The Great Asian Showdown: India’s Kolkata Class v/s China’s Type-52D Destroyer

[AMDR]

Best Data I could find on Kolkata, Some of it is estimated. (i had to edit out some non-relevant stuff)

 

[SrNair]

I know project 15 B is an upgraded version, but do you have any specifics?

In January 2011, the Cabinet Committee on Security
gave approval for a follow-on order of four more destroyers under Project 15B. Project 15B will retain the same hull as 15A"Kolkata"-class destroyers, but there will be significant changes in the superstructure that will improve the ships stealth
characteristics, it will incorporate a flush deck
, include betteracoustic signature
and infrared signature
reduction systems and more sophisticated weaponry such as: Nirbhay
land-attack cruise missiles, hypersonic BrahMos-II
anti-ship missiles and Barak 8
-ER SAMs
.[23]
They will operate two helicopters, and are expected to displace approximately 8,000tonnes
at full displacement (500 tonnes more than 15A). Russia's Baltic Shipyard
has been contracted to provide four sets of line shafts
by 2017. Saint Petersburg
's Northern Design Bureau was consulted during the design phase.[24]
[25]

The total cost of the project is expected to be INR
300 billion(US$5 billion).[26]
Build-time for Project 15B is expected to be shorter than 15A, as no major re-designing would be done and would require only one and a half years of planning. Due to this, each warship is expected to save US$
1 billion in costs. After finalisation of design, the first destroyer is expected within four years, with the others delivered at annual intervals, starting from 2018.[27]
Mazagon Docks
laid the keel for the first P-15B destroyer, INS "Bangalore", on 12 October 2013.[16]


We will have more than 32Brahmos 2 VLS and 64+ Barak ER systems.Perhaps you can.expect more of it.

 

[TimeTraveller]

I know project 15 B is an upgraded version, but do you have any specifics?

 

[45'22']

In my view the article didn't go far enough into considering the difference in the performance of the weapon systems.

The Kolkata's Barak 8, Brahmos and MF / STAR have superior performance to anything that china has and that makes the Kolkata number 1, but that being said, because of lower quantity of missiles, its not able to sustain combat as long and its more vulnerable to enemy missile saturation attacks. The fact that have empty space that can be use for more VLS systems in the future tells me that the quantity issue is probably a temporary issue. I expect that the space will be used for other future missiles,

In my opinion the Kolkata gets a conditional number 1 place.



What will be the differences between projects 15A and 15B?

1-Adding the new, Indian Nirbhay Land Attack Cruise missile to the VLS inventory, with a 1,000 km range.
2-Adding the new, hypersonic, Brahmos II anti-surface/ship missile to the armament, with a 300 km range.
3-Adding a new, Extended Range Anti-Aor Missile (ER-SAM) with a range of at least 100 km.
4-An imporved superstructure with radar and infrared stealth.
5-A fully flush deck, also enhancing stealth.
6-The displacement of each Project 15B will be approximately 7,200 tons, a 200 ton addition over the Porject 15A Kolkatas

The construction of first(D66) under 15B will be started by 2016

 

[Bornubus]

In January 2011, the Cabinet Committee on Security
gave approval for a follow-on order of four more destroyers under Project 15B. Project 15B will retain the same hull as 15A"Kolkata"-class destroyers, but there will be significant changes in the superstructure that will improve the ships stealth
characteristics, it will incorporate a flush deck
, include betteracoustic signature
and infrared signature
reduction systems and more sophisticated weaponry such as: Nirbhay
land-attack cruise missiles, hypersonic BrahMos-II
anti-ship missiles and Barak 8
-ER SAMs
.[23]
They will operate two helicopters, and are expected to displace approximately 8,000tonnes
at full displacement (500 tonnes more than 15A). Russia's Baltic Shipyard
has been contracted to provide four sets of line shafts
by 2017. Saint Petersburg
's Northern Design Bureau was consulted during the design phase.[24]
[25]

The total cost of the project is expected to be INR
300 billion(US$5 billion).[26]
Build-time for Project 15B is expected to be shorter than 15A, as no major re-designing would be done and would require only one and a half years of planning. Due to this, each warship is expected to save US$
1 billion in costs. After finalisation of design, the first destroyer is expected within four years, with the others delivered at annual intervals, starting from 2018.[27]
Mazagon Docks
laid the keel for the first P-15B destroyer, INS "Bangalore", on 12 October 2013.[16]


We will have more than 32Brahmos 2 VLS and 64+ Barak ER systems.Perhaps you can.expect more of it.

Bro...what about Dhanush ....on which IN warship will...it be installed....and is it comparable with DF 21

 

[Gessler]

Bro...what about Dhanush ....on which IN warship will...it be installed....and is it comparable with DF 21

Dhanush won't be put to operational use, ever.

 

[SrNair]

Bro...what about Dhanush ....on which IN warship will...it be installed....and is it comparable with DF 21

Dhanush was just a research program.It wont deploy for operational purpose

1-Adding the new, Indian Nirbhay Land Attack Cruise missile to the VLS inventory, with a 1,000 km range.
2-Adding the new, hypersonic, Brahmos II anti-surface/ship missile to the armament, with a 300 km range.
3-Adding a new, Extended Range Anti-Aor Missile (ER-SAM) with a range of at least 100 km.
4-An imporved superstructure with radar and infrared stealth.
5-A fully flush deck, also enhancing stealth.
6-The displacement of each Project 15B will be approximately 7,200 tons, a 200 ton addition over the Porject 15A Kolkatas

The construction of first(D66) under 15B will be started by 2016

No P 15A already have 7500 ton .P 15B would have 8000 ton

 

[45'22']

Dhanush was just a research program.It wont deploy for operational purpose



No P 15A already have 7500 ton .P 15B would have 8000 ton

Oh yeah....thanks for the edit

 

[Carlosa]

In January 2011, the Cabinet Committee on Security
gave approval for a follow-on order of four more destroyers under Project 15B. Project 15B will retain the same hull as 15A"Kolkata"-class destroyers, but there will be significant changes in the superstructure that will improve the ships stealth
characteristics, it will incorporate a flush deck
, include betteracoustic signature
and infrared signature
reduction systems and more sophisticated weaponry such as: Nirbhay
land-attack cruise missiles, hypersonic BrahMos-II
anti-ship missiles and Barak 8
-ER SAMs
.[23]
They will operate two helicopters, and are expected to displace approximately 8,000tonnes
at full displacement (500 tonnes more than 15A). Russia's Baltic Shipyard
has been contracted to provide four sets of line shafts
by 2017. Saint Petersburg
's Northern Design Bureau was consulted during the design phase.[24]
[25]

The total cost of the project is expected to be INR
300 billion(US$5 billion).[26]
Build-time for Project 15B is expected to be shorter than 15A, as no major re-designing would be done and would require only one and a half years of planning. Due to this, each warship is expected to save US$
1 billion in costs. After finalisation of design, the first destroyer is expected within four years, with the others delivered at annual intervals, starting from 2018.[27]
Mazagon Docks
laid the keel for the first P-15B destroyer, INS "Bangalore", on 12 October 2013.[16]


We will have more than 32Brahmos 2 VLS and 64+ Barak ER systems.Perhaps you can.expect more of it.

Very nice, at that point it goes beyond the 52D, but of course will need to deal with the Type 55 within that time frame, but with hypersonic Brahmos, that ship can take on anything.
Way to go India

The construction of first(D66) under 15B will be started by 2016

That's a short timeframe, very nice.

India has gone through a long and difficult period in their naval program, lots of delays and issues, but that period is behind, India had a great learning experience and was able to master advance technologies.

Now the sausage machine started to work and those babies are coming out nicely, one after the other: Kolkata, Kamorta, INS Arihart sub. The sausages are rolling......

No more free lunch for the chinese in the Indian Ocean. HARI OM TAT SAT

 

[SrNair]

Very nice, at that point it goes beyond the 52D, but of course will need to deal with the Type 55 within that time frame, but with hypersonic Brahmos, that ship can take on anything.
Way to go India



That's a short timeframe, very nice.

India has gone through a long and difficult period in their naval program, lots of delays and issues, but that period is behind, India had a great learning experience and was able to master advance technologies.

Now the sausage machine started to work and those babies are coming out nicely, one after the other: Kolkata, Kamorta, INS Arihart sub. The sausages are rolling......

No more free lunch for the chinese in the Indian Ocean. HARI OM TAT SAT

Chinese will find some way to counter it .jBut a lot of investment during previous decades is now paying off.
So developments will always going on.Like you said IOR wont be a turf of China.Actual range of Brahmos is classified .When we deploy hypersonic version we dont even need saturation attack enemy ship.

 

[SecularNationalist]

There is no comparison of indian and chinese navy .Simple fact.

 

[Misay]

Chinese will find some way to counter it .jBut a lot of investment during previous decades is now paying off.
So developments will always going on.Like you said IOR wont be a turf of China.Actual range of Brahmos is classified .When we deploy hypersonic version we dont even need saturation attack enemy ship.

India and China are neighbors，You should know what I mean，lol

 

[cnleio]

1. Indian Navy doesn't get Israel Barak-8 missile yet (if im wrong, pic pls !) ... but Chinese has HQ-9B on 052D-class.

2. Indian has BrahMos VLS on Kolkata-class, Chinese has YJ-18 super-sonic missile VLS on 052D-class.

YJ-18 VLS launch.gif

3. Right now PLAN has 6x 052C-class, 2x 052D-class, and new 3x 052D launched in the shipyard & sea trial.

Chinese r building more 052D-class DDGs, number to 20+ in different shipyards.

When 2nd Indian Kolkata-class out ... u will find out Chinese 1st 055-class DDG launch in 2015~2016 ... then let's continue to compare Kolkata-class vs China 055-class (10,000+ ton, 100+ VLS cells) ...

 

[Anony]

Nice Comparison, but i differ a bit on Weapon comparison. Firstly both Barak-8 and Brahmos is more advanced than what is present on 052D. Thus, mere comparison of number of VLS cell is a little out of place considering when probability of Barak-8 defending Ashm coming from adversary will be higher than that of HQ 9 and when the target to intercept is Brahmos, probability will fall further (though I don't doubt HQ 9 capability just that I give Barak 8 a little higher point), though I agree that against fighter HQ 9 provides bigger range of engagement but it should be noted that engaging a fighter at even 100km range is a tough call, let alone 200km and fighters can engage ships from far greater range.

Secondly, 8 Brahmos can be lauched in a minute time but that is not the case with YJ-12.

Thirdly, when Shivalik class frigate has 64 fixed VLS cell( 32 Barak1, 24 Shtil & 8 Brahmos) , there is no reason to disagree that Kolkata Class has less than 80 VLS cell. Shivalik class displaces 6200 ton at full load and Kolkata Class looks much bigger than that, thus must be having enough space

 

[vsdave2302]

I agree with @SvenSvensonov that it is quite silly/futile to compare induvidual weapon systems in isolation without facotring in their respective support mechnisms and using context.


Anyway, an interesting take:

SNAFU!: The Indian D63 Kolkata Destroyer is the most balanced on the planet.

That is why Brahmos is a real *** kicker. When western shi[s can not come closer, where is the question of comparing Chinese ships. For more datail read article posted by me on forum.

How to defend Brahmos?- American analysis.

Bro...what about Dhanush ....on which IN warship will...it be installed....and is it comparable with DF 21

It is operational while Df 21 is not. It is much more accurate than Df21/. DF 21 has a greater range. DF 21 is heard more as an anti aircraft career missile. Parallel of DF 21 is in making by DRDO.

1. Indian Navy doesn't get Israel Barak-8 missile yet (if im wrong, pic pls !) ... but Chinese has HQ-9B on 052D-class.

2. Indian has BrahMos VLS on Kolkata-class, Chinese has YJ-18 super-sonic missile VLS on 052D-class.

YJ-18 VLS launch.gif
View attachment 200653


3. Right now PLAN has 6x 052C-class, 2x 052D-class, and new 3x 052D launched in the shipyard & sea trial.

Chinese r building more 052D-class DDGs, number to 20+ in different shipyards.
View attachment 200645


When 2nd Indian Kolkata-class out ... u will find out Chinese 1st 055-class DDG launch in 2015~2016 ... then let's continue to compare Kolkata-class vs China 055-class (10,000+ ton, 100+ VLS cells) ...
View attachment 200652

Missile in video is very slow compared to Brahmos.