The India Pakistan geographical divide is at least 1600 years old

[M. Sarmad]

I think you are confusing Gujrat/punjab to be named after Gurjara. Gujrat city in north punjab is named after nomadic gujjars who settled in it in Mughal era, so relatively recently.

Gurjara and Gujjars are the same people.

As per V.A Smith, Gujjars migrated from the west by the Quetta and Kandahar route to the Rajputana and from Rajputana, they migrated to Punjab.

Muin ud-Din Munshi and Vinayak Vaidya believe primary Gujjar settlements were around Mount Abu, in Rajasthan. They argue that from Mount Abu they migrated to Punjab via northerly direction. “This more or less close association of the dialects of the Gujars of the Sub-Montane districts of Punjab, hill country to the northwest of Punjab, and the lower hills from Chamba to western Nepal with eastern Rajasthan and especially Mewati dialect, clearly indicates the migration of Gujars from Rajasthan, where they acquired this language, to Yamuna valley through Delhi and from there westward into northwest hill country and further northward into the Himalaya.”

Akbar then did get (few of) them settle down in the pargana Gujrat, sarkar Chej Doab, suba Lahore, named so after the Gujjars, in the year 1588

..... Nomadic Gujjars are hand full of people and minuscule compared to the Gurjar caste spread to such a great extent. Nomad Gurjars are a small part of Gurjars. Its a pity that Gurjars are only remembered as Nomads since the contemporary history and geography books give example of Nomad people and quote minuscule Gujjar nomads.

Thanks to the Criminal Tribes Act of 1871 which declared Gujjars criminal by birth for their opposition of the Brits in 1857.

 

[xyxmt]

Great to see more and more Indians admitting it. We are two different peoples, even though we share similarities in culture due to partition era migration and centuries of Mughal/British rule. Pakistanis are a distinct people, with a distinct heritage, culture, history, practices, beliefs and etc... different from Indians.

contiguous geographical regions share come similarities in language and culture in the border regions that doesnt make them same as Indians would wish as to be same as them

 

[Sindhi(Indus)]

Punjabis, Kashmiris were Indians they're even Indians till this day

The caste system existed in Kashmir and Punjab

It doesn't exist in Sindh, Balochistan, KPK

That being said, Dardics are still blond hair and blue eyed people who were the outer branch of Hinduism in the past

Sindhis were not Hindus, they were Buddhist people and 80% of the population was when Bin Qasim arrived,

The Sindhi Hindus are from migrants in India

Raja Dhair was not a local but an invader from the south

Generally speaking Sindhi Buddhist were not violent races but the Hindu Brahmins were at the time

Never in Sindhi history has Sindh ever been with India

Do NOT let the dark skin in Sindh say a different story since Kashmiris are light skin but are full hinduized people and that pandits and brahmins still exist

These concepts were never in Sindh

 

[xyxmt]

Punjab was center of All Indian (Hindustan) empires, Punjab ruled India for centuries so Punjab has to be Indian (Hindustan)

 

[Cherokee]

Punjab was center of All Indian (Hindustan) empires, Punjab ruled India for centuries so Punjab has to be Indian (Hindustan)

No it was Bihar (Maurya) and the Mughals ( Delhi ) . Also British Empire but it was not indigenous . Punjabi empires never had dominion over entire India . Only three dynasties did.

 

[xyxmt]

No it was Bihar (Maurya) and the Mughals ( Delhi ) . Also British Empire but it was not indigenous . Punjabi empires never had dominion over entire India . Only three dynasties did.

Delhi was part of Punjab historically

 

[Cherokee]

Delhi was part of Punjab historically

I won't call Mughals Punjabis tbh .

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

Punjabis, Kashmiris were Indians they're even Indians till this day

The caste system existed in Kashmir and Punjab

It doesn't exist in Sindh, Balochistan, KPK

That being said, Dardics are still blond hair and blue eyed people who were the outer branch of Hinduism in the past

Sindhis were not Hindus, they were Buddhist people and 80% of the population was when Bin Qasim arrived,

The Sindhi Hindus are from migrants in India

Raja Dhair was not a local but an invader from the south

Generally speaking Sindhi Buddhist were not violent races but the Hindu Brahmins were at the time

Never in Sindhi history has Sindh ever been with India

Do NOT let the dark skin in Sindh say a different story since Kashmiris are light skin but are full hinduized people and that pandits and brahmins still exist

These concepts were never in Sindh

View attachment 536318 View attachment 536319 View attachment 536320
View attachment 536323 View attachment 536324 View attachment 536325

please give small description which map is what,especially the circular maps

 

[Chhatrapati]

Delhi was part of Punjab historically

Delhi was never part of Punjab. There was never a Kingdom centered around Punjab that ruled major chunks in India historically. Rather it was the other way around.

 

[Sindhi(Indus)]

Sindh was with the Mughals

Sindh was with Durrani empire

Sindh was with Ghaznavid empire

If these empires stretched into India, that doesn't mean Sindh was with India, that means Sindh was self governing and that it was apart of the empires,

please give small description which map is what,especially the circular maps

The maps are from Persians and Turks

Al Ishtkari

Al Kashghari

Accounts from Ibn Battuta are also available too

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

Sindh was with the Mughals

Sindh was with Durrani empire

Sindh was with Ghaznavid empire

If these empires stretched into India, that doesn't mean Sindh was with India, that means Sindh was self governing and that it was apart of the empires,


The maps are from Persians and Turks

Al Ishtkari

Al Kashghari

Accounts from Ibn Battuta are also available too

Sindh stopped being part of any Indian empire (established by Hindu/Buddhist Indo-Aryan speakers) originating from Gangetic plain after the Maurya period...of course parts of SIndh the constituted the Thar desert most probably came under Guptas, Gurjara Pratiharas

 

[Sindhi(Indus)]

Sindh stopped being part of any Indian empire (established by Hindu/Buddhist Indo-Aryan speakers) originating from Gangetic plain after the Maurya period...of course parts of SIndh the constituted the Thar desert most probably came under Guptas, Gurjara Pratiharas

No the Rajathani empires never held Sindh in history

No Indian empire stretched over Sindh besides the Mauryan that was Buddhist who stretched into Eastern Iran too

However Buddhism is not Indo Aryan

You don't even know if Siddartha Guatama was an Indo Aryan, many research says that his family was from the Shakya Saka races from Nepal at the time

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

No the Rajathani empires never held Sindh in history

No Indian empire stretched over Sindh besides the Mauryan that was Buddhist who stretched into Eastern Iran too

However Buddhism is not Indo Aryan

You don't even know if Siddartha Guatama was an Indo Aryan, many research says that his family was from the Shakya Saka races from Nepal at the time

View attachment 536526

I meant that Gurjara Pratiharas or Gupta empire may have held 25-50,000 sq kms extra compared to the modern border in the Thar region...

Scythians migrated into India post-Mauryan empire....Scythians in Nepal around 500 BCE is a bit of a stretch...and even if BUddha's family may have had some Scythian lineage, he would be still Indo-Aryan as he spoke something very close to Pali as mother tongue...just like Pashtuns who migrated to Punjab or UP hundreds of years ago are now Punjabis or North Indians because of their language and inevitable admixture in blood

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

excellent resources for historical maps as well as military maps of the Indian subcontinent

http://dsal.uchicago.edu/maps/
https://legacy.lib.utexas.edu/maps/india.html
http://legacy.lib.utexas.edu/maps/ams/india/
http://gulf2000.columbia.edu/maps.shtml

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

The Aryan Migration/Invasion Theory is more or less set in stone now

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-46616574