What's new

The Javelin challenge

shree835

BANNED
Joined
Jun 26, 2010
Messages
3,005
Reaction score
-19
Country
India
Location
India
The irony in India-United States relations is that all the right things are said about them, and all the wrong things done. So while the two countries are said to be bound by virtue of being “the world’s largest democracy and the world’s oldest democracy,” a line unfailingly included in the speech of every visiting dignitary from the U.S., the reality is a big drift in bilateral ties.

As the time nears for Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to the White House in September, there is an apparent effort to ensure that his talks with President Barack Obama are productive. The pressure has grown on Washington to show it wants to take bilateral ties forward under Prime Minister Modi, who it had blacklisted while he was Gujarat Chief Minister over the 2002 riots. The latest endeavour came from U.S. Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel, who arrived in New Delhi shortly after Secretary of State John Kerry. After his meetings with Mr.

Modi, External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj and Finance and Defence Minister Arun Jaitley, Mr. Hagel pronounced himself convinced that the two sides “can transform our potential into results.” The main focus of his meetings was cooperation in the defence sector. India is the world’s largest importer of arms, and also among the biggest buyers of U.S. materiel. Since 2008, New Delhi has bought U.S. defence equipment worth nearly $10 billion and has been pushing for transfer of technology to manufacture those weapons here. Mr. Hagel appeared to concur, saying the way to transform defence ties would be to move “from simply buying and selling to co-production, co-development, and freer exchange of technology.”

Declarations apart, the U.S. has a reputation for not being very reliable on precisely this aspect of its military partnerships. No agreements were announced during Mr. Hagel’s visit. The two sides, however, agreed to activate their stillborn 2012 Defense Trade and Technology Initiative. Mr. Hagel is said to have discussed a “pilot plan” to co-produce and co-develop the Javelin anti-tank missile, manufactured by Raytheon-Lockheed Martin.

A team from the company had visited India some years ago, but drew the line at transferring technology to enable the system to be built locally. It is unclear if New Delhi’s recent decision to increase the FDI limit in defence production from 26 to 49 per cent will be a game-changer. The limited hike has not received an effusive welcome from weapons contractors. A deal on the Javelin would be far dearer than the Spike, the Israeli alternative the Army has extensively tested and liked. Still, Mr. Hagel’s offer should be put to the test, to check if the U.S. is serious about taking its military partnership with India to a higher level.

The Javelin challenge - The Hindu
 
.
The irony in India-United States relations is that all the right things are said about them, and all the wrong things done. So while the two countries are said to be bound by virtue of being “the world’s largest democracy and the world’s oldest democracy,” a line unfailingly included in the speech of every visiting dignitary from the U.S., the reality is a big drift in bilateral ties.

As the time nears for Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to the White House in September, there is an apparent effort to ensure that his talks with President Barack Obama are productive. The pressure has grown on Washington to show it wants to take bilateral ties forward under Prime Minister Modi, who it had blacklisted while he was Gujarat Chief Minister over the 2002 riots. The latest endeavour came from U.S. Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel, who arrived in New Delhi shortly after Secretary of State John Kerry. After his meetings with Mr.

Modi, External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj and Finance and Defence Minister Arun Jaitley, Mr. Hagel pronounced himself convinced that the two sides “can transform our potential into results.” The main focus of his meetings was cooperation in the defence sector. India is the world’s largest importer of arms, and also among the biggest buyers of U.S. materiel. Since 2008, New Delhi has bought U.S. defence equipment worth nearly $10 billion and has been pushing for transfer of technology to manufacture those weapons here. Mr. Hagel appeared to concur, saying the way to transform defence ties would be to move “from simply buying and selling to co-production, co-development, and freer exchange of technology.”

Declarations apart, the U.S. has a reputation for not being very reliable on precisely this aspect of its military partnerships. No agreements were announced during Mr. Hagel’s visit. The two sides, however, agreed to activate their stillborn 2012 Defense Trade and Technology Initiative. Mr. Hagel is said to have discussed a “pilot plan” to co-produce and co-develop the Javelin anti-tank missile, manufactured by Raytheon-Lockheed Martin.

A team from the company had visited India some years ago, but drew the line at transferring technology to enable the system to be built locally. It is unclear if New Delhi’s recent decision to increase the FDI limit in defence production from 26 to 49 per cent will be a game-changer. The limited hike has not received an effusive welcome from weapons contractors. A deal on the Javelin would be far dearer than the Spike, the Israeli alternative the Army has extensively tested and liked. Still, Mr. Hagel’s offer should be put to the test, to check if the U.S. is serious about taking its military partnership with India to a higher level.

The Javelin challenge - The Hindu
looks nothing more than the last ditch effort by paid media to somehow intimidate the NDA govt in exepptting the deals finalised as the UPA left them cause huge ammounts of US tax payers money and effort by US defence contractors has already gone into lobbying for these deals and that they dont want there investemnt ending up as a failed effort

but i dont think that the deals will be done as UPA had finalised rather NDA govt will renagociate all of them yes this will hurt owr mordenisation of armed forces but in long run will it willbe good for owr forces
 
.
looks nothing more than the last ditch effort by paid media to somehow intimidate the NDA govt in exepptting the deals finalised as the UPA left them cause huge ammounts of US tax payers money and effort by US defence contractors has already gone into lobbying for these deals and that they dont want there investemnt ending up as a failed effort

but i dont think that the deals will be done as UPA had finalised rather NDA govt will renagociate all of them yes this will hurt owr mordenisation of armed forces but in long run will it willbe good for owr forces

I am good as long as rafel is signed,please don't renegotiate MMRCA.All other deals specially with the US needs to be re looked at
 
.
I am good as long as rafel is signed,please don't renegotiate MMRCA.All other deals specially with the US needs to be re looked at
well brother to my knowledge the ammount of kickbacks promised per plane run into 7 digit and that too in $$s and the greedy IAF top brass , MOD baboons and UPA netas are paerties in crime with 50% share to netas while 25% each for MOD & IAF top brass
 
. .
It will be good if US somehow gets MMRCA deal even if they get it buy offering F-35s.
 
.
javelin and spike...how they can be compared sir..i am a new member and wanted to learn about all these things...i also found spike on some news across internet,but can't understand it..can someone explain please..:unsure:
 
.
US anti-tank missile Javelin in face-off with Israel's Spike | Business Standard News

The United States is rising steadily up the list of India's top military suppliers. The ministry of defence (MoD) is finalising a decision to allow the FGM-148 Javelin missile, built by US companies Lockheed Martin and Raytheon, into a contest to supply the Indian Army with anti-tank guided missiles (ATGM).

This is bad news for Israeli company, Rafael Advanced Defence Systems, whose Spike ATGM was poised to be awarded the contract for 8400 missiles for India's 350-odd infantry battalions, estimated to be worth Rs 9,300 crore ($1.5 billion). When India floated a tender, only Rafael had offered a missile that met the army's requirements. Now the Javelin is on offer and an interested MoD wants it to compete with Spike.

On November 11, the MoD's apex Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) debated whether to buy the Spike. Eventually, it shied away from a single-vendor purchase, though a "global technology scan" that the military carried out earlier this year found no comparable option. Now, with the Javelin on offer, albeit as a latecomer, the game has changed.

The US Department of Defense (the Pentagon) has offered the Javelin in two separate letters to the MoD this year. As Business Standard first reported (September 17, "US offers to co-develop new Javelin missile with India") the Pentagon has sweetened its offer with a proposal to co-manufacture the Javelin in India, and to partner the Defence R&D Organisation (DRDO) in co-developing an advanced version of the missile for the future.

The Pentagon has offered the Javelin under the US Foreign Military Sales (FMS) programme. This implies it would be contracted directly between the Pentagon and the MoD, with the Pentagon negotiating terms with Lockheed Martin and Raytheon, and charging India 3.8 per cent of the contract amount as a fee. The MoD, wary of procurement scams, believes FMS contracts are relatively clean and increasingly favours this route. The C-17 Globemaster III transport aircraft, bought for Rs 25,000 crore ($4.12 billion) was an FMS contract; the on-going purchase of M777 artillery guns is also through the FMS route.

The Javelin offer also benefited from the personal advocacy of the recently retired US defence secretary, Ashton Carter, who lobbied forcefully during his visit to New Delhi on September 17.

"(The Javelin) is being offered to no other country but India", Carter told the media in New Delhi.

MoD has declined to comment on this proposal, but officials privately term the offer "unprecedented". US equipment has always been bought over-the-counter. Now the offer to co-manufacture the third-generation (i.e. "fire-and-forget") Javelin ATGM could bring in US best practices in high-tech manufacture. Meanwhile, the DRDO is evaluating the proposal to co-develop the fourth-generation missile, an offer that the US has not made even to its closest allies.

The Javelin, which has seen extensive combat in Iraq and Afghanistan, is regarded as the world's premier man-portable, anti-tank missile. It allows infantrymen, who are often vulnerable to enemy tanks, a weapon to destroy tanks from four kilometres away.

If the Javelin were superior to the Spike, as US officials claim, it would also be more expensive. The Pentagon's co-manufacture and co-development offer seeks to compensate for that higher cost.

Yet, the army is frustrated at the stalling of the Spike purchase, which was being finalised after extensive trials. The army has now asked the DRDO to co-develop an ATGM with an international partner. Since defence procurement rules require the DRDO to select a development partner through competitive bidding, Lockheed Martin and Raytheon might have to compete with Rafael, and possibly other global vendors as well.

MoD sources welcome the prospect of US companies competing with other vendors to partner India in missile co-development. "The more vendors that compete, the better the deal for India", says an official.

Missile co-development with Israel has been plagued with glitches in the past. The Indo-Israeli Long Range Surface-to-Air Missile (LR-SAM) and Medium Range Surface to Air Missile (MR-SAM) projects are running years behind schedule.

Meanwhile, Washington-based sources tell Business Standard that the Pentagon plans to make the Javelin offer even more attractive. Declining to provide details, they say the MoD will soon hear the specifics.

Washington had not offered India the Javelin when the MoD first floated a global tender for ATGMs. The Pentagon was eager but the State Department argued that equipping India so lavishly would "alter the regional military balance". With the US-India engagement maturing, the State Department is now fully on board. Indian Army missile pilots had fired the Javelin several times during US-India joint exercises and were impressed by its performance. Nevertheless, the Javelin would be comprehensively trial-evaluated, as the Spike has been. That will only begin when an FMS request is processed between Washington and New Delhi.

With over Rs 50,000 crore ($8 billion) worth of orders already on its books, America is closing in on another Rs 30,000 crore ($5 billion) worth of arms sales to India. These include six C-130J Super Hercules tactical transport aircraft; 22 AH-64D Apache attack helicopters; 15 CH-47F Chinook heavy-lift helicopters; and 145 M-777 ultra-light howitzers. The Javelin could now swell that tally.
 
.
What is similarity between Spike & Javelin??
 
. . . .
IMHO Govt. of India needs to think twice before buying anything thing from Amreeka,Who knows in coming time they'll put sanctions on us and leave us with no option in our darkest time.Just my 2 cents :cheers:
 
.
Javelin is the best ATGM in the world..no doubt abt it.But we need certain production rights..so we can't be held hostage in wartime.
 
.
Please care to explain ...

F-35 is a 5th gen plane designed to be used by all three services as per their needs and it will add teeth to IAF & specially IN against PLAAF & PLAN as they don't have a 5th gen plane which can fulfill requirements of all three services specially Navy.
 
.

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom