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The Indian SSN Project: An Open Literature Analysis

how much SSBNs India needs?

  • 3

    Votes: 4 7.1%
  • 4

    Votes: 52 92.9%

  • Total voters
    56
The number of SSBNs and SSNs must be way more than discussed here so far. Three SSBNs can only be the minimum number, since you normaly have one out in service one in reserve, while another one could be taken out of service for repars or maintenance. The SSBN capability is too important for the nuclear triad, that IN will be left with just such a small number.
SSNs on the other side must be procured in even greater nubers, since they normally will be used to escort SSBNs and carriers. With at least 3 aircraft carries in future, we would need again a rotation of 3 SSNs to protect them. Besides, SSNs like the Akula are also hunter subs, operated alone and at long distances to hunt enemy subs as well to gather intelligence. All these roles can't be fulfilled with Diesel - Electric subs, since they don't have the range/endurrance, the speed and the ability to stay submerged for such a long time.
 
The Working of Nuclear Submarine





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The Nuclear Reactor of Arihant


Arihant_Reactor.jpg
 
The number of SSBNs and SSNs must be way more than discussed here so far. Three SSBNs can only be the minimum number, since you normaly have one out in service one in reserve, while another one could be taken out of service for repars or maintenance. The SSBN capability is too important for the nuclear triad, that IN will be left with just such a small number.
SSNs on the other side must be procured in even greater nubers, since they normally will be used to escort SSBNs and carriers. With at least 3 aircraft carries in future, we would need again a rotation of 3 SSNs to protect them. Besides, SSNs like the Akula are also hunter subs, operated alone and at long distances to hunt enemy subs as well to gather intelligence. All these roles can't be fulfilled with Diesel - Electric subs, since they don't have the range/endurrance, the speed and the ability to stay submerged for such a long time.

We won't stop with only 3 SSBN's , the govt will clear the production of Another 3 Submarines once we get the third one.I Think 6 SSBN's are enough while we need SSN's in large Number.Akula will give us much needed expertise in operating SSN's while a Indigenous production line of SSN is needed.May be we are already working on it , they won't reveal it just like the ATV

The Requirement must be of More than 9 SSN's.12 SSN's if we are looking to procure 6 SSBN's in total.

Development of Long Range SLBM's is needed to arm up the SSBN's , this SSBN act as Mobile,Hidden Missile Bases.The Range of those Missile should be enough that we can Cover the target in China from Indian Ocean.Similiarly Long Range Submarine Launched cruise Missile is needed to arm up SSN/SSGN's

we can Work on Submarine Launched version of "Nirbhay" which can Provide us effective Arm in Attack Missions
 
an Informative article

Till the '70s, nuclear submarines used two reactors, each with steam boilers and PHT pumps for redundancy though these added to the radiated noise.

But once reactor reliability was established, most advanced nations now use a single reactor for more silent operations. Theoretically, a single reliable PWR reactor, with a single steam boiler and a single PHT pump, would produce the least noise.

The second issue mentioned by "experts" is the reactor life and how the Americans have been operating their ninth generation submarine reactors with 25-year life spans, as compared to the rest of the world. Our "experts" should remember that the world's first nuclear submarine, the American USS Nautilius, had a reactor core life of only two years. There is no doubt that the Americans are 50 years ahead of India in this regard, but we must understand that a safe submarine reactor requires a combination of metallurgy and enriched Uranium-235 (U-235) to achieve longer reactor life. And this data is a closely-guarded secret for obvious reasons.

Some articles in the Indian media, about using 80 to 93 per cent enriched U-235 in a submarine reactor core, are incorrect.


This use of weapon grade U-235, may, under some emergent situations, "convert" a reactor into a fission bomb by making the transition from "critical" to "super critical" stage during operations.
We should be happy that our scientists have made a submarine reactor (irrespective of whether it is a few generations behind the Americans and Russians). The important thing here is to see how the reactor operates in harbour and sea trials. Based on this initial experience, improvements can be made to the life and stealth qualities of this reactor.

The third issue mentioned by the "experts" is the reactor power and why we need an SSBN to have higher reactor power to transit at a speed of 30 knots.

Reactor power, as indicated, is thermal and not electrical (eg 100 MW is 100 megawatts of thermal power). Most SSBNs need a transit speed of below 20 knots since their task is to avoid contact with enemy warships and submarines and launch their SLBMs when ordered in a second strike.

Given our geographical location vis-à-vis our two nuclear-armed adversaries, an SSBN with a speed of 20 to 24 knots, but with SLBMs of about 5,000-km range, should suffice. It should be noted that SSNs (or tactical nuclear attack submarines), which are required to search and sink enemy warships and submarines, would need higher speeds (over 30 knots, which, depending on the SSN size, would require a single reactor of 160 to 200 MW or two reactors, each of about 80 to 100 MW).

There are a few other factors which decide submarine stealth -- improved shock mounts, "rafting" (where the reactor and machinery are not in direct contact with the pressure hull), hydrodynamic hull shape, skewed propellers or the new pump jet propulsion system, "static" electrical machinery, anechoic tiling, silent weapon and garbage discharge systems among others). Similarly, greater diving depths are a combination of metallurgy, pressure hull thickness and frame spacing (steel frames are the inner skeletons which, along with the keel, provide support to the pressure hull.

For example, an expensive titanium-hulled submarine can dive to twice the depth of a modern steel-hulled submarine.

Also, in the case of two "similar" steel-hulled submarines, the one with a thicker pressure hull and "closer, thicker frame spacing" would dive deeper, but would pay a penalty in loss of some speed.
Diving depths of submarines are a closely guarded secret, as are noise figures and weapon-firing depths. A nuclear submarine also needs a system to generate oxygen and absorb carbon dioxide and other gases to enable human beings to live and operate in demanding conditions underwater. Production of drinkable sea water and the ability to get rid of garbage (food and human waste) are equally important and technologically demanding.

Our scientists and the Navy personnel involved in work on the Arihant have indeed achieved a major milestone. However, much more needs to be done, and I hope it is done without any unwise and unnecessary publicity.

In addition, India now also needs to begin work on a faster, deeper-diving SSN (tactical nuclear attack submarine) to provide its Navy with a major sea denial capability in the vast expanses of the Indian Ocean.
This SSN will require a single 160 to 200 MW reactor and improved stealth and complex metallurgy. We are beginners in the field of nuclear submarines and have a lot of catching up to do before we start celebrating. VICE-ADMIRAL ARUN KUMAR SINGH retired as Flag Officer Commanding-in-Chief of the Eastern Naval Command, Visakhapatnam

Defence: The ABC of N-subs
 
(108) Details of India's efforts in this and related areas are provided in a very recent article by Pravin Sawhney who is a former major of the Indian Army. The accuracy of his statements cannot be verified.

The desired weapons capability needed by India have been calculated and presented by Nair.
...
For China he made the following recommendation: "Creation of a weapons capability to pull out five to six major industrial centers plus two ports designed to service China's SSBN fleet. This makes a total of 8 nuclear strikes."

"The ideal configuration of warhead numbers and yield would be: Two strikes of one megaton each for metropolitan centres and port facilities; two strikes of 15 kt each for battle field targets; one strike with a yield between 200 and 500 kt each for dams; one strike of 20 to 50 kt each for military airfields; and, one strike each of 15 kt for strategic military communication centres."

The author that compiled "An Open Literature Analysis" provides a compelling reason for China to never permit India to develop thermonuclear weapons. If India does develop thermonuclear weapons and miniaturizes them, India will indeed pose a serious threat to China.

Therefore, the only rational Chinese policy is to neutralize all Indian nuclear facilities during the twenty-year window after India someday detonates a hydrogen bomb and tries to miniaturize it.

The United States perceives the development of an Iranian atomic bomb as a serious national security threat. The United States has openly stated that military means is an option to denuclearize Iran.

The scenario of India possessing a miniaturized W-88 class thermonuclear weapon poses a threat that is 100 times more dangerous to China than an Iranian atomic weapon presents to the United States. I am convinced the CCP will militarily denuclearize India long before you attain a W-88 class thermonuclear weapon.
 
The author that compiled "An Open Literature Analysis" provides a compelling reason for China to never permit India to develop thermonuclear weapons. If India does develop thermonuclear weapons and miniaturizes them, India will indeed pose a serious threat to China.

Therefore, the only rational Chinese policy is to neutralize all Indian nuclear facilities during the twenty-year window after India someday detonates a hydrogen bomb and tries to miniaturize it.

The United States perceived the development of an Iranian atomic bomb as a serious national security threat. The United States has openly stated that military means is an option to denuclearize Iran.

The scenario of an Indian miniaturized W-88 class thermonuclear weapon poses a threat that is 100 times more dangerous to China than an Iranian atomic weapon presents to the United States. I am convinced that the CCP will militarily denuclearize India long before you attain a W-88 class thermonuclear weapon.

And you wonder why the world consider you the next leader of AXIS
after Germany and soviet :tdown:
 
The author that compiled "An Open Literature Analysis" provides a compelling reason for China to never permit India to develop thermonuclear weapons. If India does develop thermonuclear weapons and miniaturizes them, India will indeed pose a serious threat to China.

Therefore, the only rational Chinese policy is to neutralize all Indian nuclear facilities during the twenty-year window after India someday detonates a hydrogen bomb and tries to miniaturize it.

The United States perceives the development of an Iranian atomic bomb as a serious national security threat. The United States has openly stated that military means is an option to denuclearize Iran.

The scenario of India possessing a miniaturized W-88 class thermonuclear weapon poses a threat that is 100 times more dangerous to China than an Iranian atomic weapon presents to the United States. I am convinced the CCP will militarily denuclearize India long before you attain a W-88 class thermonuclear weapon.

permission! "WEED" pretty strong one at that. so you mean china permitted India to have nuclear weapon

500full.jpg
 
The author that compiled "An Open Literature Analysis" provides a compelling reason for China to never permit India to develop thermonuclear weapons. If India does develop thermonuclear weapons and miniaturizes them, India will indeed pose a serious threat to China.

Therefore, the only rational Chinese policy is to neutralize all Indian nuclear facilities during the twenty-year window after India someday detonates a hydrogen bomb and tries to miniaturize it.

The United States perceives the development of an Iranian atomic bomb as a serious national security threat. The United States has openly stated that military means is an option to denuclearize Iran.

The scenario of India possessing a miniaturized W-88 class thermonuclear weapon poses a threat that is 100 times more dangerous to China than an Iranian atomic weapon presents to the United States. I am convinced the CCP will militarily denuclearize India long before you attain a W-88 class thermonuclear weapon.


What a post man..:rofl:. US could not do that with sanctions. China can neither sanction nor attack our sites. Comedy piece:

---------- Post added at 06:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:51 PM ----------

I think Nuclear subs are like aircraft carriers...They have to be made for evolution of design, technical mastery and power projection. I dont think India can stop now. Well on the way towards a true blue navy.
 
We are building 4 SSBN
With INS Arihant likely to be inducted later this yr or early next yr
And INS Arhidaman likely to be launched early 2013 and be inducted in 2015
INS (Anirudh) Likely to be Launched in 2016 , and inducted in 2018
INS (Avinash) Likely to be launched in 2018 and inducted in 2020

The first 2 subs will carry 12 K15 Ballistic Missiles with 750-1900 Km Range ,
While Last 2 Subs will carry 6-8 K4 Ballistic Missiles with 4000 Km range and Ability to carry Either a Single 500 KT warhead or 4-6 50 KT Warheads
 
The author that compiled "An Open Literature Analysis" provides a compelling reason for China to never permit India to develop thermonuclear weapons. If India does develop thermonuclear weapons and miniaturizes them, India will indeed pose a serious threat to China.

Therefore, the only rational Chinese policy is to neutralize all Indian nuclear facilities during the twenty-year window after India someday detonates a hydrogen bomb and tries to miniaturize it.

The United States perceives the development of an Iranian atomic bomb as a serious national security threat. The United States has openly stated that military means is an option to denuclearize Iran.

The scenario of India possessing a miniaturized W-88 class thermonuclear weapon poses a threat that is 100 times more dangerous to China than an Iranian atomic weapon presents to the United States. I am convinced the CCP will militarily denuclearize India long before you attain a W-88 class thermonuclear weapon .

And you assume that Indian administration will sit, twiddling their thumbs, and not react, while India is getting "militarily denuclearized"... and that India will not use the "non miniaturized arsenal" as a response to an attack on her Nuclear Installations...? I am genuinely astounded at the naiveness of your conclusion!

And btw... India is not Iraq or Afghanistan... US and EU has taken only economic steps and are still struggling to contain Iran... And to think of a country, which can choke if it's exports are stopped for 6 months, to attack and contain a nation like India...? Either you are plan n simple drunk or completely out of touch or a false flag,cuz i can"t believe US text books and internet informatio to be so 'communistically' agenda driven... lol
 
very comprehensive article
but little bit information about Pakistan reaction of purchasing nuclear sub
in past Pakistan was interested in Type 091 submarine
from china
but today Chinese have much more advance Type 096 submarine subs under evacuation
 

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