THE PAKISTAN WE LOST SOMEWHERE BETWEEN OUR EGOS AND IMMORALITIES

[M.SAAD]

All I'm saying that Quaid probably wanted a modern Muslim majority state with some basic Islamic principles, not a fully Islamic state with Shariah and Mullah rule etc.


Quaid e Azam in his own life wasn't a religious person, and what's wrong with secularism?? Most people don't even know the exact definition of it .

 

[VCheng]

All I'm saying that Quaid probably wanted a modern Muslim majority state with some basic Islamic principles, not a fully Islamic state with Shariah and Mullah rule etc.


Quaid e Azam in his own life wasn't a religious person, and what's wrong with secularism?? Most people don't even know the exact definition of it .

Whatever Jinnah wanted for Pakistan died with him in 1948. What the Objectives Resolution says after its adoption in 1949 is what determined what happened next in Pakistan after that.

 

[OrionHunter]

Maybe you failed to read the 1st part of my post and only quoted the part that interested you....I did blame the politicians FIRST then you lot which is not deniable! MQM and Baluchistan

Agreed to the first part of your this post. Disagree with the second!!

 

[saadee]

Beca

why does Lady Diana looks so uncomfortable? why did you put her in between a bunch of policemen LOL

because thulla on her left side is giving her a dirty look.

 

[Jf Thunder]

because thulla on her left side is giving her a dirty look.

he is talking to her...................

 

[saadee]

he is talking to her...................

I was just kidding

 

[Jf Thunder]

I was just kidding

..................

 

[Azad-Kashmiri]

Many people are allergic to this term 'secularism'. Its means nothing but separation of state and religious affairs. No, its not propagation of liberalism and nudity in disguise. If Quaid was an Islamist, he would have tasked some known Mullah of the time to head the First Islamic Department of Pakistan. Rather he chose a Jewish Rabbi convert to Islam for the task:

You obviously don't comprehend the system of separation of state and religion. Any religious laws, actions can be challenged in the Dajalic system in the courts. For example prohibtions of alcohol and gambling; hijab, salaah, sowm in ramadhan, zakat, etc. It is a front for spreading immorality and decadence.

 

[CIS-TRANS]

Quaid e Azam in his own life wasn't a religious person, and what's wrong with secularism?? Most people don't even know the exact definition of it .

I don't see anything wrong with original secularism but in Pakistan mostly secular are more corrupt and always criticizing others unfairly, I mean a person holding some ideology must act that should attract others instead of complaining. Be attractive and folks will follow you.

 

[Azad-Kashmiri]

Hi,

The answer to your question is not straightforward as it would seem.

But in I will try my best to put it in few and clear words to avoid ambiguity.

Lack of Education in both Extreme mindset . ( Madrasas and schools)

By that I dont mean literate. you can see we have loads of Masters without a decent job in Pakistan, we have loads of Hafez-e Quran with dark and regrettable records.

We are quite literate in our schools and madrasah i.e we can read, and write, quite and parrot quite well. But have failed miserably in understanding the message that was conveyed to us.

We have severe identity crisis (all of sub-continent) In our school we are taught of western stories and in Madrassah we are taught on how to hate everything which is from west.

''Opposing west is Islam, and opposing Islam is progressive model'' is the idea that we are brought up with.

Both of which are equally wrong

The notion of ''educated=illiterate'' is an excellent deduction.

The Secularists/liberals for their inferiority complex, and their ignorance of Islam and kuffar comments on PDF.

Before the Last Hour there will be commotions like pieces of a dark night in which a man will be a believer in the morning and an kafir in the evening, or a believer in the evening and kafir in the morning.(Abu Dawood)

Unfortunately, they're in power as prophesied by nabi as'salaathu was'salaam:

Power and authority will be given to wrong people. [Bukhari]

The 38 million madaris graduates in 20 years have distant themselves from society. The real Muftis are not the ones on television seeking peoples votes within a system that is unislamic. They are liars! Like my imam said, ''thahtha kuffar wa nifaq''. They are ''under disbelief and hypocrisy''.

He @syedali73 made an important observation; tarbiat! If we look at upbringing of the past and today, they're is no concept of responsibility in today's child. If a child makes a mistake, he must have been led astray by someone else. If he fails his exams, it was so and so's fault. They don't have humanity and mercy in their heart's.

Naturally, as a Muslim I'm going to say we need Islamic nizam. There has to be an education of what REAL Islam is. Not Taliban, ISIS, Saudi or any any other ''cultural Islam''. This is not difficult as people may think. Islam has been around for over 1430 years, and for over 1300 years up and till 1924 there was an Islamic State. The most powerful state in the history of mankind.

 

[posedion]

War War ---- hate hate ---- nations lost ----- humanity lost ----- what difference India or Pakistan

Mori araj suno, dastagir pir
O my Lord, pay heed to my appeal
(repeat)

Mairee kahun kaa say mein apnay jiya ki pir
I am a faithful follower of my Creator

Mori araj suno, dastagir pir
O my Lord, pay heed to my appeal

Rabba sachiya, toon tay akhia see
My true Lord, you had said

Ja oye bandiya jug da shah ain tu
“Go man, you are master of the world

Saadian nemataan terian daulataan nenh
My bounties on earth are your treasure

Saada naib the alijah ain tu
You are the viceroy of your Creator”

Ais laaray teh torr kudh puchia eh
After baiting me with these promises

Kee ais nimanay teh beetiyaan nenh
Countless years have passed by

Kaddi saar we layee o rab saiyaan
My Lord, did you ever enquire what transpired with your man

Terey shah naal jugh kee kitiyan nenh
What your man has suffered in this world?

Kithay dhons police sarkar dee eh
Somewhere, those in power and with the means intimidate, harass and terrorize

Kithay dhandhli maal patwaar di eh
Elsewhere, draft and bribery are rampant

Ainj hadaan wich kalpay jaan meri
My soul is shaken down to my bone

Jeevain phahee ich koonj kurlaundi eh
Just like a bird flutters when caught in a trap

Changa shah banayaee rab saiyaan
You made a fine king indeed, my sweet lord

Paulay khaandayaan waar na aundi eh
All I have gotten are endless beatings

Mainu shahi naeen chaidi rab meray
I don’t want kingship, my Lord

Mein tay izzat da tukkar mangna haan
All I need is a morsel of respect

Meinu taang naeen mehlaan maraiaan di
I have no desire to live in palaces

Mein tay jeevain di nukkar mangnaa haan
I just want a small nook to live my life

Meri mannain tay tairian main mannan
If you agree with me, I will agree with you

Teri sohn jay ik wi gal moran
I won’t decline anything no matter how unreasonable

Jey ay maang nai pujdi tain rabba
If you don’t look out for me God!

Fayr main jawan teh rab koi hor loraan
Then I should go and seek for myself another god

Mori araj suno, dastagir pir
O my lord, pay heed to my appeal
(repeat)

Arieb Azhar:
Iss surat seh
With this grimace

Arz sunatay
Pleading

Dard batatay
Sharing the pain

Nayya khaitay
Rowing the boat

Minnat kartay
Asking for his blessings

Rasta taktay
Waiting expectantly

Kitni sadiyaan beet gai hain
Countless centuries have passed by

Ab jakar yeh bhaid khulla hai
Only now has it been revealed

Jis koh tum ne arz guzari
The one who you had appealed to

Jo tha haat pakarnay waala
The one who held your hand and guided you

Jis jaag laagi nao tumhaari
Where your boat had docked

Jis say dukh ka daaroo manga
From whom you had asked for a panacea for your pain

Toray mandir may joh nahin aaya
The one who did not visit your temple

Woh tau tum heen thay
It was you only

Woh tau tum heen thay
It was you only

 

[Azad-Kashmiri]

what's wrong with secularism??

Its haram!

 

[VCheng]

Naturally, as a Muslim I'm going to say we need Islamic nizam.

Just in Pakistan, or the Middle East, or all over the world? Are you willing to accept that there can be diversity of beliefs or systems for the vast numbers of humanity that are not Muslims?

 

[hussain0216]

Actually it's the Pakistan army and the ISI which are responsible for the current horrible state of Pakistan ....they have plundered Pakistanis and PAKISTAN AS A WHOLE.....there is lot of corruption in Pak army but nothing ever comes out.... and if anybody tries to expose Pak army, he or she gets brutally killed.....Pak army and ISI officials are super rich and they live like kings....Pak army and ISI have turned Pakistan into an islamic terrorist state for their own benefit... Pakistanis should face this reality....Death to Pak Army and the ISI

Pakistan Army is the reason why we stand as a nation

We have a 7 times bigger external enemy and many internal

Without the military we would have been buried

We are now emerging and could become a economic powerhouse and it will partly be because of the defence of Pakistan by the military

 

[M.SAAD]

Actually it's the Pakistan army and the ISI which are responsible for the current horrible state of Pakistan ....they have plundered Pakistanis and PAKISTAN AS A WHOLE.....there is lot of corruption in Pak army but nothing ever comes out.... and if anybody tries to expose Pak army, he or she gets brutally killed.....Pak army and ISI officials are super rich and they live like kings....Pak army and ISI have turned Pakistan into an islamic terrorist state for their own benefit... Pakistanis should face this reality....Death to Pak Army and the ISI

So this is your first post on a Pakistan defence forum