mutazili thought and we are secular already.