The Jats of Sindh

[Shahmir]

Ah not really ... Punjab assembly speaker... Ministers .. Sanaullah/mashood/defence minister Tanvir,Ahsan Iqbal and many more .. Even PPP govt had many Rajput ministers etc.. Even the army chief is a Rajput..


Nope they aren't jatts .. Baluch .. But a significant Jamali population is Sindhi speaking .. Just like magsis who are also found in Southern Punjab near DIK-layyah region.

Yes that is what I also find strange trend in PMLN government that they are awarding so much to these Rajputs when they are not much important in most parts of central punjab and I consider it a very bad precedence on part of PMLN party. Rana Sanaullah for example is a punjabi migrant background from Faisalabad and we all know that biggest migrant tribes from eastern punjab were actually arain and jatts and sheikhs. There is something definitely wrong in the head of PMLN people to award so many important posts to rajputs of central punjab.

I think the jatts , gujjars and arains are politically divided among many parties in central punjab and the minority rajputs from these areas are taking advantage of that situation and hence getting disproportionate share and representation in the government of punjab.

 

[Shahmir]

And no such thing as working as kammis .. Yes some poor might cultivate some land on thaika.. But from what I've seen even the poorest Rajput would own a few acres .. Another thin I've noticed in Punjab .. Kammis either try to be syeds/qureshis,Rajputs or jatts... I've seen such ppl getting owned by real Rajputs several times.. Just ask their goth or sub clan n voila.. We don't know/never asked n other excuses..

You seem talking more like a rajput than a baloch. I don't want to offend anyone but in gujranwala we say that any low caste who does not have any caste identity can happily take "rajput" identity because it is considered the most ambiguous identity in most parts of central punjab, so much for superiority of rajputs .

It is relative. Awan is nobody in bannu but is upper class in khushab. Turi tribe were "hamsaya" of bangash and were of inferior status but by conquering the area they became landowners and pashtuns of equal status. Khattak is of lower social status as "hamsaya" among marwats but the same marwat is of lower social status living among khattaks. Jatts of lakki marwat is of lower social status, in DI khan he is not.
Rajput being superior by default is BS.

Believe me it is biggest internet hoax , come to gujranwala, sialkot , narowal areas and see no one gives a flying fkk about anything called rajput, these are essentially jatt and gujjar areas particularly jatt.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Yes that is what I also find strange trend in PMLN government that they are awarding so much to these Rajputs when they are not much important in most parts of central punjab and I consider it a very bad precedence on part of PMLN party. Rana Sanaullah for example is a punjabi migrant background from Faisalabad and we all know that biggest migrant tribes from eastern punjab were actually arain and jatts and sheikhs. There is something definitely wrong in the head of PMLN people to award so many important posts to rajputs of central punjab.

I think the jatts , gujjars and arains are politically divided among many parties in central punjab and the minority rajputs from these areas are taking advantage of that situation and hence getting disproportionate share and representation in the government of punjab.

Rajputs are politically strong in the areas where they live ... In Central Punjab you will see Rajputs in every govt cabinet be it PPP or pmln ... Even in South you will see langrials n johiyas being strong...

It is relative. Awan is nobody in bannu but is upper class in khushab. Turi tribe were "hamsaya" of bangash and were of inferior status but by conquering the area they became landowners and pashtuns of equal status. Khattak is of lower social status as "hamsaya" among marwats but the same marwat is of lower social status living among khattaks. Jatts of lakki marwat is of lower social status, in DI khan he is not.
Rajput being superior by default is BS.

I've seen kakakhels complain abt being clubbed with khattaks... I've seen proud khattaks .. Have both Kakakhel aswell as Khattak frnds from ziarat kaka saheb n shaidu.. And even Karak ( Khattak stronghold)..

Yes that is what I also find strange trend in PMLN government that they are awarding so much to these Rajputs when they are not much important in most parts of central punjab and I consider it a very bad precedence on part of PMLN party. Rana Sanaullah for example is a punjabi migrant background from Faisalabad and we all know that biggest migrant tribes from eastern punjab were actually arain and jatts and sheikhs. There is something definitely wrong in the head of PMLN people to award so many important posts to rajputs of central punjab.

I think the jatts , gujjars and arains are politically divided among many parties in central punjab and the minority rajputs from these areas are taking advantage of that situation and hence getting disproportionate share and representation in the government of punjab.

Rajputs are politically strong in the areas where they live ... In Central Punjab you will see Rajputs in every govt cabinet be it PPP or pmln ... Even in South you will see langrials n johiyas etc being strong...

It is relative. Awan is nobody in bannu but is upper class in khushab. Turi tribe were "hamsaya" of bangash and were of inferior status but by conquering the area they became landowners and pashtuns of equal status. Khattak is of lower social status as "hamsaya" among marwats but the same marwat is of lower social status living among khattaks. Jatts of lakki marwat is of lower social status, in DI khan he is not.
Rajput being superior by default is BS.

I've seen kakakhels complain abt being clubbed with khattaks... I've seen proud khattaks .. Have both Kakakhel aswell as Khattak frnds from ziarat kaka saheb n shaidu.. And even Karak ( Khattak stronghold)..

You seem talking more like a rajput than a baloch. I don't want to offend anyone but in gujranwala we say that any low caste who does not have any caste identity can happily take "rajput" identity because it is the ambiguous identity in most parts of central punjab, so much for superiority of rajputs .




Believe me it is biggest internet hoax , come to gujranwala, sialkot , narowal areas and see no one gives a flying fkk about anything called rajput, these are essentially jatt and gujjar areas particularly jatt.

I have Rajput frnd .. A jatt room mate from pindi bhattian.. The second roomie is a jatt from gujrat.. Etc etc ... I've lived in gujranwala for 3 years... If I say things openly it will offend many here .. I'm only trying to be a little bit honest .. .. The areas you quoted have few Rajputs .. But even in the areas they reside they have atleast a MPA from them .. Kamoki area again a lot of Rajputs.. N dominate politics.. Ahsan Iqbal another Rajput from narowal area .. Etc etc..

 

[Shahmir]

I have Rajput frnd .. A jatt room mate ... I've lived in gujranwala for 3 years... If I say things openly it will offend many here .. I'm only trying to be a little bit honest .. .. The areas you quoted have few Rajputs .. But even in the areas they reside they have atleast a MPA from them .. Kamoki area again a lot of Rajputs.. Ahsan Iqbal another Rajput from narowal area .. Etc etc..

Having an MPA does not always mean large presence of a particular caste in that area, if your jatt opponents are divided along many party lines and you get kammis vote on your side you may win even in jatt strong holds. And rural areas of kamoki are mostly jatts but their problem is that there are too many small clans of jatts there and are politically divided and a rajput takes advantage of that situation in every election.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Kaka khels are of non-pashtun origin and were allowed by khattaks to settle.
Khattaks are spread from mardan to kalabagh, they were originally from shawal valley from waziristan. Then settled in karak and from there they conquered rest of the areas.

Yes .. They are syeds .. But still ppl consider them khattaks .. Which they don't appreciate much .. I've seen afridis claim they are the strongest .. The wazirs claim they are best..n many would dis the khattaks for being a weak ppl.. In Baluchistan .. We marris say we are the strongest n jamalis,magsis etc being weak n so on.. In the end .. Jis ki lathi aus ki bhains..

 

[dil_dil]

I have yet to see a Rajput claiming or having a jatt surname .. Infact I've heard jatts say "we are all the same ppl jatts" but not rajputs.. Infact Rajputs are more proud o their ancestory than jatts.. Also shah or Kashmiri quoted the book on castes,races .. I've read tht too .. N even tht records tht Rajput is more of a status... They consider them superior to others .. Going by the Hindu holy scriptures .. Rajputs also are placed above jatts.. No offence to jatts.

Higher status based on brahmin scripture? This is bs, at least in case of Punjab. And in central punjab jatts are dominant, if not in numbers then in influence for sure. Way above rajputs. And "rajas" are known as kammis in our area (kharian tehsil) a part from Chibs rajputs. To differentiate they call themselves chibs instead of rajas, and are known as "khas rajput". They are not dominant in numbers but their life style is not that of kammis of our area like many rajas. I only recently learned Chibs are rajputs.

Potohar is rajput area right? Check from this list in following districts Rawalpindi, Chakwal, Attock and Jhelum. Total seats 14, yet here is names of non-rajputs winners.

National Assembly of Pakistan

Ch Nisar Ali Khan
Mr Shahid Khaqan Abbasi
Sheikh Rashid Ahmed
Mr Imran Khan
Sheikh Aftab Ahmed
Mr Muhammad Zain Elahi
Chaudhry Khadim Hussain

There are Maliks in list who are probably rajputs, but these 7 our of 14 are definitely not rajputs. Caste politics are overrated, do they play role? Yes to a extent. Is there any Ghakkhar there in list? Because, can't see any kayani but i think Ghakkhars are pretty dominant in Potohar region. And also Ghakkhar never needed rajput title did they? At least historically they were always known as just Ghakkhars. I also don't see awan in Potohar region list.

And i don't know what kind of jatts have you met in real life, never seen anyone claiming rajput ancestry in real life at all.

Rajputs are politically strong in the areas where they live ... In Central Punjab you will see Rajputs in every govt cabinet be it PPP or pmln ... Even in South you will see langrials n johiyas being strong...
c..

Langrial in south claim to be jatts, they are jatts basically. Watto of PPP in central punjab, again claim to be jatt.

 

[Progressive1]

@Shahmir kashmir the lohars who have taken up mughal surname, are real mughals by ancestry? Or they are fake?
When i look at people of karachi, there are so many mughals among them. Not just mughals, most of their population seem to consist of syeds and arabs like qureshis, sadiques, farooqis, usmanis etc. Matlab har aira ghaira in karachi, ya tou mughal, turk, pathan hey ya Hazrat Muhammad p.b.u.h, hazrat abubakar, hazrat Omar, hazrat usman ki awlaad hey...shakal daiko tou dalit ki surat nazar aati hey. In your punjab, you people can tell who is who, but what does your people think about these mughals , syeds etc of karachi?


I have also observed that. DI khan's jats must be of different stock. They have sri lankan complexions. Among marwats there is proverb "dase tor laka jatt" (as black as jatt).

I have noted the same thing in Karachi, It seems foreign ancestry phenomena was lot bigger in UP/Bihar,never seen this to that significant extent among old native Pakistanis ethnicities. Couple of Biharis I once met from Karachi were all siddiques, but from what I have seen Shia Muhajirs defo look different from their origin state, from those I have met almost all looked at least Punjabi, Sindhis.

 

[Shahmir]

Higher status based on brahmin scripture? This is bs, at least in case of Punjab.

Langrial in south claim to be jatts, they are jatts basically. Watto of PPP in central punjab, again claim to be jatt.

Yes it seems like some people are more into hindu brahmin manusmriti classification of the superiority of tribes/castes. But they should come out of their dream world as paksitan is a muslim society and here castes/tribes are merely treated as identities not some god given superiority classes as in the case of hindus.

I have noted the same thing in Karachi, It seems foreign ancestry phenomena was lot bigger in UP/Bihar,never seen this to any significant extent among old native Pakistanis ethnicities. Couple of Biharis I once met from Karachi were all siddiques, but from what I have seen Shia Muhajirs defo look different from their origin state, from those I have met almost all looked at least Punjabi, Sindhis.

Shia syeds from india are more likely to have some iranian/iraqi ancestary , it was also found in genetic paper on indian shias, I think this is also valid for shia syeds of punjab and sindh. That may explain different outlook of indian shias.

 

[dil_dil]

i would say given the magnitude of claims and self appointed titles, a reasonable estimate would be 8 to 10 million jatts - a little under 10% of Pak punjab. this is excluding kammis, rajputs, churas etc adopting jatt names lol. and probably similar number in east punjab where they comprise about half the population.

8-10 million in whole Punjab?

 

[dil_dil]

Yes it seems like some people are more into hindu brahmin manusmriti classification of the superiority of tribes/castes. But they should come out of their dream world as paksitan is a muslim society and here castes/tribes are merely treated as identities not some god given superiority classes as in the case of hindus.



Shia syeds from india are more likely to have some iranian/iraqi ancestary , it was also found in genetic paper on indian shias, I think this is also valid for shia syeds of punjab and sindh. That may explain different outlook of indian shias.

In Kharian tehsil there two rajput chib villages, Bhudo Chak and Tuttha Rai Bahadur. They speak punjabi little differently then us,

Can you guess the dialect?

Mare ki, tare ki. ''Chalo Juliye''

Porke inya, which translate in to catch someone. Or phar ke leya in majhi dialect. This is Potohari or dogri?

 

[Shahmir]

In Kharian tehsil there two rajput chib villages, Bhudo Chak and Tuttha Rai Bahadur. They speak punjabi little differently then us,

Can you guess the dialect?

Mare ki, tare ki. ''Chalo Juliye''

Porke inya, which translate in to catch someone. Or phar ke leya in majhi dialect. This is Potohari or dogri?

This is pothohari and pahari spoken on general pothohar areas of jehlum, rawalpindi, most of AJK and poonch and Rajauri. Dogri is more similar to the dialect spoken in north eastern parts of sialkot and shakargarh.

This punjabi dialect from Shakargarh is close to dogri

comparison dogri dialect of jammu , I have a feeling that dogri is shakargarhi punjabi mixed with little bit of pothohari pahari

 

[dil_dil]

This is pothohari and pahari spoken on general pothohar areas of jehlum, rawalpindi, most of AJK and poonch and Rajauri. Dogri is more similar to the dialect spoken in north eastern parts of sialkot and shakargarh.

This punjabi dialect from Shakargarh is close to dogri

comparison dogri dialect of jammu , I have a feeling that dogri is shakargarhi punjabi mixed with little bit of pothohari pahari

2nd video is pure dogri dialect?

 

[Shahmir]

2nd video is pure dogri dialect?

2nd video is pure dogri dialect?

Yes second video is standard dogri spoken in jammu city, off course in villages they would speak more rough form of dogri. One family in our street are settlers from a village of Shakargarh near border area with jammu and they nearly speak standard dogri language while talking to each other. the video that I shared about sharakgarh is perhaps a village much farther away from border that is why it is more in line with punjabi but with dogri accent.

 

[dil_dil]

Kaka khels are of non-pashtun origin and were allowed by khattaks to settle.
Khattaks are spread from mardan to kalabagh, they were originally from shawal valley from waziristan. Then settled in karak and from there they conquered rest of the areas.

Who are Khels of Mianwali?

 

[Shahmir]

Who are Khels of Mianwali?

Niazi tribe of imran khan is cousin tribe of luffymonkey's marwat tribe, they are both lohani pashtuns and migrants from Katawaz Paktika province of Afghanistan. I think it is time to send them both back to Paktika .